Randell Mills Speaks with Sterling Allan about Upcoming Blacklight Power Demo

Sterling Allan of PESN has gotten hold of Blacklight Power CEO Randell Mills and conducted an interview mainly about the current state of Blacklight Power technology and the upcoming demonstration on January 28th. In the interview Dr. Mills provides an overview of BLP’s technology and talks about beneficial and advantageous it is — claiming it has superior power density, efficiency and cost-effectiveness, and will be able to supplant the grid eventually by providing households with a cheap source of DC electricity that will be able to meet all home power needs.

At the heart of the BLP system is the need for magnetohydrodynamic converter that can convert the plasma output directly into electricity — something that Dr. Mills says can be build with off-the-shelf parts.

Dr. Mills said at the demonstration he will talk about the theory behind his work — specifically about the hydrino, which he terms a more stable state of hydrogen which he says makes up the indert dark matter of the universe. Also at the demo he will be showing the production of plasma from a H2O-based fuel that is used in the BLP process.

You can hear the interview with Dr. Mills in the video below:

Sterling Allen’s report can be found at the link below.

http://pesn.com/2014/01/20/9602425_Randell-Mills_explains_upcoming-Blacklight-power-demo/

  • Buck

    Strange interview. I sincerely hope that the demonstration is not conducted in the same fashion. At this point, I discount Mills as he does a PR about achieving a 10MW device and now the demonstration wont be with such a device.

    In the end, the demonstration will tell the story.

  • Buck

    Strange interview. I sincerely hope that the demonstration is not conducted in the same frenetic fashion. At this point, I discount Mills as he does a PR about achieving a 10MW device and now the demonstration wont be with such a device.

    In the end, the demonstration will tell the story.

    • enantiomer2000

      Agreed. I am disappointed. Just more fund raising hype.

  • Kim

    Here are my thoughts.

    Randall mills is a talker.
    12000 amps to electrodes to turn catalyzed hydrino water into plasma.
    Massive heat thru put into heat sinks on the Magnetichydrodynamic generators.
    Digitizing gears providing micro expansion chambers 200 rpm.
    Supersonic Plasma.

    He says its all easily built from off the shelve products.
    He has no Prototype, computer animated theory only

    He is going to demonstrate the Supersonic Plasma on the 28th.

    All fine and dandy, but it will take large amounts of money and time to
    work out the bugs for such a dynamic device. 2 years or more away from
    a practical product.

    Rossi’s device does not have the same energy density, yet he as already done most
    of the leg work ect…

    Respect
    Kim

    • Fortyniner

      IF Mills can successfully demonstrate significant excess energy on the 28th, then extracting useful work from the energy produced in the form of hot, fast moving plasma is basically engineering. If the MHD converter doesn’t work initially, or can’t be made to work at all, there are probably other ways to harvest the energy if the gain is high enough. If all else fails the supersonic plasma could possibly be ejected from the reactor through a restrictor and venturi (reaction engine) or through a ceramic turbine (rotary power soure), or simply run through a heat enchanger to collect the thermal energy.

      • Fortyniner

        Close, but no coconut. It seems that there will be a bang from the reactor, with nothing to be seen, followed by endless recalculation by bloggers of any data released, followed by ‘what they should have done was…’ and ‘maybe next time…’.

    • Charles

      12,000 amps is a huge number of amps. Through 1 ohm, that would produce 144,000,000 watts (P=I^2*R) Staggering.

  • Kim

    Here are my thoughts.

    Randall mills is a talker.
    12000 amps to electrodes to turn catalyzed hydrino water into plasma.
    Massive heat thru put into heat sinks on the Magnetichydrodynamic generators.
    Digitizing gears providing micro expansion chambers 200 rpm.
    Supersonic Plasma.

    He says its all easily built from off the shelve products.
    He has no Prototype, computer animated theory only

    He is going to demonstrate the Supersonic Plasma on the 28th.

    All fine and dandy, but it will take large amounts of money and time to
    work out the bugs for such a dynamic device. 2 years or more away from
    a practical product.

    Rossi’s device does not have the same energy density, yet he as already done most
    of the leg work ect…

    Respect
    Kim

    • IF Mills can successfully demonstrate significant excess energy on the 28th, then extracting useful work from the energy produced in the form of hot, fast moving plasma is basically just engineering. If Mills’ MHD generator doesn’t work at the claimed efficiency, there are probably other ways to harvest energy from it if the gain is high enough. If all else fails the supersonic plasma could possibly be ejected from the reactor through a restrictor and venturi (reaction engine) or through a ceramic turbine (rotary power source), or simply run through a heat enchanger (boiler).

      One week to go until we find out what he has so far. From the various snippets I suspect that if we are lucky we will see a capacitor-initiated desktop plasma generator that may look somewhat like Ugo Abundo’s ‘hydrobetatron’ when running (bright, arc-like plasma within a glass or ported reactor vessel), highly instrumented and arranged to discharge plasma through a calorimeter.

      • Close, but no coconut. It seems that there will be a bang from the reactor, with nothing to be seen, followed by endless recalculation by bloggers of any data released, followed by ‘what they should have done was…’ and ‘maybe next time…’.

        “It’s Deja Vu again
        Out of the blue again”
        Jim Prior

    • Charles

      12,000 amps is a huge number of amps. Through 1 ohm, that would produce 144,000,000 watts (P=I^2*R) Staggering. That would illuminate 21 million hallway night lights.

  • Ophelia Rump

    How does so much energy get transferred from such a small space without becoming a bomb?
    These statements suggest no comprehension of the forces involved.

    With that much energy density in that small a space wouldn’t that vaporize the device and a good chunk of its surroundings.
    Massive power plants require massive cooling systems and massive plumbing to carry that much heat and pressure. You cannot simply confine that much heat into a small space without causing massive pressure.

    I will be grateful if the day comes where this guy turns on his first successful prototype outputting 10 MW from a square foot.
    I will not attend the event but I look forward to the video.

    • Charles

      Sorry Ophelia, you don’t output power from a square foot. In mathematics, a square foot is infinitely thin and, ergo, has no volume, thus it cannot have output because there is nothing there. Now, a cubic foot, that is another matter.

      Don’t feel bad though. When most people start talking about power I shudder. They, including a lot of engineers, do not seem to grasp the difference between power and energy especially in the electrical world.

      What is it with people and numbers? Every time Rush Limbaugh e.g. starts talking about things containing numbers, I plug my ears.

      • A minor quibble, but if the MHD generator (where the electrical power will originate) produces a current of even 3MW which flows through an external circuit, then it is the contact surface area of the electrodes that is important. Exactly how you would collect this power from these small electrodes and transfer it into non-superconducting copper cables of several inches diameter (or many, providing similar capacity) is an unexplained mystery. However, existing MHD generators have quite low efficiencies (10-20%), and an output of even 3MW from a 10MW plasma stream would be an accomplishment. The greater part of the power would therefore remain available as heat and kinetic energy, which would need alternative means of harvesting (assuming that Mills’ claim of near 100% conversion efficiency is, er, ‘optimistic’).

        As for a reactor of 1 ft3 producing a 10MW plasma stream but staying physically intact – well lets just say I’d need to see that with my own eyes. No chance of that though – I would think it unwise to be any closer than a couple of city blocks away from such a device when it was fired up.

        • kmarinas86

          MHD generator efficiency is a function of ionization of the plasma and its velocity.

    • kmarinas86

      Power = Force * Velocity

      Want to reduce the forces on the device while delivering the same power? Deliver the power at high velocity and low static pressure, or analogously, high current and low voltage or charge density. Use of a supersonic plasma beam satisfies this condition.

  • Christopher Calder

    This is jaw dropping stuff that sounds like science fiction and too good to be true fantasy, but Mr. Mills has a large staff working for him, claims third party verification of his plasma process, and, as I understand it, his company was purchased by a large power corporation that has its own scientists to verify his work. So it appears it is not just one man going nuts, it is hundreds of people going nuts or an authentic breakthrough of incredible importance.

    All I can say I hope it is true. This technology would be great for building a fan jet engine. How many watts of power would you need to produce the thrust of a 747 fan jet? The Pentagon will be jumping for joy if it works,…until the Russians, Chinese, and Iranians get it as well.

    We need to become a peaceful species if we are to survive this powerful level of high technology.

  • This is jaw dropping stuff that sounds like science fiction and too good to be true fantasy, but Mr. Mills has a large staff working for him, claims third party verification of his plasma process, and, as I understand it, his company was purchased by a large power corporation that has its own scientists to verify his work. So it appears it is not just one man going nuts, it is hundreds of people going nuts or an authentic breakthrough of incredible importance.

    All I can say I hope it is true. This technology would be great for building a fan jet engine. How many watts of power would you need to produce the thrust of a 747 fan jet? The Pentagon will be jumping for joy if it works,…until the Russians, Chinese, and Iranians get it as well.

    We need to become a peaceful species if we are to survive this powerful level of high technology.

  • NT

    Without a dream you go nowhere – I am dreaming, hoping and praying he pulls this one out of the hat and soon…

  • NT

    Without a dream you go nowhere – I am dreaming, hoping and praying he pulls this one out of the hat and soon…

  • Giuliano Bettini

    10 megawatts IN HOW LONG?

    The energy supplied by 10 MW in 1ms is equal to the energy supplied by a 10 Watt bedside lamp in a quarter of an hour WOW!!

    • Giuliano Bettini

      or … maybe 1000 times more

    • artefact

      As I understand it the 10MW are for one spark event with 12000A * 6V = 72KW
      But he stated somewhere else that it can be continuous. (many sparks)

    • Giuliano Bettini

      If I’m not wrong again, I would say that it is a 10 watt light bulb for about 10 days. Oh well, it’s always a little.

    • Sanjeev

      It implies a continuous 10 MW when time is not specified.
      So a coal power plant of 500MW supplies that 500MW continuously.

    • Andreas Moraitis

      10 kJ or 2.778 Wh is — according to WolframAlpha — about

      “1.1 × typical battery energy content of an alkaline long-life AA battery”.

      • Andreas Moraitis

        On the other hand, if they need a 12000 A current at a (hypothetical) voltage of 10 V over 1 ms to trigger the reaction they would consume only 120 J. Pretty good COP.

  • Giuliano Bettini

    10 megawatts IN HOW LONG?

    The energy supplied by 10 MW in 1ms is equal to the energy supplied by a 10 Watt bedside lamp in a quarter of an hour WOW!!

    • Giuliano Bettini

      or … maybe 1000 times more

    • artefact

      As I understand it the 10MW are for one spark event with 12000A * 6V = 72KW
      But he stated somewhere else that it can be continuous. (many sparks)

    • Giuliano Bettini

      If I’m not wrong again, I would say that it is a 10 watt light bulb for about 10 days. Oh well, it’s always a little.

    • david55

      10 MW / H

      • Andre Blum

        That doesn’t make sense. Do you mean MWh/h?

        • david55

          10 MW / H =10000 kW / H –>supply power to 10000 Home–> average power consumption 1kW / H for each Home

          • Andre Blum

            W (Watt) is the unit of power. power per time does not make sense. Compare: your car may have a 200 kW engine (old unit would be HP, 200 kW = 268 HP). It makes no sense saying that it has 268 HP per hour.

            Wh (Watt-hours) is a unit of energy (as is Joule. 1 MJ is 0.27 kWh). It multiplies power with the amount of time you are consuming or producing this power. If you run your engine at peak power for 10 hours, you have used 2000 kWh.

            If you use your engine variably, not always using peak power, but want to express the average power, you could say you used e.g. 80 kW, you could make this more explicit by saying 80 kWh/h.

            The same applies here when we are talking Mills’ power production. If he says he produces 10 MW, we may assume (as Sanjeev says) that he is talking continuous production. (or he may mean average production as in MWh/h, if his power level varies over time.)

            It seems you think Mills means to say 10 MWh (although you write MW/h). This is possible, but I don’t think so.

          • david55

            Average production is 10 MWh/h

    • Sanjeev

      It implies a continuous 10 MW when time is not specified.
      So a coal power plant of 500MW supplies that 500MW continuously.

    • Andreas Moraitis

      10 kJ or 2.778 Wh is — according to WolframAlpha — about

      “1.1 × typical battery energy content of an alkaline long-life AA battery”.

      • Andreas Moraitis

        On the other hand, if they need a 12000 A current at a (hypothetical) voltage of 10 V over 1 ms to trigger the reaction they would consume only 120 J. Pretty good COP.

  • ies

    “All electric cars apart from the Tesla use DC motors” er no.. they don’t in fact, most use AC, including the Volt! Strange statement Dr Mills.

    • Charles

      As a one-time Chief Engineer of a motor and motor-drive company, I will say that DC is very difficult to deal with and for purposes of control and efficiency the first thing that happens is to turn it to AC or if you wish pulsed DC (pulse width modulation – typically) which is really a form of AC. In the case of electric cars, however, you are really stuck with starting with a battery (DC) or sometime in the not to distant future., capacitors. The mega-capacitor will be one of the greatest advances in power storage, bye-bye batteries.

  • Charles Hansen

    There was initial talk of measuring the energy output via calorimeter… is that still the case? Is it just going to be a light show? I’m not seeing any convincing evidence of the claims, or even hope to see that evidence, quite yet. Without the MHD, they will only have heat, and 10MW is roughly 833 stoves at full power. In 1ft cube. That will be some heat…. even 5% of that is over 40 stoves equivalent waste heat @ 95% electric conversion efficiency….. Also is liquid helium cooling off-the-shelf? I’d be surprised. I’d like to believe…

  • nickec

    My guess is that *possibly* Mr. Mills will show a plasma discharge which will be measured. Most of the presentation will consist of what you *could* do with a very strong plasma. If he uses competent measurement techniques, some capable investigators *may* investigate further. I will be very surprised if the “demo” goes beyond what I have outlined above. I do hope for success, and I wish we could see more. It just does not seem likely we will see more. IMHO

    The interview suggests that a functioning system, like Mr. Mills outlined, has yet to be built by him or his associates. Though he repeatedly *insists* that building a system can be done by integrating inexpensive off-the-shelf parts. I look forward to the 28th.

  • Sanjeev

    “10^10 Watts per Liter of water. To put that in perspective, the entire U.S. grid is 6 x 10^11watts….”

    This seems to be the mother of all claims. Rossi must be scared.

    • Charles

      If Rossi is scared, the front of his pants should be showing a hydrino source large enough to power a small city.

  • Sanjeev

    “10^10 Watts per Liter of water. To put that in perspective, the entire U.S. grid is 6 x 10^11watts….”

    This seems to be the mother of all claims. Rossi must be scared.

    • Charles

      If Rossi is scared, the front of his pants should be showing a hydrino source large enough to power a small city.

  • Wayne

    DOES BLACKLIGHT INTEND TO MARKET THIS NOW OR AFTER ANOTHER 25 YEARS OF RESEARCH? Why does this one simple question ellude interviewers?

    Yes.. We understand a power source 100 times cheaper than coal is beneficial.. DUH!!!!

    Look.. Blacklight has released identical press releases with third party verification’s annually. It is just that time of year again.

    Go to their website and read their press release for 2012. It sounds like they were ready to stock Home Depot, but years later it is more of the same.

    I understand the products need R&D, testing, certifications, Theories, and more, but the main question on a zillion minds is WHEN…

    WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN.

    Is that too hard a question to ask. Isn’t Who, What, Where, When the basics an true interviewer would cover?

    Should I buy a new car now, or will it need a Hydrogen conversion (from onboard hydrogen from BLP electricity) in 5 years?

    Is their product stable (The Rossi device was not in 2011 but is now )?

    I even emailed BLP myself asking this with no response (I asked briefer without any doubt).

    WHEN, WHEN, WHEN. Is the 28th a day for history or will history come in another 25 years?

    • Daniel Maris

      Fair comment. I think we are getting a bit tired of BLP claims that are not backed up by anything commensurate to the claims.

    • Sanjeev

      Your frustration is understandable. With $80 mil funding and a generator which will take only weeks to build (as he says), he could have demonstrated that generator instead, shown working at an independent location with some names and faces.
      I don’t see a point in demoing a calorimeter to the ordinary public.

      • Fortyniner

        To me, that is the proverbial elephant. If they have backing in place, I would have thought they and their backers would want to stay quiet in public until they were ready to roll their stuff out, including the power converter. Any demos/milestones would be for the eyes and ears of those concerned only.

        If they *don’t* have backing, then why not? They have been making claims for years and interested parties (including the military) would have made contact and kept a watching brief, then would surely have offered backing when they got anywhere near the claimed power densities and outputs.

        I don’t find the remaining options too encouraging, but am reserving judgement ’til the 28th.

        • Donk970

          I think that Rossi’s claims and the claims of others has pushed these guys into premature confabulation. They really would have been much better off waiting a few months to build the complete system even if it wasn’t perfect. It’s possible that investors or board members got panicky and demanded a public demo to keep Rossi or someone else from getting commitments from potential customers.

          • Fortyniner

            Yes, I agree that Mills has probably been pushed into this seemingly rather pointless exercise. Whether that is for the reason you suggest, or for some other reason (such as pending seizure of the technology on ‘national security’ grounds as others have suggested) remains to be seen. If his claims are even partly true then it seems that he may have found a novel way to initiate powerful explosions – something that might not escape the attention of the military.

    • LENR G

      It is true that they have been touting their great system and their new hydrino theory for some time. However when I try to piece together the engineering timeline it looks like in late 2012 they were testing cells that had a COP of only 1.8 (ENSER report) but had achieved 50x greater power density than a year before (and a previous round of validations). So if we take them at their word they had some interesting results and some validation of their hydrino theory in 2011, were able to test a bunch of cells in 2012 and achieve and validate over-unity but were still a ways from commercialization.

      Now they claim a COP of around 100 with off the charts power density so they are essentially claiming very significant breakthroughs in 2013… to the point where a device they can design is a commercialization no-brainer. So, perhaps rushed by Rossi, they are going public.

      Mills will try to demonstrate the core reaction and talk about the underlying theory and the evidence for it. I think this is appropriate (though it will prove nothing) IF IF IF it is immediately followed by commercialization and widespread independent validation. If he doesn’t announce concrete plans for these things on the 28th then that’s a huge red flag.

      Like I said in an earlier post, this is the end of the line for Blacklight Power. Either it is one last dog and pony show to try and get a few more tens of millions to keep his well-executed scam going or it is the final pit stop before the race to commercialization. Because the technology he describes, if it’s real… well there’s absolutely no reason to delay its propagation. In the real world this is Blacklight’s coming out party. They would show and tell all. Be completely open about everything. In the alternate scam universe they slink back into the shadows and nothing happens.

      It’s not feasible that nothing happens. There is no reason on the planet for further R&D before commercialization on what they claim. It’s ridiculously good. It must be set free. Pepco could have these things generating electricity for them at their plants in a couple of months. If they detour into months/years of working on the perfect magnetohydrodynamic (MHD) plasma power converter then you know it’s all a sham.

      If they delay at all I would be in favor of forced government takeover in the interest of national security. Then the government could manage and accelerate the commercialization (or the subpoenas, as appropriate).

      • LENR G

        To elaborate a little bit, we should hear almost immediately about agreements with OEMs — named, not protected by NDAs.

        There should be prototype devices being tested at a minimum of 3 universities within a month or two. The information about the tests should be public — who, what, where, when.

        There should be a persistent public relations campaign to educate the media and everyone.

        Blacklight Power should involve the highest levels of the US Government to validate the technology and that involvement should be public.

        Also, since Pepco Holdings is a partial owner we should expect an endorsement of the technology from them.

        In short, time to go big or go home.

        • deleo77

          LENR G you make a lot of really great points. Mills did say that they will talk about their commercialization efforts at the demo. So we can expect to hear something. It will be a matter of how specific he chooses to be in terms of timing, OEM’s etc. Anything less than that and I think everyone here will be disappointed.

          Either the demo next week is going to land with a thud, and no one will be talking about it except on forums like these, or it will be the real deal, in which case the mainstream media will jump all over it. There isn’t a lot of room in between. I actually think it will be a big deal and will put BLP in the spotlight.

          Also, on Vortex a poster was saying that BLP has essentially built a Papp Engine. For anyone interested in the history of it, it can be found here. It’s a good read.

          http://www.infinite-energy.com/iemagazine/issue51/papp.html

          • friendlyprogrammer

            The Interviewer did ask when BTW. I had missed it.

            I enjoy the subject and Sterling Allen is at the forefront of investigation.

            Kudos to his enormous efforts on behalf of us all.

            I am just frustrated Dr. Mills avoids discussion of a timeline.

  • Wayne

    DOES BLACKLIGHT INTEND TO MARKET THIS NOW OR AFTER ANOTHER 25 YEARS OF RESEARCH? Why does this one simple question ellude interviewers?

    Yes.. We understand a power source 100 times cheaper than coal is beneficial.. DUH!!!!

    Look.. Blacklight has released identical press releases with third party verification’s annually. It is just that time of year again.

    Go to their website and read their press release for 2012. It sounds like they were ready to stock Home Depot, but years later it is more of the same.

    I understand the products need R&D, testing, certifications, Theories, and more, but the main question on a zillion minds is WHEN…

    WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN.

    Is that too hard a question to ask. Isn’t Who, What, Where, When the basics an true interviewer would cover?

    Should I buy a new car now, or will it need a Hydrogen conversion (from onboard hydrogen from BLP electricity) in 5 years?

    Is their product stable (The Rossi device was not in 2011 but is now )?

    I even emailed BLP myself asking this with no response (I asked briefer without any doubt).

    WHEN, WHEN, WHEN. Is the 28th a day for history or will history come in another 25 years?

    • Robert Ellefson

      What makes you think a meaningful answer to this question exists? Creating a marketable product from scratch takes time and involves uncertainty even when the technologies involved are mature. When you are working on complex, cutting-edge technologies, schedules are very difficult to predict. When you are creating a marketable product from scratch with complex technologies that are so far ahead of the cutting edge that new fields of science need to be created in order to understand what is happening, then I would venture to guess that ‘very difficult to predict’ would be understating the matter. I share your frustration and eagerness for a resolution to all of these tantalizing announcements of clean abundant energy technologies, but I doubt that BLP is capable of providing the information that you want. I think your questions are better addressed to government leaders. Where is the public investment that is so urgently needed for this field? Why are our governments abdicating their responsibilities for enabling this type of technology development entirely?

    • Sanjeev

      Your frustration is understandable. With $80 mil funding and a generator which will take only weeks to build (as he says), he could have demonstrated that generator instead, shown working at an independent location with some names and faces.
      I don’t see a point in demoing a calorimeter to the ordinary public.

      • To me, that is the proverbial elephant. If they have backing in place, I would have thought they and their backers would want to stay quiet in public until they were ready to roll their stuff out, including the power converter. Any demos/milestones would be for the eyes and ears of those concerned only.

        If they *don’t* have backing in place, then why not? They have been making O/U claims for some time and interested parties (including the military) would surely have made contact and kept a watching brief, then would presumably have offered backing when they got anywhere near the claimed power densities and outputs.

        I don’t find the remaining options too encouraging, but am reserving judgement ’til the 28th.

        • Donk970

          I think that Rossi’s claims and the claims of others has pushed these guys into premature confabulation. They really would have been much better off waiting a few months to build the complete system even if it wasn’t perfect. It’s possible that investors or board members got panicky and demanded a public demo to keep Rossi or someone else from getting commitments from potential customers.

          • Yes, I agree that Mills has probably been pushed into this seemingly rather pointless exercise. Whether that is for the reason you suggest, or for some other reason (such as pending seizure of the technology on ‘national security’ grounds as others have suggested) remains to be seen. If his claims are even partly true then it seems that he may have found a novel way to initiate powerful explosions – something that might not escape the attention of the military.

    • It is true that they have been touting their great system and their new hydrino theory for some time. However when I try to piece together the engineering timeline it looks like in late 2012 they were testing cells that had a COP of only 1.8 (ENSER report) but had achieved 50x greater power density than a year before (and a previous round of validations). So if we take them at their word they had some interesting results and some validation of their hydrino theory in 2011, were able to test a bunch of cells in 2012 and achieve and validate over-unity but were still a ways from commercialization.

      Now they claim a COP of around 100 with off the charts power density so they are essentially claiming very significant breakthroughs in 2013… to the point where a device they can design is a commercialization no-brainer. So, perhaps rushed by Rossi, they are going public.

      Mills will try to demonstrate the core reaction and talk about the underlying theory and the evidence for it. I think this is appropriate (though it will prove nothing) IF IF IF it is immediately followed by commercialization and widespread independent validation. If he doesn’t announce concrete plans for these things on the 28th then that’s a huge red flag.

      Like I said in an earlier post, this is the end of the line for Blacklight Power. Either it is one last dog and pony show to try and get a few more tens of millions to keep his well-executed scam going or it is the final pit stop before the race to commercialization. Because the technology he describes, if it’s real… well there’s absolutely no reason to delay its propagation. In the real world this is Blacklight’s coming out party. They would show and tell all. Be completely open about everything. In the alternate scam universe they slink back into the shadows and nothing happens.

      It’s not feasible that nothing happens. There is no reason on the planet for further R&D before commercialization on what they claim. It’s ridiculously good. It must be set free. Pepco could have these things generating electricity for them at their plants in a couple of months. If they detour into months/years of working on the perfect magnetohydrodynamic (MHD) plasma power converter then you know it’s all a sham.

      If they delay at all I would be in favor of forced government takeover in the interest of national security. Then the government could manage and accelerate the commercialization (or the subpoenas, as appropriate).

      • To elaborate a little bit, we should hear almost immediately about agreements with OEMs — named, not protected by NDAs.

        There should be prototype devices being tested at a minimum of 3 universities within a month or two. The information about the tests should be public — who, what, where, when.

        There should be a persistent public relations campaign to educate the media and everyone.

        Blacklight Power should involve the highest levels of the US Government to validate the technology and that involvement should be public.

        Also, since Pepco Holdings is a partial owner we should expect an endorsement of the technology from them.

        In short, time to go big or go home.

        • deleo77

          LENR G you make a lot of really great points. Mills did say that they will talk about their commercialization efforts at the demo. So we can expect to hear something. It will be a matter of how specific he chooses to be in terms of timing, OEM’s etc. Anything less than that and I think everyone here will be disappointed.

          Either the demo next week is going to land with a thud, and no one will be talking about it except on forums like these, or it will be the real deal, in which case the mainstream media will jump all over it. There isn’t a lot of room in between. I actually think it will be a big deal and will put BLP in the spotlight.

          Also, on Vortex a poster was saying that BLP has essentially built a Papp Engine. For anyone interested in the history of it, it can be found here. It’s a good read.

          http://www.infinite-energy.com/iemagazine/issue51/papp.html

          • friendlyprogrammer

            The Interviewer did ask when BTW. I had missed it.

            I enjoy the subject and Sterling Allen is at the forefront of investigation.

            Kudos to his enormous efforts on behalf of us all.

            I am just frustrated Dr. Mills avoids discussion of a timeline.

  • Gerard McEk

    Frank, you have applied to watch this demo, will you be there? I hope you will be able to confirm Mills statement input power vs. output power. A factor 100 should be easy to confirm… However, I am not very optimistic that you will succeed in it.

    • ecatworld

      Yes, I have asked for an invitation, but haven’t received one, and I think today is the deadline for them to be issued.

  • Gerard McEk

    Frank, you have applied to watch this demo, will you be there? I hope you will be able to confirm Mills statement input power vs. output power. A factor 100 should be easy to confirm… However, I am not very optimistic that you will succeed in it.

    • Frank Acland

      Yes, I have asked for an invitation, but haven’t received one, and I think today is the deadline for them to be issued.

  • Daniel Maris

    Marketable yes…but prototype? Rossi gave demos with his prototypes (and we also saw earlier prototypes). After several years in the field he shouldn’t be relying on computer graphics. That makes no sense at all.

    • LENR G

      I think they plan to demo the actual reactor core with some calorimetry suited for high power events (bomb calorimeter).

      In a way that’s even better than showing a full prototype.

      Of course demos don’t really get you anything in terms of actual validation except to draw a line in the sand. What happens after the 28th will be key.

  • Andre Blum

    That doesn’t make sense. Do you mean MWh/h?

    • david55

      10 MW / H =10000 kW / H –>supply power to 10000 Home–> average power consumption 1kW / H for each Home

      • Andre Blum

        W (Watt) is the unit of power. power per time does not make sense. Compare: your car may have a 200 kW engine (old unit would be HP, 200 kW = 268 HP). It makes no sense saying that it has 268 HP per hour.

        Wh (Watt-hours) is a unit of energy (as is Joule. 1 MJ is 0.27 kWh). It multiplies power with the amount of time you are consuming or producing this power. If you run your engine at peak power for 10 hours, you have used 2000 kWh.

        If you use your engine variably, not always using peak power, but want to express the average power, you could say you used e.g. 80 kW, you could make this more explicit by saying 80 kWh/h.

        The same applies here when we are talking Mills’ power production. If he says he produces 10 MW, we may assume (as Sanjeev says) that he is talking continuous production. (or he may mean average production as in MWh/h, if his power level varies over time.)

        It seems you think Mills means to say 10 MWh (although you write MW/h). This is possible, but I don’t think so.

        • david55

          Average production is 10 MWh/h

  • Charles

    Sorry Ophelia, you don’t output power from a square foot. In mathematics, a square foot is infinitely thin and, ergo, has no volume, thus it cannot have output because there is nothing there. Now, a cubic foot, that is another matter.

    Don’t feel bad though. When most people start talking about power I shudder. They, including a lot of engineers, do not seem to grasp the difference between power and energy especially in the electrical world.

    What is it with people and numbers? Every time Rush Limbaugh e.g. starts talking about things containing numbers, I plug my ears.

    • Fortyniner

      A minor quibble, but if the MHD (which is presumably where the electrical power will originate) has + and – electrodes, between which flows a current of 10MW, then it is the surface area of the electrodes and not the volume between them that is important. Exactly how you would collect this power from these electrodes and transfer it into non-superconducting copper cables of several inches diameter (or many, providing similar capacity) is an unexplained mystery.

      As for a reactor of 1 ft3 producing a 10MW plasma stream but staying physically intact – well lets just say I’d need to see that with my own eyes. No chance of that though – I would think it unwise to be closer than a couple of city blocks away from such a device when it was fired up.

  • Andreas Moraitis

    Admin, with no discourtesy, it’s Sterling Allan (not Allen). (You can delete this post.)

    • bachcole

      I am more worried about well-meaning people locking Mills up for years in a lunny bin.

  • bachcole

    This comment is what you could call a scathing review. If you don’t want to read a scathing review, I suggest that you don’t read it.

    In this paragraph I will address the social/personality aspects of this interview only. When I hear Rossi talk, I hear a sweet and reasonable person who thinks through what he is going to say and clearly knows what he is talking about. When I hear McKubre, I hear an incredibly dignified, wise, knowledgeable, easy going person who clearly knows what he is talking about. When I hear Godes, I hear a reasonable person with a good sense of humor. Listening to Mills, I felt like I was listening to a psychotic person who knows how to hit all of the “oh gee whiz wow” buttons in quick succession. I think that Mills is sincere. I think that he should lay off the coffee. I will believe him when I see the input vs. the output. Right now, because of this interview, and because of many of the physics problems already listed here by those far superior to me in the physical sciences, I actively DISBELIEVE that Mills has anything other than a very interesting theory. It is not unheard of that a psychotic will “seduce” other people into their delusions. Heavens Gate and Jonestown come to mind. Mills could be such a case. Even if his theory is true, it could still be the case.

    Mills saying that what he has can be build with all off-the-shelf equipment just ain’t so; it is what we sometimes call “a lie”. The MHD has not yet even been invented. I would hardly call that off-the-shelf. And a unit in my house that puts out 1 million watts, it would burn down my house. And he said that the gears are disengaged for 1/60 of the time and are heat sinked and this is going to solve the heat problem of 1 million watts. Please, people, I also look forward to his demonstration, but I won’t be really excited as the 28th approaches. Really. He may have something, but his presentation is dreadful to the point of being psychotic.

    • BroKeeper

      Very interesting how people can come up with a different analysis of ones demeanor/character. You could be right and I’m a pie-in-the sky kind of person. Very interesting, The truth could be known soon.

    • bitplayer

      See artefact’s note to forty-niner, above:

      “Peter, he did go through this spiel realy at least two times. Sterling Allan wrote on his page that his software did not record the first time and Mills did the interview a second time (a little faster though)”

    • bitplayer

      PESN page, explanation of Mills’ presentation manner:

      “This morning I was fortunate to be able to interview Dr. Mills for thirty minutes. Unfortunately, due to a computer glitch, my Skype recorder wasn’t turned on. But he graciously agreed to do another interview, which was shorter because he had a meeting he had to get to. And, because I had already asked my questions, he rolled through the information in quick manner, addressing pretty much all the same points in rapid-fire manner.”

      Unusual conclusions are sometimes related to incomplete information and/or mistaken assumptions.

    • Pekka Janhunen

      Agreed completely, Roger. Except that I think his theory is not possible so I don’t find it interesting. In principle he might have some excess heat. But since nothing indicates that he would be demonstrating it next week, he probably doesn’t.

      • artefact

        From Pesn:
        “They will also demonstrate a powerful burst of energy, which makes a shock-wave
        that results in a loud sound. This will go into a heat measurement device, also
        known as a “bomb calorimeter” which measures the heat dissipated into
        the water. This data will be given, by which the power per unit volume can be
        calculated.”

        • BroKeeper

          I hope it’s not on high on the Richter scale for home devices. My wife won’t like replacing the china often.

          • BroKeeper

            Seriously I’m curious about the noise level of those plasma sparks with 20K amps. To me the current resembles lightening.

        • Pekka Janhunen

          Showing that output is larger than input is not enough, it must be excess beyond the chemical limit. It’s very difficult to show it convincingly during one afternoon. Each kg of material can produce chemical energy for one hour at 13 kW power or for 45 seconds at 1 MW power. An alternative to lengthy test is to open the device and let people analyse it so that they get convinced that the energy-producing part is very small, but that’s also not possible to get done during one afternoon. Levi et al. did both: long duration and open the same device. A demo is not a substitute for independent verification, as many people on page have pointed out.

          • artefact

            Now I see what you mean.

    • kmarinas86

      “Mills saying that what he has can be build with all off-the-shelf equipment just ain’t so; it is what we sometimes call ‘a lie’.”

      If Mills means off-the-retail-shelf (as in those found in shops open to the general public), then you’re probably right.
      If Mills means off-the-commercial-shelf (as in those found in shops open only to members of industry), then you’re wrong.

  • BroKeeper

    Although with these “unbelievable” claims, I noticed while observing the interview Randell Mills’ calm and transparent demeanor voice throughout. This is not a man of disillusion or concerned about possible fraud and extortion indictments with million dollar civil suits and 25 years of imprisonment. Yes, even with 1/10 of exaggerated power claims it constitutes a new energy at least 100 times power currently available.

    If a 10 MWH within a cubical foot device is true then there is a limit to anyone home can consume. Instead of a unit per home why not community buried mini grids supporting 10K homes each. Instead of .1 cent/KWH for a home unit, why not unlimited maintenance free energy distributed from one local central point supported by very small local or state tax dollars (I know this is an oxymoron: government = low taxes)?

    With this in mind, as far as a home unit is concerned, will still allow Rossi with a viable future safe device because of the average home needs. It depends on which provider can provide the cheapest and safest system. This, with all its flaws, is where capitalism shines – competition (although I prefer cooperation in a perfect giving society – good luck with that one).

    Who knows, January 28th may be a very historical date of awakening. I’m looking forward to the demo.

    • Fortyniner

      For me he comes over as a salesman going through a spiel he’s done a hundred times before, but I guess that’s just one more example of how people’s prejudices can alter perceptions (I tend to mistrust people who talk too fast and lack intonation – which I freely admit is utterly irrelevant). I also don’t like round numbers in this context – real factors tend to be fairly random).

      • artefact

        Peter, he did go through this spiel realy at least two times. Sterling Allan wrote on his page that his software did not record the first time and Mills did the interview a second time (a little faster though)

        • Fortyniner

          Yes, noted. I’m trying to stay in neutral mode, but some of the claims are just a bit too much and this probably colours my impression of Mills.

      • BroKeeper

        Yes, Rossi’s delivery appears more sincere IMO. Tough to really know.

      • GreenWin

        Fortyniner, Mills is far more skilled at the science he is passionate about than good media performance. I agree, it sounded like what it was, a dozen bullet points regurgitated to Sterling because Stirling did not check to see if he was recording the original interview. But if you dig into any of his papers – he reports many non-round numbers as his entire low ground H premise is built around the n/137 fractions.

        I think if we see a demo with qualified energy density anywhere near what he is claiming – it will be impressive. And since it appears that MHD is near-commercial for converting fire (presumably hot fires like fluid bed coal) – the next phase could be demoed in 6 months. I don’t expect or demand for a commercial product “right now!” Mills has been in bed with government and military for a long while. He may have just gotten a green flag to pull this out from behind the black curtain.

        His papers and documentation are IMO meticulous. Reading the recent massive patent app is indicative of his work. In the animation it looked like he/Sterling used a Bussard / Polywell design for the MHD (toroids arranged in a cube.) If his plasma can be oscillated, the MHD convertor should as he says not be too complex – outside keeping heat and ionization from damaging the materials.

        • NT

          GreenWin, Do you think this device (if real) can someday be scaled down (to around D cell battery size) to plop into a home power distribution receptacle, same for your vehicle? Something on the order of being 20 kWh and capable of ramping up and down as load demands change? Or am I just dreaming ahead too far?

          • GreenWin

            Possibly. STMicro is experienced in nanoscale chip production and they have filed an LENR patent app. I guess they think they can do LENR on a chip. I would think first vehicle apps would simply charge Li-ion batteries at $.01/kWh. Safety issues for mobile reactors are significant. BTW I have Not read Mills’ whole patent. His work is dense and detailed requiring a huge commitment of time. I’ve read most of his GUT.

          • NT

            GreenWin, Thanks for your insight and I agree with you on his patent application. Even as an old retired chemist, I must take it in tiny gulps with many re-reads while trying to understand/digest what I just read. – amazing!

          • BroKeeper

            As 49’r mentioned above carrying tanks of liquid helium and nitrogen is not a very cool (aaah very cool) idea within in a vehicle should it rupture in an accident. Obviously the cubic foot device is probably not taking that storage volume in considration. It appears much depends on future materials and attachements before device is ready for market. At this point in time IMO Rossi has the edge for first-to-market advantage.

          • Fortyniner

            First you would need another small ‘miracle’; room temperature superconductors – unless you want to carry around some tanks of liquid helium and nitrogen.

    • tlp

      This 10 MW version on the animation video is indeed meant to support 10k homes, look at the video to the end.

  • bachcole

    This comment is what you could call a scathing review. If you don’t want to read a scathing review, I suggest that you don’t read it.

    In this paragraph I will address the social/personality aspects of this interview only. When I hear Rossi talk, I hear a sweet and reasonable person who thinks through what he is going to say and clearly knows what he is talking about. When I hear McKubre, I hear an incredibly dignified, wise, knowledgeable, easy going person who clearly knows what he is talking about. When I hear Godes, I hear a reasonable person with a good sense of humor. Listening to Mills, I felt like I was listening to a psychotic person who knows how to hit all of the “oh gee whiz wow” buttons in quick succession. I think that Mills is sincere. I think that he should lay off the coffee. I will believe him when I see the input vs. the output. Right now, because of this interview, and because of many of the physics problems already listed here by those far superior to me in the physical sciences, I actively DISBELIEVE that Mills has anything other than a very interesting theory. It is not unheard of that a psychotic will “seduce” other people into their delusions. Heavens Gate and Jonestown come to mind. Mills could be such a case. Even if his theory is true, it could still be the case.

    Mills saying that what he has can be build with all off-the-shelf equipment just ain’t so; it is what we sometimes call “a lie”. The MHD has not yet even been invented. I would hardly call that off-the-shelf. And a unit in my house that puts out 1 million watts, it would burn down my house. And he said that the gears are disengaged for 1/60 of the time and are heat sinked and this is going to solve the heat problem of 1 million watts. Please, people, I also look forward to his demonstration, but I won’t be really excited as the 28th approaches. Really. He may have something, but his presentation is dreadful to the point of being psychotic.

    • Brokeeper

      Very interesting how people can come up with a different analysis of one’s demeanor/character. You could be right and I’m a pie-in-the sky over trusting kind of person. Very interesting, The truth could be known soon.

    • Otto1923

      Well you say that MHD hasn’t been invented but since this is the internet we can quickly ascertain that your statement ‘hasn’t been invented’ is a lie.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MHD_generator

      -Many prototypes and research machines. And they are simple and easy to build using generic materials and off the shelf parts.

      • bachcole

        Thank you for correcting me. Are any being used anywhere for the purposes of energy production? What is their status?

        • david55

          In last 50 years many prototype MHD Generators has been built around world you can see few picture of them in this paper. even a 500MW Generators .
          http://www.irdindia.in/Journal_IJAEEE/PDF/Vol2_Iss6/16.pdf

          • bachcole

            Thank you, david55. So, they exist, and it is do-able. But off the shelf they are not.

        • GreenWin

          Much MHD research is behind black walls. The implications for all manner of propulsion alone would classify most of the high end. Read the Village Voice article I link at the top Roger. It sheds a lot of light on reasons for BlackLight technology to be kept quiet. Until now.

      • cx

        I assume he means the MHD hasn’t been invented yet by BLP for their machine.

        • bachcole

          I’m going to hang tough with “it’s not off-the-shelf” like a can of WD-40. I doubt if it is in usage. But if Otto1923 says that it has been invented, I believe him.

    • Pekka Janhunen

      Agreed completely, Roger. Except that I think his theory is not possible so I don’t find it interesting. In principle he might have some excess heat. But since nothing indicates that he would be demonstrating it next week, he probably doesn’t.

      • artefact

        From Pesn:
        “They will also demonstrate a powerful burst of energy, which makes a shock-wave
        that results in a loud sound. This will go into a heat measurement device, also
        known as a “bomb calorimeter” which measures the heat dissipated into
        the water. This data will be given, by which the power per unit volume can be
        calculated.”

        • Brokeeper

          I hope it’s not high on the Richter scale for home devices. My wife won’t like replacing the china often.

          • Brokeeper

            Seriously I’m curious about the noise level of those plasma sparks with 20K amps. To me the current resembles lightening with 200 PPM.

        • Pekka Janhunen

          Showing that output is larger than input is not enough, it must be excess beyond the chemical limit. It’s very difficult to show it convincingly during one afternoon. Each kg of material can produce chemical energy for one hour at 13 kW power or for 45 seconds at 1 MW power. An alternative to lengthy test is to open the device and let people analyse it so that they get convinced that the energy-producing part is very small, but that’s also not possible to get done during one afternoon. Levi et al. did both: long duration and open the same device. A demo is not a substitute for independent verification, as many people on page have pointed out.

          • artefact

            Now I see what you mean.

    • kmarinas86

      “Mills saying that what he has can be build with all off-the-shelf equipment just ain’t so; it is what we sometimes call ‘a lie’.”

      If Mills means off-the-retail-shelf (as in those found in shops open to the general public), then you’re probably right.
      If Mills means off-the-commercial-shelf (as in those found in shops open only to members of industry), then you’re wrong.

  • Brokeeper

    Although with these “unbelievable” claims, I noticed while observing the interview Randell Mills’ calm and transparent demeanor voice throughout. This is not a man of disillusion or concerned about possible fraud and extortion indictments with million dollar civil suits and 25 years of imprisonment. Yes, even with 1/10 of exaggerated power claims it constitutes a new energy at least 100 times power currently available.

    If a 10 MWH within a cubical foot device is true then there is a limit to any one home can consume. Instead of a unit per home why not community buried mini grids supporting 10K homes each. Instead of .1 cent/KWH for a home unit, why not unlimited maintenance free energy distributed from one local central point supported by very small local or state tax dollars (I know this is an oxymoron: government = low taxes)?

    With this in mind, as far as a home unit is concerned, will still allow Rossi with a viable future safe device because of the average home needs. It depends on which provider can offer the cheapest and safest system. This, with all its flaws, is where capitalism shines – competition (although I prefer cooperation in a perfect giving society – good luck with that one).

    Who knows, January 28th may be a very historical date of awakening. I’m looking forward to the demo.

    • For me he comes over as a salesman going through a spiel he’s done a hundred times before, but I guess that’s just one more example of how people’s prejudices can alter perceptions (I tend to mistrust people who talk too fast and lack natural intonation – which I freely admit is not only utterly irrelevant but is explained near the end). I also don’t like round numbers in this context (such as ’10MW from 1 cubic foot’, ‘one hundred times the energy density of gasoline’) – real factors tend to be much more random.

      • artefact

        Peter, he did go through this spiel realy at least two times. Sterling Allan wrote on his page that his software did not record the first time and Mills did the interview a second time (a little faster though)

        • Yes, noted. I’m trying to stay in neutral mode, but some of the claims are just a bit too much and this probably colours my impression of Mills.

      • Brokeeper

        Yes, Rossi’s delivery appears more sincere IMO. Tough to really know.

      • GreenWin

        Fortyniner, Mills is far more skilled at the science he is passionate about than good media performance. I agree, it sounded like what it was, a dozen bullet points regurgitated to Sterling because Stirling did not check to see if he was recording the original interview. But if you dig into any of his papers – he reports many non-round numbers as his entire low ground H premise is built around the n/137 fractions.

        I think if we see a demo with qualified energy density anywhere near what he is claiming – it will be impressive. And since it appears that MHD is near-commercial for converting fire (presumably hot fires like fluid bed coal) – the next phase could be demoed in 6 months. I don’t expect or demand for a commercial product “right now!” Mills has been in bed with government and military for a long while. He may have just gotten a green flag to pull this out from behind the black curtain.

        His papers and documentation are IMO meticulous. Reading the recent massive patent app is indicative of his work. In the animation it looked like he/Sterling used a Bussard / Polywell design for the MHD (toroids arranged in a cube.) If his plasma can be oscillated, the MHD convertor should as he says not be too complex – outside keeping heat and ionization from damaging the materials.

        • bachcole

          Despite my allergy to conspiracy theories, I find merit it your “Mills has been in bed with government and military for a long while. He
          may have just gotten a green flag to pull this out from behind the
          black curtain.”

          • GreenWin

            Not unusual. Raytheon was building high energy radar systems for mil when they discovered that microwaves could cook food! Four years later they introduced the first commercial microwave oven. A version of which will be heating my tea in a minute…

        • NT

          GreenWin, Do you think this device (if real) can someday be scaled down (to around D cell battery size) to plop into a home power distribution receptacle, same for your vehicle? Something on the order of being 20 kWh and capable of ramping up and down as load demands change? Or am I just dreaming ahead too far?

          • GreenWin

            Possibly. STMicro is experienced in nanoscale chip production and they have filed an LENR patent app. I guess they think they can do LENR on a chip. I would think first vehicle apps would simply charge Li-ion batteries at $.01/kWh. Safety issues for mobile reactors are significant. BTW I have Not read Mills’ whole patent. His work is dense and detailed requiring a huge commitment of time. I’ve read most of his GUT.

          • NT

            GreenWin, Thanks for your insight and I agree with you on his patent application. Even as an old retired chemist, I must take it in tiny gulps with many re-reads while trying to understand/digest what I just read. – amazing!

          • Brokeeper

            As 49’r mentioned above carrying tanks of liquid helium and nitrogen is not a very cool (aaah very cool) idea within in a vehicle should it rupture in an accident. Obviously the cubic foot device is probably not taking that storage volume in considration. It appears much depends on future materials and attachements before device is ready for market. At this point in time IMO Rossi has the edge for first-to-market advantage.

          • First you would need another small ‘miracle’; room temperature superconductors – unless you want to carry around some tanks of liquid helium and nitrogen.

      • bachcole

        Dear 49er, I don’t think that talking too fast is irrelevant. A speeded up mind along the continuum of mental/emotional/spiritual health is in the direction of crazy.

      • AstralProjectee

        If you would have read original article by Sterling you would know that Randell had to go fast since he just did an interview and the whole thing was not caught on Skye since Sterling said that there was a glitch in the camera and it never recorded. So they had to do the whole interview again and Randell had to go someplace. So that is why Randell was talking fast. So he just summed up all the things he just said before.

        • Yes, I’m aware of that – it’s why I said “… but is explained near the end”. Even given that, it still sounded too practiced. None of this matters though – we’ll find out soon enough how much is real.

    • tlp

      This 10 MW version on the animation video is indeed meant to support 10k homes, look at the video to the end.

  • Private Citizen

    Questions I wish Sterling had asked:
    1. During the demo, what measures will you take to assure skeptics the setup and measurements are beyond trickery?
    2. With the heat and energy you mention, why don’t you hook up a generator and run the device in self-sustained mode?

    Certainly hope Frank gets an invite; would be helpful to have an informed eyewitness on hand.

    • enantiomer2000

      The problem is that Sterling is a huge believer.. in anything! Anybody that claims to have an ultimate Zero Point Energy Flux Capacitor Magnetic Motor has him jumping up and down. Since he isn’t skeptical, he can’t come at the interview from the correct approach.

      • bachcole

        Thank you, david55. So, they exist, and it is do-able. But off the shelf they are not.

  • Private Citizen

    Questions I wish Sterling had asked:
    1. During the demo, what measures will you take to assure skeptics the setup and measurements are beyond trickery?
    2. With the heat and energy you mention, why don’t you hook up a generator and run the device in self-sustained mode?

    Certainly hope Frank gets an invite; would be helpful to have an informed eyewitness on hand.

    • enantiomer2000

      The problem is that Sterling is a huge believer.. in anything! Anybody that claims to have an ultimate Zero Point Energy Flux Capacitor Magnetic Motor has him jumping up and down. Since he isn’t skeptical, he can’t come at the interview from the correct approach.

  • SteveW

    Ok, but then why did they release a patent? Is the patent incomplete? Maybe MFMP or some other competent organization should try and replicate it off their patent application. Mills has stated it’s so simple and can be built with off the shelf components. It almost seems like Mills is encouraging this. Putting the pieces of the puzzle together, you have BLP filling and posting on the internet their patent for a device worth possibly trillions of dollars before they had the chance to even finish building and testing the prototype. The MHD converter for plasma to electric conversion is only disclosed- they do not file a patent application for it – are they in such a rush they didn’t have time to file a patent but worry if it isn’t disclosed someone else will try to block them from using it. If BLP’s device is real, it is a certainty, the DOD would confiscate it for national security. Did BLP realize the DOD was in the process of doing just this and then rushed to disclose it on the internet. Once it’s its in the public domain, the DOD’s window of opportunity to confiscate this technology is lost forever. Did BLP take the risk of rushing the patent and possibly losing their IP to beat the DOD- knowing If the DOD got a hold of it- they would probably get nothing (or worse). Just wondering.

    • GreenWin

      Former high level DOD officers have sat on BlackLight’s Board since at least 1999. Read the Village Voice article I link to above for details.

  • Oceans2014

    the high power density says that the Mills reaction must be the Papp reaction and could be classified as Cold Fusion – http://www.infinite-energy.com/iemagazine/issue51/papp.html

  • orsobubu

    frank, also this is a prelude to far away, new forms of energy, from matter-antimatter annichilation, 1000x nuclear fission

    http://home.web.cern.ch/about/updates/2014/01/antimatter-experiment-produces-first-beam-antihydrogen

    • BroKeeper

      Yes, each home can then have their own vaporizing laser sentry to rid of intruders.

      • Fortyniner

        But think of all those poor Jehovah’s Witnesses…

        • artefact

          but you will not have to give tips to the pizza delivery service any more.

          • GreenWin

            Which of course means Domino’s will be hiring.

  • orsobubu

    frank, also this is a prelude to far away, new forms of energy, from matter-antimatter annichilation, 1000x nuclear fission

    http://home.web.cern.ch/about/updates/2014/01/antimatter-experiment-produces-first-beam-antihydrogen

    • Brokeeper

      Yes, each home can then have their own vaporizing laser sentry to rid of intruders. “No muss no fuss”.

      • But think of all those poor Jehovah’s Witnesses…

        • artefact

          but you will not have to give tips to the pizza delivery service any more.

          • GreenWin

            Which of course means Domino’s will be hiring.

  • Christopher Calder

    Questions:

    My guess is that the solid fuel consist of hydrated pellets of foamed nickel. So the high current instantly breaks apart the H2O into hydrogen and oxygen and also turns the H2 gas into H1 Rydberg hydrogen atoms with stretched elliptical orbits. What happens to the free oxygen, which is very flammable and corrosive? Won’t the free oxygen corrode the fuel pellets (nickel oxide), weaken them, and blow them apart after a few cycles? Will the electrodes corrode over time? How long will the contraption last?

    Are hydrinos really being formed, or is this essentially the same energy producing phenomena that occurs in Rossi and Defkalion reactors? Will the nickel (I guess) fuel pellets eventually turn to copper? Are slow moving neutrons created?

    • Fortyniner

      Another possibility that I suggested in an earlier thread is that the ‘fuel’ is an alkali metal hydroxide such as lithium hydroxide, that is dissociated in the reaction chamber to lithium oxide and hydrogen. The hygroscopic oxide would then be returned to the water source (vapour) for rehydration – Li2O + H2O -> 2 Li(OH) – and the cycle repeated.

  • Questions:

    My guess is that the solid fuel consist of hydrated pellets of foamed nickel. So the high current instantly breaks apart the H2O into hydrogen and oxygen and also turns the H2 gas into H1 Rydberg hydrogen atoms with stretched elliptical orbits. What happens to the free oxygen, which is very flammable and corrosive? Won’t the free oxygen corrode the fuel pellets (nickel oxide), weaken them, and blow them apart after a few cycles? Will the electrodes corrode over time? How long will the contraption last?

    Are hydrinos really being formed, or is this essentially the same energy producing phenomena that occurs in Rossi and Defkalion reactors? Will the nickel (I guess) fuel pellets eventually turn to copper? Are slow moving neutrons created?

    • Another possibility that I suggested in an earlier thread is that the ‘fuel’ is an alkali metal hydroxide such as lithium hydroxide, that is dissociated by heat in the reaction chamber to lithium oxide and hydrogen. The hygroscopic oxide would then be returned to the water source (vapour) for rehydration – Li2O + H2O -> 2 Li(OH) – and the cycle repeated.

  • Ronzonni

    One problem I don’t see addressed in the Mills piece is how to get the energy out of the cell. If you generate millions of watts in a very small, tiny space, how do you keep the cell from melting? The diagrams and videos don’t show any sort of cooling system at all! What cooling system and coolant can carry away millions of watts from a tiny cell? That may be something to ask Dr. Mills.

  • Pedro

    I read Sterling’s description of the 10 MW apparatus, and I think it makes no sense.
    The device consists of 2 interlatching gears with 60 tooth rotating at 200 RPM. Each time when the gears align, a small chamber is created in which the reaction is triggered. So we get 12000 little “explosions” of 10 KJ every minute, or 200 bursts per second. The interval between bursts is 5 msecs, and each explosion probably lasts 1 msec and the other 4 msecs are ‘wasted’ repositioning the gears to create the next chamber. Am I right in saying that 200 1msec bursts of 10KJ each second is less than 10 KW continuously??
    Sterling however writes this: “The 60-toothed gears rotate at 200 rpm, at about a
    millisecond time scale per reaction. So at a rate of 10 kJ per tooth, gives 10
    MW of power continuously, at an efficiency of 90 percent conversion rate”.
    Where does the 10 MW come from? Even if I multiply 200 x 10 KJ I only end up with 2 MW.
    So what’s the correct number? 2 KW, 10 KW, 2 MW or 10 MW?

    • Leonard Weinstein

      You are confusing power with energy. A J is a J whether obtained over 1 ms or 5. It is energy. 10 kJ at 12,000 per min is 10 MW average power over that time. The high rep rate should allow a smooth output, just like care engine individual piston combustions in sequence.

      • Leonard Weinstein

        Correction, part of my response is wrong. I concentrated on the first part of your comment, and did not do the net effective power calculation. If the tooth rate is 200 rpm with 60 teeth, the number of energy producing actions per second is 200. This times 10 kJ gives 2 MJ/sec. (=2 MW). However only 90% conversion is obtained, so the net output is 1.8 MW.

        • Pedro

          Hi Leonard, your correction and my follow up question crossed each other… so we now agree that the 10 MW box produces 1.8 MW. Why would Mills do such a thing? Or is Sterling Allen mixing up the numbers?

          • Leonard Weinstein

            Hi Pedro, The instant power in a pulse (10kJ in 1 ms) would give the 10 MW before conversion to electricity. However, this would require 1000 rpm, not 200. Comments were made that speed is adjustable, so it may have been simple misstatement.

          • Pedro

            Yes, that could be the explanation. Maybe we get some more numbers on the 28th.

          • Fortyniner

            I’m guessing that the ‘gearwheel reactor’ and the whole recirculating system is conceptual only at the moment, and that what Mills has (and will hopefully be able to demonstrate) is more likely to be a reaction in a small mass of ‘fuel’ that can be sustained only until the fuel runs out.

            At 1000 rpm there would not be time for fuel to drop into the gear ‘teeth’ – in fact the rotary motion would fling away any solid material that happened to be picked up before it could be carried into the reaction cavity. There is also the issue of clearances around the gears – mechanical wear from a solid fuel would erode both the side walls and the gear tooth surfaces quickly, and this could only be accelerated by energy release and by initiating spark erosion. Not only that but the temperatures at which this mechanism would be expected to operate are simply completely unrealistic.

            In short I just don’t believe it. I’m still hopeful though that there is a potential energy source here, which I hope (but don’t necessarily expect) to see confirmed to a reasonable level of proof in 6 days time.

          • GreenWin

            I too would like to know what part these “gears” play in the scheme. If the plasma can be induced to rotate/oscillate by design or the MHD convertor – then the fixed MHD coils conduct the current out to power smoothing and load. Haven’t looked closely at the animation.

        • Job001

          Really? Grid efficiency matters with free fuel? Really?
          Really? Homeowners want DC and maybe $15,000 conversion cost? Really?

          Assuming near zero fuel cost, grid efficiency loss of say 10% is IRRELEVANT while a $15,000 home and appliance conversion to DC is RELEVANT. Let us presume a utility converts to Mills energy, writes off the old facilities and discontinues use of purchased energy, natural gas, nuclear, etc.

          The utility then has primarily maintenance and operation of the grid and can deliver electricity at say $0.03/KwHr vs $0.15/KwHr now, a 80% reduction. Assume 20 million homes do not have to spend $15,000 for a savings of $300 billion to get a 80% reduced electric bill. If the utilities do not convert, then homeowners will.

          The cost to utilities would be let us estimate; 3Kw/Home x 20E6 homes/$10/Kw x 100 to 1 install to MHD purchase ratio =$60 billion. If the homeowner only saves a net of 3 cents/KwHr most will take the no investment savings from the utility of 80% and let the utility operate the possibly risky high maintenance MHD unit. Most home owners would rather get an extra car, a plug in to reduce fuel cost also, let us presume.
          The point is, Mills is talking home installation but like Rossi is actually going to market utilities.
          So, that would explain the megawatt MHD output talk while illustrating a home size unit.

          • Pedro

            Hi Job, do you think consumers will get much out of a conversion to LENR or other “free” energy sources if they stay connected to the grid? At this moment, the electricity that utilities generate cost them 4 ct/KWh and they sell it for 15 cents making some reasonable profit. If they switch to some novel energy source they have huge write offs, huge investments in new technology and conversions, and after that their electricity production cost may drop to near zero at best. So at most they save 4 ct/KWh, but with all the one-time cost they have had, they are not going to pass on the entire savings to the customers. And surely, their other costs (the grid, etc) are not going to change. I fear that the only benefit for the customers is going to be that they get green energy for the same price as the old “dirty” fossil energy. A huge improvement for mankind, but no improvement for the customers. Only the “richer” people who can afford the upfront investment to buy a home unit will actually save money in the long run.

          • US_Citizen71

            Like anything technology based the price will drop with time. Initially up through maybe the first decade of production LENR devices your statement of “Only the “richer” people who can afford the upfront investment to buy a home unit will actually save money” will likely hold true. But once the initial wave of demand passes and production capacity meets demand the price for a home sized unit will drop considerably. DVD players were $2800 the first year they went on sale, I saw one at retailer for $19 this past weekend.

          • atanguy

            “they are not going to pass on the entire savings to the customers”
            Right Pedro,pretty obvious to me – Some people here are dreaming thinking that if LENR is sold to the utilities that they will see lower electricity price…

          • Job001

            Many utilities are partially regulated. It is society and money that will decide how this works out. Carefully investments provide better results. For instance, a plug in car may be a good investment if electrical costs drop and fuel costs do not. I’m skeptical about how fast DC appliances will be available if one goes that way.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            IF LENR is not sold in Home Depot on some sort of payment plan then counterfeits will pop up more than has ever seen before. They are “off the shelf parts” according to Mills..

            Every green energy researcher (windmills,Hot Fusion,Solar) will find themselves unemployed so can start making counterfeits by the thousands.

            If this device goes commercial and is as claimed they could never meet construction demand.

            Grid Energy is nothing. Imagine being able to drive a Motor home across the United States without stopping for fuel.

            Every Business will save money in heating, air conditioning, delivery truck fuel, electricity and all their suppliers will also share savings (down the road). A $500 television may only cost $100 after all of the considerable savings are funneled.

            Of course replacing coal and nuclear plants are just a natural first step, but we are talking about fairly simple devices with little or no moving parts.

            A dollar store flashlight is more complicated fabrication wise, so if costs are $15 000 per unit, it would not be long before my entire street had counterfeits at $100 a pop.

          • Job001

            $15,000 Estimate includes cost plus installation plus converting house electrical system and appliances to DC, maybe more. Big changes are presumed.

          • Fortyniner

            I agree that home installation would be very unlikely for all the usually discussed reasons, plus in this case the unacceptability of maintaining liquid gas supplies for the superconducting magnets. As you say, BLP’s claimed system would only be suitable for commercial generation, if it is feasible at all.

            One more reason for using AC is that it is less lethal than DC, but the potential cost to homeowners of converting with a 15+ year payback period would almost certainly make it a non-starter anyway. However there would be no problem with a DC primary source as this could easily be converted to AC using rotary converters in power stations or electronic ‘inverters’ in each home served. The former would be the natural choice as any new power plants would have to coexist with the existing system for a decade or two, and unless the utility wanted to install an entire parallel distribution system, they would have to match standard AC output. This situation would persist even after full conversion, and the existing AC supply system is likely to persist indefinitely.

          • bachcole

            The “fight” between AC and DC I believe will be bigger than any in history.

            Tell us more about the safety issues, please. I am an electronic technician, and I never heard of it before. That doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist; I just want to hear more about it.

          • Fortyniner

            DC current is more efficient at stopping the heart, if this is in the flow path, as it affects the electrolyte balance of cells such as heart muscle cells more rapidly and extensively. Otherwise, for momentary contact there won’t be much difference, subject to contact resistance, voltage, flow path etc. – as you will know.

            For more sustained contact – more than a couple of seconds – DC current at significant voltage will electrolyse the tissues along the flow path and especially near the points of contact, causing deep, burn-like tissue damage. This can also be followed by a Herxheimer-type reaction to electrolytic products released from dead cells.

          • georgehants

            Morning.
            “It’s like nothing we’ve ever seen before. It’s very high in sulphur,
            it’s very high in magnesium, it’s got twice as much manganese as we’ve
            ever seen in anything on Mars. I don’t know what any of this means.
            We’re completely confused, and everyone in the team is arguing
            and fighting (over what it means).”
            – Steve Squyers, Ph.D., Mars Opportunity rover team leader
            http://www.earthfiles.com/index.php?category=Headline+News

          • Fortyniner

            Wow – that’s weird. The fact that it ‘appeared’ and hadn’t been there before must mean it is either volcanic in origin or a meteor fragment, I would guess. I assume that telescopes or orbiters would have spotted any volcanic activity, so perhaps a chunk coming from a nearby meteor impact? Admittedly a bit of a coincidence that the crawler happens to be there at just the right time. Its either that or a small green person scuttled in and dropped it there while the camera wasn’t looking…

          • friendlyprogrammer

            OOOPS – FORTYNINER… You switched up AC and DC in your posts. It is Alternating Current (AC) that is the most dangerous and was developed by Nicola Tesla. Direct Current (DC) is less dangerous but cannot travel nearly as far, and that was developed by Thomas Edison.

            Edison tried to show the dangers of AC by electrocuting dogs and elephants in public. AC is used in electric chairs. AC is what comes out of your plug in a normal house.

            NOTE: Either way it is a very simple process to convert one to another especially given the extreme cheapness of the proposed generation abilities.

            I think you meant to say this the other way around but had a brain freeze while typing.

            Switching the AC/DC in your posts and they make sense..

          • Fortyniner

            No, no mistake. Please see my later addition in answer to Bachcole below. Regarding conversion, I suggested in an earlier post that large rotary converters (DC motor and AC generator on the same shaft) would solve the problem of DC output.

          • Omega Z

            Peter

            The Technology for highly Efficient DC/AC Convertors exist.
            This would likely be much cheaper And efficient then a DC motor to an alternator.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Probably fell off the rover. It’s likely a 20 billion dollar doodad.

          • Omega Z

            Martians throwing Rocks.

            Pan the camera & you’d see Martians with Protest Sign. Earthlings Go Home…

      • Pedro

        Thanks for clearing that up. I wikied that and read that watts = joule/sec. So with 200 pulses of 10 KJ you get 2 MW. Why is Mills talking about 10 MW? Am I still making an error here?

  • Pedro

    I read Sterling’s description of the 10 MW apparatus, and I think it makes no sense.
    The device consists of 2 interlatching gears with 60 tooth rotating at 200 RPM. Each time when the gears align, a small chamber is created in which the reaction is triggered. So we get 12000 little “explosions” of 10 KJ every minute, or 200 bursts per second. The interval between bursts is 5 msecs, and each explosion probably lasts 1 msec and the other 4 msecs are ‘wasted’ repositioning the gears to create the next chamber. Am I right in saying that 200 1msec bursts of 10KJ each second is less than 10 KW continuously??
    Sterling however writes this: “The 60-toothed gears rotate at 200 rpm, at about a
    millisecond time scale per reaction. So at a rate of 10 kJ per tooth, gives 10
    MW of power continuously, at an efficiency of 90 percent conversion rate”.
    Where does the 10 MW come from? Even if I multiply 200 x 10 KJ I only end up with 2 MW.
    So what’s the correct number? 2 KW, 10 KW, 2 MW or 10 MW?

    • Leonard Weinstein

      You are confusing power with energy. A J is a J whether obtained over 1 ms or 5. It is energy. 10 kJ at 12,000 per min is 10 MW average power over that time. The high rep rate should allow a smooth output, just like care engine individual piston combustions in sequence.

      • Leonard Weinstein

        Correction, part of my response is wrong. I concentrated on the first part of your comment, and did not do the net effective power calculation. If the tooth rate is 200 rpm with 60 teeth, the number of energy producing actions per second is 200. This times 10 kJ gives 2 MJ/sec. (=2 MW). However only 90% conversion is obtained, so the net output is 1.8 MW.

        • Pedro

          Hi Leonard, your correction and my follow up question crossed each other… so we now agree that the 10 MW box produces 1.8 MW. Why would Mills do such a thing? Or is Sterling Allen mixing up the numbers?

          • Leonard Weinstein

            Hi Pedro, The instant power in a pulse (10kJ in 1 ms) would give the 10 MW before conversion to electricity. However, this would require 1000 rpm, not 200. Comments were made that speed is adjustable, so it may have been simple misstatement.

          • Pedro

            Yes, that could be the explanation. Maybe we get some more numbers on the 28th.

          • I’m guessing that the ‘gearwheel reactor’ and the whole fuel recirculating system is conceptual only at the moment, and that what Mills has (and will hopefully be able to demonstrate) is more likely to be a reaction in a small mass of fuel that can be sustained only until the fuel runs out. That could be almost instantaneously; a quick flash and it’s over – in which case it would inevitably be followed by endless arguments about whether the ‘flash’ released more energy than the initiating spark had input, how much fuel is consumed, what the energy source actually is… and so on.

            At 1000 rpm (and probably at 200 prm) there would not be time for fuel to drop into the gear ‘teeth’ – in fact the rotary motion would probably fling away any solid material that happened to be picked up before it could be carried into the reaction cavity. There is also the issue of clearances around the gears – mechanical wear from a solid fuel would erode both the side walls and the gear tooth surfaces quickly, and this could only be accelerated by shockwaves from energy release, and by initiating spark erosion. Not only that but the temperatures at which this mechanism would be expected to operate are simply completely unrealistic.

            In short I just don’t believe that this mechanism is possible. I’m still hopeful though that there is a potential energy source here, which I hope (but don’t necessarily expect) to see confirmed to a reasonable level of proof in 6 days time.

            Edit: I’ve just read Artefact’s PESN find further down the page, which seems to confirm my speculation in the first para above. Apparently a bang rather than a flash – a closed reactor inside a bomb calorimeter as LENR G has already suggested might be the case. No-one (not even optimists) will be convinced by this unless the energy output is enormous, and even then there will be huge doubts about what has taken place inside the reactor (‘maryyugo’ will be shrieking ‘TNT’ all over the web and there will probably be many who believe him).

            Edit 2: nickec has also previously suggested that the reactor design is probably conceptual only. Mental note to self: read thread *before* posting…

          • GreenWin

            I too would like to know what part these “gears” play in the scheme. If the plasma can be induced to rotate/oscillate by design or the MHD convertor – then the fixed MHD coils conduct the current out to power smoothing and load. Haven’t looked closely at the animation.

      • Pedro

        Thanks for clearing that up. I wikied that and read that watts = joule/sec. So with 200 pulses of 10 KJ you get 2 MW. Why is Mills talking about 10 MW? Am I still making an error here?

  • GreenWin

    The history of Dr. Mills’ work with the top echelon of research laboratories and industries (NASA Glenn, Siemens Westinghouse, DOE Idaho National Engineering, Conectix Untilites, Air Force’s MIT-managed Lincoln Laboratory in Lexington, Massachusetts) is long.

    “We actually purchased a total of three large electrolytic cells and
    conducted very controlled experiments,” Jacox says. “We followed the
    protocols Randy suggested and followed his technique and we got the same
    results he had,”
    Michael Jacox. nuclear engineer, Texas A&M’s Commercial Space Center for Engineering, formerly with DOE’s Idaho National Engineering laboratory.

    Much of this excellent Village Voice article by Eric Baard details the high level of confirmations various Mills’ processes have gotten from mainstream science and military entities. It is likely some or all of his product work has been detoured for military applications.
    “BlackLight Power’s newest board member is retired vice admiral Michael P. Kalleres, who commanded the U.S. fleet in the Atlantic during the Gulf War and the North Atlantic Treaty Organization’s Striking Fleet. He’s also a consultant for the Defense Science Board and the Naval Studies Board of the National Academy of Science. “I feel very confident in what [Mills] has created,” Kalleres says. He
    adds that he has no investment in BlackLight Power and takes no salary
    from the company…”

    http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-12-21/news/quantum-leap/6/

    With all this… ahem, heat for such a long time – I look forward to ANY demo given by Dr. Mills.

    • deleo77

      I think the comment below by Storms is a good one, Mills has promised and failed to deliver for a long time now. But there are some things that he may have a clear advantage on – a clear theory being one of them. A lot of people want to see a commercial product on the 28th, but Mills still needs his Pons and Fleischmann moment. If he can show his plasma reaction in an indisputable way with 3rd party verification, that will be a good demo. Yes, he should outline a clear path and timeline for commercialization. But showing the reaction in a clear way with other scientists verifying his work would be a big deal given that BLP is a well funded, well connected, American based company (sorry but that is an issue for the 60 Minutes of the world). Mills may need another $100+ million in VC money to commercialize his device, but if he can prove the science is real, there will be some people who will want to give it to him.

      “Mills has one great advantage. He has a unifying theory that LENR does not have. He also has money that can be focused by that theory. These are essential features a successful effort must have, which are missing from LENR.

      Rossi was lucky. He found the gold without actually knowing where to look. He was at the right place and was willing to explore possibilities other people ignored. Meanwhile, people in the LENR field are each prospecting based on their own maps, while Mills is making his map more detailed and focused on where the gold is actuallylocated.”

      Ed Storms
      On Jan 21, 2014, at 9:03 AM

      • bachcole

        I’m open to new ideas and perspectives. (:->)

      • Sandy

        Rossi’s success exemplifies the proposition that “Genius is one per cent inspiration, ninety-nine per cent perspiration”. http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/genius-is-one-percent-perspiration-ninety-nine-percent-perspiration.html

        Rossi’s hard work and dogged determination to succeed should be celebrated by people all around this planet.

      • GreenWin

        Thanks deleo, that is a good comment. BlackLight is very well connected. Randy would not have a green light to demo this if it were IMO, not part of a broad plan to upgrade the commercial energy infrastructure. It’s all kinda fun… in a geeky way. More fun when analogies to Greek Classic literature help clarify the geopolitical drama. 🙂 Hatip to Henning.

    • bachcole

      Green4theWin, you are talking me into an alternate theory. That theory is that perhaps Mills was hurried because he had already been through it all once before and he had an important meeting to get to; and he has been slow to reveal because of a Navy Blue (a very dark version of blue) curtain which has been lowered, perhaps thanks to Rossi et. al.

      But it still sounds like he is exaggerating; I won’t be having a 1 cubic foot object in my house that is putting out 1 million watts. I think that the immediate surrounding air would explode like lightning. I wish that someone would do the math and calculate how hot such 1 cubic foot would have to be.

      • tlp

        That cube is putting out that 10 million watts (10 MW) trough the electrical output. Most of the energy is going out, not warming the box. Mills says the MHD is (or will be) well over 90% efficient. Lets assume its 95%. Then the box is heated by 500 kW. That is quite a heater, but you are not going to put it in your closet, but out in the field as in the animation video. And it gives electricity for a village, not one house.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          True. There will also be attempts to scale down for automotive use. Imagine 600 million less smog producing cars on the road.

          • tlp

            Mills@SocietyforClassicalPhysics:
            “SF-CIHT can be scaled in either direction. For smaller applications we would probably use PDC conversion with permanently magnetized electrodes for the magnetized electrodes. See Power & Hydrino Characterization section http://www.blacklightpower.com/publications/

    • Pedro

      Hi GreenWin, Jones Been over on Vortex has a good memory or a good archive. This is what he writes about past projects/products by Mills…

      Randy Mills apparently does not realize how much like a charlatan his public image has become. Looking back over recent memory of Mills and his Millions – he is a one man money magnet.
      1) Mills very publicly promised a Capstone turbine powered by hydrinos. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      2) Mills promised a very clever “reverse gyrotron” which got a lot of attention. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      3) Mills licensed several New Mexico Utilities to produce power using his “solid fuel” cell. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      4) Mills announces a hydrino battery of incredible capability. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      5) Mills announces hydrino light source. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      6) Mills announce a 10 MW power source. Result: pending.

      Not a very good track record!

      • BroKeeper

        Maybe he is bipolar and can’t complete anything he starts. Just saying. (no I’m not bipolar too – I think, Hmmmm….).

      • GreenWin

        I dunno Pedro. I would tend to believe someone with hard connections to the MIC like Vice Admiral Kalleras over Jones Bean. What is apparent is the battle over these high density alternative forms of energy going commercial. If all the products BlackLight announced were re-directed/classified to mil apps – (e.g. under the US Invention Secrecy Act of 1951) investors could be making money on military sales. Else why are they still there? From the Voice article:

        “A spokeswoman for the Indian Head Division of the Naval Surface Warfare Center in Maryland says in an e-mail letter that after a meeting with Mills “there was considerable interest in the reported properties of the new hydrogen-containing compounds, and in obtaining samples for independent analysis and evaluation.”

      • bitplayer

        The “Mills did X” phrases and “Millions raised” phrases could be verified with appropriate information access. The joining of them under the same number appears to be an attempt to imply that the millions raised were directly correlated to those “Mills did X” phrases.

        I was under the impression that BlackLight Power did other things that produced value, which therefore might be the basis of the millions raised.

        Rossi has over-implied lots of things (e,g, consumer edition manufacturing facility). It’s an endemic problem for entrepreneurs.

        I’m not trying to say Mills has something. I’m just saying that Jones Been’s presentation of the information is not particularly edifying and appears to be particularly prejudicial.

    • Private Citizen

      Dr. Michio Kaku,
      a theoretical physicist based at City University of New York on Mills’ new laws of physics:
      “the only law that this business with Mills is proving is that a fool
      and his money are easily parted.”

      • friendlyprogrammer

        Yet there are now over 20 companies purporting to be developing LENR including NASA, Toyota, Brillouin, BLP, Honda, Mitsubishi, Piantelli, Hagelstein/MIT/Miley/Andrea Rossi/Defkalion/Celani/MFMP/ and more. None of whom are related to the other. No LENR is real. The only questions are when will it be ready for commercialization.

        Can such a high energy device be dangerous. I think the military has thwarted some patents just to examine if LENR can be used to make a bomb.

        • Pekka Janhunen

          Kaku’s comment concerned Mills, and Mills is not LENR, says Mills.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Aside from the term LENR, it is likely they are all on the same rainbow. It sounds like Mills was where Rossi was 10 years ago. Who knows. I just want cheap power to come soon.

      • GreenWin

        Presumably Michio refers to various branches of the US military who have quietly invested in BlackLight.. And to VC and utility investors who are savvy with technology. And since not one investor has complained for the past twenty years, perhaps the fool is the one who scoffs.

      • Job001

        Pure skepticism is a worthy philosophy, and it is not science.

        Since it is not my money but OPM i.e. that of whales who are worthy long shot investors, and not fools, I don’t care.

        Without sufficient facts and in light of the long history of “Crackpots who were right”,

        http://blog.vixra.org/category/crackpots-who-were-right/

        I’ll tolerate the wait rather than jumping to long shot contusions.

    • georgehants

      Morning.
      It’s the foundation of myriad personality assessment tests,
      self-motivation books and team-building exercises – and it’s all bunk.
      http://www.livescience.com/39373-left-brain-right-brain-myth.html

  • GreenWin

    The history of Dr. Mills’ work with the top echelon of research laboratories and industries (NASA Glenn, Siemens Westinghouse, DOE Idaho National Engineering, Conectix Untilites, Air Force’s MIT-managed Lincoln Laboratory in Lexington, Massachusetts) is long.

    “We actually purchased a total of three large electrolytic cells and
    conducted very controlled experiments,” Jacox says. “We followed the
    protocols Randy suggested and followed his technique and we got the same
    results he had,”
    Michael Jacox. nuclear engineer, Texas A&M’s Commercial Space Center for Engineering, formerly with DOE’s Idaho National Engineering laboratory.

    Much of this excellent Village Voice article by Eric Baard details the high level of confirmations various Mills’ processes have gotten from mainstream science and military entities. It is likely some or all of his product work has been detoured for military applications.
    “BlackLight Power’s newest board member is retired vice admiral Michael P. Kalleres, who commanded the U.S. fleet in the Atlantic during the Gulf War and the North Atlantic Treaty Organization’s Striking Fleet. He’s also a consultant for the Defense Science Board and the Naval Studies Board of the National Academy of Science. “I feel very confident in what [Mills] has created,” Kalleres says. He
    adds that he has no investment in BlackLight Power and takes no salary
    from the company…”

    http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-12-21/news/quantum-leap/6/

    With all this… ahem, heat for such a long time – I look forward to ANY demo given by Dr. Mills.

    • deleo77

      I think the comment below by Storms is a good one, Mills has promised and failed to deliver for a long time now. But there are some things that he may have a clear advantage on – a clear theory being one of them. A lot of people want to see a commercial product on the 28th, but Mills still needs his Pons and Fleischmann moment. If he can show his plasma reaction in an indisputable way with 3rd party verification, that will be a good demo. Yes, he should outline a clear path and timeline for commercialization. But showing the reaction in a clear way with other scientists verifying his work would be a big deal given that BLP is a well funded, well connected, American based company (sorry but that is an issue for the 60 Minutes of the world). Mills may need another $100+ million in VC money to commercialize his device, but if he can prove the science is real, there will be some people who will want to give it to him.

      “Mills has one great advantage. He has a unifying theory that LENR does not have. He also has money that can be focused by that theory. These are essential features a successful effort must have, which are missing from LENR.

      Rossi was lucky. He found the gold without actually knowing where to look. He was at the right place and was willing to explore possibilities other people ignored. Meanwhile, people in the LENR field are each prospecting based on their own maps, while Mills is making his map more detailed and focused on where the gold is actuallylocated.”

      Ed Storms
      On Jan 21, 2014, at 9:03 AM

      • bachcole

        I’m open to new ideas and perspectives. (:->)

      • Sandy

        Rossi’s success exemplifies the proposition that “Genius is one per cent inspiration, ninety-nine per cent perspiration”. http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/genius-is-one-percent-perspiration-ninety-nine-percent-perspiration.html

        Rossi’s hard work and dogged determination to succeed should be celebrated by people all around this planet.

      • GreenWin

        Thanks deleo, that is a good comment. BlackLight is very well connected. Randy would not have a green light to demo this if it were IMO, not part of a broad plan to upgrade the commercial energy infrastructure. It’s all kinda fun… in a geeky way. More fun when analogies to Greek Classic literature help clarify the geopolitical drama. 🙂 Hatip to Henning.

        • bachcole

          I am 80% skeptical as of 3:18 P.M. MST. (:->) I hope to God that I am wrong.

    • bachcole

      Green4theWin, you are talking me into an alternate theory. That theory is that perhaps Mills was hurried because he had already been through it all once before and he had an important meeting to get to; and he has been slow to reveal because of a Navy Blue (a very dark version of blue) curtain which has been lowered, perhaps thanks to Rossi et. al.

      But it still sounds like he is exaggerating; I won’t be having a 1 cubic foot object in my house that is putting out 1 million watts. I think that the immediate surrounding air would explode like lightning. I wish that someone would do the math and calculate how hot such 1 cubic foot would have to be.

      • tlp

        That cube is putting out that 10 million watts (10 MW) trough the electrical output. Most of the energy is going out, not warming the box. Mills says the MHD is (or will be) well over 90% efficient. Lets assume its 95%. Then the box is heated by 500 kW. That is quite a heater, but you are not going to put it in your closet, but out in the field as in the animation video. And it gives electricity for a village, not one house.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          True. There will also be attempts to scale down for automotive use. Imagine 600 million less smog producing cars on the road.

          • tlp

            Mills@SocietyforClassicalPhysics:
            “SF-CIHT can be scaled in either direction. For smaller applications we would probably use PDC conversion with permanently magnetized electrodes for the magnetized electrodes. See Power & Hydrino Characterization section http://www.blacklightpower.com/publications/

    • Pedro

      Hi GreenWin, Jones Been over on Vortex has a good memory or a good archive. This is what he writes about past projects/products by Mills…

      Randy Mills apparently does not realize how much like a charlatan his public image has become. Looking back over recent memory of Mills and his Millions – he is a one man money magnet.
      1) Mills very publicly promised a Capstone turbine powered by hydrinos. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      2) Mills promised a very clever “reverse gyrotron” which got a lot of attention. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      3) Mills licensed several New Mexico Utilities to produce power using his “solid fuel” cell. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      4) Mills announces a hydrino battery of incredible capability. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      5) Mills announces hydrino light source. Result: never delivered, never explained. Millions raised.
      6) Mills announce a 10 MW power source. Result: pending.

      Not a very good track record!

      • Brokeeper

        Maybe he is bipolar and can’t complete anything he starts. Just saying. (no I’m not bipolar too – I think, Hmmmm….).
        (:->)

        • friendlyprogrammer

          Dr Mills is a Harvard educated Medical Doctor with a degree in Chemistry. He is Phi Beta Kappa (High Academic Achievement, they induct the most outstanding students of arts and sciences at American colleges and universities.) and Magna Cum Laude (Top 10% of his class). He published a Unifying Theory of Physics which is largely ignored, but does hold many patents for Medical procedures and various inventions. Look him up.

          Hardly a Bipolar underachiever. Look up what he has invented already and compare to your own achievements. Here are a few…

          * Magnetic Susceptibility Imaging (MSI)
          – a revolutionary body scanner that uses
          magnetic fields, an array of SQUIDS
          (Superconducting Quantum Interference
          Devices), and a mathematical algorithm
          which functions in concert like the visual
          system to provide high resolution 3 – D
          internal vascular images.

          * MIRAGE (Mossbauer Isotopic Resonant
          Absorption of Gamma Emission> a cancer
          therapy comprising a Mossbauer isotope
          derivatized DNA binding pharmaceutical and
          radiation which activates the isotope in
          situ to cause eradication of cancer with
          radiation doses of one millionth that
          conventionally used during radiation
          therapy.

          * Luminide – a universal drug delivery
          molecule where intracellular drug release
          occurs when the prodrug reacts with
          cellular free radicals via a mechanism
          involving chemiluminesce, photochromism,
          and intramolecular energy transfer.

          But if you think this describes a slacker…. Or even a fraudulent slacker…

          The fraud theory is laughable. Dr Mills is a Harvard Educated Medical Doctor. He could sneeze into 1000 dollar bills in any job he wanted. Someone this smart does not dedicate 25 years to a scam.

      • GreenWin

        I dunno Pedro. I would tend to believe someone with hard connections to the MIC like Vice Admiral Kalleras over Jones Bean. What is apparent is the battle over these high density alternative forms of energy going commercial. If all the products BlackLight announced were re-directed/classified to mil apps – (e.g. under the US Invention Secrecy Act of 1951) investors could be making money on military sales. Else why are they still there? From the Voice article:

        “A spokeswoman for the Indian Head Division of the Naval Surface Warfare Center in Maryland says in an e-mail letter that after a meeting with Mills “there was considerable interest in the reported properties of the new hydrogen-containing compounds, and in obtaining samples for independent analysis and evaluation.”

        • bachcole

          I think that the time for soft/social evidence is over and the time for performance is upon us. If the 28th demo is not very convincing, I will be finished with all of the Mills talk and all of his talk.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Mostly what is needed is a demonstration at least worthy of attracting competition. If nations start throwing billions of dollars at LENR (again) results will speed up.

      • bachcole

        What say ye, GreenWin?

      • friendlyprogrammer

        When computers first came out they were the size of schools and not very practical for home use. Extensive R&D made it possible for them to become smaller and more powerful.

        Dr Mills is a Harvard educated Medical Doctor with a degree in Chemistry. He is Phi Beta Kappa (High Academic Achievement, they induct the most outstanding students of arts and sciences at American colleges and universities.) and Magna Cum Laude (Top 10% of his class). He published a Unifying Theory of Physics which is largely ignored, but does hold many patents for Medical procedures and various inventions. Look him up.

        He has had third party verification’s throughout, but he is now getting this to a state that seems viable.

        I do not know if it will come now, but some form of LENR will come within the decade.

        • bachcole

          LENR already came, in the form of the E-Cat and the 2013 Levi, Essen et. al. Report. But Mills?? There are many cases where extremely brilliant people go crazy, so his past does not mean that we should drop our critical thinking skills and just accept anything that he says. He has made many extraordinary claims, extraordinary even for us LENR+ believers, so he is going to have to demonstrate them. His hot air will not heat my house.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Remains to be seen.

          • bachcole

            Agreed.

    • Private Citizen

      Dr. Michio Kaku,
      a theoretical physicist based at City University of New York on Mills’ new laws of physics:
      “the only law that this business with Mills is proving is that a fool
      and his money are easily parted.”

      • bachcole

        My standard of proof with Mills will be the same as with Rossi: Output divided by input, without Mills around.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        Yet there are now over 20 companies purporting to be developing LENR including NASA, Toyota, Brillouin, BLP, Honda, Mitsubishi, Piantelli, Hagelstein/MIT/Miley/Andrea Rossi/Defkalion/Celani/MFMP/ and more. None of whom are related to the other. No LENR is real. The only questions are when will it be ready for commercialization.

        Can such a high energy device be dangerous. I think the military has thwarted some patents just to examine if LENR can be used to make a bomb.

        • Pekka Janhunen

          Kaku’s comment concerned Mills, and Mills is not LENR, says Mills.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Aside from the term LENR, it is likely they are all on the same rainbow. It sounds like Mills was where Rossi was 10 years ago. Who knows. I just want cheap power to come soon.

      • GreenWin

        Presumably Michio refers to various branches of the US military who have quietly invested in BlackLight.. And to VC and utility investors who are savvy with technology. And since not one investor has complained for the past twenty years, perhaps the fool is the one who scoffs.

      • Job001

        Pure skepticism is a worthy philosophy, and it is not science.

        Since it is not my money but OPM i.e. that of whales who are worthy long shot investors, and not fools, I don’t care.

        Without sufficient facts and in light of the long history of “Crackpots who were right”,

        http://blog.vixra.org/category/crackpots-who-were-right/

        I’ll tolerate the wait rather than jumping to long shot contusions.

    • georgehants

      Morning.
      It’s the foundation of myriad personality assessment tests,
      self-motivation books and team-building exercises – and it’s all bunk.
      http://www.livescience.com/39373-left-brain-right-brain-myth.html

  • GreenWin

    Much MHD research is behind black walls. The implications for all manner of propulsion alone would classify most of the high end. Read the Village Voice article I link at the top Roger. It sheds a lot of light on reasons for BlackLight technology to be kept quiet. Until now.

  • AstralProjectee

    Can someone please tell me how much money does it take to make a KWh with BLP’s technology?

    This is how much it was with their old technology CIHT http://www.blacklightpower.com/wp-content/uploads/images/CostComparison.png I know the new technology the SF-CIHT seems to be much much more powerful. So can someone put this into perspective with how much money it takes to make a KWh electricity with BLP’s technology?

    Thanks.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      100 times cheaper than coal. Go to Blacklight Power Website and there is a price graph on one of their main page links. I think this is 10 times better than their previous validations.

      http://www.blacklightpower.com/technology/sf-ciht-cell/

      Found it (link above) “0.1 cents per kWh” Coal is 9 cents per kWh…

      A gain of X10 since the previous validations is why we did not see it then (supposedly).

      • AstralProjectee

        Well technically it’s 90 times cheaper than coal, not 100. Coal being the cheapest conventional energy source.

        I see that the picture that I showed you talked about their CIHT cell while the picture you directed me too is of the SF-CIHT cell. Yet both of them are at the same prices??????? I am scratching my head. So the CIHT and the SF-CIHT are the same thing? Doesn’t make sense.

        Thanks.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          I not aware where you located the first picture. I thought I was just answering a question, but you seem as informed as myself. I can recall seeing the older version was something like 1 cent per kWh, meaning they had improved it by a factor of 10.

          Here in 2009 video they were claiming 1-2 cents per kWh.

          http://money.cnn.com/video/news/2008/12/11/news.energyfix.121108.cnnmoney/

          (approx 50 seconds in).

          I know I had seen that figure quite a lot back then as even a price equal to coal would be awesome, but that was 10 X cheaper. Now they are claiming to have improved that by 10 X also. (okay 90% less than coal), but technologies usually improve over time so it will likely get even cheaper.

          Note in video… they say.. at end… “They say it as least 5 years away”. This was in 2009. It is now almost 5 years away coming into 2014. They are where they were claiming they wanted to be technically.

          I am still not going to throw any parades until after it goes commercial (if it does).

          I am inclined to believe we are due for a breakthrough on this front from someone soon. BLP is possible.

          They do have a long list of impressive verification’s.

  • GreenWin

    Not unusual. Raytheon was building high energy radar systems for mil when they discovered that microwaves could cook food! Four years later they introduced the first commercial microwave oven. A version of which will be heating my tea in a minute…

  • bachcole

    Check this out. I have not yet read it. It is by Tom Whipple about the upcoming Mills demo: http://fcnp.com/2014/01/21/the-peak-oil-crisis-hydrinos-in-your-future/

  • Job001

    Really? Grid efficiency matters with free fuel? Really?
    Really? Homeowners want DC and maybe $15,000 conversion cost? Really?

    Assuming near zero fuel cost, grid efficiency loss of say 10% is IRRELEVANT while a $15,000 home and appliance conversion to DC is RELEVANT. Let us presume a utility converts to Mills energy, writes off the old facilities and discontinues use of purchased energy, natural gas, nuclear, etc.

    The utility then has primarily maintenance and operation of the grid and can deliver electricity at say $0.03/KwHr vs $0.15/KwHr now, a 80% reduction. Assume 20 million homes do not have to spend $15,000 for a savings of $300 billion to get a 80% reduced electric bill. If the utilities do not convert, then homeowners will.

    The cost to utilities would be let us estimate; 3Kw/Home x 20E6 homes/$10/Kw x 100 to 1 install to MHD purchase ratio =$60 billion. If the homeowner only saves a net of 3 cents/KwHr most will take the no investment savings from the utility of 80% and let the utility operate the possibly risky high maintenance MHD unit. Most home owners would rather get an extra car, a plug in to reduce fuel cost also, let us presume.
    The point is, Mills is talking home installation but like Rossi is actually going to market utilities.
    So, that would explain the megawatt MHD output talk while illustrating a home size unit.

    • Pedro

      Hi Job, do you think consumers will get much out of a conversion to LENR or other “free” energy sources if they stay connected to the grid? At this moment, the electricity that utilities generate cost them 4 ct/KWh and they sell it for 15 cents making some reasonable profit. If they switch to some novel energy source they have huge write offs, huge investments in new technology and conversions, and after that their electricity production cost may drop to near zero at best. So at most they save 4 ct/KWh, but with all the one-time cost they have had, they are not going to pass on the entire savings to the customers. And surely, their other costs (the grid, etc) are not going to change. I fear that the only benefit for the customers is going to be that they get green energy for the same price as the old “dirty” fossil energy. A huge improvement for mankind, but no improvement for the customers. Only the “richer” people who can afford the upfront investment to buy a home unit will actually save money in the long run.

      • US_Citizen71

        Like anything technology based the price will drop with time. Initially up through maybe the first decade of production of LENR devices your statement of “Only the “richer” people who can afford the upfront investment to buy a home unit will actually save money” will likely hold true. But once the initial wave of demand passes and production capacity meets demand the price for a home sized unit will drop considerably. DVD players were $2800 the first year they went on sale, I saw one at retailer for $19 this past weekend.

        • bachcole

          That is a drop of 147.4 to 1. Given the nature of DVD vs. LENRs, I would guess that it will be greater than that.

      • atanguy

        “they are not going to pass on the entire savings to the customers”
        Right Pedro,pretty obvious to me – Some people here are dreaming thinking that if LENR is sold to the utilities that they will see lower electricity price…

      • Job001

        Many utilities are partially regulated. It is society and money that will decide how this works out. Carefully investments provide better results. For instance, a plug in car may be a good investment if electrical costs drop and fuel costs do not. I’m skeptical about how fast DC appliances will be available if one goes that way.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      IF LENR is not sold in Home Depot on some sort of payment plan then counterfeits will pop up more than has ever seen before. They are “off the shelf parts” according to Mills..

      Every green energy researcher (windmills,Hot Fusion,Solar) will find themselves unemployed so can start making counterfeits by the thousands.

      If this device goes commercial and is as claimed they could never meet construction demand.

      Grid Energy is nothing. Imagine being able to drive a Motor home across the United States without stopping for fuel.

      Every Business will save money in heating, air conditioning, delivery truck fuel, electricity and all their suppliers will also share savings (down the road). A $500 television may only cost $100 after all of the considerable savings are funneled.

      Of course replacing coal and nuclear plants are just a natural first step, but we are talking about fairly simple devices with little or no moving parts.

      A dollar store flashlight is more complicated fabrication wise, so if costs are $15 000 per unit, it would not be long before my entire street had counterfeits at $100 a pop.

      • Job001

        $15,000 Estimate includes cost plus installation plus converting house electrical system and appliances to DC, maybe more. Big changes are presumed.

    • I agree that home installation would be very unlikely for all the usually discussed reasons, plus in this case the unacceptability of maintaining liquid gas supplies for the superconducting magnets. As you say, BLP’s claimed system would only be suitable for commercial generation, if it is feasible at all.

      One more reason for using AC is that it is less lethal than DC, but the potential cost to homeowners of converting with a 15+ year payback period would make it a non-starter anyway. However there would be no problem with a DC primary source as this could easily be converted to AC using heavy duty rotary converters in power stations (it might even be possible to convert existing generators by installing DC motor drives in place of turbines).

      Any new power plants would have to coexist with the existing system for a decade or two, and unless the utilities using DC generators wanted to install an entire parallel distribution system, they would have to match standard AC output. This situation would persist even after full conversion, and the existing AC supply system is likely to persist indefinitely.

      http://iopscience.iop.org/1755-1315/16/1/012052

      • bachcole

        The “fight” between AC and DC I believe will be bigger than any in history.

        Tell us more about the safety issues, please. I am an electronic technician, and I never heard of it before. That doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist; I just want to hear more about it.

        • DC current is more efficient at stopping the heart if this is in the flow path, as it affects the electrolyte balance of heart muscle cells more rapidly and extensively than AC. With that said, AC can cause relatively greater fibrillation of the heart by upsetting the ‘pacemaker’ function of heart cells, so perhaps there is not all that much to choose between them. Otherwise, for momentary contact not flowing through the heart there won’t be much difference, subject to contact resistance, voltage, flow path etc. – as you will know.

          For more sustained contact – more than 30 seconds or so (muscles locked up) – DC current at significant voltage (c.100Vdc+) will cause electrolysis in the tissues along the flow path and especially near the points of contact, resulting in deep, burn-like tissue damage in addition to actual heating effects. This can be followed by muscle and organ ulceration and a Herxheimer-type reaction to electrolytic products released from dead cells. A comparable AC shock won’t do this, although there may still be some relatively superficial tissue damage from heating effects.

      • georgehants

        Morning.
        “It’s like nothing we’ve ever seen before. It’s very high in sulphur,
        it’s very high in magnesium, it’s got twice as much manganese as we’ve
        ever seen in anything on Mars. I don’t know what any of this means.
        We’re completely confused, and everyone in the team is arguing
        and fighting (over what it means).”
        – Steve Squyers, Ph.D., Mars Opportunity rover team leader
        http://www.earthfiles.com/index.php?category=Headline+News

        • Wow – that’s weird. The fact that it ‘appeared’ and hadn’t been there before could mean it is either volcanic in origin or a meteor fragment, or perhaps it just rolled into view when it was disturbed by ground vibrations. I assume that telescopes or orbiters would have spotted any volcanic activity, and it would be a bit of a coincidence that the crawler happens to be there at just the right time to spot a new meteor fragment, so just a loose rock that rolled there when the crawler got close? Its either that or a small green person scuttled in and dropped it there while the camera wasn’t looking…

          • friendlyprogrammer

            OOOPS – FORTYNINER… You switched up AC and DC in your posts. It is Alternating Current (AC) that is the most dangerous and was developed by Nicola Tesla. Direct Current (DC) is less dangerous but cannot travel nearly as far, and that was developed by Thomas Edison.

            Edison tried to show the dangers of AC by electrocuting dogs and elephants in public. AC is used in electric chairs. AC is what comes out of your plug in a normal house.

            NOTE: Either way it is a very simple process to convert one to another especially given the extreme cheapness of the proposed generation abilities.

            I think you meant to say this the other way around but had a brain freeze while typing.

            Switching the AC/DC in your posts and they make sense..

          • No, no mistake. Please see my later addition in answer to Bachcole below. Regarding conversion, I suggested in an earlier post that large rotary converters (DC motor and AC generator on the same shaft) would solve the problem of DC output.

          • Omega Z

            Peter

            The Technology for highly Efficient DC/AC Convertors exist.
            This would likely be much cheaper And efficient then a DC motor to an alternator.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Probably fell off the rover. It’s likely a 20 billion dollar doodad.

          • Omega Z

            Martians throwing Rocks.

            Pan the camera & you’d see Martians with Protest Sign. Earthlings Go Home…

  • Gp

    Hi, from an average,at best, mind, this looks like these guys have been playing the energy World Cup for the last two decades (just like everyone else) and next week they are playing the final. On paper they look like they have all the golden eleven players. And they say that the players are now so perfect together, that it will be an unprecedented spectacle. To me this says that even a football (energy) ignorant will be blown away by the spectacle. If we don t feel like we have witnessed that, we will know it was just another delusion energy fantasy final

  • phmb23

    Oil futures have dropped significantly in the last 2 months. Could this reflect increasing belief in the reality of LENR?

    A while ago, Frank was kind enough to post my predictions regarding how LENR would affect the economy. One of my predictions was that once LENR is recognized as real and it is accepted that the cost of electricity produced by it is going to be substantially cheaper than current power, the price of oil will plummet. Because I believe this, I keep an eye on oil futures at http://www.cmegroup.com/trading/energy/crude-oil/light-sweet-crude.html.

    The price of oil futures for delivery in Dec 2020 has dropped from $80 to $75 since Nov 2013. Prices for delivery in Dec 2017 through 2022 show similar sharp drops. This is a fairly substantial drop and is the lowest price for oil futures that I have seen since 2009, but before I jump to the conclusion that this reflects growing acceptance of the reality of LENR, I must look for other possible causes. The usual causes of oil price changes are:

    New technology for oil extraction (primarily fracking)
    The economic outlook
    Political risks in the Middle East
    New technology in alternative energy (excluding LENR)

    The obvious one that jumps out as the most likely suspect is the deal with Iran which will allow them to sell their vast oil capacity to
    western countries, but I do not think this will be enough to drive the price below the cost of oil extracted by fracking.

    I do not think the economic outlook has deteriorated significantly since November and I am not aware of any major advances in solar or wind power. So either the experts are predicting that it will be profitable to extract oil by fracking and sell it at less than $75 or some of them are betting on LENR.

    • bachcole

      I am ignorant of these matters and had no idea that futures went so far out into the future. That is 8 years. If I were into oil futures, I would DEFINITELY not be buying oil futures 8 years out unless I got an absurdly low price, like perhaps $25.

    • US_Citizen71

      Fracking, fuel efficiency and a currently stable world political climate are likely the cause. I would also look at the recent slowdown of the economy and industrial output of China. If the amount of plastic being shipped out of China drops then their demand for oil will drop as well. China is also going through crash program in fracking as well. By 2020 the US is currently expected to become an net oil exporter due to fracking, if that happens the landscape changes and the $75 might actually be a premium price. I wouldn’t look at the current drop being caused LENR, I wish it was but LENR is still way to fringe science to be the cause for the oil futures to be dropping. The sell off of drilling leases on a widespread scale I believe will be the true beginning of the end for the oil market.

      • Omega Z

        Add: U.S. winter demand is low point of the year.
        U.S. Production is pushing 8 Million barrels a day.
        Libya just added 1/2 Million a day.
        Iraq has increased by 1 Million & climbing.
        If Iran behaves & And stops Uranium Enrichment, They will be allowed to sell an additional Million a day.
        When LENR does present, It will only effect Oil prices temporarily then rebound. It will take several years before it really has impact on Oil prices.

    • atanguy

      @phmb23
      In my opinion it is more the effect of the economic outlook, see:
      “the limits to growth pdf” A very long link but worth it to read:
      http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCkQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.donellameadows.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuserfiles%2FLimits-to-Growth-digital-scan-version.pdf&ei=PCXfUrSgJs31oAS0-oD4Ag&usg=AFQjCNFN6-1lMq34o-JXJwnaMqOwvVAkwg&sig2=jleFCmRm11hTTVtpcnSSQw&bvm=bv.59568121,d.cGU&cad=rja
      It was a report for THE CLUB OF ROME’S Project on the Predicament of Mankind
      This report written forty years ago and revisited recently in 2012, obviously doesn’t talk about LENR,but still the base of the economic outlook for people in power.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        If LENR goes commercial it will completely change and revamp economies. Monies previously spent filling your gas tank or powering buses will be funneled into an economy where everything becomes a lot cheaper.

        Imagine any product. They now no longer need gas in their delivery trucks, their buildings are heated or A/C cheap. Every supplier they use also have the same savings, so every widget will be a lot cheaper.

        Boats / Cars / Campers / Trucks / Blimps (Yes Blimps will come back) / will all be able to run with clean fuel without cost.

        Imagine breathing fresh country air in downtown LA.

        Previously arid locations can pump cheap desalinated water all over and create farms/food and clean water to millions.

        I could go on and on and on.

        LENR will drastically change the world.

        My story ends with me driving (autopilot) a 150 foot LENR ship all over the world without the need for fuel.

        • malkom700

          The problem will only be home unit. I do not understand why such interest in domestic units at the outset. Domestic units obviously will not be any cheaper to produce electricity as a large unit, moreover they will pretty taxed.

          • malkom700

            Note that the units in cars have the character of domestic units.

          • Brokeeper

            If a unit is used for both car and home then I can see your point. While parked in the garage it would run the electric/heat and charge up a storage tank of liquid salts or generate hydrogen for the rest of the day and more once all the safety issues are resolved.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Taxation only applies to legally sold units. This technology in all its forms (Ross ecat, etc.) seems quite simple to reproduce once a prototype/sample is seen, and appears to be less complicated than a dollar store flashlight.

            The Gov’t taxed cigarettes too much and they start seeing illegal cigarettes pervade the market. The Gov’t restricted alcohol use and illegal booze starts to flow.

            These will be reasonable to purchase after a few years, but I am sure there will be inflated demand for a long time.

  • bachcole

    I am ignorant of these matters and had no idea that futures went so far out into the future. That is 8 years. If I were into oil futures, I would DEFINITELY not be buying oil futures 8 years out unless I got an absurdly low price, like perhaps $25.

  • US_Citizen71

    Fracking, fuel efficiency and a currently stable world political climate are likely the cause. I would also look at the recent slowdown of the economy and industrial output of China. If the amount of plastic being shipped out of China drops then their demand for oil will drop as well. China is also going through crash program in fracking as well. By 2020 the US is currently expected to become an net oil exporter due to fracking, if that happens the landscape changes and the $75 might actually be a premium price. I wouldn’t look at the current drop being caused LENR, I wish it was but LENR is still way to fringe science to be the cause for the oil futures to be dropping. The sell off of drilling leases on a widespread scale I believe will be the true beginning of the end for the oil market.

    • Omega Z

      Add: U.S. winter demand is low point of the year.
      U.S. Production is pushing 8 Million barrels a day.
      Libya just added 1/2 Million a day.
      Iraq has increased by 1 Million & climbing.
      If Iran behaves & And stops Uranium Enrichment, They will be allowed to sell an additional Million a day.
      When LENR does present, It will only effect Oil prices temporarily then rebound. It will take several years before it really has impact on Oil prices.

  • atanguy

    @phmb23
    In my opinion it is more the effect of the economic outlook, see:
    “the limits to growth pdf” A very long link but worth it to read:
    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCkQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.donellameadows.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuserfiles%2FLimits-to-Growth-digital-scan-version.pdf&ei=PCXfUrSgJs31oAS0-oD4Ag&usg=AFQjCNFN6-1lMq34o-JXJwnaMqOwvVAkwg&sig2=jleFCmRm11hTTVtpcnSSQw&bvm=bv.59568121,d.cGU&cad=rja
    It was a report for THE CLUB OF ROME’S Project on the Predicament of Mankind
    This report written forty years ago and revisited recently in 2012, obviously doesn’t talk about LENR,but still the base of the economic outlook for people in power.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      If LENR goes commercial it will completely change and revamp economies. Monies previously spent filling your gas tank or powering buses will be funneled into an economy where everything becomes a lot cheaper.

      Imagine any product. They now no longer need gas in their delivery trucks, their buildings are heated or A/C cheap. Every supplier they use also have the same savings, so every widget will be a lot cheaper.

      Boats / Cars / Campers / Trucks / Blimps (Yes Blimps will come back) / will all be able to run with clean fuel without cost.

      Imagine breathing fresh country air in downtown LA.

      Previously arid locations can pump cheap desalinated water all over and create farms/food and clean water to millions.

      I could go on and on and on.

      LENR will drastically change the world.

      My story ends with me driving (autopilot) a 150 foot LENR ship all over the world without the need for fuel.

      • malkom700

        The problem will only be home unit. I do not understand why such interest in domestic units at the outset. Domestic units obviously will not be any cheaper to produce electricity as a large unit, moreover they will pretty taxed.

        • malkom700

          Note that the units in cars have the character of domestic units.

          • BroKeeper

            If a unit is used for both car and home then I can see your point. While parked in the garage it would run the electric/heat and charge up a storage tank of liquid salts or generate hydrogen for the rest of the day and more once all the safety issues are resolved.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          Taxation only applies to legally sold units. This technology in all its forms (Ross ecat, etc.) seems quite simple to reproduce once a prototype/sample is seen, and appears to be less complicated than a dollar store flashlight.

          The Gov’t taxed cigarettes too much and they start seeing illegal cigarettes pervade the market. The Gov’t restricted alcohol use and illegal booze starts to flow.

          These will be reasonable to purchase after a few years, but I am sure there will be inflated demand for a long time.

  • Miles
    • Buck

      It is big news . . . however, it did not make much of a ripple as it came out in the midst of the rush of news just prior to New Years. It was drowned out by Rossi, Cherokee Investments-Industrial Heat, and China’s investment of $1.65B in an alternate energy industrial park with LENR (Rossi) highlighted.

      Personally, I see Brillouin as the LENR company closest to commercialization and their S.Korean licensee takes them one step closer to achieving just that goal. But, I can live with being wrong if another LENR firm commercializes first.

      • GreenWin

        Buck, so as to not impugn the Rossi team, including its NPS adviser, we might want to soften the pitch re Chinese high level authorities. Lest a modern Joe McCarthy appear to gum the works?

        • Buck

          GW,

          I understand you point. However, the news is already out and all the details are posted on Blogs like PESN or E-Cat World.

          What does the acronym NPS stand for?

  • Miles
    • Buck

      It is big news . . . however, it did not make much of a ripple as it came out in the midst of the rush of news just prior to New Years. It was drowned out by revelations about Rossi’s Hot-Cat, Rossi’s partnership with Cherokee Investments-Industrial Heat, the apparent involvement of the highest levels of authority in China, and China’s investment of $1.65B in an alternate energy industrial park with LENR and Cherokee Investments-Industrial Heat highlighted.

      Personally, I see Brillouin as the LENR company closest to commercialization and their S.Korean licensee takes them one step closer to achieving just that goal. But, I can live with being wrong if another LENR firm commercializes first.

      • GreenWin

        Buck, so as to not impugn the Rossi team, including its NPS adviser, we might want to soften the pitch re Chinese high level authorities. Lest a modern Joe McCarthy appear to gum the works?

        • Buck

          GW,

          I understand you point. However, the news is already out and all the details are posted on Blogs like PESN or E-Cat World.

          What does the acronym NPS stand for?

  • lukedc

    Shell just pulled out of a $20 Billion dollar LNG project in QLD Australia. It looks like it will not go ahead now. Interesting times.

  • Fortyniner

    Yes, I’m aware of that – it’s why I said “… but is explained near the end”. Even given that, it still sounded too practiced. None of this matters though – we’ll find out soon enough how much is real.

  • bachcole

    LENR already came, in the form of the E-Cat and the 2013 Levi, Essen et. al. Report. But Mills?? There are many cases where extremely brilliant people go crazy, so his past does not mean that we should drop our critical thinking skills and just accept anything that he says. He has made many extraordinary claims, extraordinary even for us LENR+ believers, so he is going to have to demonstrate them. His hot air will not heat my house.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Remains to be seen.

      • bachcole

        Agreed.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          100 times cheaper than coal. Go to Blacklight Power Website and there is a price graph on one of their main page links. I think this is 10 times better than their previous validations.

          http://www.blacklightpower.com/technology/sf-ciht-cell/

          Found it (link above) “0.1 cents per kWh” Coal is 9 cents per kWh…

          A gain of X10 since the previous validations is why we did not see it then (supposedly).

          • AstralProjectee

            Well technically it’s 90 times cheaper than coal, not 100. Coal being the cheapest conventional energy source.

            I see that the picture that I showed you talked about their CIHT cell while the picture you directed me too is of the SF-CIHT cell. Yet both of them are at the same prices??????? I am scratching my head. So the CIHT and the SF-CIHT are the same thing? Doesn’t make sense.

            Thanks.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            I not aware where you located the first picture. I thought I was just answering a question, but you seem as informed as myself. I can recall seeing the older version was something like 1 cent per kWh, meaning they had improved it by a factor of 10.

            Here in 2009 video they were claiming 1-2 cents per kWh.

            http://money.cnn.com/video/news/2008/12/11/news.energyfix.121108.cnnmoney/

            (approx 50 seconds in).

            I know I had seen that figure quite a lot back then as even a price equal to coal would be awesome, but that was 10 X cheaper.

            Note in video… they say.. at end… “They say it as least 5 years away”. This was in 2009. It is now almost 5 years away coming into 2014. They are where they were claiming they wanted to be technically.

            I am still not going to throw any parades until after it goes commercial (if it does).

            I am inclined to believe we are due for a breakthrough on this front from someone soon. BLP is possible.

  • georgehants

    So important that maybe off topic will be allowed
    ——

    Business

    Davos

    Oxfam: 85 richest people as wealthy as poorest half of the world

    As World Economic Forum starts in Davos, development charity claims growing inequality has been driven by ‘power grab’The extent to which so much global wealth has become corralled by a
    virtual handful of the so-called ‘global elite’ is exposed in a new
    report from Oxfam on Monday. It warned that those richest 85 people
    across the globe share a combined wealth of £1tn, as much as the poorest
    3.5 billion of the world’s population.http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/jan/20/oxfam-85-richest-people-half-of-the-world

    • Curbina

      The only news about this is that it got reported in a “main stream media”.

  • georgehants

    So important that maybe off topic will be allowed
    ——

    Business

    Davos

    Oxfam: 85 richest people as wealthy as poorest half of the world

    As World Economic Forum starts in Davos, development charity claims growing inequality has been driven by ‘power grab’The extent to which so much global wealth has become corralled by a
    virtual handful of the so-called ‘global elite’ is exposed in a new
    report from Oxfam on Monday. It warned that those richest 85 people
    across the globe share a combined wealth of £1tn, as much as the poorest
    3.5 billion of the world’s population.http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/jan/20/oxfam-85-richest-people-half-of-the-world

    • Curbina

      The only news about this is that it got reported in a “main stream media”.

  • Brad Arnold

    Who gives a darn if it is AC or DC…what is important is scale. Remember, Mills and BLP are doing a demo not with an industrial scale generator, but with a micro and concept one. Why if it is so easy to scale? I am not rubbishing this, it is amazing, I am only pointing out that the devil is in the details. I pray that after Jan 28, BLP will be considered the leader in the LENR race to commercialization, but I wouldn’t bet my life on it.

    • tlp

      The key element for the final product, 10 MW powerplant, is the MHD plasma to electricity converter, because that is most effective way to transfer the generated energy away from the machine, via electric wires. Without the MHD it would melt.
      So the demo need to be smaller and/or very short period.

  • Brad Arnold

    Who gives a darn if it is AC or DC…what is important is scale. Remember, Mills and BLP are doing a demo not with an industrial scale generator, but with a micro and concept one. Why if it is so easy to scale? I am not rubbishing this, it is amazing, I am only pointing out that the devil is in the details. I pray that after Jan 28, BLP will be considered the leader in the LENR race to commercialization, but I wouldn’t bet my life on it.

    • tlp

      The key element for the final product, 10 MW powerplant, is the MHD plasma to electricity converter, because that is most effective way to transfer the generated energy away from the machine, via electric wires. Without the MHD it would melt.
      So the demo need to be smaller and/or very short period.

  • friendlyprogrammer

    Mostly what is needed is a demonstration at least worthy of attracting competition. If nations start throwing billions of dollars at LENR (again) results will speed up.

  • anony-mouse

    i heard about this blacklight power demo happening tomorrow, got all excited at what this means for the future… then i tried to find info about it, and all the comments seem to be negaitive. As you guys know more than i do about this can you please explain whats going on… is this just one big advertisement to get money or is it going to be the day the world changes???

    • bachcole

      Dear Precious-Mouse, good questions. The bottom line is that if something comes along that is absolutely, positively new and is different from what people think or do, then there is absolutely, positively going to be opposition. People’s ego’s and incomes become threatened by the absolutely, positively new. LENR does not fit into the paradigm of the modern world, and it will bring down certain high mucky-mucks with lots of bucks. So it is no surprise that there a LOTS of people saying that it ain’t so. However, it has been proven, and good science is not about what people say but about thinking for yourself and looking at the evidence.

      This link will get you started with LENR: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtweR_qGHEc&list=PLFBAB0BB637C4A59E Mike McKubre has to be the archetypal distinguished, laid-back cool dude.

      This link will finish off your doubts about LENR+ and the E-Cat: http://arxiv.org/pdf/1305.3913.pdf

      Now, understand that Rossi and the E-Cat has already changed the world. It is sort of a done deal, except that it has not manifested even close to fully. It is just getting started, so you can still join in on the fun of watching the world change. Whether Mills is going to help change the world or not remains to be seen; tomorrow may or may not show us whether he is a player or not. Most people here are definitely on the fence. Everyone is excited about seeing what happens tomorrow.

      We are all skeptics here. Some of us are believers. A believer is either a skeptic that has been convinced with the evidence or is a follower. There are no followers here as far as I know, other than perhaps yourself. I invite you to become a skeptic and look closely at the links that I provided you. It took me 19 months to become a believer in Rossi and the E-Cat. You can do it in perhaps a few hours. (:->)

    • jousterusa

      See “Here Comes the World-Changer” at http://www.american-reporter.com and use the Control+F function in Windows to search for “World-Changer”, which will take you right to it!

  • anony-mouse

    i heard about this blacklight power demo happening tomorrow, got all excited at what this means for the future… then i tried to find info about it, and all the comments seem to be negaitive. As you guys know more than i do about this can you please explain whats going on… is this just one big advertisement to get money or is it going to be the day the world changes???

    • bachcole

      Dear Precious-Mouse, good questions. The bottom line is that if something comes along that is absolutely, positively new and is different from what people think or do, then there is absolutely, positively going to be opposition. People’s ego’s and incomes become threatened by the absolutely, positively new. LENR does not fit into the paradigm of the modern world, and it will bring down certain high mucky-mucks with lots of bucks. So it is no surprise that there a LOTS of people saying that it ain’t so. However, it has been proven, and good science is not about what people say but about thinking for yourself and looking at the evidence.

      This link will get you started with LENR: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtweR_qGHEc&list=PLFBAB0BB637C4A59E Mike McKubre has to be the archetypal distinguished, laid-back cool dude.

      This link will finish off your doubts about LENR+ and the E-Cat: http://arxiv.org/pdf/1305.3913.pdf

      Now, understand that Rossi and the E-Cat has already changed the world. It is sort of a done deal, except that it has not manifested even close to fully. It is just getting started, so you can still join in on the fun of watching the world change. Whether Mills is going to help change the world or not remains to be seen; tomorrow may or may not show us whether he is a player or not. Most people here are definitely on the fence. Everyone is excited about seeing what happens tomorrow.

      We are all skeptics here. Some of us are believers. A believer is either a skeptic that has been convinced with the evidence or is a follower. There are no followers here as far as I know, other than perhaps yourself. I invite you to become a skeptic and look closely at the links that I provided you. It took me 19 months to become a believer in Rossi and the E-Cat. You can do it in perhaps a few hours. (:->)

    • jousterusa

      See “Here Comes the World-Changer” at http://www.american-reporter.com and use the Control+F function in Windows to search for “World-Changer”, which will take you right to it!