New Poll: Your View on Hot Cat Photo

I’m not surprised to read the variety of opinions here and elsewhere regarding the now famous glowing ‘Hot Cat’ that was released by Daniele Passerini. I just put up a new poll to try and gauge current sentiment about the picture.

When it comes down to it, I think one’s reaction to it is going to be based on one’s overall opinion of the E-Cat. I don’t think that many people’s minds have been changed by this picture alone. As I’m sure many people know here, I have been convinced about the reality of the E-Cat technology for a long time now, and so my personal reaction to the picture was one of being very impressed that a LENR reaction could produce such heat.

Some people have said that it’s possible that this heating effect could have been done with the wires that can be seen, or through some unseen wiring in the frame. Others have said that the picture is faked, citing lack of air distortion due to heat — or that the tube could have a light bulb inside.

I realize that many people have different opinions regarding this technology, and this picture is just one piece of evidence in a much larger picture. It will be interesting, as always, to see what readers here think. I have learned that the majority of readers here don’t comment, but many who don’t comment click on the polls.

Hot Cat Closeup

By way of comparison here’s the picture of the hot cat leaked last year by ‘Cures’ from the Cobraf forum.

Hot Cat 2

  • Ecco the Dolphin

    Admin: bigger version of the photo here, you might prefer using this in your blog post:
    http://i.imgur.com/qfUz9rp.jpg

    As for the poll, I don’t think there’s much indicating that the steel cylinder there is being heated by LENR process. So I chose the most conservative and realistic option: Reactor Heated by Conventional Means. The photo is not clear enough to discern details other than it looks quite hot, possibly above 750-800C. The kind of proof it shows is different:

    – That they (possibly the third party testers) were testing a hot-cat model back in November in Ferrara
    – That the E-Cat 1 MW container that can be seen in the background was in Rossi’s new Ferrara garage since at least last November
    – That Daniele Passerini does have access to exclusive and/or confidential information (some people doubted this)

    • Thanks for the link, Ecco — used that picture!

  • Eric

    From what I understand Rossi has not even commented this picture, so it could be anything. Maybe it’s just a reference run with an electrical heater to calibrate the equipment. Nevertheless, I want to believe. But maybe too much; if I saw a picture on this site, showing a photo-shopped zebra glowing red, I would at first glance think “Wow, amazing! Rossi made LENR happen inside animals.”.

  • Toussaint

    Why not see the picture as it is posted by Passerini?

    All this intellectual masturbation about the possibity of this Photo beeing a fraud is just pathetic.

    It is for these reasons Rossi stoped the public demonstrations of the Ecat

    Nothing will statisfy these skeptics.

    • Ecco the Dolphin

      It was posted in the previous blog post here on E-Cat World, but I think not everybody knew that you could see a larger version by copy/pasting its URL in the browser address bar. So here’s a direct link to it:

      http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-XuKgtxpqL9U/UYQSyPJP-OI/AAAAAAAAJYI/96mRUBJjs1w/s1600/hot-cat.JPG

    • Roger Bird

      Most of these people doing the mental masturbation for the sake of skepticism are all new. So I can understand that they are doing their best. They haven’t see and read what we have.

      • Andre Blum

        good comment.

      • Ash

        Not true in my case. I’ve been following ‘free energy’ schemes for decades. Rossi is just the latest in a long line.

        Look at Prosper-René Blondlot for the classic example. Delusion happens to real scientists too.

    • Bernie Koppenhofer

      +1

    • Miles

      “Nothing will statisfy”.. I’ll be satisfied when I buy an Domestic eCat. Just hope a product can come to market in 2013.

  • AB

    Reposting my thoughts on why I’m leaning more towards a red hot metal tube as opposed to red glass tube lit by a lightbulb.

    The red color is very uniformly distributed, except for a slightly darker if well defined ring in the center. This to me suggests that the red material is red hot metal and that the ring is section of the tube which absorbs/handles heat differently. If it was a glass tube with a ring of paper or some similar semi-opaque material then I would expect the ring to cast a shadow which expands to the far side of the light bulb and gradually decreases in strength. The red would also not be as uniform across the tube (simple math, one end would receive far more light than the other).

    As for the white hot spot, it also seems to be more concentrated in one spot than what one would expect from a light bulb.

    Generally to me this object appears to be more consistent with a red hot metal tube with a hot spot than a red glass tube lit by a lightbulb.

    The source of the heat is another question.

  • otto1923

    I am sorry but this looks shooped to me. This is possible nowadays yes? I assume there are many competent shoopers in italy. Lets see a movie so we can declare that shooped as well.

    • Redford

      You can’t believe any image on face value nowadays, and i mean any. And if it really is edited by people with means to do it, you won’t find trace.

      That being sais, 99% of the time it is not faked. And here? I personnally doubt it, as it doesn’t smell photoshop (which I know professionnaly, as opposite to LENR :P) but I would not swear it’s not ^^

      • daniel maris

        It would be odd if Rossi is a fraudster that he doesn’t do more photoshopping,given how easy that is.

        So, yes, this COULD be photoshopped but it doesn’t form part of a pattern of photoshopped fraud.

      • Thinksforself

        I live in Photoshop for my lively hood and I believe that the image is not a photoshop creation. The image is not crisp enough to see heatwaves due to the focus being set on the power strip at the bottom of the picture. Plus the camera on a smart phone is really just a pin hole, making it hard to get a good depth of field. But the reactor could simply be painted to look hot and lit and photographed to make it look real, people make millions doing such things in Hollywood. I had to vote hopeful but unknown.

        • Bob

          Actually, just to argue a point, a pinhole camera is one of the few cammeras which give an infinite depth of field. It’s only when you introduce a lense that all this depth of field stuff comes up.
          The fuzziness of the first photo is due to it being taken in low light conditions and this was done to make the cylinder look a brighter red. Under normal light the cylinder would have been a very dull red, if red at all. In fact it would have looked like it does in the second picture which was obviously taken in better light conditions.

          • Thinksforself

            I didn’t want to wade into photographic theory, but the issue is not a narrow enough depth of field to pick up the heat lines. The focus needed to be on the ecat with a tight depth of field some thing you don’t get with an smart phone camera. If you look at the original shot, instead of the crop pictured above, you will see the power strip I mentioned. The autofocus averaged it into the shot setting the focus to be between the power strip and the ecat. The lack of focus directly on the ecat prevents the capture of the heat lines. All I would be able to say for sure is there does not appear to be any composting of images nor direct selection of the ecat to alter its color. Another wards I believe the image to be real and not altered, but can’t vouch for what it shows.

          • Barry

            I use Photoshop for a big part of my livelihood. For those who have Photoshop, right click the image with your mouse, click “Save picture as” open in photoshop, click on ENHANCE (at top), – ADJUST COLOR – slide the HUE and SATURATION buttons.
            We’re still missing a lot of CF data but the idea that this photo is enhanced or forged is extremly unlikely.

          • Barry

            ps Photoshop shows heat rising above and radiating in all directions. If I knew how to submit the image onto ECW I would show rather than being so wordy.

          • artefact

            You can use http://imgur.com/ for example to upload a picture and get a link to post here. ( I never used imgur myself though )

          • Bob

            I agree with that. I don’t think the image has been photoshopped at all and is quite genuine.

  • Sean

    This One is hard to prove picture wise. Having been in foundry’s I am familiar with this colour. Usually you cannot approach within 3 feet without the protective heat shield clothing. Also remember the hot simmering air above the castings as they cool even when not glowing. As for the 750-800C, this seems hotter than the atomic reactors which I looked up @ 650 Deg FUEL temperature max. Would like to know how it compares to the latest HMS Astute submarines small sealed reactor which will go for 26 years without refuelling. If Rossi’s Hot Cat can do this scaled up, then we will have a true safe propulsion system for our nuclear fleet including the new BAE super carriers. Don’t understand why BAE is not banging on Rossi’s door.

  • Blanco69

    I voted ‘don’t know’ on this one. Simply because it’s the only answer I could record with any certainty. I have no reason to believe that any aspect of the picture is fake or staged. It’s possible that this is a piece of fantasy art. It’s also possible that is one of the first pictures of a true wonder – an ecat doing it’s thing, sipping hydrogen and kicking out 1000 degs. I’m certainly not disheartened but I guess I’m still waiting.

    • Peter_Roe

      +1

      • Barry

        +1 In science and religion it’s self-deception to believe what you want to believe. I voted the same Blanco.

        • GreenWin

          In fact we believe a chair is a material object capable of supporting weight. In science we believe the chair is constructed from molecules made of atoms that are 90% empty space. The chair consists of more empty space than particles of energy. Yet we sit, confident we shall not suddenly fall on our bums. Belief, intent, human consciousness (Sheldrake e.g.) alters the matter.

        • georgehants

          +1 but boy I hope it’s real.

  • Fibber McGourlick

    Looks good to me. When was the photo taken?

    • artefact

      20. November 2012

    • 20th November 2012, 18:13, with an iPhone 4. If the EXIF information in the image is correct.

  • Lu

    Very moving picture, could be iconic. Wish we had confirmation…

  • Mike Cheek

    Cherry red to bright cherry red color for iron indicates 900 – 1000 deg C. Yellow-white to white color is 1300 – 1400 deg C. Or ranging fro 1650 F to 2550 F.

    How can we explain no optic distortion due to hot air thermals? This complete lack of distortion seems to go against the authenticity of the photo. Again, I assert there would have to be significant hot air thermals. Can anyone explain why we don’t see them? Don’t get me wrong, I would love to be disproved. But I can think of no good explanation.

    • Omega Z

      Mike

      I believe this is 1 of the Effects of the Black Body paint.
      I Believe it reflects back or suppresses the (Radiant Heat) you speak of for more Accurate IR Temp readings. The Paint is designed for 1200`C temps. Maybe some of our more Technicals here can give more Info on this. How the Numbers work Etc..

    • GreenWin

      Why is it the doubters all have tongue-in-cheek names and post so infrequently? A thorough analysis suggests unique handles and FUD comments originate from a single orthodox source.

  • Omega Z

    Admin

    My Opinion on the Pic. It’s the Real Deal…

    Another Choice to be added to the Poll-

    The Reactor is Heated by Conventional means Producing a LENR REACTION..

    Explanation. It’s powered by Conventional means, but is producing far higher temps then what Input would account for. You have LENR action taking place.

    My Opinion is based on what we’ve Seen, Read/Data, & Discussed before. As Passi has indicated that this was a push to the Limit, I suspect were seeing 1200`C. Possibly 1500`C at the Core nearing Nickel melting point. This would explain the white heat circle in the photo.

    As to People speculating on the Color & it’s Characteristics-
    This Tube is Covered with a Special High Temp(1200`C) Military Grade Black Paint. A Black Body Test. The Color Characteristics will be different then what you would expect. It’s used for IR temp reading for high accuracy Data.

  • Al S

    Well maybe the properties are such that heat sinks with distance from the reaction in a manner different than one expects. Pretty big secret to keep quiet about if that’s true! Please, I’m just speculating in an open way.

  • Omega Z

    Help

    Some of those here that’s been at this a long while.
    There was a Russian Female I believe who lives & Studies in the Ukraine that was at Francesco Celani’s Cell Demo at the National Instruments LENR Conference.

    Did anyone ever confirm her Name. I believe there was a Russian Female at 1 of Rossi’s Demo’s also. Are they 1 & the Same.
    Looking for the Name or Names should they be different persons. Can Anyone help.

    This may mean nothing. I’m piecing bits of info together that may be interesting in connection to Rossi’s Cat.
    Thanks for any help you can provide.

  • Lukedc

    If it’s any consolation it appears that the rack is the same in both pics.

    • Ecco the Dolphin

      The location (Bologna vs. Ferrara) and time of the photo (July 2012 vs. November 2012) are different, though.

  • Lukedc

    I’m not saying the following with any certainty because I can’t see the guage of the power input feeds very well but;
    With a silicon carbide or molybdenum disilicide heating element this effect could be created quite easily. A moly-di heating coil, depending on the rating could provide heat up to 1800c & comes in many different configurations.

    • Shane D.

      True. But can you also get all the supporting characters in the “scheme”, which there appears to be many, to play along with the farce?

      I take this latest move by Leonardo as positive. Not because they simply posted a series of pictures that could have been taken anywhere/ anytime and meaning nothing because of that, as some here suggest, or everything as some others imply…

      But because Rossi, or whomever, knew that showing the physical activity, heavy equipment, security guard, others attending (blanked out -as you would expect), would paint a realistic picture of reality without divulging too much.

      Showing what they did makes it all the more difficult to believe that this is all a big scam. It does not rule scam out, but it does make it all that more difficult to argue for.

      • Lukedc

        My only concern is that they are performing misguided science.
        I do so hope this is not just a test of the chassis and what we see in the picture is a heating resistor augmented by the LENR effect.

        • Warthog

          The only people “performing misguided science” are the skeptics. They are an amazing bunch, able to totally ignore hard data and retain their negative views. The WAY they ignore the data is to simply deny that it exists. They simply refuse to look at it.

          Note: the above comment applies to the field of LENR as a whole, not Rossi’s efforts.

          There is more than sufficient well-grounded research to establish LENR as a reality beyond any shadow of a doubt.

          • +1
            add to that that interest to rossi is maybe that he is the less serious looking on the ramp.

            most ignore aldo proia which is the only serious reason to trust rossi reactor.

            Nelson report on Defkalion is carefully ignored.

            even more serious, SRI report on Brillouin is ignored.

            STMicro on Celani is carefully ignored.

            all that is well explained by Thomas Kuhn, who says that old-school during a paradigm change, choose the evidence they use to justify they are right.

            no way to convince, convincing evidence are simply rejected and ignored, while evidence of anomaly in the old-theory are ignored too…

            no hope, don’t panic.
            Rossi’s third party report if it exists, if it is published, if it is not rejected or eternally rewritten because of pathologic peer-review, will have no impact.

            forget any hope.

            only hope is in making many clients happy, especially the competitors.

            US SciAm accepted wright brothers because France have bought the technology.

            The trick of some expert in networked business in conservative countries like France, is to invite foreign partners so the French companies stop saying “do the business as we say”, and start to say “oh, we follow you because there are foreigners who compete”.

        • GreenWin

          Huizenga, Koonin, Jones, Ballinger etc. performed “misguided science” in their now exposed attempt to protect self-interests.

      • Ash

        The history of companies like Blacklight Power, Steorn, EEstor and even Intelligentry should tell you that it’s not too hard to get a variety of credible sounding people to go along with any sort of scheme. As a logical argument (appeal to authority), its pretty unreliable.

        • GreenWin

          Golly Ash… do you have any credible sounding people going along with you?

      • lenrdawn

        “Showing what they did makes it all the more difficult to believe that this is all a big scam.”

        I heard that argument lots of times but I don’t get it. Why would somebody with a gun (if it is a gun) and a bunch of people shown in a picture have to be “in” on a scam (if it is one) just because they are in the same room? If Rossi managed to keep his catalyst secret from Levi and Focardi (both said they had no idea what it was) despite running the experiments right under their noses, then he could easily hide a false power reading from them as well. A hired gun won’t care what happens around him. He’s there to scare off the bad guys, not to make scientific inquiries. And the heavy equipment isn’t especially convincing either. Have you seen that insanely huge Brazilian “gravity machine” on PESN? Dozens of people and hundreds of tons of equipment many times more expensive than anything Rossi has shown so far were involved – but nobody halfway familiar with basic physics would believe that it works (and I would bet any money that it doesn’t).
        Nothing of that proves or even hints at Rossi being a scammer – but it also doesn’t give him any credibility either. I think it is generally useless as an argument.

        • Roger Bird

          That would make it an extremely elaborate and complicated con, and yet he doesn’t ask for money from the public. It doesn’t make any Occam.

          • Dave

            Roger, Rossi may not ask for money from the public, but he does have some kind of licensing system set up. Many have speculated that he’s running an investment scam.

          • GreenWin

            Gosh Dave, AEC’s Dr. Robert Bussard told the world that tokamak hot fusion was a fraud. It didn’t seem to stop our government from throwing more taxpayer money into the black hole. Investment scam??

        • “If Rossi managed to keep his catalyst secret from Levi and Focardi (both said they had no idea what it was) despite running the experiments right under their noses, then he could easily hide a false power reading from them as well.” I don’t agree. The catalyst is possible to keep secret by just not opening the innermost box and disallowing some fancy instruments. But I haven’t a slightest idea how to fake large power in the presence of physicists who are allowed to measure and go around the device for hours.

          In other respects I agree with what you write (except that I haven’t checked that gravity machine).

          • Roger Bird

            Remember that Levi and Focardi are respectful colleagues and a scam would necessarily be run on vics and marks, who would not be very respectful and would feel perfectly happy revealing a scam.

          • GreenWin

            Roger, you are clearly not up on the current psychosocial science. There are no “victims” – only people who allow themselves to be… like a 4 year old child whose parents abandon her in the street. ‘Nuff said.

          • Roger Bird

            I don’t see your point. Of course there are victim, in the short run.

  • Barry

    The picture is impressive but there is a lot of information missing. I hope it is doing what we think but as far as faith, I’m siding with the Apostle Thomas.

    • daniel maris

      A nice reminder that Thomas never got marked down for his doubts – he ended up a saint like the rest of them. 🙂

    • Roger Bird

      Thomas stopped doubting when he put his hand in Jesus wound after the Resurrection. Many of us have had enough experience and evidence with Rossi that we have put our doubts aside. However, should an E-Cat salesman knock on my door tomorrow, I will be dragging my doubts back out.

      • Omega Z

        I would add That Rossi has on several occasions said that if ANYONE should try to sell you an E-Cat to contact him. They are not legit.

    • I love both if these pictures but the second one we published in The American Reporter as symbolic of the raw energy and power of the E Cat. That’s my favorite!

    • GreenWin

      Barry, yours is a broad statement. Thomas’s gnostic gospel was long suppressed by the Church. Appropriate to this event he said, “Test all things, holding fast what is good.”

      The contributors here have for the most held fast IMO.

      • Roger Bird

        And the word “gnostic” was an invention of St. Irenaeus as part of his campaign to make all the other gospels (“gnostic” gospels) heretical, so as not to confuse the illiterate bumpkins that inhabited that world at that time. I am not an illiterate bumpkin and so I demand to see the other 30 “gnostic” gospels.

        • GreenWin

          St? Irenaeus? The binitarian who opposed Polycarp and felt the 7th day Sabbath unnecessary?

          Most of the gnostic texts were found at Nag Hammadi. You may need to visit here: http://gnosis.org/naghamm/nhl.html

      • Barry

        To quote Saint Thomas “I will not believe until I touch the nail holes in his hands and also get a third-party verification”. (It might be a little bit of a loose interpretation).

        • GreenWin

          “…third-party verification, from qualified scientists the Pope approved.” The “Lost Text of St. Thomas!”

  • Bob

    As I said in a previous post, it looks impressive so my initial reaction is to think that finally we see something which might be real.
    However, that was exactly my reaction to the early release of the original ecat information two years ago and I now think that was seriously misplaced. So looking at this picture with a more critical eye, what can we see?

    The outer cylinder is certainly hot but how hot?
    From the photo it appears to be a dull red. Not bright red or cherry red but dull red.
    I know it looks brighter than that in the first photo shown above but that is because the exposure has been increased way above normal to accentuate the effect. You can easily verify this by looking at everything else in the photo. Notice how dark everything else is, particularly the big blue ecat behind it which we know to be bright blue. It is now a very dark grey blue. The photo is very much under exposed on everything else which makes the reactor look brighter. So, I take the reactor as actually being dull red.
    In the second photo, the exposure is at a more normal level and the outer case of the reactor is not visible as being red at all, although I can accept that this may have been taken early in a test when it hadn’t had time to heat up. But then if that’s the case, why release that picture rather than the one which might show it blistering hot?

    So, looking at the two photos, how hot is it in the first photo?
    Thermal radiation from a black body first becomes visible in low light conditions at around 500 deg C. therefore I take it that the second photo shows the reactor at 500 C or less. Probably around 450 deg C.
    The first photo I take as dull red because it is over exposed, and would therefore be at around 600 deg C. maximum. In both photos the internal temperature is much hotter than this but that is irrelevant when working out the energy radiated from the device because the energy can only be radiated from the outside surface.
    We can compare the heat radiated from this with the heat radiated by one of those old nichrome wire wound 1Kw room heaters.
    They are a similar length and heat up to an almost yellow orange colour which equates to around 1000 deg C. and obviously at that temperature they radiate 1 kilowatt. They have to. They are rated at 1 kilowatt.
    The diameter shown in the first photo is about 4 or 5 times that of a 1 kilowatt heater so if it was the same surface temperature as the heater we could take it as having 4 to 5 times the radiated energy, but it is not the same colour so it is not the same temperature. I tend to think the increased surface area of the cylinder is negated by its lower surface temperature and therefore may be so low as to be only that supplied by the heating element. I suppose it really depends on how big the internal heating element is. If it is only 150 watts or something close to that, then the pictures would strongly indicate a surplus of energy. But if the heating element is 1 kilowatt or more then the pictures are entirely consistent with that level of power output. If the element is 2 or 3 kilowatts then I would not be even slightly tempted to believe there is an excess of energy being shown.

    I also note two more points.
    Firstly, this is the same device which was measured by the Swedish authority and they quickly concluded there was no excess energy. This cannot be ignored. Logically they were good at their job and knew what they were doing.

    Secondly, there is obviously no shielding so if there is a LENR taking place, it is happening with no harmful radiating being emitted.
    I find that a little difficult to believe considering the low temperature device was said to produce gamma rays which increased as the temperature and COP increased. That has been the assumed reason for the maximum limit of 6 on the COP. And yet here we have a reactor which operates in exactly in the band which has been previously been avoided, without emitting any harmful radiation. That can only be explained by saying that the two technologies are entirely different
    I simply cannot accept that the same person can come up with two apparently different technologies in such short time when the rest of the world is incapable of reproducing the first, even when it has now been widely publicised as to the method.
    Yes, I know,.. the ‘secret catalyst’. But I don’t really buy that one anymore.

    But I do like the pictures. Keep them coming.

    • Omega Z

      Bob

      These are 2 different prototypes. The Top image is just a different design- Optimized, Same technology. Tested in November.

      The Bottom pic is from July. When Cures leaked it, he said it was at about 800`C. The test continued after he left(He wasn’t there for the full duration of the test), but was apparently increased to about 1200`C. This was heavily discussed at the cobraf website for several months & thought to be just under 800`C. Note there was IR images along with it used for their discussions.

      I Posted before- 4 hrs. shut down probably till cool enough to handle.
      The 4 hour start up I believe is staged. Pauses/rests at certain temps then continue. It’s been 25 years, but I recall there is metallurgical reasons for this. I Just don’t remember the details.

      The Swedes used an Older voltage tester plus were never there long enough to bring the H-Cat to temp. Thus Rossi redesigned the controls to avoid the problem in future tests. I Would Note that The Swedish investors are still on board, so they must have worked it out. Their the ones supposedly working on the Heat distribution deal to the north. At the very least their taking a wait & see on the H-Cat.

      As for the Shielding, Rossi has incorporated Tungsten steel into the core, Which provides shielding to the Gamma rays in place of the lead.

      Now the Bad News. Both of these are apparently obsolete now that Rossi has the Mouse/Cat. One poster on JONP tagged it the Tom & Jerry after the Cartoon.

      As for the Voltages, Based on past info, It should require about 2.67Kw to fire it up & 1.67Kw average their after. Based on COP>6.
      But we really don’t know anything about the H-Cat for sure at this time. Especially with the Mouse/Cat debut…

      Just My Opinion- I’m reasonably confident Rossi has a Product.
      Timeline to Market. BIG ???.
      I Also doubt Rossi is the Only 1 this far along. I think there’s 1 or 2 others very close. Their just keeping their mouths Shut.

    • Roger Bird

      Bob, since I don’t share you initial assumption that our enthusiasm 2 years ago was misplaced, I didn’t read the rest of your very long post. If someone were to invent the internal combustion engine (Benz, 1888), would you think that 2 years was way too long to get the thing commercialized? Or if someone were to invent the atomic pile (Enrico Fermi, 1942), would you think that 2 years was way to long for the appearance of a nuclear power plant? Two years ago Rossi was blowing hot water/steam out a hose. I say, great start. Now he is on the verge is shipping. I don’t see anything misplaced. What may be misplaced is our impatience and Rossi’s failure to always do what he says. Very few business people, developers, inventors, and human beings always do what they say they are going to do.

      • GreenWin

        Roger, cogent arguments about the absurd expectations from suedohsceps. This drum will sound louder as e-cat is revealed: 62 years since Project Matterhorn established the goal of unlimited, clean fusion energy. Globally taxpayers have invested (without informed consent) $270+billion dollars eq. To date, not one single Watt of useful energy. To date 62 years of failed ignition.

        Rossi’s team in 2 years has achieved astonishing performance at ZERO cost to taxpayers. Global old guard is being swept up… new blood and bone “in course.”

    • Barry

      Bob, I appreciate your thoughts but I copied the first photo into photoshop and overexposure is not an issue, however there does appear to be a lot of heat going through the wires. To me the big question is how much of this phenomenon is happening from CF and how much is it happening from an electrical source?

  • Dag Blomqvist

    ——– Ursprungligt meddelande ——–
    Ämne: RE: För hemmabruk
    Datum: Thu, 2 May 2013 11:54:32 -0700
    Från: George Xanthoulis
    Till: ‘Dag’
    Kopia: ‘Symeon Tsalikoglou’

    Dear Mr. Dag Blomqvist,

    Thank you very much for your interest towards our product.

    The countries that will first host manufacturing and sales networks for Hyperion products will be France, Italy, Greece (Balkans), Mexico and one South East Asian country. More countries, like Sweden, will soon follow. This will approximately be towards the start of 2014.

    All the costs of our product will be announced when it is finalized. Our product will produce thermal energy.

    If you are interested to learn more about our product, you can download some documents about our technology in our website, in the technology section.

    Respectfully,

    Xanthoulis George

    Marketing

    Defkalion Green Technologies

    1140 Homer Street, Suite 250

    Vancouver, BC, V6B 2X6 Canada

    Tel : +1 604 683 5555

    http://www.defkalion-energy.com

  • G_Zingh

    Don’t know if anyone has mentioned this, but it looks to me as if the top is just like the bottom picture except the HotCat in the top picture has no black paint and no epoxy type paste on it. It looks to me that the bottom one glows the same color red in that tiny spot on it’s face where there is no black paste. Look how smooth the face in the top pic is compared to the muddy texture of the bottom one,

    Perhaps the top picture was taken later in the day and that accounts for the different overall tint in the photo.

    If I was to speculate I would guess that the reason we are allowed to see it now is that it is ‘old’ tech and the cat and mouse is the new game.

  • Gerrit

    If Rossi was a Sudoku puzzle it would look like this:

    http://i.imgur.com/2JfVR4q.png

    The october 2011 demonstration is the “9”
    The safety certification is the “2”
    The photos (all of them) is the “5”

    And the 3rd party report is the “7”, but we don’t know where to put it yet.

    🙁

    • David

      777 jackpot!

    • Barry

      Heh Heh

    • Roger Bird

      Dear Gerrit, although I disagree with the number of data points that you have in your Sudoku, I just about fell on the floor laughing when I saw it, and I love your analogy. It is absolutely precious epistemology. We are really struggling here to see what is real. And I think that it is a fabulous exercise. Thank you for the laugh and the lesson.

  • kasom

    http://22passi.blogspot.com/2013/05/fino-al-limite-di-rottura.html
    Passerini gave additional information:

    L’attività di testing della tecnologia di Rossi si è protratta per mesi e mesi… la foto che segue mostra un esperimento in cui l’hot-cat è stato spinto quasi fino al limite di rottura; è datata 6 mesi fa e la dedico a chi crede (o magari vuol darci a bere di credere) che rappresenti un “asino volante”:

    Ho resistito fino ad oggi prima mostrarla a qualcuno… ora – mi dispiace – ma non non resisto più. E spero ardentemente – quanto l’hot-cat della foto! – che siano pubblicati quanto prima questi benedetti report dei numerosi test effettuati a Ferrara.

    N.B. Se Cures non avesse mai mostrato quella famosa foto, a mia volta non avrei mai svelato quella di oggi…

    “Si tratta di due cilindri di acciaio coassiali. Lo spazio interno fra i due cilindri contiene la resistenza di riscaldo e la camera di reazione con il materiale attivo. Le basi sono sigillate con mastice da altoforno della Saratoga. Non serve la sigillatura in pressione. Il tutto verniciato di vernice nera per aumentare l’emissività e in grado di reggere 1200 °C

    Questa è una fase della misura.

    Al momento della foto, la temperatura media della superficie esterna era di 801 °C con picco locale di 873 °C. Temperatura superficie interna da 1100 °C a oltre 1200 °C. Parallelo di 2 resistenze di riscaldo (4 cavi che vedete). Valore del parallelo 6 Ohm. Tensione di alimentazione in alternata (50 Hz) di 147 Volt. Corrente assorbita 24,25 Ampere. Potenza assorbita 3,56 kW. Potenza irradiata dalle due pareti interna ed esterna considerate uguali per un totale di 13,39 kW al lordo della temperatura ambiente media di 35 °C Parete interna al calor bianco inavvicinabile sotto il metro per il soffio di aria bollente. Parete esterna misurata da termocamera con precisione 2% del valore misurato. Parete interna misurata con termometro a laser da 1,2 metri di distanza da manina traballante desiderosa di conservare la pelle attaccata.
    Valori conservativi e per difetto (molto) causa asportazione calore moto convettivo stimato in almeno 8% su parete esterna e coseno irradiazione basso per parete interna causa alto angolo di irradiazione verso termometro a laser (puntamento quasi in asse con il cilindro interno).
    Reazione stabile senza grilli per la testa. Praticamente noiosa.”

    Google translation is very poor, maybe some of here can give us a human translation…….

    • Ecco the Dolphin

      This is old information given by “Cures” in 2012 when he leaked the first Hot-Cat photo.

      • Shane D.

        It may be old (6 months) information like you say, but I see many of our forum experts guessing at this original Hot-cats specs and performance when all they have to do is read what has already been given. So here is a google translate:

        “These are two coaxial steel cylinders. The internal space between the two cylinders contains the resistance heating and the reaction chamber with the active material. The bases are sealed with mastic by the blast of Saratoga. There is no need to seal under pressure. All painted black paint to increase the emissivity and able to withstand 1200 ° C

        This is a stage of the measurement.

        At the time of the photo, the average temperature of the outer surface was 801 ° C with a local peak of 873 ° C. Inner surface temperature from 1100 ° C to over 1200 ° C. Parallel switching of 2 heating resistors (4 cables that you see). Value of the parallel 6 Ohm. Supply voltage alternating current (50 Hz) of 147 volts. Current consumption 24.25 amps. Power consumption 3.56 kW. Radiated power from both internal and external walls considered equal to a total of 13.39 kW gross of average ambient temperature of 35 ° C internal wall white-hot unapproachable under a meter for the breath of hot air. External wall measured by thermal imager with precision 2% of the measured value. Inner wall measured with laser thermometer from 1.2 meters away from small hand shaky eager to keep the skin attached.”

        • Roger Bird

          That was a lot to read and understand. Did I just read that it was an LENR putting out a COP of 3.76, roughly?

        • Peter_Roe

          “The internal space between the two cylinders contains the resistance heating and the reaction chamber with the active material.”

          This was discussed at the time of Penon tests when the prototype was opened, and only a ceramic heater was visible – no ‘reaction chamber’.

          It was suggested at the time that either sealed tubular ‘reactors’ may have been buried in the ceramic, or that the central tube may have consisted of concentric inner and outer tubes forming a chamber between. However the fact is that no ‘reaction chamber’ was evident in the images, so this claim remains a mystery.

          http://www.lenr-coldfusion.com/2012/09/09/test-high-temperature-e-cat-hot-cat/

    • Ecco the Dolphin

      Did you take this photo yourself?

    • artefact

      on the ELA pic one can see good how small the active site of the reactor is. It is smaller then the early “ball reactors” in 2011 (5cm diameter). It must have a very huge energy density. The rest of the reactor is probably a chemical hydrogen storage.

      I’m eager to know how in the new design the mouse is placed, so that it does not get a sunburn 🙂

    • John

      I see, this is very good. Do you have a short video clip? What was the temperature(s) on the HotCat?

      John
      EHV test Eng

      http://fotoforensics.com/analysis.php?id=b5bc0b13bec6c15469a9057f08397081191b15f0.443832

      • Blanco69

        The older hot cat photo, to me, looks a bit suspect under the error level analysis. I haven’t seen this type of analysis before but when you look at the tutorials, an area that has been modified shows up lighter than the surrounding area. If that’s the case then the hole in the centre of that flaming hot cat looks a bit suspicious. The analysis would suggest that an older, darker image fragment could be sitting in there.

    • Roger Bird

      I tend to believe what people say. Here is Passerini saying that it is authentic. I believe him. Remember, if he is lying, his reputation for honesty around here would be destroyed, sort of like Rossi’s word.

      • lenrdawn

        Yes, but that applies to every lie ever told, doesn’t it. Anyway, I would also tend to believe that the picture wasn’t shopped, for the simple reason that it shows nothing but a glowing piece of metal.

        • Roger Bird

          Yes, if I wanted to “leak” a fake picture, it wouldn’t be that rather lame picture. I would have had all kinds of knobs and gadgets and tubes and perhaps even some temperature gauges show really hot temperatures.

  • Robert

    What I call the photo is frustrating… like almost everything coming out of the Rossi adventure! There is just enought to make one get a little excited, but a LOT to cause serious doubt and frustration.

    As I mentioned before, the lack of safety and overall setup of this test is quite remarkable! Even if I had a conventional heat source running, I believe most trained, experienced engineers would NOT have it running is such an unsafe, uncontrolled environment. The rack this is on is very make shift and I have to call unsafe as well.

    If this was for actual testing, it does not seem to be much of a test. I see no monitoring equipment, etc. (although I guess it is possible they could be out of view frome the camera) Look in comparison to the MFMP project. What great lengths they have taken and compare the equipment involved. I also recognize they are trying to distinquish between a few watts of excess power versus 1200 C. But still, the approach is quite different.

    As seemingly always with Rossi, my feeling is that I am being “teased”. Just enough to keep me interested, yet in reality causing me more doubt than confidence. Why go to trouble of “publishing” these somewhat “meaningless” comments and photos instead of giving hard core facts? Such as:

    Instead of saying there is some mysterious test, state “Persons X,Y and Z are conducting the tests in cooperation with University A and B.”
    There is NO reason this cannot be released. Not releasing it only degrades his believabilty.

    Instead of posting all these vague comments about shipping to private customers and who will allow visits, etc. and then these comments seem to conflict or disappear with time. Come out in black and white, on record. “We have sold “5” cold cats, two to the military and three to private customers. Three are in service and two are being installed.
    We have been recording performance data and expect to release additional information second quarter.” However, ALL of his comments are vague, never seem to get followed up on or are confirmed. These are quite damming to his reputation. There is no NDA breeches on the above. Yet he will not be concise in these statements. Always vague and indeterminant. Why? I read all kinds of posts about he shipped this, or he shipped that, some were cold some were hot. Truthfully, we do not know. What he says today always seems to “fade” in 3 months and gets lost in memory. My memory stated that a private customer was to have installed a unit in March. Where is this customer? No one knows.

    I must say this… if Rossi is not a fraud or delusional, he is very odd at how he conducts business and communicates via blog posts. I do not know why he chooses this, but his public appearance is more like Roehner than MFMP or even Celani. I have worked for larger corporations. If one is his new “partner”, I cannot believe they would not have provided PR guidelines as well as technical ones!

    I used to be really excited about the Ecat. The more I see these types of announcements, photos etc., the more damage they cause to my confidence. Again, look at Celani, Brillion, MFMP and Miles. Then look at the likes of Roehner. Look at how they act, communicate and produce. Which does Rossi more resemble???? 🙁

    • Roger Bird

      Robert, Rossi doesn’t give a fig if you believe him or not. He doesn’t need us. If he is for real, then the little snippets that he sends our way is a entertainment for believers and frustration for unbelievers. In the end, if there is an end, all will be revealed.

      • Robert

        Roger,
        You are correct in that Rossi does not even know who I am. For that matter, I do not even know who you are! But please remember… the title of this thread is “NEW POLL – Your view”. I simply gave my view, which was honest, not degrading nor mean spirited. I believe every point I made is not only valid, but well reasoned.

        The thread title was not “Everyone must write positive things”. I consider myself a positive person. I certainly consider myself a very hopeful person regarding LENR. In the recent past, early 2012, I was 80% persuaded that Rossi would deliver the goods in a short period of time. That confidence has eroded by his public actions and comments to some fair degree. Not that he has to meet my expectations. Not that he owes me anything. I have not emailed him and asked him to do anything. Everything I hear from him, he has given of his own accord. It is his own actions/words/lack of actions that “paint the picture of Rossi” and thus I evaluate the quality of that painting.

        I have no fights to pick, nothing to prove. I hope with sincere anticipation that a Cold/Hot/Mouse cat can be purchased by someone this year! For the world probably will be the better for it. I will not have a cool million to spend, so it will not impact me either way truthfully other than if it proves LENR and gets the world off of oil at some point.

        So, again, the thread asked for a view, I gave an honest one.
        If Rossi wants a “sparking reputation”, he will need to work on his communication skills.

        Hope you have a good day!

        • Roger Bird

          Let us bury the paper mache hatchets and forget about it. I didn’t understand you, you didn’t understand my not understand you, and so on… (:->)

          I do want all viewpoints here accepted (except those that disagree with mine, of course.) (:->)

          • GreenWin

            We cannot agree with your final statement Roger. Change it.

          • Roger Bird

            “I do want all viewpoints here accepted (except those that disagree with mine, of course.) (:->)

            becomes

            “I welcome all viewpoints here and I hope that everyone else does also (except those statements that would be incongruent with a smiley face.).

        • Peter_Roe

          Robert

          The sentiments you express in your two posts above exactly mirror what I feel. My only quibble would be the use of the word ‘probably’, as in ‘the world probably will be the better for it’. I don’t have any doubts at all about that.

          I’ve recently become uncomfortable about the gap between Rossi’s claims and the actual body of evidence available, and as a result, shifted my stance on Rossi from giving him the benefit of any doubts to the ‘neutral but still hopeful’ position you outline so well. I get the impression that several other long-term observers may have done likewise, although I have been rather surprised to find that there are one or two for whom the expression of any doubts or reservations seems to be (literally) heresy.

          There do seem to be signs of some quite large but partially hidden wheels beginning to turn, and I don’t think we have very much longer to wait for this technology to emerge in the ‘real world’ – whether or not Rossi comes through with his claims and promises.

          • Robert

            Peter-
            I agree that my comment about the world “probably will be better for it” may seem a bit odd at first glance. I had been thinking about our world, politics, basic human nature and some past scientific advances. What seems to be a logical “home run” for the benefit of mankind has not always turned out so.

            Fission based power stations was originally heralded as THE power of the future. With all the waste storage issues etc., bombs made from the technology, etc., I am not sure the world is better off with the advent of human controlled fission reactions or not.

            Video games! These “seemingly” harmless gadgets have been (in my opinin) one of the largest “cancers” effecting our youth. Greatly contributing to the lack of physical exercise to the mental/emotional conditioning of murder, theft,gun play and basic lack of consequence for one’s action they learn in the sometimes horrendous games on these devices. This item by itself, harmless, has caused great harm to our youth. (Not relieving parents of thier obligation or right to raise thier children properly here, just stating that the world really does not benefit from video games and that they cause much harm)

            So my point is, that yes, I would think LENR would be of great benefit to mankind. Although it is possible that it could cause great social upheaval as well. Sometimes these dramatic social changes can be good. Such as the end of apartheid. Sometimes they can be very bad. Such as the rise of the Nazi party.

            If the Ecat or other truly viable LENR energy reactor is made available, with the low cost it promises, there may well be large societal eruptions. What would some regimes do (such as North Korea) if power was now not an issue. What would some oil countries do, such as Iran, if they suddenly had NO income potential?

            Yes the world would definitely be changed! For better or worse? Who knows.

            -Bob

          • Peter_Roe

            Referring to your example of nuclear power, I believe that nuclear fission has been an almost unmitigated disaster from the outset, and any small benefits have been completely outweighed by the dangers, both in warfare and in civil use.

            I think that the main difference from cold fusion is that any reasonably intelligent person, armed with the facts, could have predicted the damaging consequences of nuclear fission with ease. It’s only politicians with their hidden agendas and massive technical ignorance who could not, or who didn’t care if they could.

            In the case of CF, possible downsides have been discussed on this blog fairly regularly, and about the worst that anyone has been able to imagine is that the technology might just possibly be capable of being turned into a bomb of some kind, without any actual evidence that this could actually be possible.

            Given that we are fighting wars over oil, polluting large areas of land and sea during the process of extraction and distribution, and facing ever increasing costs of energy, food and many other basic requirements, all of which could be mitigated by cheap energy, I find it hard to accept that we could in any way be better off without it.

            Of course there could always be some hidden danger, but if there is, it is probably far less of a problem that the real and immediate ones we face.

  • Kim

    There is a 1 megawatt unit that is to arrive in
    the U.S in Approx. 2 weeks ~

    If there is no outstanding issues at customs…

    When the unit comes on line and functions per
    specifications…

    The owner will realize the bounty of his purchase,and the enthusiasm will manifest and
    slowly leak to competitors.

    Negative information of any kind will be utilized first to stay the disruptive technology

    Things negative will be hyperbole- ized

    Frantic with fear… the government will make
    the final decision.

    Respect
    Kim

    • GreenWin

      I think the decision has been made without government. They are powerless to stop the rain. Or sunlight.

      • Kim

        This may be True.

  • Ecco the Dolphin

    Gherardo
    May 6th, 2013 at 2:54 AM

    Dott.Rossi,
    In the past for the first e-cat you said that the reaction in case of malfunction (forgive my inaccurate wording) would melt the core and the reaction would extinguish.
    I was looking at the picture with the hot-cat cylinder red hot for the 800+ degrees temperature reached on the outside and was thinking how is that runaway situation now for the hot-cat.
    Thanks, Gherardo

    Andrea Rossi
    May 6th, 2013 at 8:30 AM

    Dear Gherardo:
    For the Hor Cat are valid the same considerations made for the E-Cat. The melting point of Ni is around 1500 C.
    Anyway that photo (that has been published without our authorization, and we do not know how it has been leaked) is referred to a destructive test- experiment we made about 6 months ago. The stability temperature of the Hot Cat is around 350 Celsius
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

    Does this mean that Passerini is going to be “silenced” like Cures?

    • artefact

      I think Rossi knew these photos get published but he has to say he does not know because of his management or some other contracts or whatever.

      • Ecco the Dolphin

        That’s what I suspect too, but Cures did stop posting new information soon after “leaking” the original Hot-Cat photo.

      • Kim

        I agree.

        I get the impression that Rossi would
        like to be more fourth coming, but is
        throttled by management.

        Respect
        Kim

        • Maybe management=wife(?)

          • Methusela

            In my experience, that is usually correct…

    • Bernie Koppenhofer

      This kind of answer, for me, confirms Rossi/E-Cat is the real deal.

    • Andre Blum

      If the stable temperature of the Hot Cat is 350°C, does this mean 600°C steam (rossi’s target / hope) is not achievable at the moment?

      • I will ask him about that tomorrow, Andre — been wondering about that myself.

  • Linda

    Top one is a fake, IMHO. The photoshopper forgot to do the color job on the ends. Also, the hot blob glowing in the center, it should reasonably be hotter at the top, but it looks like one would imagine a flame to be.

    This looks like a doctored version of one of the shots from the set below, or related.

    Nice try though. No wonder Rossi hasn’t put his name to it.

  • mcloki

    My biggest problem with the photo is that the redness(heat) of the tube does not extend all the way to the tube edge. which is grey. Shouldn’t the entire tube be glowing red?

    • artefact

      I think I have seen in a different foto that there are grey end capsules attatched at the ends. I wonder what material they are made of if they don’t glow at 800 C.

      • Ecco the Dolphin

        I think I have seen in a different foto that there are grey end capsules attatched at the ends.

        Do you mean those which can be see here?
        http://www.scribd.com/doc/105322688/Penon4-1

        • artefact

          I think it was this picture. Unfortunately the webfilter does not let me see it where I am at the moment 😉
          http://postimg.org/image/6v14pk649/full/

        • artefact

          No, my pic was not what I had in mind. But maybe the edges have the expensive paste on it and the rest not.

      • robiD

        It’s a sealant specific for blast furnace (commercial product made by Saratoga).

    • eernie1

      There was an extensive discussion involving the visual analysis of the observable colors on JONP in the last few months.Some very interesting comments you may enjoy.

    • andreiko

      De geleiding van de temperatuur ,naar de einden van de buis vanuit de reactie is veel minder door de montage van de eindkappen, er is dus een hindernis voor de geleiding,bovendien meer massa op grotere afstand.

      • Bento

        Allez, Andreiko, ‘k versta da niet makker, gij ‘loopt’ hier nu al bijna 2 jaar rond en gij blijft koppig in’t nederlands berichten.
        Gij zegt interessante dingen, wilt ge dan ni dat men da leest of begrijpt?
        Op die manier wordt ge gewoon genegeerd.

  • Dave

    Let me get this straight. Rossi claims to have invented something that might be the most important and lucrative discovery in the history of the world, yet it looks like he’s still cobbling it together in a workshop with junk?

    If this was real he’d have billions of dollars in government grants to develop “clean energy” products based on his LENR process.

    • Roger Bird

      Not if every physicist on Earth said that it was impossible.

    • LCD

      Nah that’s not true Dave. Government grants would have strings attached and they are only useful when commercial funding vehicles don’t really exist.

      Additionally you would be silly to develop IP under the government when a commercial application worth billions is at stake. Integrate and produce prototype yes, but not design.

      I think we can speculate that if rossi has what he says he can privately show it proof positive to a few select investors and be fine.

      The thing that strikes me as odd is when he says that a third party scientific and peer reviewed independent test has been completed and we in the scientific community hear NOTHING about it.

      Lets not forget that last time Rossi was bragging about a major “scientific” magazine doing a piece on him, it ended up being Popular Mechanics and it was not flattering. Rossi has a distorted view of reality and more than likely this third party testing is probably what most scientist would consider a joke, if it even happened.

    • GreenWin

      An amusing chapter of e-cat saga is to watch the old guard abandon ship. Their hope is to avoid the dragnet that is fingering key players as ringleaders in the misappropriation of taxpayer funds. Stay tuned for shocking political chicanery from the MIC.

      “…it looks like he’s still cobbling it together in a workshop with junk?”

      That is how entrepreneurial inventors work Dave:

      http://bit.ly/18NFdRT

      • georgehants
        • GreenWin

          Oh Dear George! All we assumed was fit and form is now disintegrating into a cornucopia of contradictions!! How are we (consensus scientists) to work this way???

          Simple: those who have engaged in corruption come forward, confess and receive forgiveness. Those who choose to stonewall… receive ego-crushing exposure. Choice.

      • Dave

        GreenWin that’s true, but he should be past the entrepreneurial inventor stage given that he says the E-Cat worked to heat a factory years ago. He should have billions in either government “clean energy” grants or investor money by now.

        • GreenWin

          Seriously Dave? A guy invents a gadget that obviates a $$20 TRILLION global economy based primarily on the “petro-dollar” and you think the fat cat overseerers will welcome this?? What planet do you actually inhabit?

        • Roger Bird

          Should, should, should, should, these are words that come out of the mouths of people who have lots of expectations but not a lot of information.

    • Shane D.

      That is a valid argument, although I would say that the set-up we see now is much more sophisticated then Rossis’ initial workshop and original warm-cat prototype. Remember the first ecat after it’s unveiling?… It looked like a cobbled together cheap plumbing job.

      So it is not like he hasn’t showed some advancement in his operation and product. Maybe it isn’t what one would expect the way you put it, but there is a progression. Definitely there appears to be an influx of money.

      The one thing that blows me away is how far in front of the other LENR developers Rossi, and DGT for that matter, are. The others are dealing in milliwatts or watts and here is Rossi above them by a factor of 1000.

      It’s like the Wright brothers flying their first flight and having Rossi buzz them in an F4 Phantom fighter jet. Light years difference. How, in such a small package, with so few ingredients and components along with the “special sauce” change the equation so much?

      Baffling and exciting with the usual caveats of course.

    • Beyond some point which is specific to each project, pouring more money onto it can only slow it down. A few million scale is one which can be lead by single person, but a billion project would be more hierarchical and therefore very likely slower. SkunkWorks rule number three: “The number of people having any connection with the project must be restricted in an almost vicious manner. Use a small number of good people (10% to 25% compared to the so-called normal systems).” (http://www.lockheedmartin.com/us/aeronautics/skunkworks/14rules.html)

      • georgehants

        Pekka would “Kelly” Johnson have allowed any massaging of the data.
        How do you think Cold Fusion would have been handled if somebody like him had been in charge of the project.
        Where would we be now after 24 years with a real scientist and proven administrator running the ship.

        • Data massaging is not an issue in engineering (of airplanes, spacecraft or others) because if one tries to cheat, nature punishes immediately and the device fails in testing or in space. I don’t know the answer to your other questions.

          One might think that CF cannot be too difficult since it’s just a small piece of material in a lab: surely with all nanotechnology etc. there must be some way of knowing exactly how it works. Not necessarily so. For example a single bacterial cell is very small piece of matter (much smaller than Rossi’s nickel dust particle), yet its formation is a complete mystery: the mystery of life. We can only preserve it and let it reproduce and mutate, but we cannot create it from atoms, we don’t know if it can arise spontaneously, and if so, where and how rarely. In other words, we know almost nothing except that we have given names to some of its parts and we have some crude models about its energetics and other functions. My point is that while the explanation of CF might in principle be simple, it might also be almost arbitrarily complex.

        • georgehants “Where would we be now after 24 years with a real scientist and proven administrator running the ship.”
          There were/are ‘real scientists’ involved with CF/LENR – they are unable to keep up with Rossi? Let’s give Rossi some credit for amazing progress in development of E-Cat and Hot Cat. jdh

          • GreenWin

            Correct jdh. The wild card is, AR has astonishing help. Should we stop and consider why… we take one step closer to enlightenment.

    • psi

      Dave, You could not be more wrong about that. That sort of thing only comes after the powers that be begin to admit that they were wrong. I speak from experience.

  • Ecco the Dolphin

    More photos soon incoming?

    Francesco Toro
    May 5th, 2013 at 2:48 AM

    Dear Andrea
    has been a few months since I wrote the last post, indeed pessimistic tenor but, of course, no defeatist.
    I always kept an eye on your news sure to see more progress in the search for improvements in your invention.
    I read that Ecat version ‘home’ the average COP has switched to 6, great result!
    I also saw the report on ‘Hot Cat’, from which can be seen a COP 11.7, fine!
    While local politicians do nothing but quarrel, offering a bleak image of Italy abroad, you have continued to work preparing an invention ‘therapeutic’ for the whole world, that will shine to Italy.
    I said ‘therapeutic’ invention because over the past 150 years the man has seriously injured mother earth while you are preparing to ‘cure’ by eliminating or reducing non-renewable ‘energies’, replaced by a new technology Energy Catalizer.
    Although I will have to wait a few more years to enjoy your product always comforting to me the idea that, in a not very distant future, there will be huge benefits for generations to come and for the entire realm.
    Us, fifties generation, maybe a little less benefit, but no matter. Matter if you go ahead.
    I finally alarmed the news of Ioanna Cristescu … believe me, in 2000 I experienced personally a much smaller situation, however, reflects that illustrated by Peter F.
    Please don’t underestimate the issue.
    Warm Regards
    F.T.

    Andrea Rossi
    May 5th, 2013 at 6:04 AM

    Dear Francesco Toro:
    Thank you for your comment. Probably new series of photos will be published. Maybe, no guarantees.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

    Note: this messages are form a JONP blog post not tracked by the Rossi Blog Reader.

    • GreenWin

      “…over the past 150 years the man has seriously injured mother earth while you are preparing to ‘cure’ by eliminating or reducing non-renewable ‘energies’”

      Some “renewables” are injuring earth’s creatures more than others:

      http://www.cfact.org/2013/03/18/wind-turbines-kill-up-to-39-million-birds-a-year/

      • Roger Bird

        39 million? Are you sure? Why haven’t we seen dead bodies all over the place?

      • Jeron Levid

        Ummm… FYI GreenWin is linking to some crazy Right-Wing astroturf page… Funded by wonderful people like the Koch brothers… 😛

        • Iggy Dalrymple

          Don’t knock the Koch brothers. They all have advanced science degrees from MIT. They are among the world’s greatest philanthropists. For all we know, they may be Rossi’s secret partner. Some people get all their info from “talking points”.

          • Jeron Levid

            Who said hate? I simply mistrust people who put their personal interest above that of the, ohh I don’t know…. the entire world. Also, if you don’t think that kind of money will get you places your a fool (or a bad liar).

          • psi

            Just what is the rational for expecting Andrea Rossi to be a saint as well as an engineer and an entrepreneur? The job descriptions are different, and almost certainly mutually incompatible.

            Come to think of it, Frank, that’s the question I’d like to ask Rossi – what is his answer to people who keep insisting that he should open source his knowledge, and sometimes accusing him of being not only a fraud but a mean selfish person for declining to do so? That I’d like to hear.

            Thanks.

        • Roger Bird

          I have absolutely, positively nothing against the Koch brothers. Jeron, you might discover that you have been brainwashed by lefties who are brainwashed by communists. The little I know about the Koch brothers is that one or both of them visited the Soviet Union early on to do some oil work and discovered what a wonderful human being Stalin was and what a phucked up “system” Communism is.

          So trying to discredit GreenWin by saying that he links to a site that is associated with the Koch brothers won’t work with me.

          • Roger Bird

            There is a valuable way to hear about stuff, and that is “they say”. But one must also apply one’s critical and independent thinking or else one is going to also be taught all kinds of garbage from “they say”. This is why some forms of “they say” are called gossip and backbiting by EVERYONE of wisdom. If, however, you do all of your think and learning all by yourself, no matter how good you are at critical and independent thinking, you will still be in the Stone Age trying to invent a bow and arrow. We learn from others, but we shouldn’t swallow everything that others say.

          • Jeron Levid

            Bird you confuse me. Your like some snake eating its own tail. You try to explain away other people only to put your vestigial foot in your mouth.

          • Roger Bird

            Jeron Levid, I am committed to balance and absolute honesty.

        • GreenWin

          Sorry for the politically incorrect link. here is a statement by the Audubon Society – the premier defenders of ornithological life:

          “The bad news is that wind turbines sometimes kill a lot of birds. Some early wind projects like Altamont in California are notorious for killing many raptors, including golden eagles. Modern wind turbines are much safer for birds than their predecessors, but if they are located in the wrong places, they can still be hazardous and can fragment critical habitat. ”

          The consensus greens had to face off with honest conservationists on this one. But why should we tolerate giant killer windmills when we have a non-mechanical, non-combustive solution??

          Oh?? It does not fit the carbon tax agenda? OK.

      • Barry

        The turbines going up in South Eastern New England are quite large and spin slowly. Can’t imagine them chopping a bird. Also have seen some old ones with different colored blades to stand out more.

      • robyn wyrick
        • Roger Bird

          Scorn and spite are forms of hatred, something that liberals like to say that other people are doing, but not them. And everyone has excuses for hatred, but it still poisons one’s own soul and the social environment.

  • georgehants

    Admin who is going to be guarding the keyboard while you are away.
    Would you like us to keep an eye on whoever it is and let you know of any bad behavior.

    • Hi George,

      Thanks for the offer. At the moment I am usually not far from the keyboard. Only when I sleep or take a trip. I haven’t seen too many problems as yet. I realize that some comments take some time to get unmoderated sometimes. I hope people are not to upset when that happens.

      • georgehants

        Hey, I was thinking of watching out for the moderator misbehaving.
        Have a good enjoyable trip, many people here wishing they could join you I am sure.
        Best take a nice little carrier bag with you and if you happen to see an old Cat laying around pop it in the bag.
        🙂

        • Actually, George, I’m not going anywhere except a quiet room in my house to do the interview. Happily, it’s all going on over Skype.

          • georgehants

            O, my mistake.

          • Zeddicus Zul Zorander

            Actually that may not be a bad idea: an extra moderator would take some of the burden of your shoulders and free up your time for more articles and research or whatever you would like to do. I’m sure there are many people here that would like to assist you (not me though; way to busy in life to add this to my list of things to do)

          • Thanks, Zed — good suggestion. At the moment I’m able to keep up ok, but in time it may be necessary.

          • Roger Bird

            I will be happy to do some moderating as long as I get part of the take.

          • NJT

            Please no moderating Roger Bird. I do enjoy many of your comments, but sometimes I just have to wonder where the heck your coming from. Do you have a shotgun sitting next to your computer chair…

          • Roger Bird

            NJT, funny. I am coming from the middle, no matter what the issue is, if possible, and I will try to see everyone’s viewpoint. Because every viewpoint is bogus other than Divine Love.

          • GreenWin

            NJT, it is probably wrong but people do assess you by your use of language:

            http://www.elearnenglishlanguage.com/difficulties/youryoure.html

          • shnide

            Only crackpot, grammar nazis care so he is safe

          • georgehants

            Roger at least is willing to get into a subject, that I respect, unlike many that just sit with their smug qualifications hugging each others superiority for comfort.
            Of the many occasions I have written that the first rule of Science should be Truth, so far there has not been a stampede of scientists rushing to agree.

          • georgehants

            GreenWin, very rare that we disagree, I do not think it matters how people assess a person they are almost certainly wrong, we must look at what the person is trying to say.
            Bad spelling, bad English is I think irrelevant and superficial, only the meaning counts and must be respected above any code of language.

          • Grumpkin

            Only crackpot, grammar nazis would care about that

          • GreenWin

            grumpkinder: one usually ends a sentence with a period, that looks like this. 🙂

          • Roger Bird

            Bad spelling and bad grammar and poorly written posts shows disrespect and not caring for the reader and for one’s self. It is like dressing and smelling like a bum. Other people have to look at and smell that bum. No matter how clever or brilliant the post, the not caring and disrespect still is part of the message.

          • Roger Bird

            Why should the reader have to decipher the message when the writer didn’t care enough about himself, his message, or the reader to write the message in such a way as to make it easily readable?

    • Roger Bird

      “any bad behavior” I resemble that remark.

  • Jim

    For me the additional pictures provide a reasonable context to the first picture; I find myself willing to buy into the rest based on my interpretation of the overall pattern of information from and about Rossi, in which he acts just like a slightly paranoid, eager for recognition, getting-ahead-of-himself entrepreneur, with all the layers of partners and reviewers and doubters that entails. Few would have believed in the potential of the iPhone based on crude prototypes and news leaks. How can it be a smartphone? It doesn’t even have a keyboard!

  • georgehants

    From Cold Fusion Now
    Gerald Celente on “the biggest element that could change the world in a positive way”
    Gerald Celente is singular in his field.
    Founder of the Trends Institute and their signature publication Trends Journal, he features new energy in his forecasting work. An early subscriber to Infinite Energy magazine and friend to Eugene Mallove, Celente has been following and writing about cold fusion since 1989.
    http://coldfusionnow.org/gerald-celente-on-the-biggest-element-that-could-change-the-world-in-a-positive-way/

  • Roger Bird

    Hey Jeron Levid, some of us don’t believe in AGW and some of us do. There aren’t any bad guys here, only old technology and bad motivations. Get over it.

    • Jeron Levid

      Fair enough. Some of us believe in God, some don’t. But their may be more evidence on the side of Global warming.

      • Roger Bird

        There can be no evidence for the existence of God since evidence is an external, material thingie, and getting to know God is an internal, spiritual thingie. Whether there is AGW or not can have evidence. But if someone thinks that they have evidence as in something external for God, then they are not a philosopher. The purpose of our lives is to know God and love Him/Her with all of our hearts, but the need for evidence is a crutch and a stumbling block.

        Remember that everyone here probably believes in global warming. It is Anthropogenic Global Warming (AGW) that is in dispute. Are human being causing it? Check out this video and get back to me: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtevF4B4RtQ You will be born again, and I don’t mean in a spiritual sense.

        Understand that NO ONE on Planet Earth likes pollution. No one here likes pollution. EVERYONE will be happier and healthier when there is no pollution. I have been an advocate for pollution free energy for about 45 years. CO2, in my perspective, is a nutrient for plants and even animals. What do people do when they have an anxiety attack and/or hyperventilate; they breath their own breath in a bag enough times to calm themselves down. This gives them a shot of CO2. [It is not recommended that one keep doing this for a long period of time. (:->)]

        • So we have two theories:
          1) The standard scientific one: observed warming of earth is (for an important part) due to the observer rise of CO2 and other greenhouse gases.
          2) Your suggested explanation: observed warming of earth is due to some unknown effect, while another unknown effect is simultaneously cancelling the warming effect of the observed rise of CO2.

          That said, the continuation is less certain: I do not know how much fossil fuels we can still burn before facing some sort of catastrophe and/or having to resort to some corrective measures such as sunshields made of asteroid materials. With Mr. Rossi, we might fortunately not have to find it out experimentally.

          • Thinksforself

            The third theory is global warming is caused by milankovitch cycles otherwise known as orbital mechanics and increased solar output. Which thaws frozen tundra in turn causing a release of CO2. Explaining the observed increase of CO2.

          • psi

            Now, now, don’t go thinking for your self. : )

          • Roger Bird

            The important point here is that it is either orbital mechanics and/or sunspot cycles, and the CO2 is released either from permafrost and/or the ocean. And CO2 is NOT the driving force to any large extent. There may be a 1% affect from CO2, but that is easily wiped out by these much more powerful solar effects.

          • psi

            I agree the evidence supports these alternative explanations much better.

          • Roger Bird

            Pekka, when you watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtevF4B4RtQ the entire video, then I will read your AGW oriented posts. Otherwise, I will just ignore them. Stop being a freaking patho-skeptic and look at the evidence.

        • georgehants

          If Global Warming is correct or not, it is certain that sciences handling of the phenomenon is incompetent, corrupt and childish to the extreme.
          It is clear that one starts by being aware of the Fact that it is a difficult subject and the possibilities of both Warming and Cooling are possible.
          One then does Bloody Research to try and understand a chaotic science with almost infinite variables.
          The Research should be centralised from the United Nations and the first announcement made that Science does not know the answer, as so far there is not enough clear Evidence but with good Research hopefully a better understanding will be found.
          With the most powerful computers in the World science cannot accurately predict the weather two hours ahead but reports of the kind below show the ridiculous levels to which science, in many areas has allowed itself to fall.
          —–
          Study projects hurricanes to increase around Hawaiian Islands by end of century.
          http://phys.org/news/2013-05-hurricanes-hawaiian-islands-century.html

      • Ecco the Dolphin

        This is probably totally off-topic here, but to be fair, a distinction has to be made:

        GW aka global warming, or what has occurred to the climate in the past 200 years or so, is an undisputed fact. The Earth has been warming in modern times since the end of the Little Ice Age around the 19th century and incidentally since about the start of the world industrialization.

        The theory that mainstream proponents are pushing (and a vocal minority refusing to accept) is not merely that, but CAGW, catastrophic anthropogenic global warming, (usually shortened to AGW, more recently also Climate Change in an attempt to explain recent weather phenomena non-intuitively correlated with an anthropogenically warming world) according to which:

        – The warming occurred in modern times is unprecedented in human history;
        – Most or all the warming occurred in modern times is caused by the greenhouse effect of human CO2 emissions increasing due to fossil fuel usage;
        – Most or all the consequences of this warming will be negative, detrimental to the environment (putting fossil-fuel induced pollution aside);
        – The end result will be runaway global warming which will cause global scale, unprecedented mass extintions.

        • GreenWin

          So… If I buy these carbon credit contracts for incredibly inflated prices, AGW will end??

          • Rockyspoon

            Excellent point. “Never let a crisis go to waste”, even if the crisis is manufactured (fudging of the data) or natural (climb on board the CAGW “gravy train”). Either way, those politicians and dispicable scientists that are milking it for all its worth should be outted as the charlatans they are.

    • Ecco the Dolphin

      This is probably totally off-topic here, but to be fair, a distinction has to be made:

      GW aka global warming, or what has occurred to the climate in the past 200 years or so, is an undisputed fact. The Earth has been warming in modern times since the end of the Little Ice Age around the 19th century and incidentally since about the start of the world industrialization.

      The concept that many are pushing (and others refusing to accept) is not merely that, but CAGW, catastrophic anthropogenic global warming, (usually shortened to AGW, more recently also Climate Change in an attempt to explain recent weather phenomena non-intuitively correlated with an anthropogenically warming world) according to which:

      – The warming occurred in modern times is unprecedented in human history;
      – Most or all the warming occurred in modern times is caused by the greenhouse effect of human CO2 emissions increasing due to fossil fuel usage;
      – Most of all the consequences of this warming will be negative, detrimental to the environment (putting fossil-fuel induced pollution aside);
      – The end result will be runaway global warming which will cause global scale, unprecedented mass extintions.

  • Roger Bird

    Hey, Frank, Admin, it seems like I get email notices twice for the same blog post sometimes.

    Roger

  • I like the poll very much. However, some people are very naive about Intellectual Properties. I’m affraid, that Mr. Rossi’s facilities and he himself is bagged with surveillance equipment so tight, that even echos from flushing water in his toilet is currently analyzed.

  • A new photo of the Hot Cat has surfaced where it appears that the core is approaching meltdown!

    http://tinyurl.com/cdmw5lm