October 1 Q&A With Andrea Rossi

Below are some questions I sent to Andrea Rossi today, along with his responses:

1. When do you expect to be creating electricity with the hot cat
(Or have you already done so)?


2. You have mentioned that certifiers do not approve of using the
E-Cat to drive itself. How can you achieve the “dream of Tesla” if you
cannot self-loop the E-Cat?


3. We have seen the voluntary safety certification for the 1 MW
plant — How is this different from “product certification”?


4. When might product certification be completed?


5. Are you building the 1 MW plants in both Europe and the USA?


6. How soon will it be before people will be able to visit a working 1 MW plant?


7. Will you guarantee a COP of 6 for a Hot Cat device?


8. Will you be building any industrial units smaller than 1 MW?


9. Will you be building any industrial units larger than 1 MW — if
so how large?


10. How many non-military E-Cat plants have been ordered so far?


11. How soon can we expect the validation report to be published?



  • Ivone Martin FitzGerald

    All the more reason for getting on with LENR Connect if E-Cat, Defkalion, and Brillouin are so cagey and economical with the truth. Remember they cannot patent physics and science.

    • captain

      Rossi’s E-Cat is working very very well, it’s running since 3 yrs, and producing a tremendous amount of energy, clean, safe, very very cheap.

      Patents, brevets, validations, certifications, are only w o r d s, but Rossi’s reactor is real and working well, too well.


      Rossi is not cagey and economical with the truth. Rossi is realistic, he works 16/24 to have PRODUCTS done, not a bfew words to have this blog going on only.

      BTW, from http://www.std.com
      Help End “Heavywatergate” and the 24 YEAR USPTO

      …that’s the real problem…

      • captain

        add to my post:

        http://world.std.com/~mica/cft.html (Cold Fusion Times)

      • Ivan_Cev

        Captain, I admire your faith.

        • Ivan_Cev on October 1, 2012 at 10:09 pm

          “Captain, I admire your faith.”

          What does statement of fact or request to help with action on a cause have to do with faith?

          Maybe you apply misdirection like good lawyer attempting to distract from your real intentions?


          Regards, _Jim

  • Ivan Mohorovicic

    Kind of off-topic to this post, but in my opinion when Rossi wants to make the reader think that he is in the USA (by blatantly pointing it up), it’s because he actually is in Italy and wants, for a reason or another, to cover up this fact.

    • Casey

      His business is operating in both countries. But because of high bureaucracy in Italy, he might build production plant in Sweden.

      • telecommuter

        He ‘might’? Might this, might that – doesn’t mean anything.

    • Ivan_Cev

      So a little white lie?, Then there may be another the size of a ecat

  • Sanjeev

    E-CAT conference to be held in Pordenone, Italy, Oct 12.


  • edog

    Sounds like we are travelling backwards…
    Bamm Sham Shazam.. Nada!

    I really dont believe Rossi at the moment.
    He has gone about this whole process the complete wrong way.

    • Casey

      Who cares, do you believe or not…..

  • Andre Blum

    Do you guys agree that, seeing these answers, it looks like Rossi is getting more professional in his communications?

    These are not the answers he would have given 6 months or a year ago. Back then, he seemed to have an irresistible urge to let us know about his progress and expectations. Somehow, he seems more at peace now with the speed of it all, and with the fact that he is dependent on third parties, etc.

    Or maybe because he now has many more people directly surrounding him and giving him pats on his back, he doesn’t need to get the kind of community encouragement/endorsement he needed before.

    • Peter Poulsen

      When he stops writing in caps, i will say he is becoming more professional. Until then this is just more of the same.
      All talk no game.

      Im still waiting on that E-Cat. I mean it has been working for more than a year now, yet it seems like he isnt giving it much thought anymore.

      • GreenWin

        You might read the German Magazine Telepolis coverage of the Zurich conference titled “Cold Fusion On the Way to Market.” Link in my previous post.

        BTW, imagine if you will the kind of pressure that is surely brought upon Rossi and team – by all manner of forces who care to stop his work. I am not surprised by eccentric behavior which appears to have mellowed.

  • Roger Bird

    Reading this, I realized that one of my problems with Rossi is that we have had no confirmations other than his words since he broke out of the pack. If we are to believe him, he is so far ahead of everyone else that it sort of begs for a demo. Even Brillouin Energy Corp. has barely a commercial product that seems inferior to what Rossi is talking about.

    • Redford

      Actually you missed the action. Hot Cat report is a set of measurement made by 6 scientist. 3 of them are public, 3 of them will be soon. In the 3 publics, 1 is working for Rossi and 2 for other entities such as Bologna university. So we actually have 3rd party confirmation : competent ppl not paid by Rossi have done all their measures by themselves and are putting their reputation on it.

      • Max S

        You said yourself, one was working for Rossi. Since Rossi´s technical director (Fabiani) has coordinated the test, it can hardly be considered as independent 3rd party test. I don´t understand why believers over and over claim there was a 3rd party test. It wasn´t.
        It is a fact that Rossi does not allow indepenend control of the experiment. Why not, is the question.

        • Redford

          This is getting surrealistic. They are not testing a meteroite. They are testing an invention. To test it, they obviously need an operator. Now measurements are measurements. Either they show excess heat or not. What matters is who made the measurements. Who ? The 2 specialists in measurements are the one not paid by Leonardo. I find it very telling that people come to the point of saying that the tested machine shouldn’t have an operator to obliterate the hard facts that 3rd party testers with their own tools made their own measurements and put their name on it, taking direct risk on their career. Pons & Fleischmann should remind you that this is actually everything but a light move from them.

          • GreenWin

            Deniers role in life and in particular LENR, is to deny. It is likely an affliction.

          • Peter_Roe

            Or in some cases a pension/unemployment supplement?

          • GreenWin


          • Max S

            I disagree. It does matter who operates if the purpose of the test is to check if the device is real and exclude any chance of manipulation.
            When the operator is one of Rossi´s senior employees, it is obviously not an independent 3rd party.
            It goes even further. Cures contributed and hydrofusion people have edited the report.
            Independent is different. It does not means the test was wrong but it was definitely not 3rd party. Even in this forum it was consensus we need a 3rd party verification.
            Why does Rossi not give his working device incl operating manual to a testing company or a university and let them measure input and output. Simple. If it then passes, skeptics will start to believe it.

          • GreenWin

            Max, you and like-minded are no longer in your scientific method world. It’s a world of commerce beyond the purview of academia. To satisfy your worries, buy an e-Cat and test it yourself. But don’t expect anyone to believe your report – it’s not “third party.”

      • Ash

        Incorrect – one of the testers was a Uni Bologna student, not an employee. UniBo stated in writing in August they have no relationship with Rossi.

        • admin

          This is David Bianchini — not a Bologna student:


        • Omega Z

          MIT has nothing to do with the NANOR device, Yet Mr. Hagelstein is 1 of their professors who with Mitchell Swartz of JET Energy setup the on going NANOR demo. Hagelstein also presented/taught at a LENR workshop on the premises to students.

          Hagelstein also obtained funding for research from a private corporation, Yet an important physicist at MIT blocked the research & quashed the Funding. Note that MIT is a major recipient of Federal Funding for Hot Fusion. A cash cow for many decades to come???

          You have a somewhat Similar situation with Unibo. Professors employed by the University conducting work not officially recognized by the University.

          As You are aware of the written statement, you must also be aware of the Fact Unibo offered to work with Rossi in their facilities. Conditions: To be able to publish ALL findings up to & possibly including his IP information. Oh, Also to be paid 1/2 a Million Euro’s.

          Not only are the Professors NOT Students, They are highly regarded in their fields with prestigious awards. It’s Extremely unlikely they would risk their Reputations & Jobs on something that does not work Nor be involved with false documentation.

          • Barry

            Don’t worry Omega, Obama pulled the plug on the cash cow.

        • Max S

          Rossi´s employee who supervised the tests is Fulvio Fabiani, who is listed in linkedin as Tech Director Leonardo Corporation (Miami – USA) and also consultant for European Gaming and Gambling Tech Market.

  • Francesco

    Well…domestic e-cat is in the hands of certifiers and if we are lucky it will be certified in one year…hot cat is being sold but all the buyers want to remain secret…production of electricity will occur in one year…
    I was really convinced (maybe I misunderstood something I read) that the world could get the news that e-cat is real, possible and proven to work by the end of this year, but at this point I doubt it, unless I missed some information.
    What is really important for me, before the sale of e-cats, is that the world knows that e-cat is real and works for good; I think that this news can start a revolution and start to change things in a positive way even if the product is not yet certified and sold.
    Ing. Rossi wrote that by the end of the year the theory will be published, but at this point my fear is that there will be a further delay, or maybe there will be something published that does not give the final proof that the device works and does all the wonderful things we’ve been told.
    Don’t get me wrong, I always think that this is not a scam and I know that with certifications and new products the forecasts are a bit risky, but now I’m a bit lost and I really can’t figure out when the world will have the proof that e-cat is real.
    Frank, if I missed some information or you have any information that can clarify this I would be grateful

    • admin

      Hi Francesco,

      It is not the hot cat, but the 1 MW E-Cat (low temp.) that is on the market at the moment.

      • Francesco

        you’re right Frank, sorry for the confusion with names, but my question remains: is there any forecast as of today (for any kind of e-cat) about when the mainstream science and media will be able to accept Rossi’s technology as something real? Reading the news from your web site I thought that by the end of this year it would have been possible, but reading the latest news my impression is that it will not happen soon, unless I missed something. Is this correct in your opinion or do I miss some info?

        • Ivan_Cev

          Does not matter if Hot or Warm ecat is proven, only a prove of the working principle is needed.

      • telecommuter

        We have only Rossi’s word that anything has been sold.
        It seems highly unlikely that every one of the customers would not want to use their purchase to promote their own company/product.

  • edog

    Just bumping this up to the top of the page.. from the Captains post below.

    Very interesting! but does it work.. is it hot or cold fusion?

    Who is Star Scientific?


    • captain

      It’s a so called HOT E-CAT with T up to 1,000C and more, but very likely in due time to make hot dry steam at 600C and efficiently drive turbines to make electricity.

      Thus an hot E-Cat working very well without taxpayers’money vs the so called Hot Fusion that so far has proved to be only a voracious eater of taxpayers’ money.

      • edog

        Hi Captain.
        The Star Scientific website is great. Loads of info there.

        I hope they can pull it off..

        I wish Rossi could publish a website of this quality with pictures, information and results.

      • GreenWin

        “This [muon-based]fusion gives us energetic neutrons, which are easily converted to heat in a pressurised water reactor…”

        i.e. Heavy electron or “muon” D-D fusion -> E+He. Energetic neutrons (14.03MeV) are extremely dangerous requiring heavy shielding and radiation protections. But hey, still better than fission.

        • edog

          Yep, its like ITERs hot fusion but way cooler… and looks like it might actually be possible to commercialise

          • Ivan_Cev

            star scientific, is a charitable org, in Australia, I doubt they do more that nice videos.
            If any one is aware of real work by this org. please mention it.
            Muon catalyzed nuclear fusion is as far as hot fusion.

          • edog

            looks like they are actually making measurement on some of their devices, that they have made.. the website pictures look nice 🙂

            Looks like they have spent a lot of the charity money on cnc lathes, and testing instruments and computer banks? ?

            They say they have a way to creat cheap pions??
            Sounds more feasible than the ecat

          • Iggy Dalrymple

            Sounds more feasible than the ecat

            Has it achieved overunity? There have been hundreds of instances of overunity with LENR.

          • edog

            technically yes.

  • jacob

    Thank you Frank and Andrea Rossi for this information in the questions and answers you have provided.

    Now that the production of industrial low temp E-cats is well under way as I have expected a while ago,it is also appearent now, that things are actually settling down,so focus can be on manufacturing.

    Mr.Rossi you are right ,to keep information selective,so not to worry the cartells to much,so you can keep on building somewhat in peace.

    But don’t relax just yet,many wolves come in sheeps clothing.

    To make demonstrations to interested parties has to be selective.

    Mr. Rossi I know you have made E-cat successful,and as your orders increase little by little , success comes with each happy customer,that owns an E-cat.

    May the force always be with you,in your very important hard work.
    To advance humanity is very nobel.

  • jacob

    thanks Mr Rossi for the answers you have provided,you are succeeding in your hard work,your industrial E-cats will be a success according to current economic conditions.
    But it all takes a little longer than expected,never the less you have made great progress and good time under the circumstances.

  • jacob

    Considering Bruce Depalma and his homo polar generator with over unity between 2 and 7.7,was not able to get it of the ground to manufacture any units.
    Considering Stanley Meyer driving cars on water paid for it dearly.
    Considering Paul Baumanns Testatika with infinite over unity of a self running 3000watt generator,run by space time energy alone,working units exist in operation today in der Schweiz.

    People have to keep in mind,Rossi was smart enough to know how to fool those who control the energy by letting them think it is not a huge threat
    to their trillions in profits,I hope he continues on that road.

    • Alexvs

      To not forget the Bessler wheel.

    • clovis

      Yes, thanks, Dr. Rossi I for one think you have been very kind to keep our group here on e cat-world, so well informed. we all share in your victory’s and your set backs,
      And hope we might be of some assistance to you, in some way,
      just give the word and we will do our best, these are exciting times, and you sir lead in this journey into a brave new further, and thanks again for keeping us well informed,—clovis

      • clovis

        And thanks also Frank, you get a ata boy. smile

    • Ash

      De Palma, Meyer and Baumann were all con artists and flakes.

      Baumann was in jail for child molestation when he came up with his BS for gods sake!

      • GreenWin

        Keep hangin’ onto that anger Ash. Maybe all you have left.

      • jacob

        you guess?without proof?without research?

  • Robert Mockan

    Mr. Rossi, how might the world be different today if you had publicized exactly how to make the LENR catalyst? And thousands of scientists and engineers had been working to improve it and market products the past few years, instead of just…you?

    It is not too late to do the right thing.

    The toll is mounting, Rossi.


    • Alexvs

      Answering your questions would be cruel.

      • edog

        Alexvs. I dont understand your statement?
        I do totally agree with Robert M.

        Rossi has gone about this the wrong way.. in my opinion.

        • alexvs

          Me too. I mean I agree too with him.But the right answer: Mr. Rossi has nothing, the whole E-Cat story is an, intentional or not, scam. Given the expectations aroused the answer is cruel.
          I do not know if you will get my response. You know, I am an unpleasant poster.

          • GreenWin

            alexvs, I beg to differ. An unpleasant poster is four color art depicting a giant python crushing a beautiful young girl to death. Title it, GREED.

          • Barry

            I went to an Andy Warhol exhibit and saw some unpleasant posters.

          • GreenWin

            I did too Barry. AND I saw unpleasant posers…

    • Bernie Koppenhofer

      Robert: Offer him 500 million and find out, payoff only if it works. Or, force the “powers to be” to let our patent offices issue him a patent.

      • Robert Mockan

        If I had 500 million I would do what needs to be done. Form an LLC (Limited Liability Company) business incubator designed to provide the research facilities for advanced technology development and transfer for social benefit. The scientists and researchers who become members would defer their maximum wage earnings to share profits after product marketing, in return to having access to the laboratories and equipment to develop their ideas. Selling licenses or selling products, everybody wins.

        But then we have people like Rossi with old school business thinking who may very well be sitting on the technology 2 years, 5 years, even 10 years , from now.

        The catalyst is the key for LENR. Make that information available, and the world goes on the fast track to change, tomorrow!

    • Jim

      The path to greatest reduction of suffering may not be through general release of the secret sauce. It might impair Rossi’s acquire to generate capital to drive his R&D. The people who receive the secret sauce may not be as competent. Others may attempt to obfuscate. Governments might attempt to seize control. Patent trolls may emerge in force.

      I doubt there’s anything in Rossi’s secret sauce that adequate capital couldn’t learn within a few months. There is ample evidence to justify investment. Where are the investors?

      It’s always interesting to ask how many politically or economically preventable deaths occur each minute, but Rossi doesn’t need or deserve this extra burden.

      • Iggy Dalrymple

        Were it not for the profit motive there would be no Rossi and cold fusion would be a faint memory. There would be no ecatworld and do-gooders would be stuck with helping old ladies cross the street. The psycho-skeps would have to settle for $50/day doing “Occupy”.

        • Robert Mockan

          I respectfully disagree. I think, and create, not because of a profit motive, but for the satisfaction of knowing that the symbolical representation of reality, that is my mind, is congruent with reality, as proven by being able to design and build workable solutions to problems. If my understanding were not correct (if my representation of reality in my mind was in error), the solutions to problems would be unworkable. Yes, I need money to live in this world, a consequence of living in a world that uses money the way this does. But if I were provided with the facilities, equipment, and information resources, required to continue to think, and create, and grow, in mind, without a need for money to “support myself”, or a job to “earn a living”, then I would have no need for money.

          What I have just described is the personality of every true scientist, and artist, and indeed, of all creative peoples.

          Except of course those who want to “make money”, and feel they have accomplished important things by becoming “rich”, and more often than not, “powerful”. There is just one small detail such people neglect. In the monetary system of fractional reserve fiat currency they are “allowed” to live under, they can only “make money”, by taking it from some one else, or, as in the case of “government”, counterfeiting money out of thin air (literally).

          So there would still be a Rossi, but a Rossi who could take a giant leap for sanity, by disclosing exactly how the LENR catalyst he is using is made!

          • Robert Mockan on October 2, 2012 at 5:52 am:

            “I respectfully disagree. I think, and create, not because of a profit motive, but for the satisfaction of knowing that the symbolical representation of reality, that is my mind, is congruent with reality, a …”

            Of course you disagree, your supposed ‘reality’ being ‘real’ to yourself only, and which ‘reality’ does not work to pay the bills NOR does it work to pay others to work on your behalf (e.g. machinists, electrical controls engineers, mech engineers who have bills to pay and are in turn are paid by Rossi and company to __DO__ things).

            Such ‘idealists’ as your self do not actually work in the ‘real’ world, only, it would seem, in your mind. That kind of work does not actually do anything practical, until coupled to action externally, either by yourself or the direction you give others, along with the _pay_ they need to continue their existence in the case of engineering and trade professionals; after all, someone has to ‘pay the freight’ for labor and materials.

            Regards, _Jim

    • G_Zingh

      Poor Rossi, he has to deal with clowns, snakes, death threats, patent office obstructionists, back stabbing licensees, jealous competitors, Mafia influenced Italian politics, hate mongering anti-Rossi web sites and journalists, and the stress of 16 hour work days in bringing a revolutionary new product to market.

      And now he has the blood of 25 thousand children on his hands.

      No wonder he writes all in CAPITAL LETTERS.

      • Ivan_Cev

        You forgot He has to deal with himself too.

        • Jim


          • Peter_Roe

            Judging by some of the posts today, they are feeding so well they’ve even invited some of their friends..

    • LilyLover

      (When I say ‘you’ it does not mean literally you, Robert.)

      Some of you seem to have a view that hunger/poverty deaths could be preventable if Rossi went open source as public charity.
      One must understand that these death are preventable even without Rossi’s E-Cats.
      Earth produces 110%+ of the food it needs. If people are dying, it’s because of lack of backbone in their parents.
      Your parent’s did not have courage to fight injustice and value their labor proportionately. This has put you at a disadvantage.
      Therefore, you are helpless. May you stop perpetuating this for the sake of your children.
      If your cowardice weighs more than your love towards your children, they deserve to be extinct.
      To maintain a strong herd, the weak should die. Do they need to? No.
      Should they in a human/e society? No.
      But our society is not humane yet.

      The tolerance of aggression is supporting the suppression.
      Unless, each and every individual can exercise fractional lending practices with the same reserve requirement as the banks, no society can ever be

      considered equal or educated.

      When people allow themselves to be pushed into “stratified equalness”, in Capitalism or ANY other-ism, the ‘Tragedy of The Commons’ ensues.

      Considering all this-
      If Rossi went “charitable” or open source – He would not have enough money to propagate his product & neither would anyone else.
      By going in it for a business – He’d have people that would have lives dependent on it. He’d have a strong & brave nexus of vested interest. Even if it

      meant fighting against “the Powers”. 1000 tiny spikes can be squashed easily but Walmart cannot be killed, even by the ‘united Powers”.
      Even if the Powers tried, rich Rossi has a higher probability of staying alive and posing a threat to the Threats. (Remember his comment about paid

      snakes?) Ability to hire Francisco Scaramanga to keep the E-Cat alive is more important for it’s success than short sighted charity. (Since bankers have

      pocketed JB.)

      Therefore, businessman Rossi is more benevolent than open-source Rossi.
      & to those who say: “Rossi is a convicted villain”
      Correction: Rossi was convicted by villains.

      And, yes, even if it turns out that Rossi Rossi can’t add 2+2, let alone the complex Physics; I’ll still not hold this against him, since, the awareness he has brought, is more than MSM ever did in the last 50 years!!

      Let him be rich. It’s good for you, too.
      And may be in 30 years, we’ll find that St. Rossi, lived like an intern & donated all his money to the ‘First Real Agenda-Free Charity’.
      (Hey, Andrea, I don’t mean to put pressure on you – be rich & enjoy life. You’ll still do more than mother Teressa.)

      Good day.

    • telecommuter

      Rossi hasn’t produced commercial products.
      It is a huge step to think that, even if Rossi’s systems are producing excess heat, that his publishing what he does know would change anything.
      If he, who knows his stuff best, can’t get it commercially working, why would someone else? At the same time, there are lots of other published papers on experiments that produce excess heat. What’s keeping others from using those results?
      Finally, what is the estimated cost of electricity using LENR/CF vs what’s currently available? It’s not free. The question is how will the price of electricity be affected?

    • GreenWin

      Robert, while you may be right in long term effect, we live in a material world (last I checked) and invention regardless of importance is still the intellectual property of the inventor. What exasperates many is he has been open source on the development process. This is mainly to prevent cartels and mafia science from stealing or suppressing his invention.

      I have no problem with him making big bucks on his invention. Hey, the Gordon Gekkos (Wall St) of the world make billions pushing worthless paper around. Military black projects have warehouses of life-saving technologies, big pharma has cures for rhinovirus, diabetes, MS and maybe cancer – but they don’t publish or produce them. You know why.

      We need to restart the Edisonian method of creative technology and remove it from failed monopolies like hot fusion. Should we ask Intel to publish their proprietary machine code? Should we demand Apple give their designs to China for mass cloning? Rossi uses his own money and will deliver LENR to the market when no previous inventor or business has. Let him work in his own eccentric, quixotic way. I deeply appreciate what he’s done so far.

      • Robert Mockan

        If a family member was dying of a disease, and you had a cure, would you seek monetary compensation and recognition for your “intellectual property” before offering the cure? How about a town of people, some of whom are your friends. Would you help? Or first want to get paid? What if you do not personally know any of the people? Would that make a difference? What if we have a city, state, country? And what you decide to do can save them all.
        But only if you act now, and not wait. Think of all the reasons for waiting. To convince them you can help them? After all, they may not believe you. To be paid? But maybe they will not buy the cure, because they do not believe it works. Even if a few buy the cure, most may not. And maybe you want to wait until they say you own the “intellectual property” of the cure.

        Meanwhile, the toll of the dead and dying keeps rising.

        So what do you do? Where do you draw the line about when to help?

        Among those people there are many others who could design the cure, make it, and show others how to make it, and provide it to all who need it. But unfortunately they are not in a position to do so. Maybe they are among the dying. Who knows all the reasons? But you have the cure. You could help.

        In this little story of course the “you” refers to Rossi.
        And he has drawn a line in the sand between the living and dying.

        How many readers here would draw the line where Rossi has?

        Not me.

        • tappanjack

          Robert: You paint a severe scenario to underscore your reality that a “need” automatically generates a “demand” and if that demand is enforced it would constitute a taking. You say if your needs are satisfied then you would not have need of money. Will your needs be satisfied by a taking also? I do not understand a world without a means of exchange. History records it only degrades to a taking with a club to the head or a gun pointed at the head. As it stands a person is rewarded for their innovation and work with a monetary value, anything else allows for your reality.
          By the way how did your person (Rossi) come up with the cure to begin with?

          • Robert Mockan

            If the demand were enforced it would indeed constitute a taking. That is not what I suggest.
            People will not change the way they think about these kind of issues easily. A voluntary giving, without coercion or force being used, to the future, being its own reward, is a concept that will always remain foreign to minds that perceive themselves as separate entities. To change the way people think is a philosophical issue, not political. This is not to say a medium of exchange is not useful, merely that it should be of very limited focus, and not be a means to all ends. Unfortunately money as a tool for coercion and control has become the norm, to such an extent that people are largely unaware of how it is being used in that way. Here is one of hundreds of convenient links that discuss how the monetary system as it presently exists was used to also do exactly what you commented about “degrades to a taking”, because that aspect of human nature, to take, will always find a way to manifest itself unless people learn to perceive reality a bit differently than conditioned, and resist that fundamental aspect of their nature.

          • Robert Mockan on October 2, 2012 at 4:40 pm

            “If the demand were enforced …”

            Sounds like you could get that down through government edict, as in a fascist manner … is that what you truly desire Robert?

            You do not like freedom nor advocate the right for people to be free to do as they see fit … would that be correct?

            Regards, _Jim

        • GreenWin

          Robert, I appreciate your thoughts and watched your link on “anarchy.” Where we differ is as tappanjack notes, about need and demand. I subscribe to a world that recognizes the value of exchange. Since barter is unwieldy, monetary instruments are convenient. And as we live in a world enamored of and prescribed by game play, based on competition, one excels by applying their unique skills and abilities to the game.

          But to take your example, let’s apply it to an advanced race of beings – call them “foreigners.” They are essentially galactic anthropologists fascinated by disparate cultures. But they also subscribe to a galactic precaution, something like the Trekkie “Prime Directive.” This is a law that says advanced civilizations may not interfere in any way with the natural development of a primitive civilization.

          This means that intelligent foreigners fully capable of delivering wondrous cures, life-saving technology, spirit-expanding wisdom, cannot do so. By galactic law agreed upon by the greater community. These foreigners then stand by, observing primitive cultures, sick, dying, warring – and they do nothing. Are they wrong?? Is the greater community wrong? When do they break their “law” and act with compassion?

          • Robert Mockan

            Perhaps they break their “law” when some faction of the primitive culture gains such power and control that the future of the “primitive” culture is in doubt, and if allowed to continue to exist, might threaten the peace of the cosmos?

            Just kidding, of course. But would it not be interesting if the insane oligarchs, and their puppets in governments, corporations, and central banking, that presently control this world, were to suddenly be eradicated from the universe?

            Seriously though, when do they break their “law”?

            The answer is they do not. They change it, or eliminate it, and then choose to help, or not, depending on their own nature.

            But people in the “primitive” culture could also choose to help themselves, to rid themselves of the obstacles preventing such, and that would, in my opinion, reveal a far greater worth to their existence than hoping for others to help them.

          • georgehants

            GreenWin, If I may, your analogy of the superior beings is always a dilemma, but they, as you say, do not in any way interfere to cause the problem in the first place.
            African tribes lived for millions of years with clearly successful survival techniques, but now the rich countries interfere with the natural flow of nature, to make profits and powerful influences.
            How does one not interfere, I think impossible in this age and therefore, if one must interfere it should be by recognising that everything on the Earth is one family and there should be no borders or inequalities.
            Only by stopping the rich and powerful from gaining their privileges from inherited advantage and replacing it with only people who earn that advantage by being rewarded for service to society and the World will a form of benevolent equality arise.

          • GreenWin

            Each of you George and Robert argue to intercede as is IMO morally correct. The danger of course with different levels of intelligence, or evolution, as with my “Foreigners,” is inadvertent trauma resulting from culture shock. It’s a complex problem.

            You see my point however, that moral dilemma is not restricted to Rossi, or intellectual property concepts.

            Because this world is designed in the form of holographic game play – it invokes, in fact demands competition. Competition demands separation. Until the world’s designers wake up to the failure of gaming as a viable habitat – separation will continue.

            However, I agree with you both, as you are both intimating the same concept, i.e. the oneness or universality of consciousness. What must not be lost however is natural diversity. This is in my view an endemic part of the creation. Examine with a magnifier in winter any snow flake… they are each unique, beautiful and different. Diversity, individuality walks hand in hand with oneness. Such is the intent of the creation.

            George, be careful not to dismiss the concept of intergenerational care. If your father leaves his house and fortune to you, you have inherited privilege. Should that be outlawed? Should we neutralize genetic bias and create a species of drone beings each with the same exact genetic coding? The creation’s infinite diversity (e.g. the cosmos) says NO.

            Personally I see Rossi forging a way to unseat the PTB and insane oligarchs, and liberate a culture trapped in their matrix. He’s got EXCELLENT help! It may not be smoothly heroic or ordered to satisfy his critics. But it is happening on a regular, daily basis. And IMO, that is far better than anything we have seen from mainstream.

        • LilyLover

          If your family member was dying of a disease, and you had the cure – then what would you do, cure one person vs send it to the labs to replicate to cure millions at the expense of your favorite person, while there is a constant threat to your life for possessing the cure?

          • Robert Mockan

            It would go to the labs.

            If we were to apply that scenario to Rossi, “go to the labs”, would be equivalent to describing to the world how to make the catalyst.

          • Robert Mockan on October 3, 2012 at 1:06 am

            “It would go to the labs. …”

            Who is paying ‘the labs’?

            I see too many contradictions, leaps of faith and a total disregard for practices and procedure in the ‘real world’ as to your various prescriptions … pardon me, but may I inquire as to your age?

            10, 11, or 12?

            Regards, _Jim

  • AB

    Passerini hints at a university report coming out this month.

    1) October 12, Polo Tecnologico di Pordenone – E-Cat

    2) October [omitted], University [omitted] – surprise!

    3) October 20, IIS Pirelli of Rome – Athanor/Hydrobetatron

    • daniel maris

      Passerini normally seems to have some knowledge of what’s going on…interesting.

    • Omega Z


      If it’s from Passerini, that’s good news.

      Personally, I figured this would be pushed into November because of things that’s taken place with the measurements & such.

      We’ve posted to each other quite sometime back when I stated I expected a report from 2 & possibly a 3rd University.

      I still think 2 is a good possibility, but would add that It may be University personnel, Not the University itself.

      That said, I hope I’m surprised & it’s actually published with Full University support/validation even if it’s just 1. To me that would definitely be a game changer.

      However, If this isn’t the game changer, I still expect one in the near future. Based on what Cures has said, a definitive point is coming. He’s looking forward to it.

      Sadly, That wont be the end of the Hard Core Skeptics. They’ll change tack & try to prevent it from coming to market with safety issues & such. The Battle goes on.

  • jaques

    A very defensive Andrea Rossi this time. Perhaps he learned from the poker player!

  • daniel maris

    Well Rossi has made some small steps towards convincing us – not least the SGS certificate and the fact that he has allowed independent testing.

    HOwever, he needs to do a lot more and more “Rossi says” won’t do it.

    • Redford

      Define “a lot more”. Some people have a tendancie to move the goal post. I think it’s pretty typical. Here comes, for the 2nd time after Levi, 3rd party verification. Some people will not believe it until it’s a fact of life and they get heated in their own home. Why not, but in that case, following this story is pointless. People here should have the discipline to define a line where they’ll start to take a stance – or resign on their right to demand anything.

      • Good analysis.
        Doubt is so comfortable, like belief is for some.
        Many people about LENR make an anti-Pascal’s Wager (like some free energy do a Pascal’s Wager). They are much more afraid to be wrong than to miss the truth…

        If people have a real incentive to predict the real fact they will do better prediction, and have more rationaly chosen doubts… This happens often on financial market or british bookmakers gambles (often very different from polls, and more exacts)…

        imagine that a gang of Russion mafia propose you bet one month of salary, double or lose, freely on or against the reality of LENR, or being intermediately gunned

        People will have big incentive to weight the pro and the cons with similar weight, like an entrepreneur would do…

        If you have nothing to lose, or win, you take the easy bet… believe of deny… not weighting.

  • Robyn

    I believe that CF/LENR is fast becoming a reality. And I give Rossi benefit of the doubt. He has no obligation to me, or my eagerness.

    But boy, I’ll tell you, that’s a rough interview. For three out of eleven questions, it was all equivocation and evasion. If I were a news editor, I would not publish this article. It doesn’t fall in the category of news, since there is so little specified.

    7. I THINK SO…
    9. MAYBE

    Here is my question: On August 11, Rossi made this statement:



    I recall University of Bologna releasing a letter “there is no formal relationship between the University of Bologna” and Rossi regarding the e-cat.

    Today is October 1st, and I think the question is, was this a valid statement? Are we going to see “the results published by Univ. of Bologna”?

    Admin: I posed this question to JONP, and it was moderated out. I don’t know why. Any thoughts?

    • Ged

      It’s a good question! I think we’ll know soon enough. There are rumors of an approaching university report, and we’ve seen a great deal of testing going on. So, hm. I wonder if the Bologna idea is outdated now, or if it was all “unofficial” and at the discretion of individual professors. So many ways to wiggle words around.

      • Ivan_Cev

        6. How soon will it be before people will be able to visit a working 1 MW plant?


        This mean we will never see the offered independent demos and measures, and the ones will report are the ones “QUALIFIED” by Rossi.

        Is a theatre because Rossi does not allow for serious testing.

    • Omega Z


      You problem was mentioning a University by Name. This will get your post sent to never, never land.

      Names cause a lot of behind the scenes problems.

      I assume Rossi blocks certain things of this nature not so much for himself, but for those he works with. Being named on an open blog can lead to some very heavy harassment of that person or Entity. Even threats.

      • Robyn

        I get your point.

        But it is frustrating, because I was merely quoting him.

        In my question on JONP I didn’t mention the part about University of Bologna saying “there is no formal relationship”. I just quoted him and asked if there were any updates.

        I’ve said this before: he doesn’t owe me anything – not event the truth. I could be someone out to sabotage his efforts, or a competitor. And certainly the stakes are very high. But it’s hard to be clear on anything he says in the best of times. I just thought this was a clear enough quote.

        • Omega Z


          Yes, If you posted whats above, that would make it disappear. LENR is controversial to start & in Italy even more so. When Rossi slipped & named Unibo, there was quite a fuss about it in the Italian press. I also noticed when Unibo disavowed the connection, they also left the door open by saying Unibo & their facilities were available to Rossi if he so chose. There is no formal agreement, but there could be an informal agreement. It’s all semantics. Time will tell all.

          So you know, I posted their several times before, but my last few must have apparently raised flags. They disappeared. Now if I just post hello it disappears, Not even moderated. It is frustrating, but I understand he has to be cautious.
          Note that the Blog software does most of this automatically. Rossi probably never seen it.

  • Alex

    The time was enough to register a minimum of 10 patents, hopefully in December 2012 the world will end, and let rossi sucking her thumb along with his ganâcia.

  • jos

    Hi guys, after several years of following this forum, I have come to the conclusion that you obviously want to believe that the new messiah will bring major technology advances to the world. Wake up, he is a nut case who is full of self importance and will NEVER and I mean NEVER produce a working, peer reviewed product…You can offer him as many millions as you like but it will for ever end up in promises that all will be revealed some day in the future.

    • freethinker

      And every now and again somebody like you, being incapable of opening his eyes and see LENR as it is, has to share his two cent worth. Well buhu. We will see, wont we, what AR has or has not. In the end it doesnt matter what he has or how gullible you think we are. LENR is real, and if AR fails others will realize this technology.

      • jedslater

        Amen 🙂

      • Ivan_Cev

        Rossi, can not fail, failure will make him a con Artist!

        • GreenWin

          W?? Does that apply to thousands of hot fusionists??

      • telecommuter

        Your response is a non sequitur. The post was referring to Rossi – your response was about LENR. The two are completely different.

    • captain

      U’ve choosen the wrong blog for posting your messages. Plz…

      Ah, I was forgetting, it’s the time when some …animals… change their skin 🙁

      • Ivan_Cev

        I did not know this is a forum for dogmatics only

  • Auenland

    “6. How soon will it be before people will be able to visit a working 1 MW plant?


    The energy revolution, a billion dollar business waiting for Rossi, and he hides his product and his customers…

    I think everyone can answer the question if an inventor, that has been claiming talking was nothing, the working products count, would act this way.
    Rossi is wasting the time and good believe of thousands of people!
    This answer is a hit in the face of all who have not yet written him off.

    • freethinker

      In no way is this a hit in the face. What did you expect? An open invitation to everybody to stampede into this specific customer’s location? Ofcorse not. If anything it is a demonstration of prudence. He will not turn it into a show. And dont worry about his other customers, any serious bidder will most likely be seen as”Qualified” by AR.

      • Miles

        This is just regurgitated information we already know.

        The repetitive questions to Rossi is borderline harassment & bickering. Please “sit down”… it is still early days.

      • telecommuter

        Once a customer has bought something, it is up to them who they allow to see what they bought.
        I just can’t believe you take at face value everything that Rossi says.
        Since he has no authority over who sees what his customers have bought, it is a huge red flag that he is saying that ‘he’ has control. It raises the high probability that there are no customers – he has sold nothing.

        • Ivan_Cev

          correct… this is the logical frame for the answer.

    • Redford

      “The energy revolution, a billion dollar business waiting for Rossi, and he hides his product and his customers…”

      Actually, as long as he ships only 1MW, he just needs to show his product on appointment, which is what he seems to be already doing for years. It’s B2B, not B2C (yet). So getting the hassle of B2C without its income is not a very sensible move.

      That being said, I am more concerned by this one :

      10. How many non-military E-Cat plants have been ordered so far?

      The way I see it the most plausible reason why this would be confidential is because the number is low. I bet he sold none to very few.

      • Ivan_Cev

        See the former report: (sep 24)
        “Part 6 – Andrea Rossi and Tesla’s dream
        Rossi is ready to sell 1MW thermal plants to civilian customers, last year he sold one to a military customer since they have no problems with safety certifications. The plant in Bologna used for the october 2011 presentation had many faults and it is still there because he build a second one for the military. He estimates the life of a plant is 20-30 years and the cost is repaid after 3 years at most.”

  • LilyLover

    My post went in the wrong location…
    (When I say ‘you’ it does not mean literally you, Robert.)

    Some of you seem to have a view thathunger/poverty deaths could be preventable if Rossi went open source as public charity.
    One must understand that these death are preventable even without Rossi’s E-Cats.
    Earth produces 110%+ of the food it needs. If people are dying, it’s because of lack of backbone in their parents.
    Your parent’s did not have courage to fight injustice and value their labor proportionately. This has put you at a disadvantage.
    Therefore, you are helpless. May you stop perpetuating this for the sake of your children.
    If your cowardice weighs more than your love towards your children, they deserve to be extinct.
    To maintain a strong herd, the weak should die. Do they need to? No.
    Should they in a human/e society? No.
    But our society is not humane yet.

    The tolerance of aggression is supporting the suppression.
    Unless, each and every individual can exercise fractional lending practices with the same reserve requirement as the banks, no society can ever be considered equal or educated.

    When people allow themselves to be pushed into “stratified equalness”, in Capitalism or ANY other-ism, the ‘Tragedy of The Commons’ ensues.

    Considering all this-
    If Rossi went “charitable” or open source – He would not have enough money to propagate his product & neither would anyone else.
    By going in it for a business – He’d have people that would have lives dependent on it. He’d have a strong & brave nexus of vested interest. Even if it meant fighting against “the Powers”. 1000 tiny spikes can be squashed easily but Walmart cannot be killed, even by the ‘united Powers”.
    Even if the Powers tried, rich Rossi has a higher robability of stayign alive and posing a threat to the Threats. (Remember his comment about paid snakes?) Ability to hire Francisco Scaramanga to keep the E-Cat alive is more important for it’s success than short sighted charity. (Since bankers have pocketed JB.)

    Therefore, businessman Rossi is more benevolent than open-source Rossi.
    To those who say: “Rossi is a convicted villain”
    Correction: Rossi was convicted by villains.

    And, yes, even if it turns out that Rossi Rossi can’t add 2+2, let alone the complex Physics; I’ll still not hold this against him, since, the awareness he has brought, is more than MSM ever did in the last 50 years!!

    Let him be rich. It’s good for you, too.
    And may be in 30 years, we’ll find that St. Rossi, lived like an intern & donated all his money to the ‘First Real Agenda-Free Charity’.
    (Hey, Andrea, I don’t mean to put pressure on you – be rich & enjoy life. You’ll still do more than mother Terressa.)

    Good day.

    • Auenland

      Every five days PLUS 100.000 mouths of the most greedy and dangerous species on this planet!!!
      You are talking like a blind one about colors.

      The explosion of the population of our species has been a result of CHEAP ENERGY.
      How can anyone believe that making energy even more cheap would solve anything? That’s nonsense!

      The only cause of the problems for this planet is the explosion of the species of the homo sapiens and if Rossi would have a working unit (which he doesn’t), then maybe oil will no longer rise in price, but the investment of the next century will be agrar.
      In fact the E-Cat would make everything even worse. Much worse.

      • Auenland

        Every five days PLUS 1.000.000 (ONE MILLION!) mouths of the most greedy and dangerous species on this planet!!!

        • Omega Z


          Having studied a Population growth Map of the World, Nearly ALL population growth comes from impoverished Countries.

          Developed Countries gain nearly all population growth from immigration from the impoverished countries, Where Population growth rates can be as high as 6 to 1.

          Even Developed Countries with their own population growth are near zero.

          As an Example, The U.S. requires a population replacement rate of 2.1 for Zero growth. It presently stands at 1.86 or less. Without immigration over the last 25 years, the U.S. population would have peeked & been starting to decline.

          Japan’s Population is already in decline. They expect a 30% population drop by 2050. Japan’s Government is very supportive of Robot development. It’s to compensate for the lost manpower needed for maintaining an aging population.

          The real facts don’t fit your scenario.

          The Myth that most people believe including myself at 1 time is impoverished countries have a high birth rate to allow for the fact that many wont survive to adult hood & thus children to care for you in old age. WRONG. By the way I always thought this was counter productive as it meant more would die of malnutrition & the diseases that follow.

          In reality, The high birth rate is their way of counting wealth. Which would explain why even easy access to Birth Control has very mixed results. This Info comes straight from the source. The people themselves.

          As the interview provide no follow up or reasoning with it, I can only speculate (Where this wealth) that it comes from the long practiced Dowry system. Your Son can marry my Daughter in return for 2 camels, 1 goat, & 5 chickens. This is just a piece of a much larger picture focused around family wealth. Not nearly as simplistic as my speculation seams.

          With Cheap Energy comes higher standards of living & a change in views of wealth. This would not be immediately followed by a reduction in population growth. It would require at least 1 full generation for attitudes to change. Virtually a death of the old replaced by the new.

          As an example, A 1st generation immigrant who migrates from a country with a high birth rate. The 2nd generation drops to the U.S. norm on average.

          • edog

            good points

          • Auenland

            Not good points at all.
            Take a look at the energy and resource consumption per capita!
            Take a look how many cars/capita the industrialized countries compared to China have. Then compare this to the rest of the world! If they would have the same standard of living it would be game over.

            Instead the globalists spread propaganda, that mother earth could bear even more billions of our species – it would only be a matter of distribution. This is insane propaganda propaganda for exponential growth, nothing else.

            The economical system of the Plutcracies which call themselfes Democracies, is based on money as debt and interest slavery. This means that the economy must GROW exponentially, otherwise the whole system collapses.

            All the huge progress technology wise in the industrial countries is eaten up by the insane force to growth.
            Today we consume per capita as double as much energy as in the 1970s!

            It’s absolutely ridiculous to believe, that cheaper energy would change anything.
            Cheap energy is the source of the problems and even cheaper energy will make things much much worse for mother nature.
            But it’s the question anyway, if a species as dangerous as the homo sapiens that believes it was standing above the laws of biology and would be chosen to suppress nature, if this species is not an evolutionary doomed species anyway. At least it seems that people who would like to follow a reasonable politics, BIOPOLITICS, instead of thousands of years old religions, are such a minority that this kind of politics has no chance at all.

            Hoping that LENR will do any good to mother nature is ignorant, not to say stupid.

            If there is anything that needs to be done to help this planet, then money as debt and the exponential growth of debt due to compound interest would need to be abandoned, forbidden and punished by death.

          • georgehants

            Good points Auenland but I don’t know about the death penalty, maybe just put in the stocks for a month or two.

          • LilyLover

            Irony it is that the Money As Debt can instill exactly opposite effect in your imagination than what it should. Remember, Kim always says, infinete energy and money cannot coexist. I agree.

          • GreenWin

            Does this mean it’s okay to shoot a loan shark… er, banker??

          • LilyLover

            Not the Bankers, the Money.
            Well, personally, I won’t mind present-day Bankers (not ht banking staff) getting shot… but my view on this topic is…
            BUT yes, I agree Robert thinks too highly of the PTB, or, Current Controllers, as I like to call them. They may control the present, but the future is ours.
            & That includes them too, but at our level and not at a higher level or a lower level.
            Our parents punished us through their cowardice & complacency; if we punish the controllers children for their parent’s aggression; what makes us different?

          • georgehants

            Both Rossi and Defkalion have stated that they will give some testing results shortly.
            With Rossi who outwardly appears to work in a fly by the seat of one’s pants, Heath Robinson type of way, a delay will just be par for the course and those who wish can, without abuse, continue to follow or return to watching T.V. soap operas as they choose.
            With Defkalion, a completely different kettle of fish, they like to put across a professional, competent, under-control, persona and if they delay I think their reputation will fall markedly.

          • Auenland

            Rossi also promised that his 2nd customer will be revealed.

            Rossi claimed to have fully robotized factory for the home E-Cats.

            He also is the CEO of the one and only company in the world, where the huge delay of the main product, the home E-Cat, is no problem at all!
            Rossi not only has the energy miracle invented, but also the first comapny that doesn’t need urgently cashflow as startup…

            And what kind of investors does he have, that they are not interested in FACTS but rely on his promises? I mean Rossi claims the 1MW unit would be in the market already, but he keeps potential customers away and hides the product! Great value creation for stakeholders…

            And he is the first CEO in the world, who hides his revolutionary product instead of showing the world! Funnily this CEO travels around and always says, that talking was nothing, the products count!

            He also is the most progressive CEO ever: his “company” only communicates via blog. Also this company doesn’t make any official announcements.

            And it has no professional homepage, where potential customers and investors can inform themselfes! Instead write to the CEO privately…

            Rossi also had promised that the 1MW unit will be presented at a factory in the USA. IIRC even a live-stream was announced.

            If Rossi is not a liar or scammer, then he must be the worst CEO of the worst company on the whole wide planet.

          • Alan DeAngelis

            Other companies have patent protection.

          • captain

            Rossi,,, Rossi… and… and… if… if…
            IMHO U’d better to post in another blog instead of this one, where to get more satisfaction.

            And I remember that we’re in a season when …certain animals… change their skin… 🙁

          • N810

            Realy, Eccentric Geniuses are eccentric ?

            … go figure.

          • captain

            Dunno if Rossi eccentric or not, but if positive, I’d figure a second corp. in his hands, say LEOPARD Corp.
            In this case he’d be anyhow successful in making luxury lady hand bags with snakes’ skin 🙁
            He knows certainly wherefrom to get out the raw material, he he he Frank?

          • Peter_Roe

            Here’s what to do, Auenland: Don’t read any more blogs related to e-cats (and certainly never post on them) and try to forget anything you’ve already read that is causing stress. That way all exposure to this whole story will go away and you will be able to get on with your life, completely untroubled by Rossi’s eccentricity and inconsistency.

            So there you go – a simple, safe and effective solution, and I’m not even going to charge you for the advice.

          • Max S

            How a serious organisation´s CEO would operate at the present stage (assuming the e-cat is real):
            1. focus external communication to existing devices which are actually for sale (1 MW e-cat)
            2. present vertification reports and customer testimonials as marketing tool
            3. no communication about early stage development projects (refers to the hot cat)
            4. build a network of serious, professional sales agents
            In all of these points Rossi has failed. Think about it, why ?

          • GreenWin

            See, we have two sets of rules. One for the smart set, comfortably defending their feathered nests in their ivory towers. And another that applies to the rest of us. The hot fusionists can demand and receive billions of taxpayer dollars and promise now three separate times to deliver unlimited fusion energy.

            But if someone without an Ivory tower should use his own money, make no promises, and try to bring a product to market in the tradition of free enterprise – he gets the new rules. Which consist of one rule: “Shut out innovation.”

          • Barry

            I don’t consider myself a liar or a scammer, but as a part-time carpenter, I often tell people,”Yes, it can be done, and yes, I can do it in that time frame”. Which is hopeful optimism. Then the unexpected seeps in. Bottom line- I almost never finish in the time frame.
            He’s not promising 20 years from now like the Hot Fusion scientists. If Rossi takes a year, two years, five years, he’s constructively going about his life’s-work, under the pressure of a lot of negative criticism. Even if he fails, I believe he has actively tried. Give the guy a chance.

      • Omega Z

        Cheap energy didn’t cause population explosion.
        Modern medicine did. By doubling life spans & eliminating many cause of death.

        Antibiotics being the first major step. People no longer died from simple infections or appendicitis & such. Children living to adult hood & procreating more Children.

    • edog

      what a heartless evil comment Lilly Hater… obviously you havent seen much of the world we all live in!
      So much selfishness! I feel sick

      • LilyLover

        You see… 50% of the times I’m with option A & Only 50% of the times I think Option B is good.

    • Robert Mockan

      There seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding why people have babies.
      It is for the propagation of the species. Another consequence of that is also the young taking care of the old.

      When social, economic, and environmental circumstances, enable people to live comfortably, the birth rate falls. Indeed, all the industrialized countries are faced with extinction of their indigenous populations if the birth rate falls below replacement rate.

      LENR technology, if it were developed, would SAVE lives, because it can provide the social, economic, and environmental circumstances that lead naturally to a lower birth rate. And for the living, it would prevent needless deaths, since so much of what enables a high standard of living, including access to medical care, comes about from access to energy.

      Cheap energy is not the problem, because we still do not have cheap energy. If we did, all peoples would have access to it, and consequently, physical economies would develop to support a high standard of living for all. LENR could do what atomic energy was hoped for, provide power for everyone.

      The toll is mounting, and the needless deaths continue because of the delay in developing LENR technology (and other advanced energy sources). In their gut, most people instinctively understand this.

      • LilyLover

        Totally agree.
        Its just that… sometimes I get confused… between A & B.
        One day I wake up – I feel A is right.
        The next day I wake up – B feels right.
        Which side is right?

        A. I think, everyone has equal right to life and LENR will enable to support 25 billion people. So, let’s celebrate LENR.
        Meanwhile, the incompetents of the World will proliferate thereby reducing the % of quality gene-pool with diminishing quality of life for their kids.

        B. Follow Georgia guide-stones. Even if Earth could support 25 billions, let’s only have 0.5 billion. Every alive person deserves enough open space to live happily. Since, energy will be so cheap, robotics will obviate excessive people. So, celebrate LENR.

        Help me on this one … Robert & GreenWin.

        • edog

          Ill help you lillylover…

          How about we let LENR free and improve peoples quality of life, then put contraception in the water supplies of the world and the only way you can get the antidote and reproduce is if you earn over a million bucks a year…..

          come on… I wouldnt want a world full of people with your views and opinions.

          Enough clean water, food, warmth and safety. Access to Real Education and Healthcare(including contraception). Support when you are old.

          Energy is the key to providing it all!!.. if you have it.. Struggling to live comfortably has gone … making babies is secondary.. enjoying life is primary!
          Yep.. Im dreaming.. fantasy.. science fiction.. rubbish!! It is the power hungry, selfish people who love the status quo!

          Cheap energy???? It is costing us the world we live on.. we are killing ourselves!!

          • Ivan_Cev

            People have baby’s because they do not know the problem they getting in!

        • Robert Mockan

          The different world view bridge might be too long for me to help out in a satisfactory way in a text reply, because I am an anarchist libertarian pantheist, and my world view is not the majority. On the other hand, this you tube video portrays my way of thinking, and from it you can probably arrive at which item, A or B, I would support in your list.


          • LilyLover

            Thank you for some insight into your mind.
            Our views coincide a lot. In future, they may converge. Thanks. It was a good video.

        • GreenWin

          We know from live birth data that higher standards of living quickly reduce live births (20% in 1 generation.) This is simple economics since higher standards demand greater costs per child. Parent(s)of 6, 8, 10 children cannot provide minimal food for that many mouths. Much less the cost of higher education (matching higher standards.) Birthrate decline in China is projected to reduce that population to as little as 400M by century end. Japan and many Western nations have negative birthrates (evened by immigration)

        • Andrew Macleod

          With a larger population there is greater diversity. I like to think that we are all born equal and that environment(schooling) produces genius but it doesn’t. With less diversity there is less of a chance that the right combination of genes is made to create a genius. Cheap energy will raise the standard of living for everyone, along with access to schooling. How many geniuses have died of starvation, disease, war or never got the chance to go to school where they could show off what they could do? It’s much easier to educate a below average intelegence person to be average than it is to educate and average person to become exceptional.

  • edog


    Interesting how nickle… used for coins.. because of its low value and “uselessness” is now getting even and “tossing a spanner in the works” 🙂

    • edog

      hey! i didnt get moderated!

      • edog

        I think it happens sometimes because of my avatar pic.. I really should have brushed my hair!

        • Robert Mockan

          GOOD GRIEF!

          Now my avatar shares the same page with … THAT?!

          • edog

            Anyway its whats inside that counts!

            Thanks RObert! and now your avatar is surrounded!

  • edog


    Just bumping this to the top. LENR

    Another kind of Low Energy Nuclear Energy source!

    • Miles

      Great Find !!!….”Star Scientific Limited’s muon catalysed fusion will deliver huge benefits to mankind since it will be the world’s first abundant energy supply”.

      Sounds interesting. Look Out Rossi.

  • Tony76

    On the subject of intellectual proprrty discussed lower in this thread:

    “Should we ask Intel to publish their proprietary machine code?”
    Yes, why not?

    “Should we demand Apple give their designs to China for mass cloning? ”
    There is no basis or reason to make such a demand. There “design” of the rectangle and a grid of application icons makes a mockery “intellectual property”.

    Open Source money making methods are quite adequate for the majority. But for Bill Gates fatasists, adequate is not enough. This aplies to all new energy claimants except Pirelli School.

    If Rossi has anything he should publish on the Internet into the hands of humanity and live off receipts as the most famous and important man to have ever lived.

    From what we have learned of the E-cat technique, it does not require armies of scientists or sophisticate laboratories.

    There are no “powers that be” that could block such a publication. Dismantling digital protection on DVD video went instantly viral and so would Rossi’s formula.

    “Rossi uses his own money and will deliver LENR to the market when no previous inventor or business has. Let him work in his own eccentric, quixotic way. I deeply appreciate what he’s done so far.”

    Are you sure the world last that long, waiting for Rossi? Have you seen all the military hardware in the Midle East jostling for oil?

    • Tony76

      “In 1989, Tim Berners-Lee, then a researcher at CERN, invented the World Wide Web as we know it. When he created it, he could have chosen a path wherein the Web would have remained under his control. Instead, he chose to share his work with the world. Thanks to that decision, the standards behind the Web are free to all. The ability to communicate and share freely via the Internet has become such an integral part of our lives that the U.N. has stated that access to the Web should be considered a human right.”

      Pity Rossi admires Bill Gates instead of Tim Berners-Lee or Alexander Fleming http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Fleming

  • georgehants

    Most scientific retractions involve fraud, not error
    Posted on October 2, 2012 – 06:28 by Kate Taylor
    More Sharing ServicesShare
    There’s been a ten-fold increase in the number of fraud-related retractions of biomedical papers since 1975, putting paid to the idea that it’s usually just a case of owning up to an inadvertent error.
    In a new analysis claimed to be the most comprehensive of its kind, a US team has concluded that misconduct – such as fraud or suspected fraud, duplicate publication and plagiarism – is responsible for two-thirds of all retractions.

    • Max S

      why don´t you open your own hate-scientists-blog ?
      You tell us almost every day that scientists are typically involved in fraud, are corrupt or incompetent. It is not really helpful for the case of LENR.
      Just curious, do you include Fleischmann and Pons in this, too ?
      Quote from the article you have cited “Authors commonly write, ‘We regret we have to retract our paper because the work is not reproducible,’ which is not exactly a lie. The work indeed was not reproducible — because it was fraudulent,”
      somehow it reminds us of the early days in cold fusion or what people have made out of it…..
      Disclaimer : I am not suggesting at all that F&P´s work was fraud

      • georgehants

        Max S, I am just strange and I like the Truth.
        Science is a profession that demands simple things, speak the Truth, follow the Evidence and do the research.
        Instead most of science is a joke of Dogma following closed-minded religious like, self-servers.
        The Cold Fusion debacle is not unusual but the norm in science, incompetent leaders being followed by incompetent scientists willing to discard the Truth for almost any reason.
        There are True scientists that I always applaud, but they are few and then always condemned and abused by the establishment hugging majority.
        Your being annoyed at me for stating the Facts of life appears strange if you are aware of the terrible crimes against all scientific Rebels.
        Science calls anything a fraud that does not fit their liking, such as P&F and many more good honest scientists in many subjects.
        I show that these card carrying followers are the real frauds, as in the report above.

        • Babble

          @georgehants. I guess you don’t read many science sites. New discoveries are being made every few minutes. They are just not being used in a new product every hour because many just add to our knowledge in physics, astronomy, evolution, medical, etc. This argues against your theme that most science is a joke, it is a quest for understanding new knowledge that is going very well. Engineering is what turns it into products and that is what Rossi is doing. Broad statements cause damage too, look at the numskulls calling global warming a hoax.

          • Peter_Roe

            You mean ‘num(b)skulls’ like these?:


            And your qualifications for calling them numbskulls are… ?

          • Babble

            On your link 98% of the most published climate change scientists say global warming is caused by humans. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Climate_science_opinion2.png

            I stated the numskulls (idiots, Republicans, etc.) call it a hoax so you have provided proof. My qualifications are that I agree with the good and vast majority of scientists.

          • Sid Cox

            “climate change scientist” are just that. They have a change agenda. Outside of the CCS group you will find the evidence that man-made contributions have little to do with the changes that occur. But then you can believe anything you want to believe. For every CCS groupie you will find 4 outside the group that disagree unless you are a selective thinker.

          • Babble, the clarion call for global warming is not even based on clear, objectifiable science, but rather, it seems, a plethora of inadequte GCM models (which require tweaks and constant adjustment not to ‘run oof the rails’ during sim runs). The proof for LENR does seem more concrete than that which exists for the forecast increase in a ‘terminal’ global temperature increase (and I don’t have to remind you of our recent ascent out of ice age this past 10,000 yrs when the Wisconsin Glacier covered and sculpted most of N. America based on the geology). The real danger lies in another ice age, and not in a temp increase of 2C even … ice on this planet is the norm vs the warm interglacials that support life such as ours.

            Regards, _Jim

      • GreenWin

        The problem Max is experiments to reproduce done incorrectly. And those that did produce positive result, being suppressed. This is why science has been painted with a dark brush lately. The bad apples have tainted the barrel. And I mean Parker, Ballinger, Gell-Mann, Park, Huizenga etc.

        • Max S

          It is not that simple. After F&P announcement thousands of labs all over the world tried to replicate but mostly failed. I was a graduate student in chemistry at the time and witnessed what was done, and believe me every electrochemistry lab was looking into this. They failed not because of a conspiracy, but because of lack of understanding the underlying processes and lack of proper material control.
          F&P published too early, the work was premature at the time. Obviously F&P died not describe properly how the experiments works. I am not denying that some political characters in the science community, as you suggested, have used this in their own interest and discredited the field. But there are thousands of scientists, good ones and bad ones. To claim they are al corrupt and incompetent in gorgehants style is totally unqualified and utter rubbish.
          In fact not science failed but the American style greed of human nauture for fame and money caused the debacle.
          My concern is that Rossi is going to repeat the same thing with the same motivation.

          • GreenWin

            Mainstream science was dumbfounded at F&P. The experiments done to replicate nearly all failed to follow F&P. And they were quick to dismiss. Not due to scientific method, but due to hubris.

            Science did fail. It continues to fail since as recently as THIS year according to MIT’s Peter Hagelstein – celebrated scientists have derailed funding for LENR research. This will not stand. Those responsible for suppression of ANY viable experimental evidence will have to answer for their actions.

            House cleaning is coming.