Rossi on Validation of his Theory

After some more questions and comments from Andrea Rossi on the Journal of Nuclear Physics, it appears that there is a long-term test underway of the E-Cat which seems to have the purpose of validating Rossi’s theory behind the ‘Rossi Effect’. Rossi has said earlier this week that there are no violations of currently know physics — and the current validation underway has the purpose of validating his theory. Yesterday Rossi wrote this:

Andrea Rossi
August 22nd, 2013 at 6:19 PM
Koen Vandewalle:
Yes, a validation of the theory is in course, but “validation” for a theory is an oxymoron…better say a study of sustainability, to check that there are not violations of consolidated Physics principles . I am studying with Scientists the issue, and the study will reach its summit in October. I think no Physics principles have been violated, I just studied as well as I have been able the existing ones.
Warm Regards,

In a follow up question, I asked Rossi what might happen in October and he responded:

“Nothing in particular, but I will find confirmation if or not our theory is sustainable. It is not a small achievement, for me.”

So the test underway is an attempt to validate his theory — not to validate that the technology works. Once the validation is complete, does this mean that he might be getting ready to publish it? I would say maybe, but not necessarily. This could all be for all internal purposes, for the time being at least. If there is a major effort underway to commercialize the Rossi Effect, there is likely to be a lot of groundwork and preparation going on — and premature public release of information may not serve the business plan well. I hope we learn as much as possible as soon as possible, of course, but we have no choice but to accept Rossi & co.’s timetable.

  • daniel maris

    Interesting -is this related to securing a patent. Is he looking to get top notch scientists to confirm this is all working within known laws of physics, so sidestepping the cold fusion barrier (which seems stronger than the Coulomb barrier!).

    • Lukedc

      AR has issues with his patent. The only hope for a patent on his tech is through his partner.

      • Warthog

        Rossi may have problems with his generic original patent, but I would bet that he has many more patent applications filed or ready to file on specific “tricks” that have enabled him to get such high yield(s).

        • Chris I

          This is a good point, he can certainly patent various details for improving the utility of it… once the utility at all has been recognized. Otherwise, industrial applicability would not be recognized.

          So he still needs to make a better application that includes his secret, so that it has any hope of going through, before he can patent any utility modes based on it, unless he times these applications just right for when all and sundry can see it working.

          If he gets it right, he might at least have a more lasting edge in the market over all those who pull their own one apart and discover the ingredients.

        • Jim


          Sounds right. There certainly must be such techniques, and such granularity in technical patents seems widespread.

          @Chris I

          Helpful sketch of AR’s possible patent roadmap

        • Owen

          Calling it the Rossi Effect is one way to skirt the whole cold fusion/LENR quagmire. Call it something different, stick to known pjysics and produce a reliable reactor that patent officials can see in operation.

  • Bernie Koppenhofer

    If his partner is DEKA and they validate Rossi’s theory, I think there is a good chance they will publish their theory and results. DEKA will publish because it is good for humanity, a clean and abundant source of energy.

    • Peter
      I had to look it up. It sounds possible.

      • Barry

        This is from their Q&A-

        Does DEKA allow visitors to tour your facility?

        Not usually. Please remember that DEKA is a research and development company, and that our projects are confidential, so the stuff on our desks and in our engineering labs is not for public viewing. We have to prepare well in advance for visitors and this would be rather disruptive for the people who work here (and would probably make them pretty grouchy, too).

        • BroKeeper

          It sounds like Rossi speech; “disruptive”? Also AR has mentioned no pictures inside the building of his plant would be released. Maybe it’s a stretch but those windows are very distinctive. (Isn’t this fun?).

          • Adam Lepczak

            Kamen is also working on the Stirling Engine.

          • Bernie Koppenhofer

            We need someone in Manchester, NH to walk into DEKA headquarters and ask for Rossi. (:

  • Tommy

    DEKA has expertise in stirling engines as well. A perfect match for ECat

  • Jonathan

    Yawn. Wake me up when there is an actual product on the market.

    • Felix Fervens

      1MW E-Cat reactors have been on the market for many months

      • Kim

        Really ? Where ?

        I want to go see it.


        • Rockyspoon

          You just have to purchase one, Kim.

          What–no cash? Is that our problem?

      • bang

        on the market …
        How many are sold?
        How many are pre-ordered?
        How many are under construction/assembly?
        How many single e-cat’s have been made on that famous new robot-line, until now?

        What I can see on the several e-cat web sites is advertisement for a world-changing product that has not been sold one single time to an identifiable/known customer.
        No references from satisfied customers.
        The longer it takes for a validated, confirmed running product at a real customer, the more I become a sceptic person.

        Just my two cents…

        • Roger Bird

          There is no way I will become a skeptic with regard to the reality of LENR+. For me, that is a lock. But whether Rossi has E-Cats to sell or not, that remains to be seen.

          • Boris Ivanoff

            Rossi has advertised megawatt plants for sale since October 2011. If they are really being sold and delivered, there would be plenty of buyers. Are you suggesting Rossi lied about the availability of these plants?

          • KD

            Rossi also said, that he will decide who can buy.

          • Rockyspoon

            Would you sell a unit to your biggest competitor?

        • KD

          Do you thing every company will give busines information, just because some body want this?

          • bang

            No, I don’t think that EVERY company will do so.
            But a company, that has the solution for global energy problems ON STOCK, should act in another way. That’s my opinion.
            Just one confirmed simple customer…
            A science institution, a millionaire, a R&D department of a global player…
            1.5 Million is not so much money.

          • Roger Bird

            ‘shoulds’ do not run the world. ‘needs’ and ‘greed’ and things like that run the world.

          • bang

            Roger, I just wanted to express my unsatisfinement with the situation.

          • Rockyspoon

            Maybe you should think before expressing your unsatisfaction with the situation.

            But here’s a question–do you think Rossi and Co. are lollygagging around, or do you think they’re putting in overtime to get this thing to market?

            I believe the latter is the case, and contrivance of any other theory doesn’t make good sense.

  • Nicholas Payne

    Demonstrating no commonly accepted principle of physics is violated will help enormously with the patent

  • GreenWin

    “…consolidated Physics principles.” Sounds a little like Dr. Kim’s BEC and or other form of condensed matter effects which are readily replicated. NRL’s Kidwell et al, have consistently shown anomalous heat in D2-loaded Pd nanoparticles.

    The Essen-Levi validation concludes the E-CatHT produced volumetric gravimetric energy at least an order of magnitude beyond known energy sources. Can this result from conventional physics??

  • Linda

    His english is really improving.

  • Christopher Calder

    Blacklight Power is a company that has been around for a long time and uses a reactor with nickel powder, chemical catalysts, radio frequency stimulation, and hydrogen derived directly from water injected inside the reactor. They claim their energy comes from turning hydrogen into hydrinos, a lower energy hydrogen atom with a smaller electron orbit. – Interesting YouTube video

    The Wikipedia article shows skepticism.

    The technology predates Rossi and it does sound similar.

    • Roger Bird

      Very impressive. Thank you. I guess that that is a lock for me on Blacklight’s reality. But what bothers me is that it has not taken off. Here is a real energy source that is everything that everyone dreams about, and it is not taking over the market.

    • KD

      They claimed couple years ago, that they have 1kW and 50kW working reactors. So far there is nothing.
      They were talking about signing halve of dozen contracts for producing hundreds of thousands Megawatts of energy.
      So far nobody is producing it.

      They are talking about “hydrinoe” but so far they have nothing to show that hydrinos realy exist.

      But if you did realy carefuly read theirs statements, there wery often you could see words. “we believe” or “we expect”.
      So only this statement might be a true.

      The new news about producing energy from wapor is that they can produce 10 Watts.
      Big jump from 3-4 years ago.

  • Nixter

    The “validation” referred to could be the talked about second long term testing similar to the first Essen-Levi et al tests. From what Dr Rossi is saying, it sounds like the results of this test will not be for convincing skeptics, but to finally get at the actual theory behind the Rossi Effect. While it is true that a theory is not necessary to make the device functional, having one will reveal the how and why of it all. Once this has been done, the bearer(s) of this knowledge may,(should,(will)), be able to make predictions that will very quickly lead to advanced reactor characteristics tailored to obtain specific desired results. Once the Physics are more fully understood, it should be possible to model and then tweak parameters to enhance the EMF effect or the heat production capabilities as desired. Some feel that Defkalion has this theoretical understanding right now, perhaps they do…, when someone does have this level of understanding, you will see a rapid progression of reactor designs with increased control and output. The first to discover the Quantum-Physical mechanism behind the Rossi Effect should have a huge advantage over any competitors, they all know this, and there has to be a race to be the first going on behind the scenes right now.