Overunity Product on Market At Last? Steorn’s Orbo O-Cube Webinar (Video and Transcript now Available)

It’s been over five years since Steorn has made any direct effort to engage with the public, and most people who heard about them in the days when their strategy was to ‘upset science’ with their claims of free energy have probably assumed that they have faded into ignonimity as their technology has never yet seen the light of day.

But Steorn is coming back into the public eye. In less than 24 hours now, they will host the first in a series of webinars scheduled for Wednesday, Oct 28th at 7:00 p.m. GMT to introduce their latest device: the Orbo O-Cube, which they say is a device that charge mobile devices via a USB connection, without ever having to be recharged itself.

How can they do this? They say with their Orbo technology, which they claim operates when certain magnetic interactions produce a gain of energy. The O-Cube is apparently a solid state device with no moving parts that needs no input power to produce energy, and that can somehow recharge itself — certainly a provocative claim.

Could this be LENR? Steorn has never use that term, and actually they have never really claimed to know where the excess energy comes from — but some theorists propose that LENR is essentially an electromagnetic phenomenon, so perhaps if Orbo works as claimed, it is a form of LENR.

Anyway, setting aside theory and definitions, the interesting thing here is Steorn is now saying they will be offering an overunity product to the public — apparently this year, and these webinars are designed to bring attention to this product. A working product on the market, rather than theories, tests and replications, is really the only thing that most people care about. If Steorn has what they say, and people can buy the product, then this would certainly be a milestone.

Steorn’s only web presence these days is via this Orbo Facebook page. Today this comment was posted:

“we will be releasing details regarding pricing etc during tomorrows webinar. If you cant get a chance to see it we will be posting the video on our Facebook page the day after.”

So I’m very interested to learn more about the O-Cube. I’m registered for the webinar and I plan on sharing key points live on this post once it gets started. If possible, I’ll also order an O-Cube so I can give it a thorough testing, and report what I find.

UPDATE: Oct 28th, 2015

Live comments from the webinar will start here:

http://app.webinarjam.net/live/19428/91401be0a7/0/vc10503962Ps

Starting out with some Steorn history review. Shaun McCarthy, Mike Daly and others. Now the guy from Slattery’s pub is talking.

Now he’s talking with Pat Corbett, a major Steorn investor. Shaun says it looks like “12 years of failure”

Pat says he has had one of the powercubes in his car, taking it around to demos, for a month and it’s never stopped working. Pat says he won’t give up, he says we haven’t had the fight yet.

Shaun says he only needs to win once.

Now showing the O-CUbe 2.1 amps

The O-Cube consists of:

USB PCB board
Li Ion Batter
Orbo Power Pack

Draining the Li Ion battery
Orbo Device is constantly charging the battery.

2 smartphone charges in a 24 hour period

On sale in December for 1200 Euros 12 Month warranty

Rabbit Hole promotions will get an O-Cube

Brickbear clothing company will get one

Commercialization going on behind the scenes.

Liquid Solutions is making liquids for E-Cigarettes. 500,000 bottles per week. Will be using Orbo in their vape machines.

The webinar is over now — it lasted 20 minutes. I missed quite a bit trying to keep up, but will try to review.

There is some Q&A going on, but I can’t tune in for some reason. Here are some scraps from the Q&A:

0.4W continuous power,
alloy case,
non-radio active,
works in a faraday cage.

UPDATE: Here is a video of today’s webinar (it does not include the Q&A session following)

[fbvideo link=”https://www.facebook.com/217496297671/videos/10153326632242672/” width=”640″ height=”480″ onlyvideo=”1″]

Also, a transcript of the video has been made by Esa Ruoho and has been posted at on the vortex-l list here.

  • Gerard McEk

    Good initiative, Frank. I will follow your experience with the O-Cube with some interest. I am sure it will be no LENR, though.

  • Gerard McEk

    Good initiative, Frank. I will follow your experience with the O-Cube with some interest. I am sure it will be no LENR, though.

  • Godspeed, Steorn!!! And Frank, too. I don’t think that it is an exaggeration to say that the hopes and dreams of millions are riding on the success of The O-Cube. BOOM!!! IT’S ON!!!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhY90Qu9OiI

    That’s the censored version…you guys can look up the uncensored version if you want to. LOL!

    • Frank Acland

      I don’t think there are millions currently holding out hope for this technology. Steorn is pretty much dismissed as a failure or worse. Maybe a few hundred have hope at this point.

      • Hmmm…good point. Maybe I should have said that the hopes and dreams that millions of people have for a better world, in the near future, are riding on the success of The O-Cube. Then again, maybe I should just shut up and wait until I start to see your updates, tomorrow.

      • bachcole

        Yeah, but it will be amazing how fast they will become known if they have an over-unity product that they can sell to the public. Forget wildfires. Think of the light of Trinity flashing across the New Mexico sky at 5:30 A.M., July 16th, 1945.

        • Frank Acland

          My understanding is that the plan for validation of the technology is a word-of-mouth one. Steorn is not going to try to prove this technology themselves at the webinars, or any other event. They are going to make the tech available and let people who buy and use it talk about their experiences. They have a Facebook page set up for that purpose.

          • bachcole

            Your point? (:->) Once customers and other people find out the truth about it, even if they have to discover it for themselves, it will explode as illustrated in my previous comment. Heck, I would even go door-to-door in my neighborhood where hardly anyone knows me showing people. This, of course, is assuming that they actually have over-unity.

          • Frank Acland

            I am not challenging your scenario — just saying that they are going to have a user satisfaction strategy to promote the O-Cube, which I think is actually much more effective than trying to prove it themselves.

          • bachcole

            I thought about it, and I agree 110%. EVERY merchant and EVERY sales person on the planet is excited about their product, mostly excited about selling it to us, but us buyers can’t always tell the difference between their excitement about a pending sale and their excitement about what a good product they have. So the excitement indexes of all merchants and sales people are completely suspect. But when a customer spends money (not a good thing) is still excited about a product, that is a very good thing. (:->)

          • oldrolledgold

            What claims will they make on the box?

          • The majority of the population has no knowledge of the concept of ‘conservation of energy’ and so will not see anything surprising at all in a device that produces power but doesn’t consume anything. It’ll just be a new kind of battery to them – one that happens to last a very long time.

            There is no real need for a new kind of phone charger, so whether or not they buy an ‘O-Cube’ will come down to how fashionable it is to own one, and whether it is associated with a celebrity. Without the ‘i-Phone factor’ it will probably go almost unnoticed. Of course, if it can be miniaturised to the point where it can be built into phones instead of a battery – then it will get noticed.

            Otherwise, the value – IF it pans out – will be in the apparent violation of the ‘law’ of conservation of energy and the new physics (and devices) that will stem from that.

          • bachcole

            You’re right. What was I thinking? I guess in my mind I mixed up this O-Cube with the E-Cat. I won’t need a phone charger as big as my tabletop computer. I don’t even have a cell-phone.

          • I have a ‘mobile’ as we older folk call them here (kids just call them phones), but as I can make a ten quid pay-as-you-go ‘top up’ last six months or so, I don’t exactly over-use it. My daughters say that this is because I’m a tight-fisted and miserable old git, but I prefer to think of it as efficient use of resources.

  • Hmm.

    Well if it is not LENR.

    I wonder how much energy is floating around in WIFI and other radio signals. Think Tesla.

    Kind Regards walker

  • Hmm.

    Well if it is not LENR.

    I wonder how much energy is floating around in WIFI and other radio signals. Think Tesla.

    Kind Regards walker

  • hempenearth

    Maybe its slow magnetism.

  • hempenearth

    Maybe its slow magnetism.

  • bachcole

    They have my attention. I look forward to your summary, Frank.

  • bachcole

    They have my attention. I look forward to your summary, Frank.

  • ecatworld

    I don’t think there are millions currently holding out hope for this technology. Steorn is pretty much dismissed as a failure or worse. Maybe a few hundred have hope at this point.

    • Hmmm…good point. Maybe I should have said that the hopes and dreams that millions of people have for a better world, in the near future, are riding on the success of The O-Cube. Then again, maybe I should just shut up and wait until I start to see your updates, tomorrow.

    • bachcole

      Yeah, but it will be amazing how fast they will become known if they have an over-unity product that they can sell to the public. Forget wildfires. Think of the light of Trinity flashing across the New Mexico sky at 5:30 A.M., July 16th, 1945.

      • ecatworld

        My understanding is that the plan for validation of the technology is a word-of-mouth one. Steorn is not going to try to prove this technology themselves at the webinars, or any other event. They are going to make the tech available and let people who buy and use it talk about their experiences. They have a Facebook page set up for that purpose.

        • bachcole

          Your point? (:->) Once customers and other people find out the truth about it, even if they have to discover it for themselves, it will explode as illustrated in my previous comment. Heck, I would even go door-to-door in my neighborhood where hardly anyone knows me showing people. This, of course, is assuming that they actually have over-unity.

          • ecatworld

            I am not challenging your scenario — just saying that they are going to have a user satisfaction strategy to promote the O-Cube, which I think is actually much more effective than trying to prove it themselves.

          • oldrolledgold

            What claims will they make on the box?

          • Agaricus

            The majority of the population has no knowledge of the concept of ‘conservation of energy’ and so will not see anything surprising at all in a device that produces power but doesn’t consume anything.

            There is no real need for a new kind of phone charger, so whether or not they buy an ‘O-Cube’ will come down to how fashionable it is to own one, and whether it is associated with a celebrity.

            The value, IF it pans out will be in the apparent violation of the ‘law’ of conservation of energy and the new physics (and devices) that stem from that.

  • SG

    I’m firmly planted on the fence with Steorn. But having followed them closely from about 2007-2009, they seem to have something interesting. I’m just not convinced yet and will need to see some solid evidence. Having a unit in-hand that provides power for a period of time that clearly rules out internal batteries would be a good first indication. Taking the thing apart and inspecting the internals would be a good second indication. Assuming it worked, here is how I foresee it playing out.

    Within a few weeks, one of the mainstream tech-related sites would reveal their testing, which would be a good third indication. The word would gradually spread among tech enthusiasts. Within a few months, a university would be persuaded (confidentially) to inspect the device and provide an opinion. The university would be reluctant given their nature, but with level of interest starting to bubble at this point, they probably would, and then provide their opinion (again without fanfare and probably under NDA). Within a year (this time next year), it will be on every person’s holiday wish list, assuming that the pricing is reasonable. Within two years, a scaled up version will be touted by Steorn. EV enthusiasts will start to build them into the trunks of their cars to provide unlimited mileage. NASA will become very interested and will start to explore space applications. And well, by this time, an entire paradigm will begin to come into existence.

    But then again, it is a giant IF it works. The nice thing is, it appears that we won’t have to wait long as Steorn seems to be prepared to lay down their cards.

    • bachcole

      Reading my mind.

  • SG

    I’m firmly planted on the fence with Steorn. But having followed them closely from about 2007 to 2009, and then off and on until present, they seem to have something interesting and there is no question that they are sincere (although maybe delusional–we’ll see). I’m just not convinced yet and will need to see some solid evidence. Having a unit in-hand that provides power for a period of time that clearly rules out internal batteries would be a good first indication. Taking the thing apart and inspecting the internals would be a good second indication. Assuming it worked, here is how I foresee it playing out.

    Within a few weeks, one of the mainstream tech-related sites would reveal their testing, which would be a good third indication. The word would gradually spread among tech enthusiasts. Within a few months, a university would be persuaded (confidentially) to inspect the device and provide an opinion. The university would be reluctant to do this given their conservative nature, but with the level of interest starting to bubble at this point, they probably would, and then provide their opinion (again without fanfare and probably under NDA). Within a year (this time next year), it will be on every person’s holiday wish list, assuming that the pricing is reasonable. Within two years, a scaled up version will be touted by Steorn. EV enthusiasts will start to build them into the trunks of their cars to provide unlimited mileage. NASA will become very interested and will start to explore space applications. And well, by this time, an entirely new paradigm will begin to come into existence.

    But of course, it is a giant IF it works. The nice thing is, it appears that we won’t have to wait long as Steorn seems to be prepared to lay down their cards.

    • bachcole

      Reading my mind.

  • Angry SQUIRREL!!

    Skeptic Skeptic Skeptic!
    With LERN there is some believable ideas behind its science. With Orbo it’s energy coming out of willie nillie. Nothing breaking down just poof free energy. Unless it’s ripping energy from another dimension I don’t see how this thing makes any logical sense. My guess is this box is nothing more than a slow draining battery but time will tell.

  • Curbina

    Darn, I missed it!!!

    • Curbina

      LOL, it’s tomorrow, so I’ve still not missed it, but looking at my schedule, I see slim chance of being able to even be online at the time.

      • Frank Acland

        No worries, it will be posted on the Orbo FB page the next day.

  • wonderboy

    Hey, I wish them all the best. I’m not holding by breath, but I’m cheering for them.

  • GreenWin

    This gadget is likely to share its energy source with ADGEX “ELFE” flashlight. http://freeenergy.news/news/adgex-flashlight-powered-by-earths-magnetic-field/
    Shocking.

    • SG

      Possibly, but I don’t think so, at least based on the respective explanations of operation. Steorn claims that a specific non-linear magnetic interaction causes a net increase in energy, whereas ADGEX claims that they are directly harvesting energy from Earth’s magnetic fields. The explanations seem to have uncommon foundations. But then again, both claims are very nebulous at present.

      • Agaricus

        Another possibility is that it may use stray radio/microwave transmission energy like this charger:

        http://www.engadget.com/2015/05/04/nikola-labs-radio-waves-charge-iphone/

        (principle explained here: http://uk.mouser.com/applications/rf_energy_harvesting/ )

        I think I’d want to see the Orbo device operating happily while sitting inside a Faraday cage before I’m convinced that it is self-energising.

        • GreenWin

          Wouldn’t a Faraday cage disable all these magnetic and Schumann resonance type devices?

          • Agaricus

            Yes it would, but Steorn’s ‘Orbo’ is supposed (as I understand it) to depend on internal magnetic imbalances rather than interaction with external fields or radiation, and if that’s the case it should be unaffected. If it can’t run under those conditions, then the flashlight and RF-powered charger people seem to have got there first.

  • GreenWin

    This gadget is likely to share its energy source with ADGEX “ELFE” flashlight. http://freeenergy.news/news/adgex-flashlight-powered-by-earths-magnetic-field/
    Shocking.

    • SG

      Possibly, but I don’t think so, at least based on the respective explanations of operation. Steorn claims that a specific non-linear magnetic interaction causes a net increase in energy, whereas ADGEX claims that they are directly harvesting energy from Earth’s magnetic fields. The explanations seem to have uncommon foundations. But then again, both claims are very nebulous at present.

  • snowvoardphil

    Ultra sceptik

    Even if the device would yield ”Free energy”, I don’t think it offers any real value. From the demo products we’ve seen, this thing looks huge for the power it can provide. I’d guess it has a much lesser power density than a solar cell of the same size. Who needs a cell phone charger that has a volume of a Liter and probably weights much more than any 1 $ corded cell phone charger ?

    Stuck in the woods somewhere ? you’d be much better off with a li-ion battery, a 10th of that size that you can recharge your cell phone with. I’d be very curious to know the ROI for their device compared to our 0.08$Kwhr rate here in Quebec.

    • GreenWin

      Unfortunately for businesses using 50kW or more, the rate jumps to $6.21/kW in winter. This means recharging company phones, iPads, laptops & sundry portable devices is an far more onerous cost.

    • Blue Energy

      >’Even if the device would yield “Free energy”…’

      Really, if (*very large* ‘if’) their device is overunity, I think very little interest will be in its application as a phone charger – or in the relative convenience of its size and shape for that purpose. After reading the patent application the components seem to be very inexpensive. The interest, therefore, would be in imagining how large a box would be required to house the up-scaled components capable of recharging the battery running your house, or the one running your car, overnight.

      In that light, they’re really selling a technology demonstration toy that, as a throw-in bonus – also happens to charge your phone forever. Steorn wants to license the technology (if they’re not just extending a well-worn scam into a new decade…). They have no real interest in becoming your smart phone charging tool of choice.

      • Agaricus

        I have a spare room – perhaps I could fill it with enough ‘O-Cubes’ to power the landing light…

        Slightly more seriously (and as you suggest), once O/U from an exotic device is proven and replicated, then it becomes technology rather than ‘science’, and so subject to continuous improvement.

  • snowvoardphil

    Ultra sceptik

    Even if the device would yield ”Free energy”, I don’t think it offers any real value. From the demo products we’ve seen, this thing looks huge for the power it can provide. I’d guess it has a much lesser power density than a solar cell of the same size. Who needs a cell phone charger that has a volume of a Liter and probably weights much more than any 1 $ corded cell phone charger ?

    Stuck in the woods somewhere ? you’d be much better off with a li-ion battery, a 10th of that size that you can recharge your cell phone with. I’d be very curious to know the ROI for their device compared to our 0.08$Kwhr rate here in Quebec.

    • GreenWin

      Unfortunately for businesses using 50kW or more, the rate jumps to $6.21/kW in winter. This means recharging company phones, iPads, laptops & sundry portable devices is an far more onerous cost.

      • snowvoardphil

        That 6,21$kW is for instantenous called power over 50kW, so if you use that 51th kW for 24hr7 for 31 days (744 hr in a month), it comes up to an extra 0,008$ per Kwhr + normal kWhr rate for these extra kWhr (wich for businesse here in quebec is at 0,0487$kWhr).

        Cell phones chargers typically pull 15W ([email protected],14A)

    • Blue Energy

      >’Even if the device would yield “Free energy”…’

      Really, if (*very large* ‘if’) their device is overunity, I think very little interest will be in its application as a phone charger – or in the relative convenience of its size and shape for that purpose. After reading the patent application the components seem to be very inexpensive. The interest, therefore, would be in imagining how large a box would be required to house the up-scaled components capable of recharging the battery running your house, or the one running your car, overnight.

      In that light, they’re really selling a technology demonstration toy that, as a throw-in bonus – also happens to charge your phone forever. Steorn wants to license the technology (if they’re not just extending a well-worn scam into a new decade…). They have no real interest in becoming your smart phone charging tool of choice.

      • I have a spare room – perhaps I could fill it with enough ‘O-Cubes’ to power the landing light…

        Slightly more seriously (and as you suggest), once O/U from an exotic device is proven and replicated, then it becomes technology rather than ‘science’, and so subject to continuous improvement.

      • bachcole

        Nice.

  • georgehants

    Will be interesting to observe as the device is ripped apart and analysed.
    If by some chance it contains some new science then one would assume that it will only take our establishment scientists 50 years to think that it might be worth investigating.
    In the meanwhile the intrepid scientists who are working blindly on Cold Fusion and many others outside of the establishment will immediately start to put their talents to good use.
    The important thing, is the difference between a clever device harvesting some known energy in a novel way or the possibility of new science.
    Any denial of any possibilities before the Evidence is clear is unscientific hogwash, as ordinary people far cleverer than many scientists have been saying for thousands of years, the proof of the pudding is in the eating.

  • georgehants

    Will be interesting to observe as the device is ripped apart tested and analysed.
    If by some chance it contains some new science then one would assume that it will only take our establishment scientists and academics 50 years to think that it might be worth investigating.
    In the meanwhile the intrepid scientists who are working (unnecessarily) blindly on Cold Fusion and many others outside of the establishment will immediately start to put their talents to good use to improve on it and discover it’s temporary working theory.
    The important thing, is the difference between a clever device harvesting some known energy in a novel way or the possibility of new science.
    Any denial of any possibilities before the Evidence is clear is unscientific hogwash, as ordinary people far cleverer than many scientists have been saying for thousands of years, the proof of the pudding is in the eating.

  • Just got a radio-flashlight-phone charger where you turn a crank to generate power. Fits in the palm of your hand. (Good survival tool) Might use this and my wall charger if the O-cube is $$.

  • Just got a radio-flashlight-phone charger where you turn a crank to generate power. Fits in the palm of your hand. (Good survival tool) Might use this and my wall charger if the O-cube is $$.

  • gdaigle

    As someone under Steorn’s NDA for four years, it will be an interesting reveal. In a private Facebook group for former signers of Steorn’s NDA (including some on this thread), there is great interest in a teardown and analysis. On that site I’ve offered visual sketches suggesting what is behind the form format, and I’m curious to see how close I came.

    We know that, like the E-Cat, this will be a solid state device, likely a version of their Orbo technology is based upon their patent:

    https://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2011110951&recNum=7&office&queryString=ALL%3A(Steorn)&prevFilter&sortOption=Pub%20Date%20Desc&maxRec=28

    I know that this seems like a fraud, but as I mentioned last week during a lecture to a room of university design students studying creativity and thinking outside the box, Steorn seems secretive unless you were under their NDA and exposed to reams of technical information, extensive interactive e-learning on basic physics and engaged in over 4,300 discussion threads, 50,000+ posts and 380 shared documents.

    It should be an interesting few months.

    “History does not crawl, it jumps.” Nassim Nicholas Taleb

    • georgehants

      gdaigle, I am amazed that somewhere in scientific education, a class of ”
      design students studying creativity and thinking outside the box,” is allowed.
      You are talking about scientific design and not artistic design I hope.
      Do you mean that the students are taught and allowed to disagree with the religious Dogma of science by their teachers and not be expelled or lose marks?

      • GreenWin

        I imagine gdaigle’s class is art-oriented. Reminding us that “science” is essentially a subset of art. It is right-brained creativity /spirituality that is leading this paradigm shift.

        • gdaigle

          You are quite correct. Design has long been taught as an “applied art”, with the application being dependent upon the current technological expression of science. These were graphical, interactive, clothing and industrial design masters students with good questions about my views on the ability to print cellular tissues, integrate electronics into clothing and other insights on the merging of science and art. My presentation was on designers working with engineers and scientists.

  • gdaigle

    As someone under Steorn’s NDA for four years, it will be an interesting reveal. In a private Facebook group for former signers of Steorn’s NDA (including some on this thread), there is great interest in a teardown and analysis. On that site I’ve offered visual sketches suggesting what is behind the form format, and I’m curious to see how close I came.

    We know that, like the E-Cat, this will be a solid state device, likely a version of their Orbo technology is based upon their patent:

    https://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2011110951&recNum=7&office&queryString=ALL%3A(Steorn)&prevFilter&sortOption=Pub%20Date%20Desc&maxRec=28

    I know that this seems like a fraud, but as I mentioned last week during a lecture to a room of university design students studying creativity and thinking outside the box, Steorn seems secretive unless you were under their NDA and exposed to reams of technical information, extensive interactive e-learning on basic physics and engaged in over 4,300 discussion threads, 50,000+ posts and 380 shared documents.

    It should be an interesting few months.

    “History does not crawl, it jumps.” Nassim Nicholas Taleb

    • georgehants

      gdaigle, I am amazed that somewhere in scientific education, a class of ”
      design students studying creativity and thinking outside the box,” is allowed.
      You are talking about scientific design and not artistic design I hope.
      Do you mean that the students are taught and allowed to disagree with the religious Dogma of science by their teachers and not be expelled or lose marks?
      Would they be allowed to say Cold Fusion may be possible?

      • GreenWin

        I imagine gdaigle’s class is art-oriented. Reminding us that “science” is essentially a subset of art. It is right-brained creativity /spirituality that is leading this paradigm shift.

        • gdaigle

          You are quite correct. Design has long been taught as an “applied art”, with the application being dependent upon the current technological expression of science. These were graphical, interactive, clothing and industrial design masters students with good questions about my views on the ability to print cellular tissues, integrate electronics into clothing and other insights on the merging of science and art. My presentation was on designers working with engineers and scientists.

        • bachcole

          Science can also be seen as a subset of epistemology. (:->) Many scientists and sciencism advocates would like us to believe that science is the whole of epistemology, but LENR is soon to prove to them that such is not the case.

  • catfish

    this kind of thing hurts the credulity of this otherwise good web site

    • omelette

      What a crass thing to say! Why didn’t you threaten to boycott the site while you were at it. It would have been gross dereliction of duty to have not covered such a potentially Earth-changing story.

      But yeah, since you don’t understand the difference between “credulity” & “credibility”, I guess we can make allowances.

  • catfish

    this kind of thing hurts the credulity of this otherwise good web site

    • bachcole

      “Credulity” means one’s willingness to believe things. I see most people here as sort of skeptical, unwilling to believe things without evidence. That is how I am.

      “Credibility” means how much other people tend to believe us. Perhaps you are right, about credibility. But our credibility ain’t doing so great anyway. People think that we are true believing cultists. Little do they realize that the evidence has forced us to believe. For me and many other people, to not believe would be highly foolish and unscientific.

      Furthermore, the correct position is to withhold drawing a conclusion without good evidence one way or the other. I am merely watching the Steorn show; I have not decided whether it is true or false. If people have a problem with that and a problem with my thinking for myself, they are welcome to cram their unscientific and judgemental attitude where the Sun don’t shine and blow it out their ears. (:->)

      • GreenWin

        Nicely put bachcole. Ill conceived sniping from the peanut gallery has grown these past days. Methinks our lurking shills find their towers tarnished and tilting. Perhaps at windmills. 🙂

      • we want LENR Fusione Fredda

        Agree. Unless the item is bought and used, comments are conjectures. No?

    • omelette

      What a crass thing to say! Why didn’t you threaten to boycott the site while you were at it. It would have been gross dereliction of duty to have not covered such a potentially Earth-changing story.

      But yeah, since you don’t understand the difference between “credulity” & “credibility”, I guess we can make allowances.

  • MasterBlaster7

    Ummm. If you buy it…be sure and take a geiger counter to that thing.

  • MasterBlaster7

    Ummm. If you buy it…be sure and take a geiger counter to that thing.

  • GreenWin

    Nicely put bachcole. Ill conceived sniping from the peanut gallery has grown these past days. Methinks our lurking shills find their towers tarnished and tilting. Perhaps at windmills. 🙂

  • Andre Blum

    I wouldn’t be interested in hearing news about Steorn on this site even if it turns out to work as advertised.

    • Blue Energy

      Well I, for one, *definitely* want to hear about it if it turns out to work as advertised. That would be the biggest news of the century. I just don’t think that’s very likely. I just need to figure out a way to stop writing about it until then.

      • GreenWin

        Let’s not exaggerate Bleu. The biggest news of the century is discovery (at last) of the Higgs boson or… God Particle. How can a phone charger compete with a particle of God??

        • Blue Energy

          It’s not the charger application. It would apparently be the only known example of getting something for nothing – and electricity to boot. Who couldn’t use something for nothing in the electricity dept?

          • GreenWin

            Getting something from nothing? Or from a source science knows nothing about? Sorta like dark matter – which makes up 96% of our universe.

          • Blue Energy

            Yeah… I get ‘…source science knows nothing about…’. There is always that possibility. It could be pulling energy out of parallel universes or from background radiation or maybe the magnet eventually becomes unmagnetized. Or – maybe something else. But, it’s like conversations that end: ‘It must be aliens – that’s the only possible explanation’. There’s no real comeback for it but it also isn’t convincing in the least. Contact your buddies at Steorn and get Frank a test model with your stipulations, can you?

          • Blue Energy

            Oh – scratch that, GreenWin. The forum has already come through for Frank. That was impressive, Frank.

  • Andre Blum

    I wouldn’t be interested in hearing news about Steorn on this site even if it turns out to work as advertised.

    • Blue Energy

      Well I, for one, *definitely* want to hear about it if it turns out to work as advertised. That would be the biggest news of the century. I just don’t think that’s very likely. I just need to figure out a way to stop writing about it until then.

      • GreenWin

        Let’s not exaggerate Bleu. The biggest news of the century is discovery (at last) of the Higgs boson or… God Particle. How can a phone charger compete with a particle of God??

        • Blue Energy

          It’s not the charger application. It would apparently be the only known example of getting something for nothing – and electricity to boot. Who couldn’t use something for nothing in the electricity dept?

          • GreenWin

            Getting something from nothing? Or from a source science knows nothing about? Sorta like dark matter – which makes up 96% of our universe.

          • Blue Energy

            Yeah… I get ‘…source science knows nothing about…’. There is always that possibility. It could be pulling energy out of parallel universes or from background radiation or maybe the magnet eventually becomes unmagnetized. Or – maybe something else. But, it’s like conversations that end: ‘It must be aliens – that’s the only possible explanation’. There’s no real comeback for it but it also isn’t convincing in the least. Contact your buddies at Steorn and get Frank a test model with your stipulations, can you?

          • Blue Energy

            Oh – scratch that, GreenWin. The forum has already come through for Frank. That was impressive, Frank.

          • bachcole

            Yeah. I started having fantasies about me commenting about my poor mother who can’t afford her cancer treatments. (:->)

        • bachcole

          Nice.

  • invient

    They have a physical product. Does it do what they claim, who knows.

    The video itself didn’t lend to their credibility, who has a woman get up from under a table with a “battery is dead” t-shirt on… that isn’t professional.

    This video screams, “you haven’t wasted your money!” Especially with the e-juice guy exhaling every 30 seconds between saying he is not frustrated… yeah, you are!

  • invient

    They have a physical product. Does it do what they claim, who knows.

    The video itself didn’t lend to their credibility, who has a woman get up from under a table with a “battery is dead” t-shirt on… that isn’t professional.

    This video screams, “you haven’t wasted your money!” Especially with the e-juice guy exhaling every 30 seconds between saying he is not frustrated… yeah, you are!

  • Martijn du Pré

    saw the first ten minutes, It’s nothing! painfull to watch. I also remembered Steorn from 2008 as an interesting project, I even wander if these are the same people. Never mind continue with this site!

  • Martijn du Pré

    saw the first ten minutes, It’s nothing! painfull to watch. I also remembered Steorn from 2008 as an interesting project, I even wander if these are the same people. Never mind continue with this site!

  • Tim

    .4 watts continuous from the Orbo charging the battery

  • kenko1

    At the price they’re asking(1200 British pounds), I expect their first years sales volume. to be about 10.

    • Blue Energy

      1,200 BP?! Seriously!? Frank – you’re a hero to do this!

      • ecatworld

        1200 Euros is about $1300 — a lot of money for me, not sure I can spare that much.

        • Blue Energy

          I have to admit to being lost as to Steorn’s motives yet again. When I thought the goal was to sell a bunch of these to ordinary people to make it clear to the rest of us that their technology was for real – I could grudgingly see a purpose to it and even admire their plan. But – no ordinary person in their right mind will spend $1,300 on a dubious charger for their $200 phone. And of course, the more learned, with the possible exception of GreenWin, probably won’t buy one just on GP. Who does that leave? Almost no-one. They must know this. That would seem to indicate that Steorn *isn’t* serious about getting their invention out there after all. So why do it then? Just a way to get their name on peoples lips? Back to the gray for Steorn. As recently as last month I was determined never to think about them again. And now, without them even having accomplished anything substantive, here I am writing about them. I feel so dirty…

          GreenWin – we’re counting on you now to buy one and test it. Show the rest of us skeptics just how wrong we are! Blaze the trail for Science! Do it for The Environment! Please! 😉

          • ecatworld

            I think they must be gambling that people will buy this for the novelty, for a piece of history, or something to show off. Probably they think if you spend that much on a unit you won’t be inclined to tear it apart to try and reverse engineer.

          • Blue Energy

            Like: you’re Elon Musk sitting around bored one night surfing the Internet for something stimulating, and you idly think maybe you’ll go to a movie with the 20 bucks burning a hole through your pocket. But then you see this ad. for a $1,300 phone charger based on a previously unknown to you, get-something-for-nothing, technology. You vaguely recognize the manufacturers name from several years ago – but you can’t quite place it. And you think to yourself, ‘What the heck’! and, just on impulse, you buy that instead of the movie.

            I think you’re right about the probability that in general people won’t take it apart if they pay that much for it. But maybe, if you’re Elon Musk and have just-being-spontaneous money to buy one with anyway, $1,300 wouldn’t be an obstacle. In fact, maybe you’d buy two: one to try-out, test, and take apart now – and one to keep unopened in the original box to sell on EBay in 20 years.

            I take it their patent application was not approved?

          • ecatworld
          • GreenWin

            Hey Blue,

            How bout Steorn LOAN an evaluation unit to Frank? With a promise to return it unopened or tampered with. Besides, GreenWin blazes trails for humanity. Science is a poor cousin. :).

          • Blue Energy

            Yes! Make it so GreenWin! Use your connections. Oh, the humanity!

          • GreenWin

            You misunderstood. I said, “…blazes trails for humanity. Not with humanity. If only we could change the laws of physics Capt’n!

    • kenko1

      Why not try the Rossi strategy. ‘So cheap that no one will try to replicate.’? Say £12,00 or £1,20 plus shipping. Still…all the best😇

  • kenko1

    At the price they’re asking(1200 British pounds), I expect their first years sales volume. to be about 10.

    • Blue Energy

      1,200 BP?! Seriously!? Frank – you’re a hero to do this!

      • Frank Acland

        1200 Euros is about $1300 — a lot of money for me, not sure I can spare that much.

        • Blue Energy

          I have to admit to being lost as to Steorn’s motives yet again. When I thought the goal was to sell a bunch of these to ordinary people to make it clear to the rest of us that their technology was for real – I could grudgingly see a purpose to it and even admire their plan. But – no ordinary person in their right mind will spend $1,300 on a dubious charger for their $200 phone. And of course, the more learned, with the possible exception of GreenWin, probably won’t buy one just on GP. Who does that leave? Almost no-one. They must know this. That would seem to indicate that Steorn *isn’t* serious about getting their invention out there after all. So why do it then? Just a way to get their name on peoples lips? Back to the gray for Steorn. As recently as last month I was determined never to think about them again. And now, without them even having accomplished anything substantive, here I am writing about them. I feel so dirty…

          GreenWin – we’re counting on you now to buy one and test it. Show the rest of us skeptics just how wrong we are! Blaze the trail for Science! Do it for The Environment! Please! 😉

          • Frank Acland

            I think they must be gambling that people will buy this for the novelty, for a piece of history, or something to show off. Probably they think if you spend that much on a unit you won’t be inclined to tear it apart to try and reverse engineer.

          • Blue Energy

            Like: you’re Elon Musk sitting around bored one night surfing the Internet for something stimulating, and you idly think maybe you’ll go to a movie with the 20 bucks burning a hole through your pocket. But then you see this ad. for a $1,300 phone charger based on a previously unknown to you, get-something-for-nothing, technology. You vaguely recognize the manufacturers name from several years ago – but you can’t quite place it. And you think to yourself, ‘What the heck’! and, just on impulse, you buy that instead of the movie.

            I think you’re right about the probability that in general people won’t take it apart if they pay that much for it. But maybe, if you’re Elon Musk and have just-being-spontaneous money to buy one with anyway, $1,300 wouldn’t be an obstacle. In fact, maybe you’d buy two: one to try-out, test, and take apart now – and one to keep unopened in the original box to sell on EBay in 20 years.

            I take it their patent application was not approved?

          • Frank Acland
          • GreenWin

            Hey Blue,

            How bout Steorn LOAN an evaluation unit to Frank? With a promise to return it unopened or tampered with. Besides, GreenWin blazes trails for humanity. Science is a poor cousin. :).

          • Blue Energy

            Yes! Make it so GreenWin! Use your connections. Oh, the humanity!

          • GreenWin

            You misunderstood. I said, “…blazes trails for humanity. Not with humanity. If only we could change the laws of physics Capt’n!

          • bachcole

            “I feel so dirty…” LOL

        • bachcole

          Given your position, I would think that they would want to give you one if you couldn’t afford one.

    • kenko1

      Why not try the Rossi strategy. ‘So cheap that no one will try to replicate.’? Say £12,00 or £1,20 plus shipping. Still…all the best😇

  • Guy Thomas

    Shame they didn’t break it open and explain how they think it works. Apparently it’ll work in a Faraday cage so it isn’t converting em radiation into energy.

  • Guy Thomas

    I’d have considered buying one at 600 euro but 1200 is a lot for something that will only charge to mobile phones per day.

  • Guy Thomas

    Shame they didn’t break it open and explain how they think it works. Apparently it’ll work in a Faraday cage so it isn’t converting em radiation into energy.

  • BadgerWI

    They really need to re think their price point. $1750 for a battery charger is way to much. Assuming this thing works as advertised and is a miracle tech nobody will care. People can charge an awful lot of cell phones for 1200 pounds.

    • GreenWin

      Correct. It is not quite free energy at that price. I suspect they’re factoring in the cost of IP.

  • ecatworld

    I’ve got Some more scraps of information from the Q&A:

    0.4W continuous power, alloy case, non-radio active, works in a faraday cage

  • Frank Acland

    I’ve got Some more scraps of information from the Q&A:

    0.4W continuous power, alloy case, non-radio active, works in a faraday cage

    • pixelblot

      Another one that I was interested in finding out which he did answer yes to was the ability to daisy chain.

      • Frank Acland

        Also, they are expecting people to pull them apart, and have designed it so that will not be easy to do.

  • ecatworld

    Also, they are expecting people to pull them apart, and have designed it so that will not be easy to do.

  • On sale in december? 2015? For everyone?

    Or just special invited customers and very limited number of devices?

  • On sale in december? 2015? For everyone?

    Or just special invited customers and very limited number of devices?

  • Rob S

    I think the orbo must run on pure Guiness. Everything about these guys baffles me.

  • Rob S

    I think the orbo must run on pure Guiness. Everything about these guys baffles me.

  • In all seriousness, though, I thought that the Keshe folks were charging a bit much for their machines that are supposed to power your entire home indefinitely. (as long as the machine does not break down, of course, as can happen with anything) Well, now the Steorn folks have come along, and the Steorn products make the Keshe products look like a steal at these prices:

    http://www.keshefoundation.org/webshop/products/kf-products

    • SG

      Having followed Steorn and to some extent Keshe, I would rank Steorn’s credibility FAR above Keshe, and that is even with Steorn’s very public failures. I have little to no interest in Keshe based on what I’ve observed of him and his “teachings.”

  • In all seriousness, though, I thought that the Keshe folks were charging a bit much for their machines that are supposed to power your entire home indefinitely. (as long as the machine does not break down, of course, as can happen with anything) Well, now the Steorn folks have come along, and the Steorn products make the Keshe products look like a steal at these prices:

    http://www.keshefoundation.org/webshop/products/kf-products

    • SG

      Having followed Steorn and to some extent Keshe, I would rank Steorn’s credibility FAR above Keshe, and that is even with Steorn’s very public failures. I have little to no interest in Keshe based on what I’ve observed of him and his “teachings.”

      • I don’t know what works and what doesn’t. I was just making a comment on the price, and the fact that they both have products that can people can buy and see, for themselves, if they work.

  • BillH

    Salient points, 0.4Watts, 2.1Amps, Power=CurrentxVoltage, you do the maths. Price £1200, can only recharge 2 phones per day. Guarantee 12 months. What we have here is a powerbank in a box. You can get a XIAOMI 5.1V 2.1A 10000mAh Power Bank For Smartphone for less than £10.

    The give-away is the price and the guarantee. £1200 might not be ridiculous for infinite recharges
    but this would mean the guarantee should be for lifetime, your lifetime. The trick will be here, the box fails perhaps 2 months after you buy it, you send it back under the guarantee and they say the box has failed, and quite happily send you out a new box, this will happen 4 or 5 times until the guarantee runs out and they walk away with you £1200. They might even have satisfied customers, for a month or two. £100/mth is way too much, nice try Steorn but don’t give up your day jobs.

    • SG

      Nice concise summary, but I would disagree with you regarding the possible “trick.” The XIAOMI can only charge a phone 3-4 times–that’s it. Even if you packed three of those into the O-cube (just eye-balling it), my guess is you would get about 15 charges. Steorn would have to be swapping the O-cube and re-shipping every week or so to unhappy customers. I just don’t think this conjecture of what they are up to makes much sense. There is something else going on here.

    • hempenearth

      1200 euro Bill, not pounds

    • Slad

      Something doesn’t sound right with those numbers… 0.2V won’t begin to charge the battery that’s in your phone.

      A single LiPo cell needs at least 3.0V to charge when fully drained, and I doubt a phone has the power circuitry to step up a voltage that much.

      • SG

        As I understand it, it is 0.4 Watts continuous re-charging of the internal lithium ion battery. But the battery gives off 2.1 amps at probably 5V–Steorn state that it is enough power to charge a phone or tablet.

      • Agaricus

        There are a number of DC-DC ‘step-up’ converters around, but these seem to need a minimum of 1.2V input so this does seem odd. If Steorn have come up with an IC converter that can accept an input of 0.2V and output say 5V (perhaps by feeding into a ‘conventional’ DC-DC converter chip), then that would probably be a viable product on its own.

  • BillH

    Salient points, 0.4Watts, 2.1Amps, Power=CurrentxVoltage, you do the maths. Price £1200, can only recharge 2 phones per day. Guarantee 12 months. What we have here is a powerbank in a box. You can get a XIAOMI 5.1V 2.1A 10000mAh Power Bank For Smartphone for less than £10.

    The give-away is the price and the guarantee. £1200 might not be ridiculous for infinite recharges
    but this would mean the guarantee should be for lifetime, your lifetime. The trick will be here, the box fails perhaps 2 months after you buy it, you send it back under the guarantee and they say the box has failed, and quite happily send you out a new box, this will happen 4 or 5 times until the guarantee runs out and they walk away with you £1200. They might even have satisfied customers, for a month or two. £100/mth is way too much, nice try Steorn but don’t give up your day jobs.

    • SG

      Nice concise summary, but I would disagree with you regarding the possible “trick.” The XIAOMI can only charge a phone 3-4 times–that’s it. Even if you packed three of those into the O-cube (just eye-balling it), my guess is you would get about 15 charges tops. Steorn would have to be swapping the O-cube and re-shipping every week or so to unhappy customers. I just don’t think such conjecture makes much sense. Something else is going on here.

      • BillH

        Even if you could charge 2 phones every day for a month you would only get 62 charges and who charges their phone every day? a really big powerbank, and remember your paying £1200 for it could easily charge 20-30 times over even two months.

        You could even pay a company to send you out a powerbank every week for a year for say a fee of £10 and you’d still be nearly £700 better off. The dead giveaway is the 12 month guarantee on a device that’s supposed to work indefinitely.

        • SG

          I think the 12 month base warranty is about what I would offer if in Steorn’s shoes from a purely business perspective. My refrigerator has a 12 month warranty but has run for about 10 years now. The fact that a warranty is set at 12 months does not tell the entire story or act as a dead giveaway.

          • BillH

            In that case you should work out how much it would cost to charge 2 phones a day for 365 days using conventional methods and compare it to the $1200 asking price, because that’s all you’re guaranteed to get. At best this is an expensive product with no market.

          • SG

            Expensive? No doubt about that. But there is a market for it even at this price: potential licensees, such as smartphone battery manufacturers, the tinkerers, the curious, the wealthy who must have the latest cool gadget, the tech news sites that want to do a review, a government who wants to know what they might have up their sleeve, an Elon Musk who wants to figure it out as well, etc. The market might be small at the moment, but there is most definitely one. Of course, at a much lower price, the market would be much larger.

        • David Taylor-Fuller

          I think your wrong in your analysis BillH.

          comparing what they are offering to a battery pack currently on the market only makes sense if you assume that once the orbo power cube is depleted you will need to get a new one from Steorn. Also, the 12 months warranty isn’t the problem. It is more than ok to offer a 12 month warranty, since the components in the orbo power cube isnt just the orbo power pack. It is a traditional lithium battery that is trickle charged by the orbo power pack. so unless steorn can source battery packs with more an a 12month warranty it would be business suicide to offer an infinite warranty. That said, lets say two months go by and it stops working. the likely scenario for the frugal gadget geek would be to break out the screw driver remove the lithium ion battery pack and replace it with something else. Since once could easily test if the orbo powerpack is still working by connecting the power leads from the ORBO power pack in the ORBO power cube to a volt/amp meter.

          Now the real problem I see with steorn is if all they have done is build an electret. Which according to some brief googling is a known thing that is used in microphones today. WHY DOESNT THIS ALREADY EXIST. What is it that steorn is doing that is unique enough to get a patent.

    • hempenearth

      1200 euro Bill, not pounds

      • BillH

        1200 Euro equals
        858.68 British Pound
        Thanks for pointing this out, I copied it from a post further down, I still wont be investing.

    • Slad

      Something doesn’t sound right with those numbers… 0.2V won’t begin to charge the battery that’s in your phone.

      A single LiPo cell needs at least 3.0V to charge when fully drained, and I doubt a phone has the power circuitry to step up a voltage that much.

      • SG

        As I understand it, it is 0.4 Watts continuous re-charging of the internal lithium ion battery. But the battery gives off 2.1 amps at probably 5V–Steorn state that it is enough power to charge a phone or tablet.

      • There are a number of DC-DC ‘step-up’ converters around, but these seem to need a minimum of 1.2V input so this does seem odd. If Steorn have come up with an IC converter that can accept an input of 0.2V and output say 5V (perhaps by feeding into a ‘conventional’ DC-DC converter chip), then that would probably be a viable product on its own.

      • BillH

        A lot of it doesn’t sound right Slad, that’s why I pointed it out. Those people below are doing exactly what they were accusing me of doing before, which is using supposition to explain away the uncomfortable facts, that Steorn have supplied.

  • SG

    Disillusionment everywhere mainly due to the sticker shock. But the question remains: does it work? Their strategy appears to be: get it into the hands of others and let them share their experiences. Let them put it into a Faraday cage and monitor. Let them use it for a long enough period of time to rule out a simple battery. Let them put a Geiger counter next to it. And so forth.

    Now, at 1200 Euro, the pool of potential buyers is quite limited. This is by design. Otherwise, the entire initial production run could be swallowed up by a single wealthy entity. They are essentially selling an opportunity to buy a piece of history, not just a never-die battery. Consider that the original Apple-built computers sell for hundreds of thousands of dollars today. The high cost is also due to the many years of high development costs and no doubt a desire to try and recoup some of that. If it works (and that is still a giant IF), then the per unit price of an initial run doesn’t surprise me. In fact, it lends credence. I would be more skeptical if they were selling the initial units for $100 each.

    At the end of the day, Steorn is looking for something that has eluded them for over a decade: legitimacy. Once they have that, the production runs will increase, and the cost will come down.

    • Blue Energy

      If the entire initial production run were bought by a single wealthy entity – that would be great for them, wouldn’t it? It would give them money to play with and the ability to, semi-honestly, say that their product was a commercial hit. They could produce a second run with twice as many to sell to a less skeptical audience.

      Yes, the original Apple computers are collectors items that cost a lot of money today. But – they didn’t cost that when they were new – and were never functionally worth it. If they had been advertised for that in the early eighties, no-one would have bought any and we wouldn’t be discussing them at all now.

      But, maybe this first effort is to sell to the Steorn true-believers: those whose belief in Orbo has never wavered and who will pay any amount to have one of the first. Then, in a couple of months they’ll reduce the price to only 650 pounds for the STB who aren’t quite as well healed. Maybe all 20 from the two runs will be hand made on the Steorn site, come with a letter of authenticity signed by Sean himself, the signatures of all the Steorn engineers will be etched into the inside of the case, and the buyers names will go on a gold plaque prominently displayed near the front foyer. Then, after a year, they’ll go into actual production and sell them for $100 – which will still be a stretch for most buyers, but they would sell more.

      Are you going to get one? If so – will you please test it for us and let us know what you find? We’ll understand if you don’t open it (but we’ll like you even more if you do…).

      • SG

        Well, I might buy one (although still somewhat undecided). I’m a very curious person and have the means to buy one (although I can also think of many other things to drop $1300 on). But think of this: even if I did report back on this site that it was working, would that persuade you? I’m just an anonymous voice on the web. I guess you might have a feel for who I am based on my writings, but do you trust me? That is the problem with these things. It is almost impossible to know the truth unless you have one of the darned things right in front of you.

        • Blue Energy

          I’m also a very curious person, SG. So, I understand that itch. I’m just not as wealthy as you. People like me have to live vicariously through people like you.

          Would it persuade me? That’s a very good question… I’m not sure. It’s true that I don’t have the same sense of you that I feel I have of, for instance, Frank. Let’s say that if you bought one and reported on it here that it would definitely pull me in that direction at least. And if you bought one, tested it yourself, reported on it – and THEN loaned it to Frank, with the understanding that he wouldn’t open it or destroy it in any way, and HE tested it and then reported on it – that would be better still. How about it, Frank – would you be willing to do that?

    • Rolls Canhardly

      I think we should remember that, according to Steorn, Orbo powered vape pens should be out on the market within 6 months, and there’s no way they will be able to charge as much and be competitive, so a cheaper way to evaluate the tech should be coming soon. And the vape pens will probably be easier to open up and test.

  • SG

    Disillusionment everywhere mainly due to the sticker shock. But the question remains: does it work? Their strategy appears to be: get it into the hands of others and let them share their experiences. Let them put it into a Faraday cage and monitor. Let them use it for a long enough period of time to rule out a simple battery. Let them put a Geiger counter next to it. And so forth.

    Now, at 1200 Euro (just over $1300), the pool of potential buyers is quite limited. This is by design. Otherwise, the entire initial production run could be swallowed up by a single wealthy entity. They are essentially selling an opportunity to buy a piece of history, not just a never-die battery. Consider that the original Apple-built computers sell for hundreds of thousands of dollars today. The high cost is also due to the many years of high development costs and no doubt a desire to try and recoup some of that. If it works (and that is still a giant IF), then the per unit price of an initial run doesn’t surprise me. In fact, it lends credence. I would be more skeptical if they were selling the initial units for $100 each.

    At the end of the day, Steorn is looking for something that has eluded them for over a decade: legitimacy. Once they have that, the production runs will increase, and the cost will come down.

    • Blue Energy

      If the entire initial production run were bought by a single wealthy entity – that would be great for them, wouldn’t it? It would give them money to play with and the ability to, semi-honestly, say that their product was a commercial hit. They could produce a second run with twice as many to sell to a less skeptical audience.

      Yes, the original Apple computers are collectors items that cost a lot of money today. But – they didn’t cost that when they were new – and were never functionally worth it. If they had been advertised for that in the early eighties, no-one would have bought any and we wouldn’t be discussing them at all now.

      But, maybe this first effort is to sell to the Steorn true-believers: those whose belief in Orbo has never wavered and who will pay any amount to have one of the first. Then, in a couple of months they’ll reduce the price to only 650 pounds for the STB who aren’t quite as well healed. Maybe all 20 from the two runs will be hand made on the Steorn site, come with a letter of authenticity signed by Sean himself, the signatures of all the Steorn engineers will be etched into the inside of the case, and the buyers names will go on a gold plaque prominently displayed near the front foyer. Then, after a year, they’ll go into actual production and sell them for $100 – which will still be a stretch for most buyers, but they would sell more.

      Are you going to get one? If so – will you please test it for us and let us know what you find? We’ll understand if you don’t open it (but we’ll like you even more if you do…).

      • SG

        Well, I might buy one (although still somewhat undecided). I’m a very curious person and have the means to buy one (although I can also think of many other things to drop $1300 on). But think of this: even if I did report back on this site that it was working, would that persuade you? I’m just an anonymous voice on the web. I guess you might have a feel for who I am based on my writings, but do you trust me? That is the problem with these things. It is almost impossible to know the truth unless you have one of the darned things right in front of you.

        • Blue Energy

          I’m also a very curious person, SG. So, I understand that itch. I’m just not as wealthy as you. People like me have to live vicariously through people like you.

          Would it persuade me? That’s a very good question… I’m not sure. It’s true that I don’t have the same sense of you that I feel I have of, for instance, Frank. Let’s say that if you bought one and reported on it here that it would definitely pull me in that direction at least. And if you bought one, tested it yourself, reported on it – and THEN loaned it to Frank, with the understanding that he wouldn’t open it or destroy it in any way, and HE tested it and then reported on it – that would be better still. How about it, Frank – would you be willing to do that?

  • GreenWin

    Correct. It is not quite free energy at that price. I suspect they’re factoring in the cost of IP.

  • ecatworld

    Here are some thoughts of mine. Now sticker shock has worn off a bit, I come back to the fact that $1300 is not an unobtainable amount of money to try to figure out if we have an overunity device here — especially when compared to the $1.5 million tag that was put on the first E-Cat plant.

    Since OU has been the main focus of this website I will float this idea: personally I won’t be able to spare $1300 out of my own pocket, but I would be able to contribute $200 towards an O-Cube. If people would be willing to chip in the rest, I would be willing to test it out for the interest and information of the readers of this site and make all testing results public. If it stops working during the 1 year warranty period I would send it back for a refund, and return all donations.

    I would not be willing to tear it apart to figure out how it works. Just use it for its intended purpose.

    If you support the idea, let me know here, or privately via email ([email protected]). Don’t send any money now. I would only want to order when we know for sure that the O-Cube is available for sale.

    • Bob Greenyer

      I think we could raise that pretty quickly

    • You really need to have a back-up so that means ordering 2 Orbo’s. There are six ways from sundown to test it. Hooking it up to a power meter, recording, and displaying here on E-catworld the output of 5volts steady at 0.4watts for many days ought to satisfy most. A very simple calorimeter is simply to buy a large vacuum thermos capable of holding the Orbo and placing it inside with a few thermocouples to watch it heat up over time. Add a 0.4 watt resistor with external power supply to calibrate. So perhaps your ‘crowdfunding’ required is more like $5000. Still an incredible bargain to show off such a miracle. If you prepare carefully since Steorn promises delivery before Christmas you can be showing results by New Years Eve, long before the e-cat results are revealed to the world.

      Who doesn’t want to take the danged thing apart and see what the trickle charger is made of…

      Anyone critical of or unwilling to pony up with such a paltry sum of money and instead doesn’t remain silent about it is as perfect a definition of a ‘wanker’ as ever there could be.

    • ecatworld

      I’m happy to report that the goal of $1300 has been reached. Thanks to all who have supported! Now we need to wait until the units go on sale, which Steorn says will be in December.

      • georgehants

        Amazing and so encouraging that we have guys with such open-minds that they are willing to do the Research and put a little cash into the pot.
        You guys raised the money before I got up this morning, well done.
        In my case Leonardo was wrong but his point is indisputable in general.
        ———
        “I awoke only to find that the rest of the world was still asleep.”
        ~Leonardo da Vinci

  • Frank Acland

    Here are some thoughts of mine. Now sticker shock has worn off a bit, I come back to the fact that $1300 is not an unobtainable amount of money to try to figure out if we have an overunity device here — especially when compared to the $1.5 million tag that was put on the first E-Cat plant.

    Since OU has been the main focus of this website I will float this idea: personally I won’t be able to spare $1300 out of my own pocket, but I would be able to contribute $200 towards an O-Cube. If people would be willing to chip in the rest, I would be willing to test it out for the interest and information of the readers of this site and make all testing results public. If it stops working during the 1 year warranty period I would send it back for a refund, and return all donations.

    I would not be willing to tear it apart to figure out how it works. Just use it for its intended purpose.

    If you support the idea, let me know here, or privately via email ([email protected]). Don’t send any money now. I would only want to order when we know for sure that the O-Cube is available for sale.

    • Bob Greenyer

      I think we could raise that pretty quickly

    • You really need to have a back-up so that means ordering 2 Orbo’s. There are six ways from sundown to test it. Hooking it up to a power meter, recording, and displaying here on E-catworld the output of 5volts steady at 0.4watts for many days ought to satisfy most. A very simple calorimeter is simply to buy a large vacuum thermos capable of holding the Orbo and placing it inside with a few thermocouples to watch it heat up over time. Add a 0.4 watt resistor with external power supply to calibrate. So perhaps your ‘crowdfunding’ required is more like $5000. Still an incredible bargain to show off such a miracle. If you prepare carefully since Steorn promises delivery before Christmas you can be showing results by New Years Eve, long before the e-cat results are revealed to the world.

      Who doesn’t want to take the danged thing apart and see what the trickle charger is made of…

      Anyone critical of or unwilling to pony up with such a paltry sum of money and instead doesn’t remain silent about it is as perfect a definition of a ******** as ever there could be.

    • Frank Acland

      I’m happy to report that the goal of $1300 in pledges has been reached. Thanks to all who have supported this effort! Now we need to wait until the units go on sale, which Steorn says will be in December.

      • georgehants

        Amazing and so encouraging that we have guys with such open-minds that they are willing to do the Research and put a little cash into the pot.
        Shame that those that should, science etc. have not done the same with Cold Fusion for 30 years.
        You guys raised the money before I got up this morning, well done.
        In my case Leonardo was wrong but his point is indisputable in general.
        ———
        “I awoke only to find that the rest of the world was still asleep.”
        ~Leonardo da Vinci

        • VicB2B

          Very good quote.

  • SG

    I think the 12 month base warranty is about what I would offer if in Steorn’s shoes from a purely business perspective. My refrigerator has a 12 month warranty but has run for about 10 years now. The fact that a warranty is set at 12 months does not tell the entire story or act as a dead giveaway.

  • Roger Barker

    I was thinking about the Orbo. These Steorn’ guys have been at it for a while. It
    would be great if they could get some proper testing done that shows excess energy. Much
    like what Rossi is doing with IH. Rossi’s tests are robust and prolonged and commercially
    to the point where it will be game changing. His product will be complete and, pound for
    pound, will be unbeatable when it hits the market. There are those on other forums, like the
    Mary’s, who are saying Rossi’s tests make no sense. But this is not true. They make good
    ass sense! His tactics are one of having a proper functioning device on the market. This is a
    good strategy and conclusive. What others say don’t matter.

    • SG

      Steorn got independent testing done but nobody believed the results. This was done years ago (I think the reports were posted to pesn). I think they feel that the only way to break the glass so to speak is to put a product into the stream of commerce and let the chips fall where they may.

      • Roger Barker

        I am not overly convinced with what Steorn has been offering for a while. What I
        want to see are Rossi like tests, long, stringent tests with independent oversight
        to what is happening. The more I think of Steorn, the more I think they are a bit
        tongue and cheek with the way they do things. Remember they have been doing
        that for 15 years, IIRC. Nobody needs to see the contents of the Orbo. Simple
        black box testing will suffice and they get to retain secrecy. Nobody can poke a
        hole in this argument.

        • invient

          The Wiki on Steorn isn’t flattering. They apparently ran a ad in a international magazine calling scientists to judge their device. A group of scientists they approved concluded there was not sufficient evidence for net energy production, and after two years stopped their efforts. Steorn denies the results.

          • VicB2B

            Wiki is FUD

  • snowvoardphil

    how about you’d charge a small fee to have people look at the results ? if it’s realy all it amounts to be I’d be glad to get somekind of ”third party” review for 5$ or so.

    If it does’nt work you could still send it back and TRY to get a refund before they go bust.

  • Ivan Idso

    So we know how much power it puts out, if we knew the weight then we could determjne how long it has to run to eliminate batteries. Correct?

  • Ivan Idso

    So we know how much power it puts out, if we knew the weight then we could determjne how long it has to run to eliminate batteries. Correct?

    • BillH

      That would mean that Steorn would have to provide a full specification, I’m pretty sure they haven’t yet.

  • SG

    Steorn got independent testing done but nobody believed the results. This was done years ago (I think the reports were posted to pesn). I think they feel that the only way to break the glass so to speak is to put a product into the stream of commerce and let the chips fall where they may.

  • Joseph J

    The minimum guarantee in the EU for consumer products is two years.

    http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/shopping/shopping-abroad/guarantees/index_en.htm

    • BillH

      Here’s the interesting section from your link:-

      “In some EU countries you must inform the seller of the fault within two months of discovering it otherwise you may lose your right to the guarantee.”

    • Private Citizen

      The internal lithium battery will definitely degrade. Hope that part is replaceable.

  • georgehants

    It seems to be missed a little that what this device can do is irrelevant, only if it is gaining some usable energy.
    We have a millions strong army of scientists and those with the slightest care about science will be over the moon that they can get their hands on such a discovery to improve it and of course that could lead to power stations etc. using the knowledge gained from this small beginning.
    Noting how science has handled the miraculous Cold Fusion, I am not very confident in our science establishments, to recognise things that are the only reason for their existence.
    From little acorns great oaks (possibly) grow.

  • georgehants

    It seems to be missed a little that what this device can do in it’s present form is irrelevant, only if it is gaining some usable energy.
    We have a millions strong army of scientists and those with the slightest care about science will be over the moon that they can get their hands on such a discovery to improve it and of course that could lead to power stations etc. using the knowledge gained from this small beginning.
    Noting how science has handled the miraculous Cold Fusion, I am not very confident in our science establishments to recognise things that are the only reason for their existence.
    From little acorns great oaks (possibly) grow.

  • Redford

    The joke with the “chick” was really awful, duh.
    1200 EUR ? Pricey for sure, but anyway such a device is only useful to ppl who really needs the feature.

  • SG

    Expensive? No doubt about that. But there is a market for it even at this price: the tinkerers, the curious, the wealthy who must have the latest cool gadget, the tech news sites that want to do a review, a government who wants to know what they might have up their sleeve, an Elon Musk who wants to figure it out as well, etc. The market might be small at the moment, but there is most definitely one. Of course, at a much lower price, the market would be much larger.

  • Agaricus

    I have a ‘mobile’ as we call them here (old but reliable), but as I can make a ten quid pay-as-you-go ‘top up’ last six months or so, I don’t exactly over-use it. My daughters say that this is because I’m a tight-fisted and miserable old git, but I prefer to think of it as efficient use of resources.

  • Bob Greenyer

    Found a link to download of the pulled Orbo webinar recording – LOTS of juicy details

    https://www.facebook.com/MartinFleischmannMemorialProject/

    They wanted it viral!

    • Private Citizen

      Can’t hear the presenter, because of the loud fellow in the background. Shame.

    • SG

      Nice written summary here: http://dispatchesfromthefuture.com/

      • Bob Greenyer

        That is indeed a very good summary – thanks for sharing

        The do say “two dissimilar magnets” which should be “two dissimilar metals”

  • Bob Greenyer

    Found a link to download of the Orbo webinar recording – LOTS of juicy details

    https://www.facebook.com/MartinFleischmannMemorialProject/

    They wanted it viral!

    • what do you mean pulled? I’m confused. I just watched the 20 minute thing. was this longer video put out on the same day, yesterday? which one is the “first webinar”?

      • Bob Greenyer

        different video, this was linked to by an MFMP follower on our FB page this morning.

        Actually … only just found out it was a different video!

    • Private Citizen

      Can’t hear the presenter, because of the loud fellow in the background. Shame.

    • SG

      Nice written summary here: http://dispatchesfromthefuture.com/

      • Bob Greenyer

        That is indeed a very good summary – thanks for sharing

        The do say “two dissimilar magnets” which should be “two dissimilar metals”?

        Also, according to this

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electret

        “An electret is a stable dielectric material with a quasi-permanently embedded static electric charge (which, due to the high resistance of the material, will not decay for time periods of up to hundreds of years)”

        “Historically, electrets were made by first melting a suitable dielectric material such as a polymer or wax that contains polar molecules, and then allowing it to re-solidify in a powerful electrostatic field.”

  • Private Citizen

    The internal lithium battery will definitely degrade. Hope that part is replaceable.

  • Zephir
  • Bob Greenyer

    different video, this was linked to by an MFMP follower on our FB page this morning.

  • georgehants

    Wonderful day

  • Bob Greenyer
    • Sanjeev

      If its just an ambient energy harvesting device, then its nothing unusual, but chances of the product being real go up.
      Anyway, its easy to test, just change the ambient temperature and see any change in output.

      Frank may like to include it in his test protocol.

      • ecatworld

        Yes, I will do.

  • Bob Greenyer

    Solved

    Here are some electret based thermal harvesting papers:

    http://arxiv.org/pdf/1310.4742.pdf

    http://arxiv.org/pdf/1212.0852.pdf

    http://arxiv.org/pdf/1301.6472.pdf

    http://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1742-6596/476/1/012079/pdf

    Vibration harvesting using electrets

    http://cdn.intechopen.com/pdfs-wm/40640.pdf

    “A patterned electret could operate as this voltage source.”

    http://www.memsjournal.com/energy-harvesting/

    It is essentially an ambient energy harvesting device – thermal or sound/vibration in this case.
    No “over unity” or ether / zero point energy in this one… and no nuclear mass to energy conversion.

    But a useful application of known science none the less

    It will work in a faraday cage

    https://goo.gl/rsXkVr

    • Sanjeev

      If its just an ambient energy harvesting device, then its nothing unusual, but chances of the product being real go up.
      Anyway, its easy to test, just change the ambient temperature and see any change in output.

      Frank may like to include it in his test protocol.

      • Frank Acland

        Yes, I will do.

  • Bob Greenyer

    My best guess after an hours research.

    Two dissimilar metal foils, I’d use those that are employed in TCs as a first guess – but maybe need a bit more research.

    Then I’d get some of this

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyvinylidene_fluoride

    from here

    http://goo.gl/GMGY5K

    warm.

    and then you would need a very high electrostatic field, you could use a vandergraph or tesla – but not so controllable. A neon sign transformer is much more manageable – but need to be careful, voltages can kill… apply over as short a distance and can be achieved without ionisation/dielectric breakdown and allow to cool.

  • Bob Greenyer

    My best guess after an hours research.

    Two dissimilar metal foils, I’d use those that are employed in TCs as a first guess – but maybe need a bit more research. Possibly Magnesium / copper

    Then I’d get some of this

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyvinylidene_fluoride

    from here

    http://goo.gl/GMGY5K

    warm to over 170ºC so that the Polyvinylidene Fluoride can become fluid.

    and then you would need a very high electrostatic field, you could use a vandergraph or tesla – but not so controllable. A neon sign transformer is much more manageable – but need to be careful, voltages can kill… apply over as short a distance and can be achieved without ionisation/dielectric breakdown and allow to cool.

    adding strain/defelection in the metals may improve energy harvesting characteristics – but I feel that differing thermal and vibrational response of the two metals accounts for part of the effect.

    I would suggest a dimple array, this could could be achieved in a cold press – metals are necessary as both charge collectors/contacts for electrodes and you want them obviously as good conductors and able to bond well with the Polyvinylidene Fluoride whilst having the largest thermal expansion variation. Some acid cleaning etching could improve bonding surfaces. I would also suggest some type of pre treatment of the metal either by heat or drawing before the cold pressing to accentuate thermal related shear on one or both of the metals and optimise on orientation.

    Higher voltage/power outputs would be achieved by back to back placement with an isolation layer in a layer cake fashion.

    Production could be off rolls of foil and semi-continuous with punch cuts (need to ensure metals do not contact as a result of cut) and zig zagged together.

    Might like to add some micron sized spheres of zirconia or alumina to act as spacers to ensure no contact – as long as it does not affect other properties.

    Having it in an aluminium case is a good choice as it will couple nicely to thermal changes in the environment. Anodised black would be also useful.

    A better product would include a solar panel for very little extra cost.

  • Bob Greenyer

    I would use rolled zinc (TE = 32.5) and titanium (TE = 8.4) as the two dissimilar metals.

    http://www.azahner.com/images/therma.movement.gif

    you can get both cheaply off ebay

    http://goo.gl/lDJL65

    http://goo.gl/lgHT8o

  • Bob Greenyer

    I would use rolled zinc (TE = 32.5) and titanium (TE = 8.4) as the two dissimilar metals.

    http://www.azahner.com/images/therma.movement.gif

    you can get both cheaply off ebay

    http://goo.gl/lDJL65

    http://goo.gl/lgHT8o

  • Bob Greenyer

    hey – cheap Polyvinylidene fluoride Sheet – throw this between the rolled zinc and titanium sheets from e-bay and heat to over 170ºC in a highly electro-static field and cool.

    http://aidmer.en.alibaba.com/product/765217511-218296706/Polyvinylidene_fluoride_Sheet_PVDF_Sheet.html

  • Bob Greenyer

    hey – cheap Polyvinylidene fluoride Sheet – throw this between the rolled zinc and titanium sheets from e-bay and heat to over 170ºC in a highly electro-static field and cool.

    http://aidmer.en.alibaba.com/product/765217511-218296706/Polyvinylidene_fluoride_Sheet_PVDF_Sheet.html

  • Bob Greenyer
    • BillH

      I’m not sure how this relates to Steorn, but it is none the less interesting, perhaps a new thread would be more appropriate. Harvesting energy from mechanical movement is not a new idea though, does anyone remember the self-winding watch? The devil as always will be in the detail and whether it can be done profitably. So far it is little more than an un-costed scientific investigation funded by the public purse.

  • Bob Greenyer
    • BillH

      I’m not sure how this relates to Steorn, but it is none the less interesting, perhaps a new thread would be more appropriate. Harvesting energy from mechanical movement is not a new idea though, does anyone remember the self-winding watch? The devil as always will be in the detail and whether it can be done profitably. So far it is little more than an un-costed scientific investigation funded by the public purse.

  • Adam Lepczak

    Question to you guys: Based on the information and dissection of the Orbo, would it qualify to be called an overunity device – provided that i works?

    • ecatworld

      If it can be shown to produce more energy than is available from a battery or other chemical reaction, and if it can be shown not to be harvesting energy from the atmosphere (e.g. EM waves or ambient heat), then I think you might be able to call it overunity.

      • ecatworld

        OTOH, if it is storing a permanent electric field, then you might call it a type of energy storage.

    • Bob Greenyer

      The materials most likely to have been used are actively being researched across the globe for powering sensors and more, indeed, they have been doing just that in electret microphones since they were invented. I link to papers discussing this below – I got bored of cut and pasting as there were so many!

      Orbo is not a trivial thing to have achieved though – they must have spent a lot of time making the interesting property useful and manufacturable – which is commendable. They have made an idea a reality.

      In the video they say that most of the “protection” is the brand – and I’d wager that is the reality – I’d like to see if there is something they have done that is not derivative or obvious.

      The reality is though unless it works in a thermally controlled box ( ZERO temperature variation ) and one that is vibration and sound proof and also faraday cage in case they have an RF harvester, it is nothing more amazing than a good ambient energy harvester.

  • Adam Lepczak

    Question to you guys: Based on the information and dissection of the Orbo, would it qualify to be called an overunity device – provided that i works?

    • Frank Acland

      If it can be shown to produce more energy than is available from a battery or other chemical reaction, and if it can be shown not to be harvesting energy from the atmosphere (e.g. EM waves or ambient heat), then I think you might be able to call it overunity.

      • Frank Acland

        OTOH, if it is storing a permanent electric field, then you might call it a type of energy storage.

      • Stephen Haigh

        You missed off vibrational energy. It may be harvesting vibrational energy. There are already devices that can harvest apparently 40mW vibrational, So orbo is claiming 10x that.
        In any case overunity is a badly defined term that has little meaning and lots of negative connections.
        Ecat is not overunity, just a very interesting nuclear phenomenon, which is why i come to this site.

        • Bob Greenyer

          Indeed, my Brother uses the Piezo in his Nano Air Vehicle motor to harvest vibrational energy to re-charge the vehicles Lithium based cell.

    • Bob Greenyer

      The materials most likely to have been used are actively being researched across the globe for powering sensors and more, indeed, they have been doing just that in electret microphones since they were invented. I link to papers discussing this below – I got bored of cut and pasting as there were so many!

      Orbo is not a trivial thing to have achieved though – they must have spent a lot of time making the interesting property useful and manufacturable – which is commendable. They have made an idea a reality.

      In the video they say that most of the “protection” is the brand – and I’d wager that is the reality – I’d like to see if there is something they have done that is not derivative or obvious.

      The reality is though unless it works in a thermally controlled box ( ZERO temperature variation ) and one that is vibration and sound proof and also faraday cage in case they have an RF harvester, it is nothing more amazing than a good ambient energy harvester.

  • Sanjeev

    The deleted video is now on youtube.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLyT8taxR4w

  • Sanjeev

    The deleted video is now on youtube.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLyT8taxR4w

  • David Taylor-Fuller

    I think your wrong in your analysis BillH.

    comparing what they are offering to a battery pack currently on the market only makes sense if you assume that once the orbo power cube is depleted you will need to get a new one from Steorn. Also, the 12 months warranty isn’t the problem. It is more than ok to offer a 12 month warranty, since the components in the orbo power cube isnt just the orbo power pack. It is a traditional lithium battery that is trickle charged by the orbo power pack. so unless steorn can source battery packs with more an a 12month warranty it would be business suicide to offer an infinite warranty. That said, lets say two months go by and it stops working. the likely scenario for the frugal gadget geek would be to break out the screw driver remove the lithium ion battery pack and replace it with something else. Since once could easily test if the orbo powerpack is still working by connecting the power leads from the ORBO power pack in the ORBO power cube to a volt/amp meter.

    Now the real problem I see with steorn is if all they have done is build an electret. Which according to some brief googling is a known thing that is used in microphones today. WHY DOESNT THIS ALREADY EXIST. What is it that steorn is doing that is unique enough to get a patent.