Blacklight Power's Randell Mills Interview: Product Deployment 'Very Quickly'

The following was sent by ECW reader optiongeek — edited and expanded by myself.

Sterling Allan recently interviewed Blacklight Power founder Dr. Randall Mills for his Greater Things program on the Rense Radio network. Allan’s summarizing comment: “phenomenally exciting”. According Mills, rapid engineering advancements by multiple partners firms will allow him to deliver his 250kW to 10MW units in industrial quantities ‘very quickly.’ He says they do not expect product deployment will take decades or even years to accomplish.

In the interview, Mills says that after two decades of hitting ‘roadblocks’ and ‘impediments’ which have prevented them from commercialization, they have developed a system using photovoltaic technology that will allow them to start releasing products in the near future. Mills says that BLP has just signed a distribution deal for Canada, and are working on many more deals (he mentions $40 billon in sales).

He says they are working with 3 engineering companies who he says are helping tremendously with getting the BLP sytems ready for the market. He says every major or minor engineering issue ‘has broken in our favor’.
All of the components and subcomponents are either available off the shelf or have an easy path to implementation. Mills quotes his partner firms as saying “this thing was meant to be”, in the sense that all of the engineering challenges seem to have easy technological solutions.

His next public demonstration is scheduled for July 21st and he’s promised it will show even more advancements. He says they will also do private demonstrations in different cities for industries. He also discusses his proposed licensing model (give the device away for free, charge by the watt) and his believe that the units will fundamentally alter the nature of power distribution by obviating the need for an electrical grid. Phenomenally exciting, indeed.

The interview can be heard at this link:

http://www.blacklightpower.com/rrn-interview/

  • Gerrit

    Looking forward to seeing the “welding machine” demo in 10 days.

    Maybe this time they will provide info on energy balance.

    • optiongeek

      Demo on the 25th showed an energy balance using the “pan” type fuel – about 140J input, 700J output. The same quantity of powder fuel needs about 5J input. The difference is that that the powder type fuel is inconvenient to use in a bomb calorimeter, but the aluminum in the pan needs to be melted in the reaction, accounting for the less efficiency. To sum up, about 5x energy gain was demoed, but expect 100x in the working model.

  • You know, I have been going back and forth on Blacklight. I can’t figure them out. They have severely damaged their credibility by not delivering on such grandiose claims in the past. They have papers and validations but the hydrino theory hasn’t gotten much traction and the validations are always “within the fold” so to speak. And the demos just seem like show and tells to get more money rather than prove anything.

    But this is starting to feel a little different. Now Mills is referencing industrialization partners and specific distribution deals. They have my attention again. That would be outside the box for them if they were running an indefinite investor scam. If any of it can be confirmed… well, very interesting.

    If Rossi and Mills both have the goods then I can only conclude that Mills’ hydrinos or something similar are real and via conservation of miracles, those shrunken hydrogen atoms are the root cause of LENR, enabling nuclear interactions to occur because the atoms can come in closer proximity.

    Engineers are going to have a field day with all these new tools (if true… the validity of this emerging alternate universe may of course be positive or negative).

  • Mike

    As is often repeated around here “Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof” I work along the so-called “Energy Corridor” here in Houston, Texas, very much in the middle of fossil fuel utilization. Nevertheless I would welcome a cheap and green energy source. There are so many better uses for hydrocarbons than burning them up. But it’s also true we all wish for a “silver bullet” to solve our energy problems. There are many silver bullets for sale, but alas, there are few that are real. I wish any legitimate inventor, scientist, or tinkerer the best of luck. Worst of luck to the con artists.

    • as Usual I will choke on the extraordinay quote

      Extraordinary claims require Normal proof

      Credible claims require Normal proof

      any claim require Normal proof

      There can be fraudsters with solar panel, bakery or cold fusion.. just ask serious evidence, I mean really serious.

      • Iggy Dalrymple

        My proof is when all my friends have something that they are pleased with.
        I am a late adopter.

        • that is rational.

          The problem is not adopting or not (I’m a late adopter too), it is in denying the possibility of existence.

          today we have a pile of evidence (not on blacklight I agree) and instead of rationally considering it might be real or not, being unsure and afraid or curious, most “pretended late adopters” simply say they are SURE it is fake, false, wrong…

          that is even more rational that believing that free energy is there… rational people have to consider the possibility of LENR, with a probability which depends on their informations and approach…

          It is a good strategy not to be interested however, but in that case:

          http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/g/georgebern163003.html

          “People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.”

          For me blacklight is probably far from anything usable, and have a wrong theory… but I keep a tiny chance I am wrong.

          About LENR I concede I cannot find any realistic reasons for cold fusion not to be a real phenomenon (anomalous heat in hydride above anything chemical involving transmutations)… I should let a black swan probability to be wrong (like Illuminati conspiracy or Alien intervention or black magic or Soviet disinformation campaign). I don’t, I am not so rational above some level of converging evidences. sorry.

        • Omega Z

          Day Late, Dollar Short. Join the crowd.

          Better then being a 1st adopter & screwed.

      • roseland67

        Nicely played,
        In the Market there is Truth?
        How about:
        In Truth there is Truth?

      • Hope4DBest

        He was doing OK until the “40 BILLION” in sales… Recently GE invested 17 BN in France’s Alstom and it was front page all over the world.

        • Omega Z

          “40 BILLION”
          That is likely pre-commitments of multiple parties.
          Not a single entity.

    • jousterusa

      Good for you, Mike!

    • Omega Z

      “Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof”
      I Disagree, Ordinary accepted proof is all that is needed.
      But needed it is.

      Hows extraordinary work anyway.
      Water is wet,
      Splash.
      Splash again is that it.
      Just kidding, I here & read this all the time.
      To me , proof is proof.

      • Paul

        Obviously, in LENR the info we read on the web are only the top of the iceberg. Most of the research is secret (big or medium-size companies) or top secret (military). Also the most open scientists in LENR keep for themselves at least the most important details, as I know for direct experience. There is also a growing role of hacking to obtain illegally infos, so in current age no secret is more completely sure. This could make the LENR revolution quite faster than if had happened in the past, for example 20 years ago. US and Chinese governments have excellent battallions of hackers, but Russia and other countries too are competitive in this field. Today, also private companies could consider hacking for grabbing industrial infos, while others use traditional methods (for example, see products or person or partial infos, promise a lot of money but finally not sign a contract or pay the person).

        • Ophelia Rump

          I would not be surprised if you are correct.
          I would also not be surprised if more than one hacker has already died from self inflicted neutron bombardment.

        • Fortyniner

          If we relied on Mills’ clunky engineering, we would be.

          Fortunately we still have LENR and a few other gestating technologies that may yet save our collective ar$es.

  • Mike

    As is often repeated around here “Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof” I work along the so-called “Energy Corridor” here in Houston, Texas, very much in the middle of fossil fuel utilization. Nevertheless I would welcome a cheap and green energy source. There are so many better uses for hydrocarbons than burning them up. But it’s also true we all wish for a “silver bullet” to solve our energy problems. There are many silver bullets for sale, but alas, there are few that are real. I wish any legitimate inventor, scientist, or tinkerer the best of luck. Worst of luck to the con artists.

    • as Usual I will choke on the extraordinay quote

      Extraordinary claims require Normal proof

      Credible claims require Normal proof

      any claim require Normal proof

      There can be fraudsters with solar panel, bakery or cold fusion.. just ask serious evidence, I mean really serious.

      • Iggy Dalrymple

        My proof is when all my friends have something that they are pleased with.
        I am a late adopter.

        • that is rational.

          The problem is not adopting or not (I’m a late adopter too), it is in denying the possibility of existence.

          today we have a pile of evidence (not on blacklight I agree) and instead of rationally considering it might be real or not, being unsure and afraid or curious, most “pretended late adopters” simply say they are SURE it is fake, false, wrong…

          that is even more irrational than believing that free energy is there… rational people have to consider the possibility of LENR, with a probability which depends on their informations and approach…

          It is a good strategy not to be interested however, but in that case:

          http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/g/georgebern163003.html

          “People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.”

          For me blacklight is probably far from anything usable, and have a wrong theory… but I keep a tiny chance I am wrong.

          About LENR I concede I cannot find any realistic reasons for cold fusion not to be a real phenomenon (anomalous heat in hydride above anything chemical involving transmutations)… I should let a black swan probability to be wrong (like Illuminati conspiracy or Alien intervention or black magic or Soviet disinformation campaign). I don’t, I am not so rational above some level of converging evidences. sorry.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Many people do not realize that solar power and alternatives have become cheap. Nowadays someone can make their home energy self sufficient with less cost than an average car.

            Late adoption of tech is not the best way to go in todays age.

        • Omega Z

          Day Late, Dollar Short. Join the crowd.

          Better then being a 1st adopter & screwed.

      • roseland67

        Nicely played,
        In the Market there is Truth?
        How about:
        In Truth there is Truth?

      • Mike

        AlainCo,
        Sure. I’d be quite happy with serious evidence or “normal proof.”

    • jousterusa

      Good for you, Mike!

    • Omega Z

      “Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof”
      I Disagree, Ordinary accepted proof is all that is needed.
      But needed it is.

      Hows extraordinary work anyway.
      Water is wet,
      Splash.
      Splash again is that it.
      Just kidding, I here & read this all the time.
      To me , proof is proof.

  • roseland67

    “Very quickly”
    “Soon”
    “Any day now”
    “Very Close”
    “Right around the corner”
    “Preparing to release”
    “Demo complete”
    “Investors lined up”
    This is a re-run
    Missouri

  • JC

    I wish the best for BLP, and hope they have what they think they do. My main problem with the presentation is that it involves too much extrapolated data and not enough hard data on results. It really doesn’t matter if you extrapolate energy density from a fraction of a milliliter to 140 billion watts in a full liter. It is irrelevant. What is relevant is how much energy they are putting in and how much they are actually converting into electricity with the PV cells. As far as I can tell that is never talked about. Anyone can be optimistic, which is not necessarily a bad thing, but it would be nice to have some realism and caution. To me, it would make more sense to say something like, “Right now, we’re able to extract approximately 95% of the amount of power we are putting into it. We are working to achieve higher output levels to obtain a self-sustained system and are hopeful it can be achieved.”

  • Private Citizen

    How about at a demo with a few volt/amp meters connected for starters?

    “Pop-pop-pop” is not scientific evidence of excess energy.

  • David

    What photovoltaic technology can provide 250Kw to 10Mw of energy. Thought a standard panel was 250W peak. Can a different light source (not the sun) produce more power on a standar panel?

    • optiongeek

      When you have 50,000 suns worth of light (concentrated into a network of fiber optics) you can get pretty creative with designing your PV stack. Current concentrator PV can handle up to 1000 suns @ 42% conversion efficiency. Mills seems quite confident that this problem is addressable with current generation PV technology.

      • Robert Ellefson

        “optiongeek” – your pseudonym seems to imply that your are in the business of trading financial derivatives such as options. Are you invested in BLP or any other related entities? I think it would serve everybody here well if people making statements or assertions of fact are clear about where our interests lie with respect to the technologies and businesses under discussion. This allows for somewhat more reasonable interpretations of assertions made, rather than relying on pure guesswork as to what motivations might be in play. BTW, I do not mean to imply that your status as an investor would discredit anything you have posted. I have not interpret anything you have posted as at all unreasonable or unbelievable, and I am not intending to infer that you are being anything less than honest and direct in your stated opinions and observations. I’m just trying to keep track of who is standing where, if you know what I mean.

        For the record, I myself have no capital investment in any form of LENR or related technologies, and do not plan on having any related investments unless I start a manufacturing business in the field at some point in the relatively distant future.

        • jousterusa

          I don’t have any money, but if I did I would dump it all into BLP and AR’s work… My sole interest in BLP and LENR is in the reporting I’ve been doing on it in The American Reporter for the past three or four years, trying to get people thinking about it and ready for its advent. I went way out on a limb on both technologies, and I feel that I will shortly be fully vindicated. Then again, I wrote about the coming Fifth Caliphate in Sept., 1999 (see The American Reporter, “The War Against the Caliphate”) and it took until two wweks ago for the Caliphate to be declared. Frankly, it made me proud to have taken a stance that was so vulnerable at the time.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Then if Toyota brought LENR to market you would be broke. I do think BLP has it though. They are far too excited and it shows.

          • Omega Z

            “The War Against the Caliphate”
            Any predictions on how that turns out… 🙂

          • bachcole

            We will keep them squashed for basically ever, but we will NEVER be able to whip them out, just like Al Qaeda.

        • optiongeek

          I wish I were invested in BLP but unfortunately Mills seems to vet his investors far too strictly for the likes of poor ol’ me to put in my walking around money. In order to be a BLP stockholder, one pretty much needs a PhD and run an energy company, or some such.
          So, to answer your question on point, I have no financial ties or any other ties to BLP.
          No, my interest is purely intellectual. And since I’m asked, I’ll point out a few things that have kept me interested. The standard “proof” cited by quantum mechanics are the “precision” tests of QED (look it up on Wikipedia). The chief example is a QM-derived calculation that purports to show the value of the anomalous dipole moment (i.e. how much energy it takes to flip a hydrogen atom in a magnetic field between poles). The QM version runs well over 50 pages of terms and constants and includes phrases like (I kid you not) “The value for parameter Asub10 isn’t known but we can estimate it”. At the end of this, an answer is given that “matches” the measured value to 11 significant digits. I wonder if the guess used for parameter Asub10 had any bearing on that answer.
          In contrast, Mills can calculate the same value using his model. He starts with a well-known result called the Poynting Power Theorem. This has three components, corresponding to the change in electric energy, the change in magnetic energy, and the flow of energy into the system. To each component he provides a simple analytical value expressed in fundamental constants only (such as the speed of light), and, presto, the result matches the observed value to 11 significant digits. So which theory seems more likely, the one requiring 50 pages of parameters (some which aren’t even known), or the one needing three compact terms? In my mind, there’s absolutely no way to ignore Mills’ result. It’s the very essence of elegance. What’s more, Mills goes beyond this and provides analytical solutions for well known values that QM can’t even solve, such as the all the ratios of the lepton masses.
          So some folks are insisting that Mills’ theory is broken or wrong, but that just tells me they haven’t studied it like I have.
          So that’s why I think Mills has the real stuff – math doesn’t lie, only people do.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        Randell MIlls said 50-75 times the intensity of the sun. Just saying because you are saying 50 000. It’s minor and maybe I am wrong. I still enjoy your comments.

        • optiongeek

          I believe you misheard or possibly he mis-spoke. He has been very clear in his writings that the output intensity is 50,000 suns.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            My apologies then. One of your previous comments has me reading his book. ty

    • Omega Z

      250W peak
      That is rated according to what you can expect from a sunshine point of view. By using mirrors or lenses(Think Magnifying glass) you can increase output. You also increase the heat which isn’t wanted.

  • Private Citizen

    How about at a demo with a few volt/amp meters connected for starters? Suppose the thought never crossed Mills’ mind?

    “Pop-pop-pop” is not “phenomenally exciting” scientific evidence of excess energy.

  • optiongeek

    When you have 50,000 suns worth of light (concentrated into a network of fiber optics) you can get pretty creative with designing your PV stack. Current concentrator PV can handle up to 1000 suns @ 42% conversion efficiency. Mills seems quite confident that this problem is addressable with current generation PV technology.

    • Robert Ellefson

      “optiongeek” – your pseudonym seems to imply that your are in the business of trading financial derivatives such as options. Are you invested in BLP or any other related entities? I think it would serve everybody here well if people making statements or assertions of fact are clear about where our interests lie with respect to the technologies and businesses under discussion. This allows for somewhat more reasonable interpretations of assertions made, rather than relying on pure guesswork as to what motivations might be in play. BTW, I do not mean to imply that your status as an investor would discredit anything you have posted. I have not interpret anything you have posted as at all unreasonable or unbelievable, and I am not intending to infer that you are being anything less than honest and direct in your stated opinions and observations. I’m just trying to keep track of who is standing where, if you know what I mean.

      For the record, I myself have no capital investment in any form of LENR or related technologies, and do not plan on having any related investments unless I start a manufacturing business in the field at some point in the relatively distant future.

      • jousterusa

        I don’t have any money, but if I did I would dump it all into BLP and AR’s work… My sole interest in BLP and LENR is in the reporting I’ve been doing on it in The American Reporter for the past three or four years, trying to get people thinking about it and ready for its advent. I went way out on a limb on both technologies, and I feel that I will shortly be fully vindicated. Then again, I wrote about the coming Fifth Caliphate in Sept., 1999 (see The American Reporter, “The War Against the Caliphate”) and it took until two wweks ago for the Caliphate to be declared. Frankly, it made me proud to have taken a stance that was so vulnerable at the time.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          Then if Toyota brought LENR to market you would be broke. I do think BLP has it though. They are far too excited and it shows.

        • Omega Z

          “The War Against the Caliphate”
          Any predictions on how that turns out… 🙂

  • bachcole

    I will be pleasantly surprised; I hope that it is true; but I doubt it.

  • robyn wyrick

    Interestingly, by the comments below, there isn’t a lot of hope about BLP in this population — and given that, I wanted to thank you, Frank, for posting this. I think it’s good to have a spectrum of ideas.

    • nobody is sure there is nothing . have to check.

  • robyn wyrick

    Interestingly, by the comments below, there isn’t a lot of hope about BLP in this population — and given that, I wanted to thank you, Frank, for posting this. I think it’s good to have a spectrum of ideas.

    • nobody is sure there is nothing . have to check.

  • Gerard McEk

    How can anyone raise money and start engineering a commercial product and sign distribution deals without having proved it in a prototype? Now he wants to generate MW via a photovoltaic converter. I hope he doesn’t blast his costly panels in barrels. I would never invest in it, but perhaps I am not thinking far enough out of Randall’s energy box. We’ll wait and see….

    • Omega Z

      Never show the public you latest version. Only the last one.

      The Latest is only for select people. $$

  • Gerard McEk

    How can anyone raise money and start engineering a commercial product and sign distribution deals without having proved it in a prototype? Now he wants to generate MW via a photovoltaic converter. I hope he doesn’t blast his costly panels in barrels. I would never invest in it, but perhaps I am not thinking far enough out of Randell’s energy box. We’ll wait and see….

    • Omega Z

      Never show the public you latest version. Only the last one.

      The Latest is only for select people. $$

  • Job001

    BLP’s latest presentation was much improved from the prior one in several regards;
    1.Spectroscopy was sufficiently intriguing that good scientists should be troubled enough to think and investigate.
    2.Some calorimetry – not real convincing, it is a start.
    3.The PV explaination was reasonable, engineering can distribute light with fibre optics to illuminate PV cells at cell specification limits.
    4.R. Mills took time to explain that experimental energy release is mainly in light photons form rather than as heat and light photons can be harvested efficiently by efficient PV cells. It is a plan with some logic and explaination.
    5.Less hyperbola and a calmer explaination.
    6.Having miniature bangs eliminates many steady state safety control issues. Not bad, really favorable for safe low regulation needs.
    On the other hand, data is still very limited on calorimetry and energy balance, presumably because they have not done engineering and are not yet using fiber optics to spread the photons properly to the PV cells. R Mill did claim a 100 to 1 possible energy yield without backing this up with data.
    This was an improvement over the 2 to 1 claim for the first demonstration.
    Although no proof and scant data was available, this was a much better demo and with a real progress plan including unoptimized PV cell energy capture which was shown.
    I’m still skeptical due to low data but much more impressed with the demo quality and planning.

    • optiongeek

      I’d add that one reason Mills seems to be making such rapid progress from demo to demo is due to the extensive characterization work and theory that has gone into this. Case in point, in January BLP was planning to use MHD converters because they believed they were dealing with a primarily pressure-volume type reaction (i.e. the kind you get from a firecracker) and MHD would be the logical way to convert a hot mass of moving ions into usable electricity. However, when it became clear that essentially all of the power is in the form of blackbody radiation (i.e. sunlight) they were able to shift on a dime and redesign the conversion apparatus around photovoltaic arrays. Another example, damage to the gears/electrodes from sustained use is a real concern regarding longevity of the device. However, because of all the characterization work done to date, Mills has been able to design a current arc that will leave a crucial layer of unexploded powder covering the electrode surface and preventing damage – hence his repeated comments about a 25-year warranty. All of this comes from have a deep understanding of the physical reaction, which simply isn’t the case with any of the LENR processes. No one really understands how LENR is being driven and when hiccups in the path to commercialization occur, the only way around them is by guess work and trial and error. Does anyone really believe that “bad gaskets” caused Rossi’s Oct. 2011 trial to underperform? No – he’s clearly having development issues just like Mills only we’re not getting nearly the level of feedback, likely because Rossi doesn’t feel like he has all the answers yet.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        This is my favorite comment so far on this.

      • Omega Z

        I think leaks were a major issue among other things. Done on a shoestring budget. Control was probably not quite up to speed at that time also.
        Just don’t confuse the LT E-cat with the Hot-Cat. I’m sure he went thru the same issues with it all over again, but with experience with the LT version, advanced a little quicker.

      • bachcole

        “I’d add that one reason Mills seems to be making such rapid progress
        from demo to demo is due to the extensive characterization work and
        theory that has gone into this.” I hadn’t noticed. Are you being sarcastic?

  • friendlyprogrammer

    Yes. This is a great sign. Dr Randell Mills has obviously been very excited this year. He even explicitly signed on to youtube just to comment on one of the Youtube Prototype videos.

    If you are not aware of who Dr Randell Mills is let’s just say he is one of the smartest people imaginable. He graduated top 10% of his class and then went to Harvard where he obtained a medical degree (he is a real doctor). He invented a type of scanner that is very useful in the field of epilepsy, and a Cancer Patient Drug Therapy system before he got hooked on an idea for alternate energy which has consumed the past 26 years of his life.

    Many think he is a scammer because he has investors in BLP, but honestly a Harvard Educated Doctor can make a half million a year in wages just being a high end physician.

    Some think he is scamming because BLP keeps getting verifications and then saying a few more years. It would be like Andrea Rossi kept saying “tune in next year”. Many of us would jump ship and be disappointed.

    But now Dr Mills seems very excited. I am excited by the fact he says they are making great strides and that this technology is seemingly almost ready for market.

    Another blessing as far as BLP goes is that they have been getting Third Party Verifications the entire way, and they all speak well of the research.

    So… BLP claims a 1″ square box will soon be able to power 10 000 homes. They are acting excited about it. This would be far greater than LENR.

    Exciting is a good word for it.

    • Charles

      Just think about what is being said: “BLP claims a 1″ square box (do they really mean 1″ cubed, mathematically a 1″ square box is infinitely thin) will be able to power 10,000 homes. I wish I could imagine how many homes a 1″ cube from the sun will power. And what that temperature would be. Just for kicks, grab the nearest 100 watt bulb, 3-4 cubic inches and hold it in your hand. I severely need some sort of comprehension comparing that 1″ cube to, say, a hydrogen bomb. I can’t even grasp a megawatt just passing through a 1” cube. And I thought I was at least a half-bright electronics engineer.

      I once was responsible for the design of a radar power supply that would produce a 250,000 watt pulse for 50 micro-seconds. A required short circuit test, evaporated the shorting cable cable and produced a sonic boom through the factory.

      Somebody please help me.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        sorry I meant 1′ (foot) box.

        This technology fits perfectly with solar apparently because Photovoltaic Cells are capable of much more energy conversion than the sun can provide unless heavily amplified. This creates blinding flashes of light that are 50-75 times brighter than the sun.

        read from 27 minutes in this interview…

        “It took us two decades to work this out. We’ve hit all kinds of breakthroughs, and have said we can do this kind of power plant and 5that kind of power plant, and there was always some roadblock. This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!”

        It is RUNNING!!!!! Sorry excited here. I 100% believe he has already solved our energy woes..

      • JDM

        If you had captured the light from the flash with PV cells, you may have been able to light several LED’s!

      • Jim Anderson

        Charles you don;t have to imagine what a 1 cubic foot volume of the sun would produce below is a portion of the Wikipedia article on the sun. I agree with the rest of what you said.

        The power production by fusion in the core varies with distance from the
        solar center. At the center of the Sun, theoretical models estimate it
        to be approximately 276.5 watts/m3,[55] a power production density that more nearly approximates reptile metabolism than a thermonuclear bomb.[d] Peak power production in the Sun has been compared to the volumetric heats generated in an active compost heap. The tremendous power output of the Sun is not due to its high power per volume, but instead due to its large size.

      • bachcole

        Charles, you are not alone with your consternation with Randall Mills and with people here who are not consternated about him. I am consternated with him on so many levels that it is very difficult for me to take him seriously, and it is difficult for me to list all of the reasons.

      • Broncobet

        Actually The Matrix was right in giving a high value to the human body. All of us are more energy dense than the center of the sun. How can this be? The middle of the sun is a gigantic place. Here’s another one. How long does it take for a photon to reach the surface of the sun if created at the center (yes light travels at the speed of light). Answer… a million years,because it’s always hitting something that forces it to go at right angels.

  • Robert Ellefson

    The smell of desperation is overwhelming. Yes, BLP, you are in fact facing being left in the dust and disgraced by your multiple false-starts/broken promises once the IH report is released. If you do in fact have something worthwhile in development, then I honestly wish you the best of luck in your attempts to commercialize it rapidly – I would love for you to steal Rossi’s thunder, after all of his greed-motivated delays. However, empty claims devoid of conclusive data are not going to earn you meaningful accolades. You need to release real, measured data, even preliminary and full of caveats, but not reams of abstract theory accompanied by flash-bang-pop-smoke-and-mirrors do-not-look-at-the-man-behind-the-curtain types of demos. Good luck on pulling off a miracle – I will be thrilled to eat crow (figuratively speaking) if you succeed.

    • Asterix

      I fixed Mill’s statement for you:

      “In the interview, Mills says that after three decades of hitting
      ‘roadblocks’ and ‘impediments’ which have prevented them from
      commercialization, they have developed a system using photovoltaic
      technology that will allow them to start releasing products in the near
      future…”

      He never mentioned any “roadblocks” before…

      Ah, the “near future”, must be something like “Real Soon Now”. Sorry, but Mills seems to do this sort of thing whenever he needs more money. Yes, I’ve watched his arc-welder-type demonstrations and don’t get anything meaningful out of them. A billion-watt spark lasting half a microsecond every second or so, is still just 500 watts average.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        First.. He said two decades not three.

        … Andrea Rossi never mentioned Stability problems in 2011, but once stability was achieved we learned it was a problem.

        We do not know what “roadblocks” he speaks of, but I think it is positive he speaks of them in past tense.

        “It took us two decades to work this out. We’ve hit all kinds of breakthroughs, and have said we can do this kind of power plant and that kind of power plant, and there was always some roadblock. This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!” – Dr. Randell Mills

        You make it sound like 500 watts average from a water fuel is to be scoffed at. This tech is scalable in both directions. From as tiny as you can make a Solar Cell to 100 000 moon units that are powering a Earth Cooling device.

        • Asterix

          Mills has been at this since the early 1990s at least, pretty much saying the same thing.

          Now, we can sit here and argue about who said what, but I remember Mills clearly stating before the LHC experiments that the Higgs particle was an impossibility.

          And then, there’s this chestnut:from almost a decade ago, using Mills’ own papers to show why what he’s saying is nonsense:

          http://iopscience.iop.org/1367-2630/7/1/127/fulltext/

          After a few tens of millions of dollars, do you really think that Mills is putting on this show (along with the confusion between units of energy and power, which I’m pretty sure that any first-year Physics major understands) for any reason but to attract more money?

      • friendlyprogrammer

        If there were no roadblocks it would not have taken 25 years … correct?

  • Hope4Dbest

    He was doing OK until the “40 BILLION” in sales… Recently GE invested 17 BN in France’s Alstom and it was front page all over the world.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      So if you invented a power source that will replace oil how many billions should it be worth?

      According to BLP and it’s patents, and the excitement they are under, plus the phrase,

      “This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!” – Dr. Randell Mills.

      …. makes me think they have already been running theses with much success.

      “A car or jet engine are a million times inferior in power density.” – Dr. Randell Mills

      This means that if you put a unit in your trunk you could drive at thousands of miles per hour (lol), or at least never fill up at a service station FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE.

      This will be front page all over the world soon enough.

      I know I’d buy one. 40 Billion is NOTHING for what he has

    • Omega Z

      “40 BILLION”
      That is likely pre-commitments of multiple parties.
      Not a single entity.

    • Dan Nile

      I guess they didn’t want it on the front page.

  • GreenWin

    Mills’ hydrino theory solves many LENR problems. His magic number is 137. Mills’ early Ni + H2 experiments (1989) demonstrate an extraordinary step beyond Pons and Fleischmann. As improbable as the engineering seems, this photon capture rig seems to perform well. Congratulations to the BLP team. The next demo should be even better.

    One thought. Based on very recent surface plasma studies, Mills could replace the HV input with tuned laser energy. Same would apply to DGT’s HV source. Tuning the coherent photon input would allow far greater control of the (hydrino) transition reaction. However there would be less sparks flying about, which for pyros is half the fun.

    • Daniel Maris

      I will be the first to applaud Mills and chastise myself for my suspicions about his claims, should he ever demonstrate somethign tangible. So far he hasn’t as far as I am concerned.

  • GreenWin

    Mills’ hydrino theory solves many LENR problems. His magic number is 137. Mills’ early Ni + H2 experiments (1989) demonstrate an extraordinary step beyond Pons and Fleischmann. As improbable as the engineering seems, this photon capture rig seems to perform well. Congratulations to the BLP team. The next demo should be even better.

    One thought. Based on very recent surface plasma studies, Mills could replace the HV input with tuned laser energy. Same would apply to DGT’s HV source. Tuning the coherent photon input would allow far greater control of the (hydrino) transition reaction. However there would be less sparks flying about, which for pyros is half the fun.

  • jousterusa

    Contrary to the skepticism of some other posters, I believe this is the biggest story of this new century, and one of the great historic achievements in science. For me, I hope to restore my ability to travel freely by car without paying for gasoline. I will be happy to pay special excise taxes to support the National Highway Trust Fund on the basis of however many miles I drive. As for the units that get me off the grid, I’m just praying Mills will be able to overcome the final hurdles to placing the 10kw units in my home. Can you imagine the demand for these units in places that are prone to devastating hurricanes that may leave them without power for weeks? This technology will give American manufacturers another chance to compete with the low-wage capitals of the world – Dacca, Beijing and Shanghai, etc., when they can get their power for assembly lines and facilities free. What a blessing! What a marvel!

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Yes. I agree. This is the biggest story since computers were invented. Yes this tech might embarrass facilities like the 3 gorge dam, but the times are changing. The demand for them will be high, so let’s hope small scale units can be manufactured with ease.

      Yes. Everything will become cheaper as energy is a factor in producing everything. We will see 50″ televisions selling for $80. It’s crazy

    • USSSkipjack

      Taxes for Highways? If Mills stuff works (and that is a BIIIG IF), you wont need highways!

      • friendlyprogrammer

        I won’t because I’ll be sailing, but this could power a ionic wind personal flying machine. The drone type cars with 4 fans look nice but too many moving parts to make them safe.

        • Omega Z

          I think it will all likely be computer controlled. The masses have trouble with cars & 4 directions. Going 360×360 & they be falling out of the skies like rain drops. Big rain drops. You think hail hurts. Wow, They gonna hurt.

          By flyways, I’m talking pretty much as we have except without the need for pavement. It won’t be line of sight probably even in the rural areas. this is already regulated for aircraft & would be updated for flying cars. In some locals, helicopters have to come in and just as if they were an airplane. Following the runway & all.

          Note: I’m keen on the Ionic Idea. I’ve wondered about the weight ratio situation. I’m glad to see someone else thinking outside the box in this area.

      • Omega Z

        “you wont need highways”
        But you’ll have Flyways & will be more regulated then the highways. The only difference is there wont be hitting chuckholes.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          I think flying vehicles over a certain size will have guidance systems tied in to their computers. Computers will calculate your trip to avoid crashing.

          (small drones will be common and may even catch in propeller type crafts crashing them if not ionic)

  • Paul

    A nice race between Rossi and Mills. Mill’s apparatus could be less easy to replicate for (especially chinese future) competitors, but it seems more professional in the approach. Good luck to both of them!

    • jousterusa

      That’s the right attitude, Paul! It has been an interestuing raqce, but Rossi’s decision to abandon the home units was probably a fatal one in terms of capturing the market – if, of course, the promised BLP units quickly materialize. Mills can capture a 100% market share for the home units before Rossi can get his test results. Can’t say all of us haven’t told him that again and again.

      • Omega Z

        Rossi couldn’t pursue the home market without UL certification. Industrial is the only option. The home unit would only have been for heating or hot water.

        • artefact

          You could say the same about LENR experiments which produce only milliwasts or some watts. But if you know that even it is not much heat or the light spectra or something else is not what is known to be possible.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      If Mills has what he claims in Interview,

      “This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!” – Dr. Randell Mills.

      Then LENR will be a long afterthought, and Rossi will be forgotten even if LENR is 100% viable. The BLP power is much greater with no need to convert to electricity.

      A 1 foot square box that can power 10 000 homes. Beats LENR, and appears to be ready for market soon.

    • georgehants

      Paul, best not to underestimate the Chinese, they are probably being updated daily about BLP just as Stalin was regarding the Manhattan project.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        If China knows then the three gorges dam is a waste… instead of a tech marvel.

        • Omega Z

          But they didn’t know at that time. And at present, still not to market.
          It’s likely any projects beyond a certain point will be completed. It will take decades to transition regardless who or how many brings this technology to market. We’ll need energy to make this happen & for use until then.

  • Paul

    A nice race between Rossi and Mills. Mill’s apparatus could be less easy to replicate for (especially chinese future) competitors, but it seems more professional in the approach. Good luck to both of them!

    • jousterusa

      That’s the right attitude, Paul! It has been an interesting race, but Rossi’s decision to abandon the home units was probably a fatal one in terms of capturing the market – if, of course, the promised BLP units quickly materialize. Mills can capture a 100% market share for the home units via advance orders before Rossi can even get his test results. Can’t say all of us haven’t told him that again and again. At least Mills is pursuing an aggressive PR strategy, which Rossi has abandoned to the whims of his partners at IH LLC. Caution and wait-and-see delay is not always the best idea in a competitive field when it comes to product debuts. Study the cell phone market for examples. You want your product to be ready when it comes to market to fill the flood of early adopter orders, but it doesn’t hurt to precede the debut with lots of promises – if you can keep them!

      • Omega Z

        Rossi couldn’t pursue the home market without UL certification. Industrial is the only option. The home unit would only have been for heating or hot water.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          He also does not have necessary patents. I’d crack mine open after a day and measure the contents for all to see.

          The ecat seems mainly about contents. Thedevice itself has always been just a sealed tube of some sort. The ecat is its contents.

          For this reason maybe it cannot be patented I don’t know?

          But selling home units would be a mistake without protection.

          Would you go out and buy a “special ecat container” for $5000, when you can throw the ingredients into a pipe of your own for $29.50

    • friendlyprogrammer

      If Mills has what he claims in Interview,

      “This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!” – Dr. Randell Mills.

      Then LENR will be a long afterthought, and Rossi will be forgotten even if LENR is 100% viable. The BLP power is much greater with no need to convert to electricity.

      A 1 foot square box that can power 10 000 homes. Beats LENR, and appears to be ready for market soon.

    • georgehants

      Paul, best not to underestimate the Chinese, they are probably being updated daily about BLP just as Stalin was regarding the Manhattan project.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        If China knows then the three gorges dam is a waste… instead of a tech marvel.

        • Omega Z

          But they didn’t know at that time. And at present, still not to market.
          It’s likely any projects beyond a certain point will be completed. It will take decades to transition regardless who or how many brings this technology to market. We’ll need energy to make this happen & for use until then.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            China is very rich and uses infrastructure jobs to keep everyone working. There are allegedly millions and millions of empty homes and apartments there because they built them for the sake of work..

          • Omega Z

            It’s to bad that wasn’t expended on usable infrastructure, But at least there more on track then the U.S. who spend the same funds just paying people to stay home. One actually helps the economy while the other is just a drag on the economy.

            As to wealth, China really isn’t any better off then the U.S. The U.S. has centralized debt where China’s is spread among the provinces. But it is just as bad.

  • Charles

    Just think about what is being said: “BLP claims a 1″ square box (do they really mean 1″ cubed, mathematically a 1″ square box is infinitely thin) will be able to power 10,000 homes. I wish I could imagine how many homes a 1″ cube from the sun will power. And what that temperature would be. Just for kicks, grab the nearest 100 watt bulb, 3-4 cubic inches and hold it in your hand. I severely need some sort of comprehension comparing that 1″ cube to, say, a hydrogen bomb. I can’t even grasp a megawatt just passing through a 1” cube. And I thought I was at least a half-bright electronics engineer.

    I once was responsible for the design of a radar power supply that would produce a 250,000 watt pulse for 50 micro-seconds. A required short circuit test, evaporated the shorting cable cable and produced a sonic boom through the factory.

    Somebody please help me.

    • JDM

      If you had captured the light from the flash with PV cells, you may have been able to light several LED’s!

    • Jim Anderson

      Charles you don;t have to imagine what a 1 cubic foot volume of the sun would produce below is a portion of the Wikipedia article on the sun. I agree with the rest of what you said.

      The power production by fusion in the core varies with distance from the
      solar center. At the center of the Sun, theoretical models estimate it
      to be approximately 276.5 watts/m3,[55] a power production density that more nearly approximates reptile metabolism than a thermonuclear bomb.[d] Peak power production in the Sun has been compared to the volumetric heats generated in an active compost heap. The tremendous power output of the Sun is not due to its high power per volume, but instead due to its large size.

    • Broncobet

      Actually The Matrix was right in giving a high value to the human body. All of us are more energy dense than the center of the sun. How can this be? The middle of the sun is a gigantic place. Here’s another one. How long does it take for a photon to reach the surface of the sun if created at the center (yes light travels at the speed of light). Answer… a million years,because it’s always hitting something that forces it to go at right angels.

      • Gerard McEk

        If Mills is able to show a self looped demo at the premicis of an independent party, fully controlled by that party and run it such that any hidden chemical of battery energy source can be excluded, then he is my man. Until now he has said a lot and promised even more but shown nothing, so I am very sceptical.

        • Omega Z

          It’s to bad that wasn’t expended on usable infrastructure, But at least there more on track then the U.S. who spend the same funds just paying people to stay home. One actually helps the economy while the other is just a drag on the economy.

          As to wealth, China really isn’t any better off then the U.S. The U.S. has centralized debt where China’s is spread among the provinces. But it is just as bad.

  • georgehants

    Below is just one of the many tragedies in science where great men and women have been unfairly criticized and denied.
    If one does not have certain Evidence than a quiet mouth is a great gift.
    Some Wonderful factual, insightful comments today and the usual batch of less good quality.
    ———-
    “Ludwig Boltzmann was greatly demoralized due to the harsh criticism of
    his work. He committed suicide on September 5, 1906 at Duino, Italy by
    hanging himself. He was 62 years old.”
    He was proved correct shortly after his death.
    http://www.famousscientists.or

  • georgehants

    Below is just one of the many tragedies in science where great men and women have been unfairly criticized and denied leading to much personal suffering.
    If one does not have certain Evidence than a quiet mouth is a great gift.
    Some Wonderful factual, insightful comments today and the usual batch of less good quality.
    ———-
    “Ludwig Boltzmann was greatly demoralized due to the harsh criticism of
    his work. He committed suicide on September 5, 1906 at Duino, Italy by
    hanging himself. He was 62 years old.”
    He was proved correct shortly after his death.
    http://www.famousscientists.or

    • friendlyprogrammer

      He killed himself because he was bipolar, not because he was not believed. Every breakthrough in history meets skepticism, but will you write them off as tragic as well if any of them kill themselves. Death can be tragic, but a 62 year old man killing himself is lower on my tragedy scale. If the guy had endured his disease then he would have seen his theories accepted.

  • Sanjeev

    ” He says they do not expect product deployment will take decades or even years to accomplish.”

    Do you really need to do so much tongue twisting to say that a product will be in the market in a few months ?
    Frankly, it looks like the usual marketing talk to lure more investment. There is no solid info there whatsoever. No names of dealers, no dates, no documents, no press releases by partners, no proof of deals etc etc. Instead we have just bigger numbers. Who will believe this airy fairy BS?

    • JDM

      Perhaps one of the investment partners is a newly formed Cherokee company.
      Hedging their bets if the outcome of testing is positive or could be negative.

      • MMK

        Lol
        While Mills is 100% positive . Rossi is , could be positive or negative

    • friendlyprogrammer

      I believe him 100%. Dr. Randell Mills is genuinely excited about this. He could make a fortune working as a medical Doctor and is proud of his reputation (fights with wikipedia because they make him out as scammer).

      He says,”It took us two decades to work this out. We’ve hit all kinds of breakthroughs, and have said we can do this kind of power plant and 5that kind of power plant, and there was always some roadblock. This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!”

      It’s designed and running according to him and worldwide patents have been applied for.

      It seems as if they are there

      • MMk

        As s humble physicist, I have read his theory, which is, I must say, elegant.

        • A number of more open-minded physicists seem to agree on that, and as a non-physicist I’m happy to accept that his theories may have merit. His unsupported hype and his unimpressive experiments are another matter.

          • bachcole

            I agree with your spot on, except I would not have said it so politely and gently.

    • bachcole

      I feel like so many of his supporters here are entranced by his theory (what else is there?) when Rossi et. al. have taught us that theory can hold us back when we are trying to change paradigms.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        Maybe if you/Rossi told Mills that 20 years ago he would have got here in half the time.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      I disagree. I might describe some of their (BLP) history as tongue twisting, but it is very hard to not understand the phrase,

      “This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!” – Dr. Randell Mills

      This does not match their previous claims. In 2008 the television was telling us they were 5 years away. A similar story today would say they have it now.

      People are predictable in some instances, and BLP/Mills is very, very excited and has applied for worldwide patents. This is not the act of someone wanting investors.

      Also Mills is a Harvard Educated Medical Doctor who could dictate the highest of salaries just being a high end physician. Investors speed the process, but it appears he has his grail.

    • Anon2012_2014

      Sure, Centuries or Millennia.

      Give a predicted range.

      Randall Mills — he has a Porsche Cayenne with a “BLP” vanity license plate yet they have lost millions of dollars.

  • friendlyprogrammer

    @ EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I took this quote from just after 27 minutes into the interview.

    “This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible! ” – Dr Randell Mills.

    So forget about hoping and wishing, they have created abundant energy from water.

    Here is a dumbed down explanation of what is currently so exciting to them and us (and world).

    They can make a bunch of bright flashes using water as fuel. These flashes are 50-75 times brighter than the sun.

    Now here is something I did not know… Current Photovoltaic (Solar Cell) Cells can handle light 1000 times more powerful than the sun. The solar cells on my boat only operate at a small fraction of their capacity. If I took my solar panels and wrapped them around this BLP device I could harness more energy than if I used the sun. 50-75 times more light to convert.

    This means my current solar panels could output many times more power than being subjected to straight sunlight. Imagine a solar panel needed to power a house or boat. Now imagine that each cell was receiving 50-75 times more light.

    If you used Fibre optic cables (off the shelf) and (off the shelf) solar cells then this machine can be further optimized.

    “It really is a million times powerful than an internal combustion engine” – Dr Randell Mills (24 minutes in).

    A million times more power than a jet engine (without all that fuel planes usually need). This is already built and working….

    “140 Billion watts per liter of water” – Dr. Randell Mills.

    Those flashes of light he is creating is the energy. Solar Cells are the way to convert it to electricity.

    It is fun to hear the excitement in his voice,
    Here is a more complete quote from the 27 minute area,
    “It took us two decades to work this out. We’ve hit all kinds of breakthroughs, and have said we can do this kind of power plant and that kind of power plant, and there was always some roadblock. This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible! ” – Dr Randell Mills.

    “500 to 1000 Joules in 1/2 Millisecond” – Dr. Randell Mills.

    They have already gone into full on production mode. They had earlier in the year applied for global patents. There is at least 3 engineering firms working for them on this building prototypes and demonstration models and even Canadian Distribution is being worked out.

    Andrea Rossi should fold up shop, because this is already real and quite viable, although LENR may help insulate our Nuclear waste.

    The excitement in Dr. Randell Mills voice is obvious. He has brought the world something better than fire.

    Kudos Dr Mills. Maybe they might even change your wikipedia page to list you as a Hero.

    • Jimr

      I would be interested in someone setting up an arc welder, and surround it with several solar cells rated at perhaps 15% and measure the electricity generated. It is difficult for me to believe it would be more than 3-4 times more than in bright sunlight.
      How many of these things would have to be installed and in what configuration to generate a megawatt?

      • optiongeek

        To what purpose. Simply using an arc welder to generate sparks won’t release the 50,000 sun intensity light described by Mills. To get that kind of optical output, you would need the metal/metal hydrate fuel combination and engineer the arc in just the right condition to get the 15kA Mills tells us he needs to create the reaction. Remember that in Mills’ demos, the 50k suns only comes when the fuel and arc are just right.

        • Jimr

          I would be interested in knowing what measuring device measures 50000 times the suns intensity

          • optiongeek

            Ask Dr. Mills at the Society for Classical Physics forum. He answers just about any respectfully phrased question. I suspect it’s well within the range of his lab equipment – just pass the light through frosted glass and compare against a known light source would work, wouldn’t it?

          • bachcole

            I discern more clarity of thought.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Too bad it was not clarity of reading/listening you sensed.

            The comment you are referring to says the effect is 50 000 times brighter than the sun. This is not how I heard the facts. I heard him say 50-75 times brighter. You are commenting on someone off by a thousandfold.

            Maybe its lack of clarity you detected.

      • bachcole

        More consternation from someone afflicted with clarity of thought.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        Even if you were correct and they ONLY were able to replicate sunlight to these cells, they are still using water as the fuel.. That is not impressive enough?

        The claims of BLP are pretty grand, but it has been building for years. If you doubt them just wait a few months (we will still be waiting on the Rossi verification anyways).

        • Omega Z

          I hope Mills has what he says, But I still want Rossi & others with similar technologies to make it to market as well.
          For 1, Different technology may be better suited for different uses.
          For Another & the Most Important, Without competition, we have a continuing of the same. Priced as the market will bare. Regardless of how cheap I can make it, It will only be cheap enough to cut the competition out.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Competition will eventually be there using this tech either by waiting until Patent is history, or buy knock-offs.

            I’m rooting for Rossi as well, but science is moving fast and his tech may be outdated before it has a chance. It will always be useful for the Mitsubishi application of insulating Nuclear waste to collect Gamma.

            BLP is just a nice surprise.

    • bachcole

      If Randall Mills says “This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!”, then when is he going to demonstrate it? It is not real to me until it is demonstrated.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        What would you have him do? This breakthrough obviously is new. He has already applied for world wide patents and is telling us it’s already working far better than hoped.

        • MLTC

          Can’t you read?! He wrote that he wants a demonstration!

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Yes. If you could read how I responded you would see I do not think BLP will go out of their way to please just him. Why should they?

            Also that commenter had said similar things in other comments that were also being addressed.

      • Mark Underwood

        If you’re in the area you could always pre-register by email in order to see the next demo yourself on July 21.

        The demos will only get better and better. I believe on the 21st there will be recycling and rehydration of the metal salt, among other advances. Within the next few months I strongly suspect there will be a demo of a self looped, sustained reaction. Stay tuned.

        • Gerard McEk

          If Mills is able to show a self looped demo at the premicis of an independent party, fully controlled by that party and run it such that any hidden chemical of battery energy source can be excluded, then he is my man. Until now he has said a lot and promised even more but shown nothing, so I am very sceptical.

    • Owen Geiger

      “Andrea Rossi should fold up shop, because this is already real and quite viable…”
      Thanks for the chuckle.

  • georgehants

    foobario2, your reply contains no Evidence of wrong doing.
    A person who has invested with them and is taking them to court for fraud would suffice.

  • Barry8

    Blacklight seems far from a working model. The demos have been popcorn explosions far from smooth. Mills is quite the talker and called us a Rossi “cult”, but as Rossi would say ” In mercatu veritas.”

    • bachcole

      Barry8, I am with you.

  • Blacklight seems far from a working model. The demos have been popcorn explosions far from smooth. Mills is quite the talker and called us a Rossi “cult”, but as Rossi would say ” In mercatu veritas.”

    • bachcole

      Barry8, I am with you.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Don’t blame Mills for being on the same page as mainstream science just because he is after his own alternate energy solutions.

      His working models are working. The electric lights are powered by electricity.

      Rossi on the other hand is still electricity free.

      • It’s not too late friendlyprogrammer to change your bet to “Powder Grey”.

        .Mills demos have been a let down. 97% words, 3% same old crude plasma burst. They remind me of the “Popper” (see minutes 21 – 21:30) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zWJNyoFgJM
        I’m willing to bet if you put a solar collector on the bottom of this you could run a string of LED lights.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          Same old Plasma Burst? So does your Youtube video create Plasma from moisture and HV as well?

          I certainly would prefer this over the Rossi tech. It sounds much more scalable, and creates electricity without the need for a steam Engine.

          I do not know why everyone thinks R&D companies need to give Demos to suit them, I’d much rather see third party verifications which Blacklight is religious about and Andrea Rossi refuses to do. (lending a sealed ecat with NDA and a guard to prevent it from being opened are technically not really third party verifications).

          BLP is excited about this to apply for global patents, this marks a change in their behavior. They also are saying “We have something” instead of “We are close to something”. Their website has improved a lot with more custom videos like the car mode version.

          In your video the Plasma burst explosion moved a Piston. According to Mills, the BLP version gives off mostly light and does not give a lot of pressure. I am not clear about The Noble Gas Engine though.

          I think BLP is going for a fairly logical method of harnessing the flashes, and they seem to believe they have something. I mean they really are believing this and all of their wheels are in production modes.

          As for Rossi. His kinda verification of heat (no electricity here) is due for release in June (I mean September… or next June).

          • Friendly, it seems you have more belief in Mills and I do in Rossi. It’s not so much a need for a demo from Blacklight as the demos they say they will be putting out have been let downs. My hope in Mills waned two “demos” ago.

            Rossi’s third party verification in 2013 was, for me, quite satisfying and the 2014 one is about to come out, but most of all, whether it’s verified or not, Rossi is right, the truth will be in the market.

            Like Mike Mckubre said, “When one wins we all win”. Perhaps I’ll be proven wrong, but I just don’t believe it will be Mills.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            I have followed this eagerly since 2011 and am familiar with most LENR sources. I believe Andrea Rossi must have something because the Fraud Scenario does not make sense to me.

            I have seen many of what I consider bogus youtube claims and I understand a certain amount of skepticism is healthy.

            It is also true that BLP has previously claimed they are months away.

            as in here… although the full version CNN says 5 years away.

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ymlc8nk7Mdk

            Now… One thing that seems to make sense with Rossi and BLP is that their prototypes keep changing.

            One argument I have made on behalf of Rossi is if he is faking then why is his fakery more stable now than when $15 million of Defkalions money was on the line. His product seems to be progressing through logical stages.

            This is very true with BLP. BLP has come at this in a half dozen ways that do not resemble this final product in any way. They also seem to be following a logical progression.

            I understand their Demos are just blinking Christmas lights and sparks, but that must be weighed with all of their behaviors. They have applied for Global Patents, and I honestly think if the patent was approved tomorrow we would see this on the front page by next week.

            I know he says they will be ready in a matter of months, but realistically they cannot start production with Patent Pending status. It is prudent for them to wait for the patent to be approved.

            Two demonstrations I’d like to see myself is A) The device running with all HV coming from its output (self sufficiency) & B) Have them run a Direct Current car across the country with the BLP devices running in a trailer behind providing fuel/power.

            So they are following logical progressions. They seem to be acting excited. Just listen to this interview from 24 minutes on. Mills is so excited Sterling cannot get a word in edgewise.

            He even mentions they had roadblocks referring to them in past tense and he says every problem they faced in developing this has worked well in their favor. He keeps describing how everything is coming up roses on the Engineering end of things.

            Our last big scientific breakthrough was heavily aided by Bill Gates and his software (actually stolen from Apple who stole it from Xerox). Bill Gates was also a Harvard student.

            Harvard will be very happy if this tech comes about if only for bragging rights.

            The demos were attended by some smart people, and if a welder was being used to dupe a youtube video then I am sure it would be noticed. So in all likelihood this light is really created by moisture fueled Plasma. Using Solar Cells is beautiful. Mankind allocated Trillions of dollars in Solar Cell research in the past 100 years and they are remarkably well suited for this. The sun only uses them to a fraction of their potential. This would be better than sunlight and can run 24/7 where often the sunlight stops after 12-14 hours.

            There are also many other videos and comments explaining their tech better than in demo’s.

            Dr. Mills even started his own Youtube Channel just to answer questions and defend his videos. If you form a good question there you might get an answer, but just saying,” 97% words, 3% same old crude plasma burst.”, probably won’t go over too well.

            I Disagree they will have it within months, but I do agree they have something making them crazy. I don’t think he has the patience to wait for the patent, but we will see.

            Already they are organizing a third and fourth Demonstration this year. This is not the behavior they have ever exhibited.

            Mills said this is a demonstration at one facility of a test model. He claims they have various prototypes for various applications at various locations. Three Engineering firms.

            Your statement,

            Like Mike Mckubre said, “When one wins we all win”. is apt.

            One aspect I dislike… Mills claims this reaction is Chemical and not Nuclear. If LENR is somehow based on Hydrinos then perhaps it is also a chemical reaction (nobody else believes in Hydrinos so no Theory has been output about this). If it is Chemical then ALL THE SKEPTICS WILL SAY “I Told You So”, and ridicule us for calling it “Low Energy NUCLEAR reactions”. We will say, “yeah but you were too dumb to accept all the science given so far”, and they can argue ,” but you kept telling us this was Nuclear and that is impossible”.

            C’est la vie though…

            Mills has something pretty special going on. That much seems logical.

          • bachcole

            My faith in Mills ended immediately upon the first demo when I realized that he was playing me for a chump.

        • … for the few minutes before any optical surfaces become coated with condensed residues from the welder arcs, or the copper electrode wheels get covered in similar crud and can no longer conduct enough power.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            You cannot think of any way around this… Maybe we are doomed?

          • If we relied on Mills’ clunky engineering, we would be. He is attempting to run before he can crawl – the behaviour of a dilettante, and an arrogant one at that.

            Fortunately we have LENR and a few other gestating technologies that may yet save our collective ar$es.

  • jousterusa

    I don’t think he’s banked a cent. Investments totaling $70 million have been received, but 26 years of testing and engineering with a substantial staff of PhDs has eaten it all.

    The brilliant stroke of using PV cells to harvest the light and turn it into energy has saved him, I believe. Now the problem will ultimately be not how well it works or the theory behind it, which he has fully and frequently elaborated, but the so-called ?market disruption” that has to occur.

    Millions of retirees, like my late Mom, put all their retirement money into utility stocks that paid reliable dividends, good ones, year after year. Now folks like her are in danger of losing the entire value of those investments, because no one is going to assign any value to an asset that consists of a nuclear power plant (formerly valued at $2 billion) when it is easily replaced with a box one foot square that runs on plain old water – even seawater, since it has just as much hydrogen as any other kind.

    Then there is the huge fall in costs for manufacturing stuff, which will shock the entire world market for cars, for instance, which not only requires huge amounts of electricity to power their assembly lines but will now have to retool to be powered by Mills’ CIHT cells.

    Then there’s the refinery business, which won’t be needed any longer except for the other uses of oil, i.e., greasing things.

    Just imagine all that, and the huge power blocs in Washington arrayed behind them, not to mention the vast and very wealthy and powerful scientific establishment that backs hot fusion, and you get an idea of the mountains Mills has yet to scale.

    The fact that Mills has three engineering firms ready to turn these things out into the market is the key to the future outcome.

    After all, it will be the little guys, you and me and the rest of us, now getting robbed for gasoline and juice – electricity – that will determine who wins this titanic battle for power and untold wealth.

    I don’t think Mills is that interested in becoming as wealthy as the heirs of Edison. It seems to me his strongest motive is to vindicate his theories and his amazing and wonderful ideas.

  • Jimr

    I would be interested in someone setting up an arc welder, and surround it with several solar cells rated at perhaps 15% and measure the electricity generated. It is difficult for me to believe it would be more than 3-4 times more than in bright sunlight.
    How many of these things would have to be installed and in what configuration to generate a megawatt?

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Even if you were correct and they ONLY were able to replicate sunlight to these cells, they are still using water as the fuel.. That is not impressive enough?

      The claims of BLP are pretty grand, but it has been building for years. If you doubt them just wait a few months (we will still be waiting on the Rossi verification anyways).

      • Omega Z

        I hope Mills has what he says, But I still want Rossi & others with similar technologies to make it to market as well.
        For 1, Different technology may be better suited for different uses.
        For Another & the Most Important, Without competition, we have a continuing of the same. Priced as the market will bare. Regardless of how cheap I can make it, It will only be cheap enough to cut the competition out.

  • bachcole

    If Randall Mills says “This thing is designed, it’s running, it’s making electricity, it makes extraordinary power. This thing is incredible!”, then when is he going to demonstrate it? It is not real to me until it is demonstrated.

  • Job001

    Folks, we have an energetic horse race:
    Pole position………………….. Handicap………Speed

    Stallion “Solar PV”…………………..1……………….15

    “Tilting at wind”………………………2…………………5

    Pebble Nuc “gassy baby”………..7…………………3

    “Rossi runaway “powder grey”….4…………………6

    “Mills white lightning”……………….3…………………7

    Dark Horse Nag “FF”………………..9…………………1

    Speed is rough rank learning curve speed.

    “Tilting” second in lead with “PV” coming on fast…”gassy baby” won’t start till 2020 but has good supporters…Rossi “powder grey” report is coming out in September…while Mills “white lightning” is banging the gate with second place speed and astounding power specs. Fossil fuel nag “FF” in the lead threw a CO2 shoe, slowing down limping, might be a tough cripple but don’t count her out! Tilting and Solar have been known to fool around and be intermittent but they are fast! Folks, we have a horse race! These are my odds and handicaps, subject to capricious change. Place your bets!

    • Barry8

      Job, I’ll put $20 down on “Powder Grey.”

    • Omega Z

      “you wont need highways”
      But you’ll have Flyways & will be more regulated then the highways. The only difference is there wont be hitting chuckholes.

  • Job001

    Folks, we have an energetic horse race:
    Pole position………………….. Handicap………Speed

    Stallion “Solar PV”…………………..1……………….15

    “Tilting at wind”………………………2…………………5

    Pebble Nuc “gassy baby”………..7…………………3

    “Rossi runaway “powder grey”….4…………………6

    “Mills white lightning”……………….3…………………7

    Dark Horse Nag “FF”………………..9…………………1

    Speed is rough rank learning curve speed.

    “Tilting” second in lead with “PV” coming on fast…”gassy baby” won’t start till 2020 but has good supporters…Rossi “powder grey” report is coming out in September…while Mills “white lightning” is banging the gate with second place speed and astounding power specs. Fossil fuel nag “FF” in the lead threw a CO2 shoe, slowing down limping, might be a tough cripple but don’t count her out! Tilting and Solar have been known to fool around and be intermittent but they are fast! Folks, we have a horse race! These are my odds and handicaps, subject to capricious change. Place your bets!

    • Job, I’ll put $20 down on “Powder Grey.”

      • friendlyprogrammer

        I’ll take Lightning.

  • Ophelia Rump

    If he is a scientist then he is aware of the inverse squared law, and the fact the something being 75 times brighter than the sun means nothing. A 100 Watt bulb is brighter than the sun if you get close enough to the filament.

    • Gerard McEk

      I agree with every word of you in this post, Ophelia. I wonder how plants react on stroboscopic light. I hope plants do not suffer epilepcy :-).

  • Ophelia Rump

    If he is a scientist then he is aware of the inverse squared law, and the fact the something being 75 times brighter than the sun means nothing. A 100 Watt bulb is brighter than the sun if you get close enough to the filament.

    If he truly can produce copious quantities of light at low power cost, he can just sell agricultural lighting units for indoor farming. He should make the simplest light producing version and his funding problems are over.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      It would mean that current off the shelf photovoltaic Cells could work closer to their potential than with straight sunlight, plus the fuel for this light is water. Not too shabby.

      • Ophelia Rump

        No it means the intensity of light drops off incredibly fast with distance from the source. To understand this you only have to look at the picture in the following link. Any measure of intensity brighter than the sun is meaningless and misleading without knowing at what distance.

        Inverse-square law
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law

        The intensity of light received is a function of spreading a limited quantity of light across the surface of a sphere with the radius equaling the distance from the source. The farther you step back, the larger the sphere, and the larger the sphere’s surface. The lower the intensity of the light. The surface of a sphere increases geometrically.
        A sphere measured at a distance of one unit has a surface of 12.57 times that unit. At a distance of two units it has a surface of 50.27
        3 units = 113.1
        4 units = 201.06
        5 units = 314.16
        With each step the light is spread more thinly over the greater surface.
        Intensity without distance is a garbage measure.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          Okay. I am not understanding your point? You are suggesting his tech possibly coupled with fiber optics is not working as he claims?

          Indoor farming? Sounds like the weed industry, but still a unique thought. I wonder if they had even thought of this. Kudos for that.

          Funding Problems? What funding problems has he had? From what I can see he has been able to raise a fair amount $60-80 million.

          If he is behind on his mortgage he could always go back to being a medical Doctor and make a 1/3 mill a year.
          (current wages he would get on average)
          Radiology: $315,000
          Orthopedics: $315,000
          Cardiology: $314,000
          Plastic surgery: $270,000
          General surgery: $265,000
          Obstetrics/Gynecology: $220,000

          Although I bet he would be on the higher end of those wages because his Medical Degree was from Harvard.

          • Ophelia Rump

            He sounds just like every swindler I have ever heard pitch a bogus claim.
            Big meaningless numbers out of context and flashing lights.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            So were any of these other swindlers rich Harvard doctors, who also had studied electrical engineering at MIT? Were any of them Phi Beta Kappa?

          • Ophelia Rump

            Only reason can impress me, I am uncivilized.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Then you should be reading science texts and not investigating fringe science. Investigation requires one to look at whatever clues are available. There has been more than one fortune won and lost because people have not looked at all the information available.

            If you want facts and figures you may need to hold your breath a long time, because you are probably not a priority for them. Maybe if you were civilized.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            If only reason impresses you then fringe science is not the greatest place to look for it. Instead try accepted Mainstream textbooks.

            Most of these topics here from Andrea Rossi to Blacklight Power need to be investigated from an overall standpoint because if any of these had 100% solid replications then they would be in Nature Journal.

            The Fact Randell Mills is a real life Medical Doctor trained to use a stethoscope and prescribe aspirin is a clue to me that his interest in this pursuit is likely not profiteering. A Harvard educated Medical Doctor can usually make a very good living without resorting to fraud.

            Then you look at things like claims and logical progressions.

            If you are to investigate put on your Sherlock Holmes hat and do so..

            Look at Rossi. Just a few short years ago Defkalion offered Andrea Rossi $15 000 000 for a continued partnership if Andrea Rossi could run the ecat for 48 hours. Andrea Rossi could not meet that stability requirement at the time and so the deal was never struck.

            Yet now the ecat has been measured to not only run for at least three days, but they needed to shut it off manually after that length of time.

            It is a logical progression.

            Imagine for a second it was fraud. Why would the fraudulent ecat run so much longer now than in 2011? Is his fraudery improving? Progression makes sense.

            I might not even believe in Rossi if we did not know that at least 20 other major corporations have working LENR devices, and those are just the ones who admit it on that iceburg.

            Mills was also on a Hydrogen/Nickel/Lithium direction, but has PROGRESSED.

            I understand being impressed by reason, but not all reasoning comes from the math. The ability to read between the lines is required.

    • Gerard McEk

      I agree with every word of you in this post, Ophelia. I wonder how plants react on stroboscopic light. I hope plants do not suffer epilepcy :-).

    • Dan Nile

      They’re going to pipe the light via fiber optics, which does not following the inverse squared law. Even if they didn’t, the distances we are talking about are inches.

  • Jimr

    I would be interested in knowing what measuring device measures 50000 times the suns intensity

  • Blacklight Power will reach the market first. It will not be long now before they have a live working ready for the market prototype to show off.

    • Fibb

      And you know this how?

      • Ophelia Rump

        I have read and listened. They provide bogus numbers without sufficient context to do the math, very impressive for people who do not question or think.

        • GreenWin

          In cases such as you suggest, it is good to have spiritual and technical “DDT.” Both exist. The cost is asset full and open disclosure. And a semblance of maturity beyond “sirens.”

        • Obvious

          O.R., I like your posts more and more recently.

        • Fortyniner

          The psychological profile of those who have so far contributed around $60M to Mills’ efforts does seem… interesting. He must be an extremely persuasive individual, but I suspect that his time may be running out – there are limits to all things, including gullibility. He probably senses this, too – hence the exaggerated claims and the attempts to back them up in some way.

          I don’t think he is a fraud in the conventional sense. I believe that the key to his success (at attracting investment – not in engineering) may be that he really does believe in his own brilliance and in his fantastic claims, and that this has carried him along so far. In other words, for Mills, the boundaries between what he is absolutely sure he will be able to do, and the reality of what he has actually been able to accomplish, may have become rather blurred.

          However he has recently backed himself into a corner, possibly as a consequence of his apparently massive self belief, and if the gap between his crude engineering efforts and the hype is not narrowed, investors may begin to sense that this particular emperor’s new clothes are scanty at best.

          • georgehants

            Morning Peter, one I think can always find a few rich, dumb investors, but after a while somebody who takes the time to check things out will come along and spill the beans.
            It seems to be a lot of years that Mr. Mills has been pulling the wool.
            On the other hand we can remember DeLorean, but then they only had the abilities of a government and their advisers to convince, not very difficult.

    • Ophelia Rump

      That would be lovely but their communications so far are hype and horse hockey in an unappealing blend. If they market a product I will be in line to buy one, once it is proven.
      Until then they do not pass the sniff test. Something about them smells very wrong.

  • Blacklight Power will reach the market first. It will not be long now before they have a live working ready for the market prototype to show off.

    • Fibb

      And you know this how?

      • Ophelia Rump

        They provide bogus numbers without sufficient context to do the math, very impressive for people who do not question or think.

        Desiring LENR to be successful does not require believing in every fraud which comes along. Far from that, the frauds must be eliminated like an insect infestation on a crop.

        • GreenWin

          In cases such as you suggest, it is good to have spiritual and technical “DDT.” Both exist. The cost is asset full and open disclosure. And a semblance of maturity beyond “sirens.”

          • friendlyprogrammer

            I am not sure how your words are supposed to make sense today.

            You just said,

            “In cases such as you suggest, it is good to have spiritual and technical
            “DDT.” Both exist. The cost is asset full and open disclosure. And a
            semblance of maturity beyond “sirens.””

            (What does any of that mean?)

            I normally understand your comments to a degree, but today you seem to be having problems communicating.

          • Ophelia Rump

            He was being grand eloquent, I was able to understand, but it took all the effort I could muster, like reading Jame Joyce’s Ulysses. Far too much craft and background packed into a tiny package. Supreme density.

        • Obvious

          O.R., I like your posts more and more recently.

        • The psychological profile of those who have so far contributed $60M+ to Mills’ efforts does seem… interesting. He must be an extremely persuasive individual, but I suspect that his time may be running out – there are limits to all things, including gullibility. He probably senses this, too – hence the exaggerated claims and the attempts to back them up in some way.

          I don’t think he is a fraud in the conventional sense. I believe that the key to his success (at attracting investment – not in engineering) may be that he really does believe in his own brilliance and in his fantastic claims, and that this has carried him along so far. In other words, for Mills, the boundaries between what he is absolutely sure he will be able to do, and the reality of what he has actually been able to accomplish, may have become rather blurred.

          He has recently backed himself into a corner, possibly in an attempt to rally the troops, but if the gap between his crude engineering efforts and the hype isn’t narrowed very soon, investors may begin to sense that this particular emperor’s new clothes are scanty at best.

          • georgehants

            Morning Peter, one I think can always find a few rich, dumb investors, but after a while somebody who takes the time to check things out will come along and spill the beans.
            It seems to be a lot of years that Mr. Mills has been pulling the wool.
            On the other hand we can remember DeLorean, but then they only had the abilities of a government and their advisers to convince, not very difficult.

          • bachcole

            You’ve heard of Heaven’s Gate and Jim Jones etc. There are people capable to persuading others of believing in their psychosis. I am inclined to think that this is the explanation for the huge gulfs between Mills’ following, his claims, and his demonstrations.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          Provide to whom? How do you rate more information than the rest of us outsiders? He has no burden of proof to get this manufactured, at least not to us.

    • Ophelia Rump

      That would be lovely but their communications so far are hype and horse hockey in an unappealing blend. If they market a product I will be in line to buy one, once it is proven.
      Until then they do not pass the sniff test. Something about them smells very wrong.

      • bachcole

        For me, I hear that the theory is quite elegant, but the demonstrations have been LAUGHABLE. Seriously, in all honesty, just for me, I don’t understand why anyone takes Mills seriously.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          It might be fun to revisit this page next year.

        • artefact

          You could say the same about LENR experiments which produce only milliwasts or some watts. But if you know that even it is not much heat or the light spectra or something else is not what is known to be possible.

          • bachcole

            I could NOT say the same about LENR experiments that produce only milliwatts. 1st, they usually don’t have a theory, which is not a big problem for me one way or the other in any area that is a big paradigm shift. But mostly, ALL of those LENR experiments had input measurements and output measurements. I don’t demand glowing cylinders. I expect something that shows something. I am willing to trust people to not be crooks. But I don’t appreciate someone showing me a fireworks display with no input and no output data or graphs and then telling me stuff that is impossibly wonderful.

  • MLTC

    Can’t you read?! He wrote that he wants a demonstration!

    • Daniel Maris

      Precisely – Rossi has given working demonstrations of his product, not above criticism perhaps but demonstrations nonetheless – we’ve seen nothing like that from Mills.

      I sincerely hope he has what he claims. But there’s no particular reason we should give his claims credence.

      • Ophelia Rump

        No it means the intensity of light drops off incredibly fast with distance from the source. To understand this you only have to look at the picture in the following link.

        Inverse-square law
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law

        • friendlyprogrammer

          Okay. I am not understanding your point? You are suggesting his tech possibly coupled with fiber optics is not working as he claims?

          Indoor farming? Sounds like the weed industry, but still a unique thought. I wonder if they had even thought of this. Kudos for that.

          Funding Problems? What funding problems has he had? From what I can see he has been able to raise a fair amount $60-80 million.

          If he is behind on his mortgage he could always go back to being a medical Doctor and make a 1/3 mill a year.
          (current wages he would get on average)
          Radiology: $315,000
          Orthopedics: $315,000
          Cardiology: $314,000
          Plastic surgery: $270,000
          General surgery: $265,000
          Obstetrics/Gynecology: $220,000

          Although I bet he would be on the higher end of those wages because his Medical Degree was from Harvard.

          • Ophelia Rump

            He sounds just like every swindler I have ever heard pitch a bogus claim.
            Big meaningless numbers out of context and flashing lights.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        Demonstrations are nice shows, but science usually recognizes third party validation reports more. This is to avoid fraud/fakery.

        Andrea Rossi is now on his 2nd validation….

        BLP has had many demonstrations actually, but here is a short list of some of their verifications we have seen over the years.

        http://www.blacklightpower.com/technology/validation-reports/

        Not only has he evaluated his tech via third parties continuously over the years, but they also have been giving demonstrations with the next one on the 21 of this month.

        They are moving fast.

        As far as Rossi goes, even his third party verifications have been under the agreement nobody actual open the device. I wonder how well the BLP verifications would have gotten with a no open clause.

        It is agreed he has raised 60-80 million dollars. It is also known that he has likely spent a fair portion of that in R&D.

        He started this company on his dime. He had a Theory that could give the world new energy so he went for it. He is still a Medical Doctor that could have earned Many millions just prescribing Viagra in his career.

        Skepticism regarding Mills is that he has thought he was close from the beginning and it was always a few years away. Now he is singing a new song, “It is here now” they now say.

        • Daniel Maris

          I’ve never seen a BLP demonstration of a scaled up machine that might mean something in the market in other words something on the scale of Rossi’s demonstration.

  • geewhiz

    You can’t possibly fit enough solar cells to power a vehicle in the little box he claims is going to power a car. Utter nonsense. Get a grip.

    • Mark Underwood

      These aren’t normal solar cells. They are concentrated photo voltaics, CPV. They are more efficient than normal solar cells (over 40 percent now) and can operate at hundreds of times the sun’s intensity at the earth’s surface. Consider that at the earth’s surface the sunlight has the power of about 1000 Watts per square meter. If you take at face value Mill’s estimate of the luminous power of the Suncell, combined with the wattage that CPVs can produce, you may see that it is not utter nonsense.

      • Ophelia Rump

        At what distance from the light source did he measure the intensity, at what distance from the light source will the panels be placed? If they are not the same distance, you have been deceived.

        At 1000 watts per square meter 1 inch from the light source there are only 24 square inches available to place solar cells ( a square meter is 1550 square inches), so you cannot capture the energy you do not have enough surface. In truth there is not enough light volume anyway.

        At one foot there are 24 square feet of surface available, but the light is now down to 6.94 watts per square meter. You only have 2 square meters of surface
        The same amount of light is present but in a greater area so less intense.

        You can gather about 14 watts at 100%
        So you can get 5.6 watts at 40% Where did the 1000 watts go? There never was 1000 Watts, because that figure of 1000 watts was the intensity in square meters. You only started with a spherical inch of that intensity, there never was a square meter of it.

        These figures are extremely generous, because I used a cube of twice the radius. except for six points the entire surface of that cube is progressively farther away as you move from the center of each square wall, and therefore the light intensity is diminished. It should actually be a sphere but I do not think anyone makes spherical solar cells.

        Do you see how the rabbit disappears now? This is how extremely intelligent and well educated people lie.

        Is he a liar? I do not know. I do not trust people who craft things so that I cannot tell. I can see the craft, the craft is obvious to me. I ask myself, why does he make such effort to craft his statements like this?

        What scientist uses intensities of the sun as a unit of measure for power production? Why in hell would anyone do that? If you cannot answer that question now, you should read this entire post again.

        • Excellent analysis.

          Another problem not mentioned: if the efficiency of the PVs is 40% that means that 60% of the energy arriving at the cells/panels will be converted to heat. So for every Watt of electrical power output, you would need to dump 1.5 Watts via some kind of cooling system built into the PVs. And that is not even considering the waste heat and other energetic outputs at the reactor core, which would also need dealing with.

          As such cooling systems would be absolutely essential, why bother with PV’s at all, rather than just collecting all output energy as heat in a coolant circulating through a casing with a black interior. Perhaps the answer is that full water cooling would allow accurate calorimetry, while messing around with PVs and LEDs will provide a pretty show but no real opportunity to measure output?

          This whole clumsy idea is simply a non-starter as a realistic compact power source. If (as it seems to be) this is the best engineering solution Mills can manage for harvesting energy from a plasma reactor then I can see why he has suffered so many ‘road blocks and impediments’.

          • Mark Underwood

            The CVPs have the heat dissipating mechanism built in. They are meant to operate for very long periods of time subject to concentrated sunlight and heat. That said, with the type of CVP collection Mills is planning, for sure there will have to be extra measures taken to deal with the heat.

            These days It is much simpler and also more efficient to convert light to electricity than to go the heat route. Yet because there will be significant heat involved no doubt BLP will be dialoging with firms who specialize in products which harvest waste heat, just as they are now doing with several photovoltaic firms.

            Solar CVP is the opposite of clumsy. Very high intensity light strikes it and a very large amount of electrical power comes out. Contrast this to huge steam turbines, miles of piping, etc.

          • Ophelia Rump

            Fantastic catch, Yes I had completely overlooked the waste heat problem.
            But then, I did not believe there was much heat or light.
            Yes, even if it worked, it would not work.

            We put that down like a rabid dog.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Are you two afraid the Solar Cells will melt or something? Why is it necessary to get so dramatic about venting some heat?

          • Mark Underwood

            Who is the moderator here, and where are my posts that I wrote about six hours ago?

          • artefact

            Frank (Acland) is the owner and moderator. He only deletes posts for good reasons. But often the automatic moderation hides posts until he looks them through.

          • Frank Acland

            Yes, this is true. Yesterday I was busy for a long time before I could get to checking the posts. And sometimes I sleep.

          • Mark Underwood

            Busyness and sleep are good. I don’t mind some delay. It was only when many more recent posts from others had appeared – and mine hadn’t – that I was starting to wonder if something was up. I’m figuring now that posts from certain people – probably regulars with good history – don’t have to get approved and appear immediately.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            I find the opposite. If you came in with a fresh account it rarely gets moderated, but now my three accounts are in use they all face moderation.

          • Omega Z

            Mark
            Even Regulars can get flagged. Depending on wording.
            I would NOTE, That sometimes the automated moderation seems to take on a life of it’s own. It will even argue with it’s Human controller. 🙂

          • Omega Z

            Shame on you Frank.
            Sleeping. Busy. These are not valid excuses.
            The Report may not be out for months.
            On the Other-hand, It could pop up at any moment, And “WE” would be unaware for Hours while your fooling around or sleeping. Likely you take time out to eat as well.

            I’m Greatly Disappointed that you would put yourself & health ahead of “US”.

            Kidding, Kidding, Your doing a great Job. I often wonder how you can keep up with everything.
            I’ve heard that Prior to E-Cat World, You operated an E-Clone World. Anything to that Frank-v1, or Frank-v2 or Frank-v3 ??

          • bachcole

            A maliciously worded comment will get tossed. Being skeptical is NOT a reason that a person will get tossed.

        • Mark Underwood

          I appreciate your rational approach Orphelia. Note that you are assuming the luminosity is from a point source, at the contact of the welding wheels. But it is an expanding ball of plasma, perhaps reaching a foot in diameter, which is the source of the luminosity.

          Yet even all that may be really beside the point. It may simply be that Mills is measuring the light intensity at one foot away from centre of the detonation, and is getting light intensity at its peak that is 10^4 times (or whatever it is) the intensity of sunlight striking the earth.

          Mills is planning on achieving a lot of detonations (on the order of 10^3) a second, to make that peak luminosity essentially continuous. So at 1 foot away the power would be 1000 W x 10^4 /m^2, or 10 mega watts /m^2, before losses. At one foot away the inner surface area of a sphere is about 12 square feet, roughly 1 m^2. So the power produced is 10 mega watts, before losses. Notch that down to 1 mega watts of actual extracted power after losses.

          I do see a few potential technical problems, such as how to physically achieve something like 10^3 detonations per second. The detonation rate at the demos certainly has room to increase, but the question is how high can it go before major problems set in.

          If Mills has a historical flaw, it is that he can be overly optimistic to the point of overlooking potential engineering and practical challenges which rear their heads later on, deterring engineering companies from taking the plunge and producing a marketable product.

          This time those challenges appear to be overcome, at the baby steps stage. But question becomes how fast will the child eventually run? I predict not nearly as fast as the good doctor has predicted, but I think the child will still be fast enough to handily win a race.

          • friendlyprogrammer

            Regarding the optimism.. lol
            Yes. Mills is claiming less than a year, when common sense dictates marketing patent pending devices worth Billions is likely not prudent.

            He applied for Global patents this year, so I predict nothing further (productwise) until 2017-18.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          We can imagine all the problems we like, but they seem very convinced they have landed the big one. If we can wait until June for the Ecat verification we can give these guys a few months to show us where they are.

      • Gerard McEk

        I still do not see this generating Mega Watts, Mark!

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Solar Cells powered by the sun run at only a small percentage of their capacity, and this effect is taking light energy 50-75 times brighter than the sun. Even if these devices are larger than a square foot, it is still impressive.

  • GreenWin

    Frankly, this sim has run out of steam. This is likely due to intelligence that has a poor or prejudiced understanding of human nature. It is a gladiator game run by people who, like overindulged solipsistic Romans, care only for spectacle, bloodlust, and conflict.

    It is a message from higher beings that you are a disposable amusement for lazy asses incapable of rigorous honesty. It is a niggardly artifice confirming higher intelligence is little different than bese Walmart shoppers looking for cheap footwear. Far from divine, these money changers hide behind wings of indulgence, narcissism and indifference. It is a supremely failed cosmic experiment no less exploitative than the human slavers of East Africa.

    Perhaps these wizards of modelling will quit their toy fire engines and sirens long enough to grok that contact and effective defense does not come cheap. Or without face to face honesty.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      This message (that has at least 3 thumbs up) makes absolutely no sense to me and I have somewhat strong language skills.

      This Sim has run out of steam….. (What?)

      What is likely due to intelligence that has a poor or prejudiced understanding of human nature?

      What is a gladiator game, and where is this bloodlust and what are you talking about here?

      What is a message from higher beings that we are disposable amusement for lazy asses incapable of rigorous honesty?

      Niggardly? Is that even a word we allow in our society? Sounds quite racist actually.

      What does “perhaps these wizards of modeling will quit their toy fire engines and sirens long enough to grok” mean?

      I cannot even understand this comment in context because you were not replying to anyone but the main article.

      It does make very little sense to me.

      • Alain Samoun

        He may have moved to Colorado or too many glasses of wine made him philosophical, I guess ;=)

    • Ophelia Rump

      You dated yourself when you quoted Heinlein. Everyone knows you should never date yourself. It always ends up a cheap date, where you become compromised and hate yourself in the morning for waking up with someone you would really rather not be with.

    • georgehants

      Greenwin
      Then on the other hand if one considers the Evidence for reincarnation, everything fits into place and the sense just screams at one.
      No more distress wondering about the purpose.
      Plenty of reasons to move on and follow and search only for Truth.
      Plenty of incentive for everyone to care about others and try to build a better World.

    • Hector McNuget

      Clarifications please! Is steam-making not goals of the free energy makers? if run out of steam why not make add more water? Greenwin you make sound angry. Anger lead to hate. Hate lead to suffering.

    • US_Citizen71

      :’Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition of man. Advances which permit this norm to be exceeded–here and there, now and then–are the work of an extremely small minority, frequently despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes happens) is driven out of a society, the people then slip back into abject poverty. This is known as “bad luck.”’ – Lazarus Long

      • bachcole

        This is absolutely, positively no reason why everyone cannot live at the level of prosperity that I live at, EXCEPT we must live in balance with nature.

  • friendlyprogrammer

    Maybe if you/Rossi told Mills that 20 years ago he would have got here in half the time.

  • Owen Geiger

    “Andrea Rossi should fold up shop, because this is already real and quite viable…”
    Thanks for the chuckle.

  • friendlyprogrammer

    Too bad it was not clarity of reading/listening you sensed.

    The comment you are referring to says the effect is 50 000 times brighter than the sun. This is not how I heard the facts. I heard him say 50-75 times brighter. You are commenting on someone off by a thousandfold.

    Maybe its lack of clarity you detected.

  • Barry8

    It’s not too late friendlyprogrammer to change your bet to “Powder Grey”.

    .Mills demos have been a let down. 97% words, 3% same old crude plasma burst. They remind me of the “Popper” (see minutes 21 – 21:30) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zWJNyoFgJM
    I’m willing to bet if you put a solar collector on the bottom of this you could run a string of LED lights.

    • Fortyniner

      … for the few minutes before any optical surfaces become coated with condensed residues from the welder arcs, or the copper electrode wheels get covered in similar muck and can no longer conduct enough power.

  • Omega Z

    “They are so much simpler”
    Obviously, You Have Never Tried To Find A Short In One. 🙂
    It’s always the last wire.

  • Ophelia Rump

    At what distance from the light source did he measure the value, at what distance from the light source will the panels be placed? If they are not the same distance, you have been deceived.

    • Fortyniner

      Another problem not mentioned: if the efficiency of the PVs is 40% that means that 60% of the energy arriving at the cells/panels will be converted to heat. So for every Watt of electrical power output, you would need to dump 1.5 Watts via some kind of cooling system built into the PVs. And that is not even considering the waste heat and other energetic outputs at the reactor core, which would also need dealing with.

      As such cooling systems would be absolutely essential, why bother with PV’s at all. Perhaps the answer is that full water cooling would allow accurate calorimetry, while messing around with PVs and LEDs will provide a pretty show but no real opportunity to measure output?

      This whole clumsy idea is simply a non-starter as a realistic compact power source. If (as it seems to be) this is the best engineering solution Mills can manage for harvesting energy from a plasma reactor then I can see why he has suffered so many ‘road blocks’ and setbacks.

      • Ophelia Rump

        Fantastic catch, Yes I had completely overlooked the waste heat problem.

        • artefact

          Frank (Acland) is the owner and moderator. He only deletes posts for good reasons. But often the automatic moderation hides posts until he looks them through.

          • ecatworld

            Yes, this is true. Yesterday I was busy for a long time before I could get to checking the posts. And sometimes I sleep.

          • Omega Z

            Shame on you Frank.
            Sleeping. Busy. These are not valid excuses.
            The Report may not be out for months.
            On the Other-hand, It could pop up at any moment, And “WE” would be unaware for Hours while your fooling around or sleeping. Likely you take time out to eat as well.

            I’m Greatly Disappointed that you would put yourself & health ahead of “US”.

            Kidding, Kidding, Your doing a great Job. I often wonder how you can keep up with everything.
            I’ve heard that Prior to E-Cat World, You operated an E-Clone World. Anything to that Frank-v1, or Frank-v2 or Frank-v3 ??

          • Omega Z

            He once used a cell very much like Rossi’s. NI/H
            I think he experienced what many others run into. High gains at short longevity or Longevity with small gains. High gains & longevity seem elusive without Rossi’s catalyst.

            Thus he has taken a different route & Last I recall, his new process uses Molybdenum, So yes, a different hydrate formula.

  • Omega Z

    I know exactly what he meant. Freely, Until gas got so expensive people started using locking gas caps. 🙂

  • Omega Z

    250W peak
    That is rated according to what you can expect from a sunshine point of view. By using mirrors or lenses(Think Magnifying glass) you can increase output. You also increase the heat which isn’t wanted.

  • Ophelia Rump

    You dated yourself when you quoted Heinlein. Everyone knows you should never date yourself. It always ends up a cheap date, where you become compromised and hate yourself in the morning for waking up with someone you would really rather not be with.

  • georgehants

    Greenwin
    Then on the other hand if one considers reincarnation, everything fits into place and the sense just screams at one.
    No more distress wondering about the purpose.
    Plenty of reasons to move on and follow and search only for Truth.
    Plenty of incentive for everyone to care about others and try to build a better World.

  • Gerard McEk

    I still do not see this generating Mega Watts, Mark!

  • georgehants

    Interesting that there are always a number of commenters on page who seem to actually think that if they believe or disbelieve in something it has some meaning as to if that something is True or not.
    They do not seem to quite realise that their “opinions” do not have the slightest effect on the situation.
    Speaking classically of course.

    • Daniel Maris

      There seems to be at least one commenter who thinks he is more intelligent and perceptive than others here but is there any evidence for that belief? Speaking classically of course.

      • georgehants

        Why would you think you are that person, do not worry you are not to bad.
        The Truth always upsets a few people, just par for the course.
        Happy days.

        • Job001

          I’m not big on Truth which varies by perceiver and perspective. It is good for some things like starting wars, confirming ones biases and beliefs, and preventing scientific research and progress. 😉

          • georgehants

            Job, I agree that many people do like to make out that the truth is difficult to find.
            I always wonder why when a court of law has perfectly simple ways of ascertaining Truth if possible.
            One usually finds such people just have difficulty in excepting the simple Truth when it disagrees with their own distorted beliefs or desires.

      • Fortyniner

        “at least one…” You jest sir – that’s the norm not the exception. Why else would we continually bore one another with our opinionated maunderings, if not because we are all under the peculiar delusion that what we say is actually worth saying.

        • Omega Z

          I have No peculiar delusion that what I say is actually worth saying.
          That’s why I just type it. That way they don’t have to hear it.
          🙂

    • Ophelia Rump

      Such a pleasant way to incite a riot.

  • georgehants

    Interesting that there are always a number of commenters on page who seem to actually think that if they believe or disbelieve in something it has some meaning as to if that something is True or not.
    They do not seem to quite realise that their “opinions” do not have the slightest effect on the situation.
    Speaking classically of course.

    • Hector McNuget

      I admit mostly making the confusion here, but I preceive georgehants to be the perceptive-type. He sees the incites through the sciences of many fields, and makes clearly best of opinions on topics needing to researched. Is georgehants big sciencetist? If so – why not?

    • Ophelia Rump

      Such a pleasant way to incite a riot.

  • Paul

    Obviously, in LENR the info we read on the web are only the top of the iceberg. Most of the research is secret (big or medium-size companies) or top secret (military). Also the most open scientists in LENR keep for themselves at least the most important details, as I know for direct experience. There is also a growing role of hacking to obtain illegally infos, so in current age no secret is more completely sure. This could make the LENR revolution quite faster than if had happened in the past, for example 20 years ago. US and Chinese governments have excellent battallions of hackers, but Russia and other countries too are competitive in this field. Today, also private companies could consider hacking for grabbing industrial infos, while others use traditional methods (for example, see products or person or partial infos, promise a lot of money but finally not sign a contract or pay the person).

    • Ophelia Rump

      I would not be surprised if you are correct.
      I would also not be surprised if more than one hacker has already died from self inflicted neutron bombardment, like a monkey with a hand grenade.

      • optiongeek

        You sound like that isn’t a serious issue with LENR. I’m not familiar enough with recent research to know the answer to this, but is there really enough radiation generated in LENR to be a source of significant harm? To me that suggests a fatal flaw, the nuclear industry we know today would never be reinvented given the information we now have about contamination risk. Hot fusion has an even bigger issue with contamination risks associated with confinement loss.

        • Ophelia Rump

          Oh, perhaps you mistook my stance. I do very much believe that there are potentially extremely hazardous, deadly, and badda big boom! forms of LENR. If a researcher knew enough to avoid such a mistake, they might know enough to cause someone who stole their honey pot formula to build one of the subtly deadly variety.

  • Ophelia Rump

    He was being grand eloquent, I was able to understand, but it took all the effort I could muster, like reading Jame Joyce’s Ulysses. Far too much craft and background packed into a tiny package. Supreme density.

  • otto1923

    Serendipitous. If this thing works out, we find that just when we have a new energy source we just happen to have the ideal way of converting it to useful form. Its like when we find we need an internet-driven digital age we just happen to have the computer tech to make it possible.
    If youre like me and you believe that nothing of consequence ever happens by itself, then youve got to believe that this energy source was sitting waiting for the ancillary tech to catch up. And also for the world to be rearranged to make safe for this tech to emerge.
    Mills didnt discover it. Mills is being allowed to develop it the way Jobs and Gates were chosen to do what they did. The way that Malthus was tasked to inform the world of something that the people who actually run it had known full well for millenia.
    How would cars have operated without headlights? Ask Henry Ford and Thomas Edison. Did headlights enable cars or were electric lights actually invented a long long time ago? Was nuclear power allowed to emerge just after the world was rearranged to make it safe to do so? Was napoleons great euro purge done to prepare the world for capitalism and the industrial revolution?

    But then maybe it wont work out. Guess we’ll find out.

    • Ophelia Rump

      Somehow your reasoning seems to have reversed cause and effect.
      This is very dangerous to the fabric of the universe.

      To Ophelia Rump, In care of otto1923.
      __________________________________
      Please pass this on to otto1923 for us.

      Regarding the just happen to have an internet portion of your statement. Trust us a lot of people spent lifetimes for that to just happen. We thank you though, we like it when people see it as PFM. we are sort of magical.

      Love, The Internet.

      • Otto1913

        No, I think the CAUSE is the desired EFFECT. Humans are planners. It’s what we do. We were selected for it. Those tribes whose leaders were better at anticipating what their adversaries would do, would prevail in competition.

        I don’t think leaders would allow the most dangerous things to happen by themselves. Wars can be planned and their results predetermined. And so NOT to plan them would be suicidal. It’s the same with tech development. They’re closely related.

        Things like the internet CANNOT be the incidental result of computer tech. It is too significant. The tech had to be developed over many gens of real-world production and use. The internet could not have been the effect of PCs – it had to be the CAUSE for their development.

        • Ophelia Rump

          My first computer had no hard drive, and no communications.
          I saved up and bought a hard drive so I would not have to rewrite the programs from scratch every time I wanted to run them.
          I then saved up for a 300 bit per minute modem, That is 75 characters per minute. There was no internet at the time and you had to find someone to call to download data, like a seller of stock ticker data.

          It was amazing and thrilling, there was barely networking, internet was an outgrowth of the desire to do more with the device, an N-squared cross-linking. It was inevitable, it was demand driven, it could well have been preconceived, but that is irrelevant. Most of the contributors never knew of any preconception, they just wanted more.

      • Otto1923

        Dear internet
        Don’t you think you were anticipated? Envisioned? The transformation from analog to digital was inevitable and absolutely essential. Of course it was going to take a lot of work and a lot of people buying gadgets they didn’t need. But thanks for all your efforts.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          The Internet is more amazing than I ever thought possible as a child. I recall my mother typing a question to our 16k TRS-80 (old computer – preinternet), “Can you tell us what to do?”, and the computer just responded “Syntax Error”, but nowadays the computer can often answer questions if we are online or have good software.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Yes. Mills is only taking advantage of Solar Cells which have been in development for over 100 years.

  • kofot

    Well, sounds to good to be true….

    But please prove me wrong.

  • Chuck Valdez

    Dr. Mills has understood the magnitude of his discovery since announcing it to the world at a press conference Apr 1991 in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. There he noted that the recent cold fusion energy source was very likely a non-nuclear chemical reaction producing… you guessed it… Hydrinos! Within days, Robert Park chimes in on his APS “Whats new” newsletter to give the first of a recurring series of nasty personal attacks and flip dismissals of Randell Mills. The thing that the critics are missing in their crankiness is that this didn’t develop the way we all imagine science should progress. In a perfect world, other researchers would have helped the nascent science along but instead, it was up to Blacklight Power to slog it out changing the direction of the research every 3-5 yrs as is common with brand new, paradigm shattering science. The fascinating part is that this discovery was conceived and developed by one creative and brilliant mind battling uphill most of the way and I assure you, It will change EVERYTHING. From energy to cosmology to medicine to materials science. This is the starting point of the next fertile period of discovery and innovation. I only hope humanity is worthy of the gift.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Nice comment. I agree they are progressing logically. If LENR is Hydrinos though then LENR is chemical so we will all be in for tongue lashings from the correct skeptics we have been battling for years.

      Yes. It will change everything and it will be like the first decades of electricity. Inventions came out of the woodwork back then as lighting was not the only potential for electricity. Now we will see a storm of inventions that require off grid electricity.

      We will see flying cars, blimps, outdoor restaurants in the snow, cruise ships that are also hydrofoils, and so much more. We will see clean air globally as smog becomes a memory.

      We might even see Reagans Star Wars defense plan realized.

      So many possibilities

      • Omega Z

        Star Wars defense has always focused around the limited energy source. Always about getting the most out of the least available energy.
        Once you can continuously produce a couple hundred megawatts within a meter3 then Tera-watt lasers become available in very short order. Cloud interference & mirrored surfaces become negligible. Military will be all over it. Energy shields will be the next big military goal. NASA would be in on this shield research as well.

        • Otto1923

          When pons and fleishman were discounted, the US navy quietly began experimenting with it. What other agencies were experimenting with it that we don’t know about? Has Mills been quiet these 20 years because all the potential applications had to be thoroughly investigated before it was allowed to be released? Again – did the world need to be prepared for free energy so that free energy would not critically destabilize it?
          NO TECH BEFORE ITS TIME.
          “There is a Time for everything
          And a Season for every activity under the heavens.” Ecc3

          • friendlyprogrammer

            I recall Nicola Tesla was supposed to have powered an electric car with the use of a tiny box at great speeds. Too bad that time never came as we could have foregone global warming and fossil fuels.

          • Omega Z

            There’s been soft data on this phenomenon since at least 1920.
            While following the Rossi saga, I have come across info that indicates the U.S. Military became very interested in this field around 1962. Stumbled on would be accurate description. It concerned problems within some of their specialty electrical components. Excess heat where there was no explanation for it.

            Just speculating, but it could be that P&F were detoured to delay disclosure of this phenomenon before certain entities wanted it know. Wouldn’t be the 1st time they’ve hidden or delayed certain technology.

        • friendlyprogrammer

          Let’s hope suppression is not the recommended military course of action. They can park the lasers next to Stan Meyers tanks.

          wikipedia – Stanley Meyer died suddenly on March 20, 1998 after dining at a restaurant. His brother claimed that during a meeting with two Belgian investors in a restaurant, Meyer suddenly ran outside, saying “They poisoned me”.[1] After an investigation, the Grove City police went with the Franklin County coroner report that ruled that Meyer, who had high blood pressure, died of a cerebral aneurysm.[1] Meyer’s supporters continued to claim that he was assassinated in order to suppress his inventions

          • Omega Z

            I think Delaying is more likely then suppression this time around.
            Likely they have something even more advanced tucked away. It’s their goal to be at least 1 step ahead in the research then where society stands.

      • Otto1923

        Rossis LENR produces heat while hydrinos produce light and plasma, which complement each other very nicely. And why can’t hydrino plasma be accelerated and directed with superconducting magnets powered be light-generated electricity? Can hydrino and VASIMR tech be combined?

        • friendlyprogrammer

          I am sure we will learn many ways to harness energy in the near future based upon LENR or Hydrino Theories. Once one of these alternative energies becomes accepted it will affect Trillions of dollars in R&D.

          Let’s just get one mainstream for now.

    • Otto1923

      1991. We could have had vids of his process back then in some form or another. But he waits 20 years before offering his crude copper wheel demo and then immediately finds a way of harnessing the output with solar cells. If hydrinos are real now they were real back then. Why did he wait? He was waiting for the world to be changed. Petrodollars are no longer needed to manage the Middle East. The world is almost ready for free energy… only a few more wars, a few more cultures destroyed…

      • tlp

        All great inventions are not invented before they were invented…
        Mills invented hydrinos 20 years ago, but invented how to produce them efficiently just recently.

        • Otto1923

          Has his hydrate formula changed in 20 years? And the copper wheel and hopper feed is not something which took 20 years to think up or perfect. The only thing ‘new’ is the solar cells. This reminds me of how Bussard sat on polywell for a decade or 2.

          • Mark Underwood

            It’s totally new methodology, passing extremely high current through a water/catalyst mixture, resulting in a detonation. This previous attempts to initiate the hydrino reaction were chemical in nature.

          • Otto1923

            And so it took 20 years for them to try electricity? I don’t buy it. And a link to this molybdenum development would be helpful. Did the process not work without it or was it an improvement?

          • tlp

            They have tried electricity, but it is not so obvious that “hey, lets try with some 10000-20000 amps” in a laboratory. I think it is less than a year since they have tried with those welding machines, at least publicly. And solar technology usage is invented after January demo. And of course they have been able to optimize materials only after these fundamental changes.

          • Mark Underwood

            Exactly. Also, Mills was asked what got him to try such an implausible path of high amperage, low voltage. He replied it was the result of reflecting on theory. The guy is smart.

          • deleo77

            Mills needed time to get a higher energy density out of his hydrinos. That is what took so long, not to see the effect, but to get to an energy density that would be useful. He got there in January, but they realized that the energy was occurring in the form of light, not heat. So he switched course to PV cells for electricity generation. It is not that crazy of a scenario.

          • Chuck Valdez

            Precisely. The progression of experimental setup went from nickel electrodes in aqueous electrolysis, then gas phase plasma where the light emitted could be studied for clues to the reaction. Both these embodiments were very low power which probably ticked Mills off since he knew he was dealing with a process of approx 100 eV per transition while ordinary chemical reactions only involve a few electron volt of energy. The trick would be to find a way to increase the rate. Although electrolysis and plasma cells were not suitable for further development they did provide useful clues to understanding this new field of science that will give hydrogen much greater respect in the periodic table. Yeah, I know hydrogen is first, but everyone says he’s the simplest.That’s gotta sting!

            Hydrogen may be a lightweight but Randell Mills will show all of us how deep he really goes.

          • Omega Z

            He once used a cell very much like Rossi’s. NI/H
            I think he experienced what many others run into. High gains at short longevity or Longevity with small gains. High gains & longevity seem elusive without Rossi’s catalyst.

            Thus he has taken a different route & Last I recall, his new process uses Molybdenum, So yes, a different hydrate formula.

          • Chuck Valdez

            The use of water as the reaction catalyst is only a few years old. His original catalysts were potassium salts in aqueous electrolysis cells and later added helium and strontium when the research switched to low pressure (few torr) gas phase studies.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        BLP has a long list of papers, and third party validations. Before videos some people used to read. He even published a book about this before he started.

        What’s the complaint?

  • Ophelia Rump

    Oh, perhaps you mistook my stance. I do very much believe that there are potentially extremely hazardous, deadly, and badda big boom! forms of LENR. If a researcher knew enough to avoid such a mistake, they might know enough to cause someone who stole their honey pot formula to build one of the subtly deadly variety.

  • Ophelia Rump

    Somehow your reasoning seems to have reversed cause and effect.
    This is very dangerous to the fabric of the universe.

    Regarding the just happen to have an internet portion. Trust me a lot of people spent lifetimes for that to just happen. We thank you though, we like it when people see it as PFM. It is sort of magical.

    • Otto1913

      No, I think the CAUSE is the desired EFFECT. Humans are planners. It’s what we do. We were selected for it. Those tribes whose leaders were better at anticipating what their adversaries would do, would prevail in competition.

      I don’t think leaders would allow the most dangerous things to happen by themselves. Wars can be planned and their results predetermined. And so NOT to plan them would be suicidal. It’s the same with tech development. They’re closely related.

      Things like the internet CANNOT be the incidental result of computer tech. It is too significant. The tech had to be developed over many gens of real-world production and use. The internet could not have been the effect of PCs – it had to be the CAUSE for their development.

      • Ophelia Rump

        My first computer had no hard drive, and no communications.
        I saved up and bought a hard drive so I would not have to rewrite the programs from scratch every time I wanted to run them.
        I then saved up for a 300 bit per minute modem, That is 75 characters per minute. There was no internet at the time and you had to find someone to call to download data, like a seller of stock ticker data.

        It was amazing and thrilling, there was barely networking, internet was an outgrowth of the desire to do more with the device, an N-squared cross-linking. It was inevitable, it was demand driven, it could well have been preconceived, but that is irrelevant. Most of the contributors never knew of any preconception, they just wanted more.

  • Alain Samoun

    He may be in Colorado or too many glasses of wine made him philosophical, I guess ;=)

  • Barry8

    Friendly, it seems you have more belief in Mills and I do in Rossi. It’s not so much a need for a demo from Blacklight as the demos they say they will be putting out have been let downs. My hope in Mills waned two “demos” ago.

    Rossi’s third party verification in 2013 was, for me, quite satisfying and the 2014 one is about to come out, but most of all, whether it’s verified or not, Rossi is right, the truth will be in the market.

    Like Mike Mckubre said, “When one wins we all win”. Perhaps I’ll be proven wrong, but I just don’t believe it will be Mills.

  • georgehants

    Roger as on many occasions you are confused.
    One can take any subject, let’s say Cold Fusion and immediately start talking about the involved philosophy and intricate science of that subject.
    On the other hand one can just sensibly talk about the simple subject of Cold Fusion in an everyday sense.
    Some people have trouble facing the Truth and will always try to make out, as in your comment above that that it is not simple, in that any of the examples you give above have to be allowed for.
    Does BLP have the goods is the question today, in time we will find out and your pointless examples above will not alter that situation one iota.

  • Fortyniner

    A number of more open-minded physicists seem to agree on that, and as a non-physicist I’m happy to accept that his theories may have merit. His unsupported hype and his unimpressive experiments are another matter.

  • artefact

    The interview with some pictures and a summary is no on PESN:
    http://pesn.com/2014/07/12/9602517_Landmark-Interview_with_Randell-Mills_Blacklight-Power/

    • artefact

      no -> now

  • artefact

    The interview with some pictures and a summary is no on PESN:
    http://pesn.com/2014/07/12/9602517_Landmark-Interview_with_Randell-Mills_Blacklight-Power/

    • artefact

      no -> now

    • bachcole

      It’s too painful and embarrassing for me to read and watch a second time.

  • Otto1923

    1991. We could have had vids of his process back then in some form or another. But he waits 20 years before offering his crude copper wheel demo and then immediately finds a way of harnessing the output with solar cells. If hydrinos are real now they were real back then. Why did he wait? He was waiting for the world to be changed. Petrodollars are no longer needed to manage the Middle East. The world is almost ready for free energy… only a few more wars, a few more cultures destroyed…

    • tlp

      All great inventions are not invented before they were invented…
      Mills invented hydrinos 20 years ago, but invented how to produce them efficiently just recently.

  • Omega Z

    Star Wars defense has always focused around the limited energy source. Always about getting the most out of the least available energy.
    Once you can continuously produce a couple hundred megawatts within a meter3 then Tera-watt lasers become available in very short order. Cloud interference & mirrored surfaces become negligible. Military will be all over it. Energy shields will be the next big military goal. NASA would be in on this shield research as well.

    • Otto1923

      When pons and fleishman were discounted, the US navy quietly began experimenting with it. What other agencies were experimenting with it that we don’t know about? Has Mills been quiet these 20 years because all the potential applications had to be thoroughly investigated before it was allowed to be released? Again – did the world need to be prepared for free energy so that free energy would not critically destabilize it?
      NO TECH BEFORE ITS TIME.
      “There is a Time for everything
      And a Season for every activity under the heavens.” Ecc3

      • Omega Z

        There’s been soft data on this phenomenon since at least 1920.
        While following the Rossi saga, I have come across info that indicates the U.S. Military became very interested in this field around 1962. Stumbled on would be accurate description. It concerned problems within some of their specialty electrical components. Excess heat where there was no explanation for it.

        Just speculating, but it could be that P&F were detoured to delay disclosure of this phenomenon before certain entities wanted it know. Wouldn’t be the 1st time they’ve hidden or delayed certain technology.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Let’s hope suppression is not the recommended military course of action. They can park the lasers next to Stan Meyers tanks.

      wikipedia – Stanley Meyer died suddenly on March 20, 1998 after dining at a restaurant. His brother claimed that during a meeting with two Belgian investors in a restaurant, Meyer suddenly ran outside, saying “They poisoned me”.[1] After an investigation, the Grove City police went with the Franklin County coroner report that ruled that Meyer, who had high blood pressure, died of a cerebral aneurysm.[1] Meyer’s supporters continued to claim that he was assassinated in order to suppress his inventions

      • Omega Z

        I think Delaying is more likely then suppression this time around.
        Likely they have something even more advanced tucked away. It’s their goal to be at least 1 step ahead in the research then where society stands.

  • Omega Z

    Mark
    Even Regulars can get flagged. Depending on wording.
    I would NOTE, That sometimes the automated moderation seems to take on a life of it’s own. It will even argue with it’s Human controller. 🙂

  • Tim

    So can I get a device to power my house soon? How much would it cost?

    • Omega Z

      Tim
      You know what they say, If you have to ask, you probably can’t afford it.

  • Tim

    So can I get a device to power my house soon? How much would it cost?

    • Omega Z

      Tim
      You know what they say, If you have to ask, you probably can’t afford it.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Soon. Despite the excitement they still need to wait 3 years for patent to be approved if they even approve it. Then the majority of units would likely be used to provide grid energy while automotive companies bid to adapt it. Grid prices of electricity will start to fall and production of units scaled down for home use will likely surface in black markets before official manufacturers can meet demands.

      I think oil will be forced to lower in prices to compete with this device, and deter people from buying electric cars and trucks.

      (does this device have a name?)

      Soon enough manufacturing of these devices will take on an unprecedented pace and we will all have mostly free energy. BLP will income over patents for 20 years or so and then the tech will become open source.

      The middle east will be forced to play nice once it’s oil money washes away, and perhaps might educate their citizens with more prudence. Education trumps ignorance.

      • Omega Z

        As Electric replaces Oil, Oil will degrease in demand along with the price. Eventually, there will be an equilibrium. Likely much lower then most realize. Cheap energy will make extracting & Processing of oil cheaper. However, I suspect when oil becomes cheaper, they will find new feed stock uses for it gradually pushing prices up & in turn pushing the hold-ons to buy electric vehicles.

        Hold-ons being those who find gasoline cheap enough to nullify the need or cost/benefit to go electric.

  • US_Citizen71

    :’Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition of man. Advances which permit this norm to be exceeded–here and there, now and then–are the work of an extremely small minority, frequently despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes happens) is driven out of a society, the people then slip back into abject poverty. This is known as “bad luck.”’ – Lazarus Long

  • Omega Z

    I’ve built racing engines. I’m fully aware.
    Note I was a fan of Electric cars long before it was fashionable.
    I used to pi$$ my son off when I’d tell him that an electric car had the potential to blow any combustion engine off the road. They don’t fly apart after 7K rpm.

    My Reference to wiring. Was once my & another persons job to find a short in a specialty motor home. No schems. Hundreds of wires totaling over 10 miles of wire. As we were about to get started, I joking Grab a specific wire & said this is it. I dropped it & we got started. 16 hours later we came to the last wire. Yep. That 1. It was the shorted wire. 🙁

    Best practices, Always start with the last wire.

  • Omega Z

    I think it will all likely be computer controlled. The masses have trouble with cars & 4 directions. Going 360×360 & they be falling out of the skies like rain drops. Big rain drops. You think hail hurts. Wow, They gonna hurt.

    By flyways, I’m talking pretty much as we have except without the need for pavement. It won’t be line of sight probably even in the rural areas. this is already regulated for aircraft & would be updated for flying cars. In some locals, helicopters have to come in and just as if they were an airplane. Following the runway & all.

    Note: I’m keen on the Ionic Idea. I’ve wondered about the weight ratio situation. I’m glad to see someone else thinking outside the box in this area.

  • Omega Z

    Sorry backcole
    Your supposed to assume the caveat that I also don’t support those of a certain nature. 🙂

    • Ophelia Rump

      Only reason can impress me, I am uncivilized.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        If only reason impresses you then fringe science is not the greatest place to look for it. Instead try accepted Mainstream textbooks.

        Most of these topics here from Andrea Rossi to Blacklight Power need to be investigated from an overall standpoint because if any of these had 100% solid replications then they would be in Nature Journal.

        The Fact Randell Mills is a real life Medical Doctor trained to use a stethoscope and prescribe aspirin is a clue to me that his interest in this pursuit is likely not profiteering. A Harvard educated Medical Doctor can usually make a very good living without resorting to fraud.

        Then you look at things like claims and logical progressions.

        If you are to investigate put on your Sherlock Holmes hat and do so..

        Look at Rossi. Just a few short years ago Defkalion offered Andrea Rossi $15 000 000 for a continued partnership if Andrea Rossi could run the ecat for 48 hours. Andrea Rossi could not meet that stability requirement at the time and so the deal was never struck.

        Yet now the ecat has been measured to not only run for at least three days, but they needed to shut it off manually after that length of time.

        It is a logical progression.

        Imagine for a second it was fraud. Why would the fraudulent ecat run so much longer now than in 2011? Is his fraudery improving? Progression makes sense.

        I might not even believe in Rossi if we did not know that at least 20 other major corporations have working LENR devices, and those are just the ones who admit it on that iceburg.

        Mills was also on a Hydrogen/Nickel/Lithium direction, but has PROGRESSED.

        I understand being impressed by reason, but not all reasoning comes from the math. The ability to read between the lines is required.

  • friendlyprogrammer

    I had a few exchanges with Dr. Mills.

    “The July 21 demonstration is about continuous ignition and the technology for synchronous regeneration of the fuel. We will also show production of electricity using solar cells. The last step will be to show the ignition powered from the electricity from the solar cells. This will be shown in the following demonstration.”

    I then asked ,”How do you keep the optical parts of this clean in operation, wouldn’t they become dirty?”

    Answer was, “That will be part of the technology demonstration on July 21st.”.

    I actually have been impressed by the demos contrary to popular opinion it seems. It will be interesting.

    • deleo77

      I thought BLP’s demo in January was a bit of a joke, and I wrote them off (like a few other people here), but this latest demo in June was great. I think people here view Mills as the “boy who cried wolf”. He has been a big talker, making grandiose statements for way too long now. So why believe him this time? I get that. But if you look at BLP they have gone step by step from theory to experimentation, to validation. If BLP can produce continuous light from water and then use PV cells to produce electricity, they may finally be on to something big.

      If I were to handicap this horse race, I would say that IH has a good chance of being a heating company and BLP will be an electric company. BLP has potentially found a way to product electricity with very few moving parts. No turbines needed. That is the game changer.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        IF BLP works as claimed then LENR will be a subject in school, but with no need to actually make a device. The BLP Suncell could provide equal heat in a much smaller space just by powering heaters.

  • tlp

    They have tried electricity, but it is not so obvious that “hey, lets try with some 10000-20000 amps” in a laboratory. I think it is less than a year since they have tried with those welding machines, at least publicly. And solar technology usage is invented after January demo. And of course they have been able to optimize materials only after these fundamental changes.

  • Omega Z

    As Electric replaces Oil, Oil will degrease in demand along with the price. Eventually, there will be an equilibrium. Likely much lower then most realize. Cheap energy will make extracting & Processing of oil cheaper. However, I suspect when oil becomes cheaper, they will find new feed stock uses for it gradually pushing prices up & in turn pushing the hold-ons to buy electric vehicles.

    Hold-ons being those who find gasoline cheap enough to nullify the need or cost/benefit to go electric.

  • Omega Z

    Would you believe I have auto correct & it changed it?

    Well it was worth a shot. 🙂

  • friendlyprogrammer

    Does this device have a name? Maybe if we as a group could come up with a few really great names we could propose them to BLP?

    • deleo77

      I believe they call it a SunCell.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        Thanks.. We could do better..

  • deleo77

    I believe they call it a SunCell.

  • deleo77

    I thought BLP’s demo in January was a bit of a joke, and I wrote them off (like a few other people here), but this latest demo in June was great. I think people here view Mills as the “boy who cried wolf”. He has been a big talker, making grandiose statements for way too long now. So why believe him this time? I get that. But if you look at BLP they have gone step by step from theory to experimentation, to validation. If BLP can produce continuous light from water and then use PV cells to produce electricity, they may finally be on to something big.

    If I were to handicap this horse race, I would say that IH has a good chance of being a heating company and BLP will be an electric company. BLP has potentially found a way to product electricity with very few moving parts. No turbines needed. That is the game changer.

  • bachcole

    Doesn’t the US government have a laboratory that studies the fusion potential of extremely high currents and I presume high voltages? I am almost positive that this is the case. Apparently they are not having any more success than any of the other hot-fusion projects.. How is this any different from BLP?

  • deleo77

    Mills needed time to get a higher energy density out of his hydrinos. That is what took so long, not to see the effect, but to get to an energy density that would be useful. He got there in January, but they realized that the energy was occurring in the form of light, not heat. So he switched course to PV cells for electricity generation. It is not that crazy of a scenario.

  • Investor

    As one of those “gullible” investors in Blacklight I can say with some confidence that the SunCell works as stated. You can read the papers online. I recommend “H2O-Based Solid Fuel Power Source Based on the Catalysis of H by HOH Catalyst”. The COP in the paper is shown as about 6 but it is now close to 100 with recent advances. It did take a long time to get here but it started with a rewrite of physics and chemistry – not exactly a small task. It has been validated by outside independent parties and physicists. When you actually sit down with Mills with other excellent scientists in the room, it is clear very quickly he knows more and understands more deeply than anyone else. Therefore don’t look foolish by publishing glib critiques. Mills has thought through everything thoroughly. He did take several pathways to commercialization that did not work well enough, but that is the process of invention. He has published papers on each path he experimented with and they make an interesting read. Some of his earlier work, especially in solid fuels, will have other application. The underlying science was always correct.
    Just to note, I understand Rossi ( who has yet to really state clearly what he is doing) is now using a lithium catalyst which Mills was experimenting with a decade ago. My guess is Rossi is producing some excess heat and hydrinos but he will face similar issues as Mills with that approach. At any rate, since that technology is now in the public domain, due to Mills’ publications, Rossi’s device is not patentable at any basic scientific level (eg. composition of matter patent) except perhaps as a machine which can be easily designed around. That is good news for anyone wanting to produce heat.

    • HiggsField

      Any news from todays demo?

  • HiggsField

    Any news from todays demo?