Rossi 'Very Satisifed' with Ongoing Testing

Andrea Rossi is reporting that tests of the hot cat are ongoing, and that so far he is very pleased with the results. September 21 was apparently an important day in this testing regimen, as Ross described on the Journal of Nuclear Physics:

The test of today has been a particular session, in the context of the 4 month work of validation of the Hot Cat, because today we made important modifications : the reactor is now very different from the prototype we talked about in Zurich.

It has no more the internal cylinder, has different dimensions, has many modifications: I hoped to get improvements in the minimum COP. We also made an electric measurement with new experts, to review the work made before, with new instruments. In the final report we will describe in particular the important work of today, that for now is under NDA.

I am very satisfied. First, because the measurements have confirmed that the work made up to now has given resulkts very close to the ones obtained after a peer reviewing, second because my modifications have improved the Hot Cat. The test began this morning at 7 a.m., is finished few minutes ago at 22,30 .

Said this I have the duty to repeat that the tests are going on, will continue, we are not ready to give final results. We are still in R&D, we still have not a Hot Cat ready for the market. All the data we got are stioll subject to variations.

One of the goals of this new design, then, was to increase the minimum COP. The paper presented in Zurich showed a COP of somewhere around 2.5 (calculated very conservatively), and from this report it appears that may have been exceeded. There is no mention of whether there was self-sustain involved in this test — that was not involved in the report presented at Zurich.

Rossi states here that the measurements from the new tests confirm those of old tests — probably mentioned to try and dispel doubts raised by the press release of Hydro Fusion, which stated tests on the Hot Cat performed by their agent did not demonstrate that any excess heat was generated.

Rossi also mentions that these tests are “both validation and development tests: the two tasks intertwine between themselves, because during the tests we learn, react, modify.” We don’t know who else is involved in this testing process, but it sounds like at some point a report of this process will be published.

  • Italo R.

    People ask for photo and video of running e-cats.
    I think that many are tired of words only…

    • it’s currently under NDA…
      we have to wait until these validation tests aren’t finished.

    • daniel maris

      Yes, it’s odd nothing is shown, given we have the SGS certificate – one concludes there must be SOMETHING there!

    • Ged

      We HAVE seen pictures. Zurich report? People… come on now. Are attention spans -that short-? Do people need to take memory boosting pills or something? Every time we’ve been told we’d get a report, we have. We’ll see this one too -in due time-.

      I don’t mean to sound frustrated, but we’ve seen PLENTY of hot cat pictures. Thermal, visible light, etc. We’ve had leaks, we had official reports. Just… have patience.

      • Peter_Roe

        We seem to need some kind of archive of ‘milestones’ that can be referred to with 1 click, or goldfish syndrome seems to take over depressingly quickly.

        • Ged

          That is a very good idea. Have links to demo vidoes and report pdfs, major news and such, throughout the timeline since ’10 or ’11. Also could be cool to have a comparison between expected time versus actual time of milestones, to give perspective.

          • Omega Z

            Ged

            I’ve had the same thoughts. An easy to access archive of all the Info. Both good & bad. When someone asks for a link for proof, it’s just 1 click away.

            Many of us have spent many hours backtracking to say the least. I have so many tabs it’s hard to find what I’m looking for & sometimes I’ve inadvertently deleted it. Sometimes on purpose only to regret it latter.

            Yes an archive in chronological order with a brief description & links would be great.

            Aside from refreshing our own memory & a place to direct others to, it would be great for the newbies.

            I wonder if Frank would be interested in setting it up if Volunteers would help in the searching & organizing it by eliminating repetitious links & chronicle ordering.

            Just a thought. A big task…

          • admin

            Hi OZ, Ged,

            I am all for creating an archive of important events and milestones. If people would like to volunteer, let me know and I will set up a way for people to collaborate. Probably in Google docs initially. I will need email addresses to allow folks access to the document. I will probably have to restrict access to a limited number of known people to ensure reliability.

            What do you guys think?

          • Jim Johnson

            http://lenrconnect.com/group/ecat-development-timeline

            This is ready to go. Happy to turn this over to someone.

        • GreenWin

          “Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing, doubting, dreaming dreams no mortal ever dared to dream before.”
          Edgar Allan Poe

  • edog

    Hey guys,
    anyone understand Italian? I was wondering if someone could give me a brief rundown of what Mr Abundo is up to?

    Daniele Over at 22passi has some videos pictures and some communications about the latest Athanor/ Hydrobetatron device.. google translate is good but it doesnt work very well on the videos 🙂
    http://www.22passi.blogspot.de/

    I am sorry for my ignorance
    but some help would be extremely welcome!

  • Martin

    Validation is not certification, right? I am kinda confused with these different types of cats and validations.

    • Validation = check if Rossi’s claims are true
      Certification = check if the Device is secure.

      So in my oppinion a Validation is more interesting for us, at the moment.

  • Gerrit

    I will be very satisfied when Hydro Fusion publishes a press release stating that they have performed a new measurement on the hot cat and the results where all okay and that they are best friends forever with Rossi again.

    • +1 🙂

    • GreenWin

      It may already have happened – but not yet publicized.

  • There is a new method to produce LENRs with hydrogen and cobalt instead nickle or palladium:

    https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=ZGVmYXVsdGRvbWFpbnxvaGlvdG9pb3xneDpjZGMzM2VjNGQwY2ExZDc&pli=1

    It seems it has a higher efficiency

    • Ged

      The Zeocat! Now that is a name. I’ll have to chew on this a bit to dissect its meaning and validity.

      Great find and thanks for sharing!

    • Ged

      The writing and style may be pretty basic, but it’s a very good effort. They attempted blank runs, which is perfect methodology, and they have a lot of pictures. Unfortunately, their results don’t seem that statistically different from the controls. They may be, but there’s a lot of variance and very small signal, so with this data alone, I cannot say. That’s just my interpretation/analysis, so others may correct me if wrong.

      I am also unsure of this Pure-Heat-Pressure-Vent method they are using, and what complications it may add.

      It’s a good effort though. Definitely on the right track of the sort of activity we’d like to see.

      • daniel maris

        So are you saying that haven’t achieved a COP greater than 1?

        • Seems they get 70 watt MORE output than input.

      • GreenWin

        This is significant. Using a variety of “recipes” these experiments have produced over-unity energy – from the same basic idea developed by Patterson and later George Miley.

    • Zvibenyosef

      Thanks for posting this fascinating article. This is yet another proof of the LENR concept. The AMHD mode of operation seems to be very promising, resulting a very consistent and reproducible exothermic effect. Their experiment which continued for over a week at over 70 degrees above null was particularly impressive. Another very fascinating aspect of their work was the unexpected endothermic effect obtained with some metals. I wonder what is going on there? This research lends more credibility to LENR and is yet another indication that we are on the verge of an energy breakthrough.

      • Finding an efficient endothermic nuclear reaction would be very useful for applications, because coupled with an exothermic reactor it could enable an electric generator which produces zero waste heat. It would be enabling tech for high power spacecraft, for example.

        • Peter_Roe

          An endothermic CF beer cooler would be handy, too!

      • Peter_Roe

        What is becoming more and more obvious is that this phenomenon (metal mediated hydrogen fusion) has been right under our noses for decades. With all the experiments that have taken place to find metallic catalysts for various hydrogenation processes it is very difficult to see how it could apparently have been missed for so long.

        • georgehants

          Peter, my reply to Gerrit,above, maybe gives your answer —
          It was reported in amazement that —
          “although no satisfactory explanation was found, R. was allowed to publish it” —-
          If science is so dumb that it discourages publication of observed Evidence because no cause can be given, then what can one expect.
          The “scientific method” and those that blindly follow it have much to answer for.

          • Peter_Roe

            George – yes that publication is actually quite surprising, against the background of the current way in which research is conducted. In the dim and distant days when I worked in a lab it was quite commonplace to publish details of ‘mystery’ observations (at least it was in molecular biology) in the hope that someone else would come up with further related info or possibly even an explanation). Perhaps this is a glimmer of things drifting back that way. Or more likely it was just an oversight.

  • Ivan Mohorovicic

    There is a new interview to Rossi here (with a video), any Italian willing to translate?

    http://radio.rcdc.it/archives/fusione-fredda-andrea-rossi-e-il-sogno-di-tesla-105847/

    • Red5goahead

      There aren’t no meaningful news in this partial interview.
      Maybe it’s worth to wait the fully one.

      • Luca Salvarani

        I can confirm Red5: here there aren’t new elements but this is only a preview…. maybe in the full interview… The only “news” is Rossi admits that his previous statement according to which all energy sources will integrate is “politically correct”… “The reality is that if e-cat will be diveloped there would really be a “revolution” (officially said)… so all other sources would be displaced (not said this officially but his words and his mimic was unmistakeable)

        • Peter_Roe

          That is a very interesting development. If Rossi feels that he can begin to take the gloves off, he must be either feeling very confident, or he knows that the nuclear and fossil energy people are not fooled for a second by ‘we can all get along together’. Clearly that was never the case.

          • GreenWin

            That may be the case now Peter. Though the fossil people will only lose by attempting to maintain the status quo. Further attempts at suppression guarantees evidence of complicity will go public. Then, if the justice system does not correct their actions, perturbed citizens might.

            Getting on board the “energy abundance train” now, buys a modicum of immunity against past misdeeds. Tickets anyone?

          • Peter_Roe

            Yes, if the ‘fossil burners’ have any sense, they’ll go along with converting their existing kit. Coal burners are doomed anyway by the green evangelists (aka ‘alternative energy’ sector) and their cronies in government, so they should be in a hurry to look at any CF alternatives.

            However, the multi-trillion dollar nuclear industry will be truly bu**ered by CF, and in addition, left with billions of dollars of decommissioning and disposal obligations. Of course these will never be met, as the nuclear sectors of the multinationals will be (and already are being) hived off as ‘free standing’ companies that will just declare bankruptcy at an opportune moment, leaving guv’mints holding their babies.

  • artefact

    On JONP:

    Andrea Rossi
    September 22nd, 2012 at 2:50 PM
    Dear Hank Mills:
    The catalysts we use are chemical products, but the action they make is confidential. I understand you can be confused, I should be the same in your position, but until I cannot disclose the theory and process I must keep this information under cover.
    Thank you for your attention,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

    • Kim G. Patterson

      I feel as if the chemical may impart a magnetic
      effect to the process in some way.

      Respect
      Kim

    • shamrock77

      .. a honest reply from Rossi that we all can appreciate at this point, we will just have to wait this out a couple of months more.

      • dsm2

        Hmmm

        Don’t you mean years more ?

        DSM

    • Peter_Roe

      “The catalysts we use are chemical products”

      This is not particularly surprising, as the simple addition of a chemical element such as copper dust would not provide the level of integration that is probably required. Presumably addition of a (nucleonic) ‘catalyst’ is the nickel powder pretreatment, which may involve a copper salt, if a copper deposition is needed to ionise hydrogen at the surface of the particles.

      Other candidates might be acids and sodium silicate (Celani’s wire pre-treatment, although these would not seem to be catalysts in any true sense) or potassium carbonate, cited by several experimenters (although the latter is probably only useful in ‘wet’ electrolytic CF systems).

      • In Celani’s SEM images one saw how a heat treatment can strongly modify the microscale surface morphology. This suggests that if the E-cat works for 6 months in over 1000 C temperature, it must somehow be able to regenerate its magic nanostructure. Maybe a catalyst plays such a role. For example it could be some alloyant which takes nickel atom’s place in the matrix, but is larger or smaller then nickel so that it distorts the matrix locally, thus creating narrow spaces for hydrogen atoms to mingle.

        • Peter_Roe

          Or perhaps some alloyed element that slowly ‘evaporates’ from the nickel at high temperatures, leaving fresh NA sites exposed?

          These ideas still leave open the question of what creates a continuous supply of ionised H though. It’s possible of course that the hydrogen ‘donor’ – presumably a light-metal hydride – is somehow deposited directly onto the nickel particles so that ‘nascent’ hydrogen ions resulting from thermal decomposition are directly available to the nickel for gas loading. In this case, no ionisation ‘catalyst’ would be necessary.

      • Max S

        The chemcial industry conducts on large scale catalytic hydogenations using Ni and Ni/Cu alloys, under H2 pressure and elevated temperatures, and never large excess heat effects had been reported.
        Therefore it is not only theoretically very unlikely that Cu could be a catalyst to initiate any nuclear reactions. There must be something else (suppose the effect is real).

        • Peter_Roe

          That is rather curious, as I commented at 10:22pm. As you say, there must be other factors, unless observations indicating anomalous heat have been routinely discarded as ‘artefacts’.

          btw, I wasn’t suggesting that copper is acting as a nucleonic ‘catalyst’, only that it is involved in promoting the ionisation of hydrogen in Rossi’s hot cat, as it supposedly does in the Celani apparatus.

  • GreenWin

    Here’s the latest from Dr. George Miley and Lenuco. He seems to get up to 70 COP on some of his runs – but has trouble keeping the catalyst from burning out.

    http://www.lenr-coldfusion.com/2012/09/21/george-miley-working-3kw-30kw-lenr-designs/

  • Claes

    New days, new “Rossi says”! 🙂

    • captain

      Ah ah ah … Claes spitted his sentence… ah ah ah

      • Claes

        I just found it so funny that everybody was screaming for a 3rd party validation. Then a bunch of people came down from the Swedish governmental testing agency, with state-of-the-art measuring equipment and people with decades of experience. They test it and find that Rossi uses the wrong type of meter. Not anything complicated – it’s just the wrong type. End of story.

        What happens? It takes 2-3 days before everybody has managed to convince themselves that Rossi is probably right and this agency is probably wrong. Not only that: bad people are being mean to Rossi!

        I’m wondering precisely who they would want to come and test it? The agency that the entire industry of Sweden is trusting (Volvo, ABB, Bofors, Ericsson you name it) obviously isn’t trustworthy compared to Rossi.

        Then Rossi keeps sayin this and that. I mean I’m not sure he doesn’t have anything but I get worried that he doesn’t react constructively and that there is a cult dynamics around him.

        • Renzo

          Please could you tell me where can I download the paper from the swedish team explaining their procedure? Have you also read the third-party report by eng. Fabio Penon?
          So why don’t you go trolling on another place?

          • Claes

            Yes, and what do YOU know? Their procedure – I would think – would be regulated professionally since they were there in their professional capacities. That’s my guess – what’s you guess?

            But to clarify. I’m not a sceptic of LENR, and even if I’ve downgraded my optimism about Rossi somewhat, I think he probably does have something. My main worries is not that he’s a scam: I don’t think that he is. My worries is that he brushes this off too easily. I’m getting worried that he’s sloppy.

            If he were it wouldn’t surprise me. Inventors are the best people for refining their inventions. Refinement and invention is quite different and takes different personalities.

            It seems to me that the low-temperature version is more promising – that’s the one that made me believe in this. In fact I have no idea why he would move beyond it at this time. My guess is that he enjoys coming up with new things and can’t motivate himself as soon as he thinks that he’s achieved what’s important. But that’s just my guess – we’re all guessing quite a lot in here.

            By the way – my impression is that the forum should be for people with an open mind. But people interpret that differently for sure! If it means that it is only for applauding every word of Rossi’s, please tell me and I’ll never come here again, because then it’s completely barren.

          • Claes

            “inventors are NOT the best people for…” – that’s how it should read.

        • captain

          It seems to me that U have not CAREFULLY read Rossi’s statement about the Swedish tester: what he has done, how long has he tested the E-Cat, how was E-Cat running at that time, still in a R&D status, not running at full power…a.s.o.

          This is not a blog/forum for skeptics and/or non believers in Rossi’s E-Cat tech.

          And when I say this, I think only to a few things:

          – that Rossi, for validation/certification purposes is giving only ‘quiet, very quiet’ E-Cats… that means that for him there’s no prob at all to increase the COP say up to 10 or more, without mentioning 20 or 50!

          – since Rossi is having tough times in having his ‘simple’ domestic E-Cat approved by USPTO and/or UL and his patents/brevets IP recognized, he likes not to put very up the performance of his hot tiger.

          – for people that so far have not yet understood the great potential of an infinite power thermal/Electric plant, finally working in a self sustain mode, is better to move to other forums, believe me. With Siemens or without Siemens, with Swedes or without them, it doesn’t matter.

          In other posts I’ve written that CF speaks Italian, and it’s true: Italian forums are very rare, but with intelligent bloggers, that are well aware of Rossi’s potential. In cobraf forum Q&A are put down in a cryptic way, say by Cures,Nevanlinna,Lmwillys and others…and sometimes it’s difficult to understand what they’re saying also for technicians (I’m not at all). However pleasant to read in some way.

          Here we hear very very often the same music by certain players: and that’s is not so pleasant.
          However here there are too many questions put to Rossi, asking for a quick reply, and this is not a good thing.

          My sincere hope is that Rossi could remain much more silent to do better his hard job.

          And my sincere hope is also that very very soon another LENR working device could be shown working from another competitor, so to let Rossi work in peace.

          • captain

            add to my post:

            For people not understanding that Rossi’s hot tiger is a Ferrari made now running like a tortoise, it’s only wasted time.

        • GreenWin

          Heh heh… everyone makes mistakes, right??

        • Max S

          Claes, fully agree with you.
          We have to assume that in the meantime these measurements at doubt have been repeated as it should have been done immediatetly. This can be done in one day.
          If Rossi was right why was there still no update and announcement by him or by hydrofusion ?

        • timycelyn

          “….with state-of-the-art measuring equipment and people with decades of experience. ”

          From what has come out subsequently on these tests if that kit was “State of the Art” then the art involved was pottery. Wrong test using the wrong kit in the wrong way. Otherwise just fine….

          • GreenWin

            And where is the Swedish specialist report? Signed by who? Where’s the Data? Equipment specs? Experimental methodology? Blank run? Independent validation?

            There is none??