Rossi: E-Cat Ran 8,000 Hours out of Possible 8,760 With COP 6

Andrea Rossi commented recently about his satisfaction with the performance of the 1 MW plant that was purchased by a military entity. Today he provided some more details about its performance in response to questions.

1. What level of availability did you experience? A. The availability is about 90%, since the plant works about 8,000 hours out of the total of 8760 hours of a year.

2. How many operating hours per year did you observe? A. 8 000

3. What output temperatures were provided (e.g., 110degC)?

A. 100- 110 °C

4. What is the average COP over the 8000 hours of operation? A. 6

Assuming these numbers are accurate, this is a tremendous achievement for the first 1 MW plant in operation. Rossi said that both the owner and he were satisfied with the plant, and these figures would explain why — with only 10% of downtime, it would seem that there have been no major breakdowns, and according to Rossi at least one recharge of the nickel powder has taken place during the reported time. We have no independent confirmation of these numbers, of course, and so there will be many still unconvinced by Rossi’s own report. Those who take Rossi at his word, however, will be encouraged by these comments.

  • John-64

    So what happens if the independant report says that they didn’t achieve any power output, or minimal (say, less than 10W)?

    Who would you believe?

    • Kim Patterson

      A very real possibility and would leave us
      in no where land.


      • Ken

        Pessimists will say “i told you so” and optimists will be discouraged but still hope. I would believe a negative report as much as I would believe that guns kill people.

      • Peter_Roe

        … until the hot cat prototype is wheeled out.

        • Ken

          Stumbling around today reading, i found an announcement for NRG labs. Their SH cell looks like a promising pair for a hot cat or even just an E-cat.

          • Iggy Dalrymple

            From NRGLab’s FAQ page:

            №53 Q: Was any of the R&D funded by US Gov’t or DARPA?

            A: Our team never works with the government, because easy money destroys scientific objectivity. We know a lot of scientists who are employed by the government. We see them at conferences and hold nothing against them. However, we never work with them. We never ask them for help. Because 99% of them are shallow-brained scientists. We don’t really want to waste our time working with people with shallow standards. For instance, read some “scientific” comments left in response to the physical phenomenon described on our website, and you will see that 99% of the audience is not capable of understanding crucial information stated in our documents. We have received more than 2,000 e-mails in response to our invention, and only about 15 of them were sent from real professionals. It is nice to respond to e-mails like those. We work with a few talented people, because they are not easy to find. We have invited one scientist to work in our laboratory in the USA and we will gladly offer him a long-term contract. To sum things up, we are a results-oriented scientific team; a collective working towards a common goal of improving the future for all mankind.

          • Ray

            NRGlabs is obviously a scam, although a very slick one with expensive videos.

            It’s run out of Singapore but all of the investors are Russians, and googling their backgrounds has shown involvement in previous lawsuits and scams.

            Also, the address on their website doesn’t exist.

            There is a lot more info on PESwiki about what they are actually showing in the videos.

        • Iggy Dalrymple

          I agree with Peter. While the thermal plant is important, the Hot-Cat will be the game changer.

          • clovis


          • georgehants

            EGO OUT
            Friday, March 15, 2013

          • GreenWin

            This is an interesting overview of a next-generation opto-metamaterial LENR development curve. I think the author mistaken in the following: “…the ill-fated sense of competitive threat that LENR poses for the people who make their living from R&D and production of nuclear energy as well as the people who work to research the standard model of particle physics.”

            There should be no threat to these people more than from fossil, wind, solar, geothermal, or biofuels. The only plausible “threat” is to those unwilling to rewrite portions of the standard model. Honest researchers find new physics motivating (e.g. adoption of QED) and quickly adopt new projects to explore new phenomena. Salaries don’t stop because you discover something new – they stop when people fail to act on those discoveries.

    • mark

      Assuming Focardi, Levi, Kullander, Essen, Stremennos, Lewan, Pattersson were wrong in basic physics energy calculatons of course!!

      • Bob

        There is the possibility that this independent test has been insisted on by some of the names you list here. These names have been used as collateral for promoting the ecat for two years now without any conclusive verification that it works.
        Maybe some of them said that either the device is submitted for proper testing or they publicly remove their endorsement.
        There is no doubt the support of these names has been largely instrumental in giving credibility to the claims of such high power outputs when all other players can prove only the possibility of small power gains.
        Rossi has already said that he will proceed with production regardless of what the results are.
        If the report is negative, and at this point I think it will be, I think he will still have some ardent supporters who will claim the test was bought out or sabotaged by the establishment to protect oil interests etc etc.

      • yamal

        they wouldn’t have to be wrong in basic physics energy calculations. they would only have to be wrong in assuming that the output was 100% dry steam. since none of them ever measured it, this is an easy enough error to make.

        • mark

          Calorimetry was repeated using a secodary heat excchanger to keep the water tempt under 100C. No steam was produced in secondary circuit.

        • HeS

          @yamal:”they would only have to be wrong in assuming that the output was 100% dry steam”

          Indeed, it can be a source of serious error, but not 600% (for the case A.Rossi).

    • Cliff

      If the independant report says that they didn’t achieve ANY power output or MINIMAL, then I’d believe the independent report.

      If that happens, then I’d question Rossi’s sanity to have ever allowed someone to look at his scam so closely.

      If that happens, then I’d want to know everything they did to test it.

      If that happens, I’d be extremely surprised.

    • Mannstein

      I would look into the background of those who did the tests and published the report. Trust but verify.

      • KD

        So, what?
        Rossi gave basic information about six months work of his 1MW plant.
        It gives some idea that E-Cat works.

        But it would be stupidity on Rossi side, to rush with mass production.
        Even best design need time, to find out and solve some hidden problems.

        Look what happened to Boeing 787 Dreamliner.
        How tremendous losses it brought to, not only Boeing Co. But also to the airlines who bought the planes.
        Every hour, the planes are grounded mean big losses to the owner which have to pay the credit they own to the banks.

        Boeing is able to absorb the losses from lawsuits, but for Rossis business it would be catastrophic.
        And, so he many times stated. Security of his IP.

        • Kim Patterson

          Sure it Works.

          Its every thing that humanity could want.


          If they thought they could introduce the it without
          giving away the secrets it would be on MAIN STREAM
          News the next morning PRONTO at A.M


        • georgehants

          From Cold Fusion Now
          “Both of us looked at each other here and said ‘cold fusion, I thought that was dead. I thought that was fake,’” Hunt said. “We started paying attention to it. And then we started looking at the history of it, and found out that it really is real. It’s being done in labs all over the world.”
          In the company’s research lab, Ryan Hunt, who holds a degree in chemical engineering from the University of Minnesota, recently stood over a pair of small, transparent tubes containing ceramic structures that hold pairs of hair-thin wires. The apparatus is similar to ones he saw demonstrated by an Italian scientist at a conference in Korea last summer.
          Hunt said he and his team achieved the cold fusion effect for the first time just last month.

          • GreenWin

            Ha! George, sweet find! The venerable New York Times prints a story:

            on the Hunt Utilities Group, but author Bryn Nelson makes absolutely no mention of LENR, cold fusion, F&P, the MFMP – OR that the front page of the HUG website prominently lists “The New Fire” as one of their special interests. Head, meet sand.

          • georgehants

            GreenWin, we must remember there is no conspiracy.
            Greg Noble asked some good questions on the page.
            I am sure the NYT will print their answers on the front page soon.

        • Jordi Heguilor

          Bad example. Boeing has being building planes (the ones that fly, not the ones Boeing SAY that fly) for decades. Rossi has shown nothing.

  • machenation

    What has GOD wroth?

    • Kim Patterson

      Wroth – Synonyms
      angry – wrathful – irate – furious – indignant – ireful


      • Ken

        I believe he meant “What hath God wrought. worked into shape by artistry or effort.

    • Sandy

      I think you meant, “What hath God wrought?”

      That phrase may be found in the Book of Numbers (Numbers 23:23).

    • yamal

      i don’t see how this is news at all. if he is telling the truth, none of this matters because even if it would run only for one hour it would already revolutionize the world as we know it. if he isn’t telling the truth, then this is just another snippet designed to keep his support community from losing patience for another week or two.

      • georgehants

        yamal, good point, I would be interested to know what you think his motivation would be to —
        “keep his support community from losing patience for another week or two.”

        • georgehants

          yamal, interesting, could you supply a link or two to show the criminal proceedings or complaints being instigated by the people that in your view are clearly being defrauded by Mr. Rossi.

          • timycelyn

            Exactly. Nice one, George.

          • clovis


          • Ray

            That’s not usually how investor lawsuits happen. Look at John Rohner/Intelligentry’s recent problem with the SEC. They defrauded 98 investors of over $1.4m, but it takes a while for the SEC to pursue a case (five years in the case of Intelligentry).

          • timycelyn

            “……or complaints being instigated ” No links to these either, it seems….

        • Kim Patterson

          You can bet one thing.

          Its about “MONEY”

          The people in the rafters want to be able to “meter” it.

          But yet risk giving away the “recipe” in the process.

          This is the primary hold up I guarantee.


      • Omega Z

        Truth- If he has what he claims, he doesn’t need US At All…

        Truth- If he Doesn’t have what he claims, he doesn’t need US At All. He gains nothing from any of us.

        So at this time, Any info he provides to Us is just an act of Kindness on his part.

        I do think overtime he has gained important info from his followers in working out a few problems. Even a Bad Idea can lead to a Good one.

        On 1 occasion, A follower suggested a Boiler Configuration that was superior to what they were working with/on.

        On another, a hard to come by Piece of technology access for testing was pointed out to him. Not that he wouldn’t have located it on his own, But located it much quicker.

        Ever try finding something on the Net And come up with 200K hits knowing that maybe only 1 or 2 apply to what your actually looking for. 100’s of pairs of Eyes are much better then 1. I’m sure this saved a lot of time.

        But, I’m sure Rossi is at a point now where this is seldom of use. We may only get info now because of appreciation for the help provided before.

  • theBuckWheat

    I am from Missouri, you’ll have to show me. But if this is all true, successful LENR products will perturb the status quo unlike anything since the invention of the airplane or electronic communications. It also will drastically push down the cost of energy so that more and more people can have access to technology that many in the west take for granted. Like refrigeration for food and for comfort.

    The cynical side of me also awaits how prosperity-haters are going to push back against LENR. Maybe they will start to whine about heat pollution, or something like potential shortages if nickel. Maybe the dangers of widespread use of hydrogen, a gas so dangerous it destroyed a famous airship long ago. Solar power never killed anyone.

    • Ken

      Well i’m not too worried about it. The internet has made the world a small place. Too many people to snuff out now. LENR may have some hurdles but it’s inevitable it will change the world.

  • Leo Kaas

    Good news, very good news!

  • Michael

    When was the unit delivered and installed?

    • Omega Z

      About this time a Year Ago.

      • Michael

        Not later than February last year I assume.

  • huilin

    Rossi’s data is heaping, but my confidence and anticipation is draining…

  • georgehants

    Assuming Mr. Rossi is genuine.
    Mr. Rossi has indicated in the past that he is religious, I will interpret that to mean he respects the only thing important in any religion, the spiritual following of morality, Truth, care and respect for others.
    He has also indicated his awareness of the benefits that a high output Cold Fusion device could do to help those needing the basics of life i.e. clean water etc.
    Therefore his reasons for delaying his “proof” of the technology must be very important, in his view.
    It will be interesting, in time to learn what those reasons are.

    • I can think of two main reasons:
      1. to preserve a more peaceful working environment for as long as possible
      2. to shorten a turbulent phase where strong LENR devices are known to exist and come but are not yet available

      • _Frank_

        Both of this explanations doesn’t make any sense to me:
        Rossi claims that he is “in the market” with 1MW plants for more than a year now and that he is ready for mass production of e-cats.
        By his latest claim he is saying that his technology is reliable (90% availibility), so why would someone (and his “strong partner”) just want to “work in peace” rather than flooding the market with 1MW plants before a competitor does.
        If he sells a thousand of this 1MW units (and he could easily do that during a one week exhibition) than he would earn more than 1billlion $ (and additionally all the invaluable glory as the savior of the worlds energy problem)

        • Garry

          Frank… respectfully to your comments.

          I think Rossi could be engaged in a process not fully determined by his desires. Patience is required– and given the Pons and Fleishmann history he needs to have this nailed. He’s not trying to convince us. He needs to convince the skeptics.

          Anyone supporting him from the inside who WANTS to see CF and LENR accepted is right to make sure the foundations are solid before a public claim. Any serious announcement of success in this is going to generate a publicity second only to aliens landing on the White House front lawn.

          Whoever is backing him knows they better get this right. The “long knives” will be out no matter what, so my bet is that those preparing for an announcement are making sure they do not “create opportunities for the enemy” in the words of Sun Tzu.

          • _Frank_

            Patience is required– and given the Pons and Fleishmann history he needs to have this nailed.

            If Rossi has what he claims for more than a year (a plant which generates hundreds of kilowatts “excess power” with a COP of 6), then he could nail this down straight away and very easy just by one convincing public demonstration, and every sceptic (including me) would shut up.

          • Garry

            I would agree if Rossi were fully in control. Having started several companies and seen what happens once someone else’s money becomes your lifeblood you are not always the determinant of your wishes.

            The roll out is being determined by committee. We know how that often turns out…

          • Kim Patterson

            I agree

            I think people are forgetting
            that he is not in full


          • _Frank_

            I would agree if Rossi were fully in control

            This leads to the next question: Why would Rossi give away the fate of his invention, the control of the deployment (or suppression) of his technology (and the spread of his fame) into the hands of a “secret partner”?
            Even in case that he needs funding for his endeavour, wouldn’t it make more sense to look for partner who leaves him the control over his business?

          • Jim

            “Why would”…the assumptive framework of your question is that there is some sort of simplistic dynamic in the overall situation in which one can go from point A to point B merely by wishing to do so. You have ignored or dismissed the related posts about complexity. If you believe you have a complete solution then you should provide an outline of the major steps, along with the obvious issues, and explain how the steps can be taken and the issues avoided. Otherwise you are indulging in magical thinking and/or attempting to create concern, doubt and indignity where none is justified.

          • Kim Patterson

            The Oil and Nuclear
            knows what is going

            They Let Andrea Know
            the rules of the game

            Rossi is happy and
            they have control
            of the release or
            non release of this
            new fire.


            This is a game Changer of the higest
            order. The Banks and
            Gangsters might as well turn the sign from open to close.

            End of Story


          • Garry

            It’s always about who will believe enough in your technology to give you the money to develop it to commercialization. As is often said in venture funding circles “You can’t starve yourself to success”. Meaning, in the best possible sense, that money applied with the right timing, placement, and pressure can benefit research. In the worst sense it means those with the money get a say in how your invention is developed and commercialized.

            Welcome to capitalism. Where ideas meet reality.

        • Frank: “By his latest claim he is saying that his technology is reliable (90% availibility), so why would someone (and his ‘strong partner’) just want to ‘work in peace’ rather than flooding the market with 1 MW plants before a competitor does.” Because this combination of parameters (110 C, COP=6, 1 MW) is not yet a recipe for significant commercial success. HotCat is the thing which is commercially valuable, and that went directly from lab to 3rd party testing according to AR.

    • Peter_Roe

      Plus possibly, 3. the partner (who probably commissioned the tests in the first place) wants to use the paper as a part of an orchestrated ‘launch’ process, but more time is needed to allow for troubleshooting and/or safety testing of a prototype.

      • HeS


      • Garry


      • timycelyn


    • kwhilborn

      Andrea Rossi broke the guiness book of world records running record for distance within a 24 hour period plus was a University graduate, Patented inventor, and author in his early life.

      The man is a motivation machine.

      • sgt

        If Rossi is telling the truth as I believe he is and he has a partner like GE (who I spent 45 years with in the Electric Vehicle business) then this all makes perfect sense to me. Since a public release that shows he has what he says will be earth shattering then GE? will want to hold off as long as possible since on day 2 they will be bombarded by inquiries, questions and orders – which need promises of delivery. You simply do not tell the world you have a product until you can promise to deliver on certain dates. – Rossi may but a major company will not.
        PS – I lean toward GE because of the NASA – Boeing work.

  • GreenWin

    Hardball with the big boys:

    Just to keep matters of “the partner” interesting here’s some further speculation on the sale of Ansaldo Energia, the Italian power plant specialist being bid for by Siemens AG, Samsung (until recently) and Doosan Heavy Industries and Construction (Korean infrastructure giant.)

    Recall that Ansaldo Energia sent its Senior Adviser R&D, Dr. Andrea Aparo to NI Week to appear on the “LENR Physics Panel” (Ansaldo was present at Andrea Rossi’s October 2011 e-cat demo.)

    Here is what Doosan has said its interest in Ansaldo is about:
    “Doosan Heavy Industries and Construction, in a move to advance in the lucrative power plant business, shaped up its plan to take over an overseas company possessing original technology in nuclear power generation. Ansaldo, especially its nuclear power production arm Ansaldo Nucleare, possesses refined technology on new regeneration* energy… Korean Herald, Jan, 2013

    Ansaldo is presently owned by Finmeccanica (Italian defense Co) and First Reserve (45%) the Greenwich CT, holding company specializing in global energy systems. First Reserve enjoys a close business relationship with the CEO of General Electric Corp.

    To make the entire opera more amusing, the Italian Attorney General recently arrested Finmeccanica chairman and chief executive, Giuseppe Orsi on bribery and corruption charges. Some Italian politicians claim sale of Ansaldo Energia to foreigners is a betrayal of trust. Does political drama get better than this??

    *”regeneration” – no clear idea what this implies

    • Kim Patterson

      Fantastic Research (thanks)

      Political/Money Posturing at its best.


      • georgehants


        • GreenWin

          George & Kim, I did leave out one more operatic element to this story: On May 11th last year Ansaldo Nucleare’s CEO was “kneecapped” – shot in the leg by a masked attacker on moped. The shooting was claimed by Greek anarchists opposed to nuclear tech, but may have been a warning from deep within the energy establishment?

          All the elements of a “big hit!”

    • AB

      “new regeneration energy” is probably renewable energy.

      • _Frank_

        yes, you are most likely right.
        The text in the original news-story continues like this
        … possesses refined technology on new regeneration energy, including wind power, geothermal heat and solar energy.
        (GreenWin ‘missed’ this part)

      • GreenWin

        There is no “renewable” work done at Ansaldo Nucleare according to their mission statement:

        The company’s specific missions are:
        Supply of new Nuclear Power Plants
        Service to Nuclear Plants and Facilities in operation
        Decommissioning of Nuclear Plants and Radioactive Waste Management

        With respect to the last item, it is apparent the LENTransmutation component of LENR represents a multi-billion$$ waste management & decommissioning business for Ansaldo (Italy voted to end use of fission power plants .)

        Ansaldo Energia pays only lip service to “renewables” – claiming no proprietary technology in solar or wind, and one biomass conversion product – potentially suited for micro-CHP.

    • yamal

      funny. when i look at the original story in the korea herald it says:

      ‘Ansaldo, especially its nuclear power production arm Ansaldo Nucleare, possesses refined technology on new regeneration energy, including wind power, geothermal heat and solar energy.’

      i’m sure you cut your quote short to save precious space on the internet.

      p.s. i see frank was quicker

  • Many Compliments !

    The whole world awaiting for this success….

    Every home may claims to have its own energy generator, a former kind of zero-point field energy. In this way we can have independence but we have to be responsible about this.
    Non more distribution network, no more losses, no smog…..
    A strong revolution for all the mankind, a little E-Cat step but a big walk….

  • georgehants
    • georgehants

      Published on 16 Mar 2013
      President Obama discusses the need to harness American energy in order to reduce our dependence on oil and make the United States a magnet for new jobs. He highlights his all-of-the-above.

    • GreenWin

      The Administration’s Presidential guidance needs to make Denis “The Dood” McDonough aware of NASA Chief Scientist, Dennis Bushnell’s recommendation to develop agency and commercial LENR/CF. This is now a political football the Administration can fumble badly, if it does not act courageously.

      The most likely action is for the new Energy Security Trust Fund to openly consider and approve grant applications from LENR researchers. Should the government’s Energy Trust (or other research grant program) fail to heed the Chief Scientist’s recommendation – a public scandal will undoubtedly follow.

      What President would not want credit for overseeing the [second] most enlightening discovery of the human race??

    • The picture behind the link brings to mind a perpetuum mobile designed by a commitee.

  • Job001

    Bias(monetary, etc.) explains things fairly well, it seems.
    So, what might we reasonably expect assuming bias?
    Military – it’s a secret;Media blackout’s and denials, ALAP (as long as possible).
    GE – Existing business non-compete; introduce niche by niche with huge hurdles, i.e. patents, certifications, market dominance, regulatory constraint, legal battles, secrets and media suppression.
    The consumer heater appliance niche might not compete with significant existing GE consumer products and thus may have a chance.
    Prediction, this “Watched pot” won’t boil soon, expect at best highly controlled non-compete niches.

  • Pietro F.

    I think the e-cat military does not exist, is a diversion to believe that other people know the secret.

    • Lukedc

      Then why are you even here?

  • yamal

    i see my answer to george has disappeared, which is a pity. not because any discussion with george would be particularly fruitful but because suppressing any discussion about the cui bono aspect of rossi’s endeavors cuts out the heart of the matter. as the old saying goes: ‘follow the money, stupid’.

    • Veblin

      If the moderation here is a problem for you, I could suggest a site that will allow you more freely express your negative views on the subject. It is very popular with people who feel like you do.

      • Gerrit


      • Roger Bird

        OK, I am impressed, but very unconvinced.

  • Harold Coffman

    When all is Said and Done …

    And, Rossi (CF) E’Cat is a Proven Success …

    Then we will all Say … (skeptics included)

    ” We Knew It All The Time … “