Q & A with Andrea Rossi on E-Cat X Stress Testing (Update: "Tremendous Step Forward for Massive Production" Made Today)

UPDATE: (February 9, 2016)

Here’s a comment from Andrea Rossi today regarding the E-Cat X:

Andrea Rossi
February 9, 2016 at 4:31 PM
Italo R.:
very premature, but I want to add that today the E-Cat X made a tremendous step forward a massive production. Today I am very happy.
Warmest Regards
A.R.

As usual we get no details, but Rossi seems to be looking beyond the current test these days and is looking towards the industrialization phase of his E-Cat project which he has said will begin once the current test is completed.

Some more quotes on the topic from AR:

Today we got a ‘loophole’.
Much work remains to be done but in less time than expected, I hope.

Today we had a very good step forward that makes me hope to give soon not just more data, but information about the massive production of the Ecat X.
What I have seen today with my eyes was not expected so soon. We got some exponential.

++++++++++++++++++++++

Jan 25, 2016

I thought it would be important to include this short Q&A between Joseph Fine and Andrea Rossi regarding the E-Cat X, which Rossi has said he has been putting through some stress testing:

Joseph Fine

Andrea Rossi,

1. What is the most recent status of the 1 MW E-Cat System and the E-Cat X (following the recent test)? AR: good standing

2. How long did the recent E-Cat X “Stress test” last? AR: a month

3. Did you try the E-Cat X “Stress test” more than once? AR: we will

4. Can you comment on the (approximate) maximum temperature achieved by the E-Cat X? AR:  not yet

5. What is the average duration of Self-Sustained- Mode (SSM) operation? AR: hours

“Curiouser and curiouser” Regards,

Joseph Fine

Andrea Rossi also said that recently they have carrying out destructive testing on the E-Cat X, and just reported that “E-Cat X resisting to the destructive attempt, good sign.” I take this to mean they were not able to destroy it. Giuliano Bettini asked Rossi if they used too much heat, or too much electricity in their attempt to destroy it, and Rossi responded: “too much heat.”

I guess the part that was the most interesting to me above is that the E-Cat X has been able to run in self-sustain mode for hours — presumably while also producing electricity as well as heat, based on Rossi’s recent reports. As usual, however, we get only minimal details, so a lot is left to our imagination. Hopefully more information will be forthcoming.

  • Billy Jackson

    Keeping in Spirit of Mr. Rossi’s short but poignant update!
    My response is: More Please!
    (i swear one of these days i am going to mail that man a thesaurus!)

  • Jouni Tuomela

    Please Mr Rossi, do try to get more funding, to have at least ten of those soon to be X-Cats running and melting along!

  • Billy Jackson

    Keeping in Spirit of Mr. Rossi’s short but poignant update!
    My response is: More Please!
    (i swear one of these days i am going to mail that man a thesaurus!)

  • LindbergofSwed

    was is the e cat x in ssm?

    • artefact

      The e-cat x in self sustained mode (without input)
      The reaction keeps going by itself. There is just a stimuli of some W as input.

      • LindbergofSwed

        Sorry, I meant was it really the e cat x in ssm, it seems like it could be the normal e cat he meant?

        • jaman73

          I had the same thought. When you get a short answer to a short question, you could come up short. (And it was my question.)
          Having said that, if the original E-Cat operates in SSM, the E-Cat X probably could also operate in SSM mode,

        • Omega Z

          The E-cat X runs in SSM.

          One of the Things Rossi has mentioned is that it may br capable of much longer periods of SSM the the other E-cats…

      • Axil Axil

        What does “W as input” mean?

        • artefact

          That should be something like “30 Watts of input electricity like in earlier models”

  • Brokeeper

    Didn’t AR mention the E-Cat X had a quick startup time? With an SSM mode sustained for hours I would think it would take little time and power to bring it back to optimum state. If so, this implies to me the E-Cat X COP is well above 100.

  • Brokeeper

    Didn’t AR mention the E-Cat X had a quick startup time? With an SSM mode sustained for hours I would think it would take little time and power to bring it back to optimum state. If so, this implies to me the E-Cat X COP is well above 100.

  • Well, if you are sucking energy in the form of electricity out of the E-Cat X, I would think that would make it allot more difficult to overheat the device. Electricity producing E-Cats should be inherently more safe and controllable than just using an E-Cat to produce only heat.

    • Gerard McEk

      Exactly. About two years ago Axil and I already suggested that the runaway could probably be damped by short circuiting the coil expecting that induction caused LENR. Now I It seems that it is not induction, but a DC current that is the main cause. If you want to initiate LENR, run a current trough the fuel, if you want to control it consume power or run power through it. Current can be induced with induction like some Russian labs are doing and that causes LENR, but it is easier running a current (AC or DC) through the fuel, but the current source must also be able to take a DC current. I hope that will be tested soon.

      • That seems to be the principle of operation in the ecat-x wafer, if not the earlier e-cats. Probably any force that can vibrate an electron cloud will do – oscillating EM field, pulsed DC, even possibly a rapidly varying electrostatic field, e.g. a spinning charged plate.

        In ecat-x the ‘heater’ plates may just be electrodes with current (pulsed DC) flowing between each pair and giving rise to resistance heating. Modulation of voltage and/or frequency provides control of the reaction, and the gap between the steel plates may determine the resonant frequency of the ‘cell’.

  • builditnow

    Navy spends $160 million converting waste beef fat into fuel.
    Navy Deploys ‘Great Green Fleet’
    http://freebeacon.com/national-security/navy-deploys-great-green-fleet/

    Anything to pretend we are doing something.

    Sanjay Gupta in his weekend GPS from Davros says that no one understands why the price of oil is going so low. It’s easy folks, a year ago the Persian “Gulf News” reported on the Indian government rush to LENR. The Saudi’s read this and they believe it. The Saudi’s are therefore aiming to be the last to pump oil and their decision keep pumping has kept everyone pumping, now out of desperation at the low price, hence helping to create an oil glut just as the demand for oil has dipped a bit. I wonder if Sanjay Gupta knows better but is not game to say anything.

    • SG

      It is the unspoken truth. Well, at least unspoken in most places except for here and a few other blogs. For those like Gupta and others to publicly admit what is true but not spoken about, would result in nothing but public ridicule. So, those in power *and* in the know continue to pretend that LENR doesn’t exist and has no chance of making any difference on the world stage. I question whether that is the best behavior that we as a species can muster.

    • Bernie Simon

      Something I didn’t know until I saw it on a Youtube video: A little more than a year ago the Rockefellers sold all their oil assets, $50 billion dollars worth.

      http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-29310475

      For those unfamiliar with their history, the Rockefeller fortune was founded on the Standard Oil company, so this was a huge deal. The press release said it was part of the campaign to fight global warming, but I am wondering if LENR also played a part in this decision.

      • bachcole

        For me, this could go either way or both. Although John D. Rockefeller was a hypocritical (believed in natural healing but funded and supported the pharmaceutical industry simply for profit, and to hell with you) POS, his grandson was quite the decent fellow who even lived with the miners in Colorado so as to understand their perspective during a labor conflict (that shows a serious commitment to goodness). The family could very well have believed in the reality of man-made global warming and LENR. Many good and decent people here think likewise.

      • Omega Z

        Warren Buffet sold all his oil stocks.

        However, he bought the railroad that transports all the oil from the oil sands with a cool 15 Billion$ share value increase in months. He also invested in the suppliers of piping the oil & gas companies companies use. Yes, Very Green.

        Bill Gates has serious investments in Oil.
        He also placed financial bets on LENR as well as other alternatives.
        How do you reconcile that???

        • Frank Acland
          • Roland

            Berkshire Hathaway had an exceptionaly poor 2015.

          • Omega Z

            I guess I missed that. I know Bill Gates thinks everyone is nuts to sell out of Oil stocks.

            And George Soros bought into coal stocks. When the price tumbled, he bought more. Actually, if you buy it cheap enough, there will be money to be made for many decades to come in all the fossil energies.

            Transitions take time & new uses will be found or some current uses continued.

    • Omega Z

      Oil prices are probably so low because we could pump zero Oil for about 2 months without anyone running out of oil. Note Even tho China is buying less oil, it is still buying more oil then needed & building storage as fast as possible. Taking advantage of the low prices.

      We continue to pump 2 million barrels a day more then is being used. This just continues to add to the oil in storage. They will soon run out of storage and have nowhere to store it..

      However, All oil needs will still be purchased as needed, because at $10/$20 a barrel, it is cheaper then the price they paid for what they have in storage. This will prolong the low oil prices.

  • artefact

    On JONP:

    “Umbi January 25th, 2016 at 2:19 PM

    Have a NEWS for domestic E-CAT ?
    1) Timing for Marketing?
    AR: Depends on F9
    2) COP?
    AR: >6, F9
    3) Duration charge ?
    AR: 6-12 months
    4) Will be X-CAT or E-CAT?
    AR: both

    Thank you”

  • artefact

    On JONP:

    “Umbi January 25th, 2016 at 2:19 PM

    Have a NEWS for domestic E-CAT ?
    1) Timing for Marketing?
    AR: Depends on F9
    2) COP?
    AR: >6, F9
    3) Duration charge ?
    AR: 6-12 months
    4) Will be X-CAT or E-CAT?
    AR: both

    Thank you”

  • Jonnyb

    This sounds very promising, don’t worry folks recon we will be there soon.

    • Zephir

      It depends on what the “soon” is supposed to mean. The first demos of E-Cat did run in January 2011 in Bologne. Now we are five years later and we even haven’t see any demo. The five-years timeframe apparently means nothing here.

      • Jonnyb

        5 years for a total new energy source is not long. If you consider the science behind it is not fully understood, it is a miracle that Andrea has got this far. Don’t forget with LENR and/or Cold Fusion there are may obstacles from main stream science to overcome as well.

        • bachcole

          We don’t really know how long this sort of thing takes because there is no “this sort of thing”. This event is completely unique in the entire history of the human race. We are now learning how long this “sort of thing” will take since this is the first time.

          • Alan DeAngelis

            Yes, I never thought I’d see anything as wonder as
            the E-Cat in my lifetime. Rossi put an end to all the “Please, May I have a cup
            of tea?” jokes. The same sort of joke Ignas Semmelweis put up with when he
            proposed the practice of washing hands with chlorinated lime solution in 1847
            while working in Vienna Generaltal’s First Obstetrical Clinic. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignaz_Semmelweis

          • Alan DeAngelis
  • Zephir

    So could we see at least something glowing without apparent source of external energy (no wires/cables)? Is it really so difficult to show us at least something? I’m getting tired with the virtual character of E-Cat news.

    • LarryJ

      Nobody but us followers would lend any credence to such a demo. It would be preaching to the choir and a total waste of time. The only demo that counts is the one you do yourself with products off the shelf.

  • Pekka Janhunen

    I have actually no idea what “How long did the recent E-Cat X “Stress test” last? AR: a month” refers to. I thought it has been running for 2+ months continuously, without a particular stress test other than being on, and since about new year also electricity being captured, before that only heat.

    • I missed that, too. Normally I just put such things down to advancing senility.

      • Owen Geiger

        I thought he said he’s running several E-Cat Xs. Apparently one was put through a separate stress test.

        • Omega Z

          Yes, He is running 3 E-cat X reactors simultaneously. About 2 months now.

          One is being run through a stress test.

          The other 2 are for obtaining other information..

          • mike wolf

            Yea, that is the way I remember it.

    • Reads fine to me that it was b+c.

  • Pekka Janhunen

    I have actually no idea what “How long did the recent E-Cat X “Stress test” last? AR: a month” refers to. I thought it has been running for 2+ months continuously, without a particular stress test other than being on, and since about new year also electricity being captured, before that only heat.

    • I missed that, too. Normally I just put such things down to advancing senility.

      • Owen Geiger

        I thought he said he’s running several E-Cat Xs. Apparently one was put through a separate stress test.

        • Omega Z

          Yes, He is running 3 E-cat X reactors simultaneously. About 2 months now.

          One is being run through a stress test.

          The other 2 are for obtaining other information..

          • mike wolf

            Yea, that is the way I remember it.

  • Mike

    Only a few days ago the 1 MW ecat needed major redesign if I remember correctly. In the answer above the status is “good standing”…..confusing

    • Omega Z

      Due to knowledge obtained throughout the 1 year test, there will be modifications to the 1MW. This should surprise nobody as this is the 1st long term test under load. Issues were expected to be found and need modifications.

      As to Rossi’s “good standing”,

      Note that the question encompasses both the 1MW and the E-cat X. So I agree, it may be confusing.

      Rossi has often stated the the E-cat X is in good standing meaning all is well at this time. I’ll assume he means all is well with both the 1MW plant & the E-cat X at this time.

  • Omega Z

    Due to knowledge obtained throughout the 1 year test, there will be modifications to the 1MW. This should surprise nobody as this is the 1st long term test under load. Issues were expected to be found and need modifications.

    As to Rossi’s “good standing”,

    Note that the question encompasses both the 1MW and the E-cat X. So I agree, it may be confusing.

    Rossi has often stated the the E-cat X is in good standing meaning all is well at this time. I’ll assume he means all is well with both the 1MW plant & the E-cat X at this time.

  • Andrea Rossi

    February 9, 2016 at 6:00 PM

    Italo R.:

    Today we got a ‘loophole’.

    Much work remains to be done but in less time than expected, I hope.

    Warm Regards

    A.R.

    Andrea Rossi

    February 9, 2016 at 5:52 PM

    Giuseppe:

    Today we had a very good step forward that makes me hope to give soon not just more data, but information about the massive production of the Ecat X.

    What I have seen today with my eyes was not expected so soon. We got some exponential.

    Warm Regards

    Andrea
    ——-

    “Massive production” – Meaning industrialization or production of energy?

    “Exponential” – Meaning a significant increase in electricity production?

    • LarryJ

      Today when asked by Janne whether the advancement was technological or regulatory Rossi responded:

      Janne:
      Technological
      Warm Regards,
      A.R.

      When asked by ItaloR about progress on certifications Rossi responded:

      Italo R.:
      Today we got a ‘loophole’.
      Much work remains to be done but in less time than expected, I hope.
      Warm Regards
      A.R.

      Combined this sounds to me like Rossi has made a technological advance that has removed a barrier to certification and will result in an assist to the implementation of a massive production. He had earlier commented that the ecatX was proving difficult to destroy which might also affect safety issues around certification.

  • Andrea Rossi

    February 9, 2016 at 6:00 PM

    Italo R.:

    Today we got a ‘loophole’.

    Much work remains to be done but in less time than expected, I hope.

    Warm Regards

    A.R.

    Andrea Rossi

    February 9, 2016 at 5:52 PM

    Giuseppe:

    Today we had a very good step forward that makes me hope to give soon not just more data, but information about the massive production of the Ecat X.

    What I have seen today with my eyes was not expected so soon. We got some exponential.

    Warm Regards

    Andrea
    ——-

    “Massive production” – Meaning industrialization or production of energy?

    “Exponential” – Meaning a significant increase in electricity production?

    • LarryJ

      Today when asked by Janne whether the advancement was technological or regulatory Rossi responded:

      Janne:
      Technological
      Warm Regards,
      A.R.

      When asked by ItaloR about progress on certifications Rossi responded:

      Italo R.:
      Today we got a ‘loophole’.
      Much work remains to be done but in less time than expected, I hope.
      Warm Regards
      A.R.

      Combined this sounds to me like Rossi has made a technological advance that has removed a barrier to certification which will result in an assist to the implementation of a massive production. He had earlier commented that the ecatX was proving difficult to destroy which might also be connected to safety issues around certification. I am sure one of the issues around certification is the toxicity of the powders being used. Just a wild guess but perhaps the destructive test produced a failure that resulted in a non explosive meltdown of the reactor which safely encapsulated the powders and thus the technological loophole.

  • Buck

    The following is an example of drawing too many conclusions from a series of coincidences.

    I think it very interesting that concurrent with the US Supreme Court setting aside today of Pres. Obama’s executive order for accelerating CO2 emission reductions from power plants, Rossi describes a “loophole” that will hopefully allow a rapid “massive production” and distribution of the E-Cat X.

    And for me, it is sending off today an email to my US Congresswoman who asked for information about LENR after I approached her at a very recent “Town Hall” meeting. It was a nice Town Hall meeting where my US Senator and US Congresswoman held a joint meeting. I shared links about ITPR1 & ITPR2, including those from Forbes, Fortune, ExtremeTech, Elforsk, Mats Lewan’s hometurf of NyTekNik, and of course ECatWorld.

    I also approached my Senator with the exact same intent. His response was interesting . . . you would have had to have been there to see that his words did not match his body language. He was polite in directing me to ARPA-E and Gate’s Energy Innovations about LENR, but he locked up when I in direct response quickly referenced Gates being caught on the YouTube video of being introduced to LENR in Italy. His words said one thing, disinterest, however his locked up body language to me suggested knowledge and interest. Maybe that interest is tied to his very recent establishment and announcement of a public policy position for leaving 80% of Fossil Fuels in the ground . . . a no lose position when LENR comes to town.

    • TomR

      Thanks for the information, Buck. I think your assessment of this is right on target. I think Obama is going to do an end run on this.

    • The first instinct of most politicians is to lie, even when lies serve no purpose. If you’d told him you had proof positive that the sun would rise again tomorrow he would probably have decided that this was probably a National Security issue, and tried to cover it up.

      • Buck

        Agaricus,

        I believe your answer mixes together the good and bad of politics to the point of confusion.

        Would you say the same thing of Congresswoman Anna Eshoo who sponsored the demonstration of LENR technology for Congress this last November? I think it very reasonable to conclude that this demonstration caused curiosity and further research by those in Congress. Which members, I can only guess.

        But for me, my Senator’s response was telling.

  • Buck

    The following is an example of drawing too many conclusions from a series of coincidences.

    I think it very interesting that concurrent with the US Supreme Court setting aside today of Pres. Obama’s executive order for accelerating CO2 emission reductions from power plants, Rossi describes a “loophole” that will hopefully allow a rapid “massive production” and distribution of the E-Cat X.

    And for me, it is sending off today an email to my US Congresswoman who asked for information about LENR after I approached her at a very recent Town Hall meeting. It was a nice joint Town Hall meeting with both my US Senator and US Congresswoman. I shared links about ITPR1, ITPR2, and the 12 month Pilot Plant trial, including those from Forbes, Fortune, ExtremeTech, Elforsk, Mats Lewan’s hometurf of NyTekNik, and of course ECatWorld.

    I also approached my Senator with the exact same intent. His response was interesting . . . you would have had to have been there to see that his words did not match his body language. He was polite in directing me to ARPA-E and Gate’s Energy Innovations about LENR, but he locked up when I in direct response quickly referenced Gates being caught on the YouTube video of being introduced to LENR in Italy. His words said one thing, disinterest, however his locked up body language to me suggested knowledge and interest. Maybe that interest is tied to his very recent establishment and announcement last week of a public policy position for leaving 80% of Fossil Fuels in the ground . . . a no lose political position when LENR comes to town.

    • TomR

      Thanks for the information, Buck. I think your assessment of this is right on target. I think Obama is going to do an end run on this.

    • The first instinct of most politicians is to lie, even when lies serve no purpose. Perhaps they suffer from some rare form of synesthesia, and telling the truth causes them pain.

      • Buck

        Agaricus,

        I believe your response mixes together the good and bad of politics to the point of confusion.

        Would you say the same thing of Congresswoman Anna Eshoo, a ranking member of the powerful Energy & Commerce Committee, who sponsored the demonstration of LENR technology for Congress this last November? I think it very reasonable to conclude that this demonstration caused curiosity and further research by those in Congress. Which members, I can only guess.

        But for me, my Senator’s response was telling.

  • Well, the world sure needs some good news right now. I just hope Mr. Rossi starts talking to the media so that his progress can affect national and world energy policy. A big flashy news conference could help a lot. When the hysterical fear of CO2 meets the prospect of low cost, reliable, carbon free E-Cat technology, it could be explosive in a good way.

  • Well, the world sure needs some good news right now. I just hope Mr. Rossi starts talking to the media so that his progress can affect national and world energy policy. A big flashy news conference could help a lot. When the hysterical fear of CO2 meets the prospect of low cost, reliable, carbon free E-Cat technology, it could be explosive in a good way.

  • Pekka Janhunen

    Maybe they made one or more E-cat X units by an automated process and it worked. Or perhaps they made (still by hand) a version of E-cat X which they know will be possible to manufacture more easily.

    • giovanniontheweb

      I think more on certificates

      • Gerald

        from jonp:

        Sebastian

        February 9, 2016 at 6:50 PM

        Dear Andrea,

        When you say “the E-Cat X made a tremendous step forward a massive production”, do you mean:

        a) progress in the regulatory/legal area?

        b) progress with the E-cat X itself, in the production of electricity (such as better COP)?

        c) progress in the mass production of the E-cat X itself?

        Andrea Rossi

        February 9, 2016 at 9:40 PM

        Sebastian:

        b + c

        Warm Regards,

        A.R.

        • giovanniontheweb

          well, better than expected

  • Pekka Janhunen

    Maybe they made one or more E-cat X units by an automated process and it worked. Or perhaps they made (still by hand) a version of E-cat X which they know will be possible to manufacture more easily.

    • giovanniontheweb

      I think more on certificates

      • Gerald

        from jonp:

        Sebastian

        February 9, 2016 at 6:50 PM

        Dear Andrea,

        When you say “the E-Cat X made a tremendous step forward a massive production”, do you mean:

        a) progress in the regulatory/legal area?

        b) progress with the E-cat X itself, in the production of electricity (such as better COP)?

        c) progress in the mass production of the E-cat X itself?

        Andrea Rossi

        February 9, 2016 at 9:40 PM

        Sebastian:

        b + c

        Warm Regards,

        A.R.

        • giovanniontheweb

          well, better than expected

  • Reads fine to me that it was b+c.

  • Jonnyb

    Self Sustain I hope!!

  • Gerard McEk

    So AR is preparing for mass production. I hope he contacted Elon Musk to put some of these Ecats in a Tesla and drive with it around the world. That would be a huge promotion for both the Ecat and Tesla.

    • Ophelia Rump

      Musk might not be so keen on the idea. It would gut the economy of batteries. Battery cost is somewhere around ten cents per mile for an EV. The electricity only costs about four cents.
      The batteries are the fuel for EVs more so than the electricity.

      • SD

        I think Musk sees further ahead than his current profits on batteries.

        • Ophelia Rump

          I bet he does not see this one coming.

          Musk is betting 5 Billion on the profitability of the battery. That is the cost of the factory to make the batteries.

          When the vehicle only requires 1 battery instead of 74, if you scaled that 5 billlion down also, the factory might only be worth a 67 Million investment. That is a lot of altruism. I would not presume upon anyone’s altruism to that degree.

          • Ophelia Rump

            Tesla is taking a loss on the vehicles, the battery business is the profit center.
            Without selling 74 cells per car, Tesla is doomed. Musk is worth 13 Billion. The E-Cat could hurt him badly.

            http://seekingalpha.com/article/3885356-tesla-earnings-loss-per-car-net-margin-hit-frightening-levels

            Tesla Earnings: Loss Per Car, Net Margin Hit Frightening Levels
            Loss per car sold at near-record high: $18,331.

          • EEStorFanFibb

            The loss per car metric is simply misleading. every bit of revenue is going back into the business to massively expand production. Tesla is fine, and not being “profitable” at this time is expected and completely warranted.

          • wondering

            @opheliarump:disqus
            Perhaps you are right but at least intuitively I wouldn’t think so. I thought batteries were the most expensive part of an EV, everything else being simpler in EVs than in ICE vehicles. With an energy source like the ECat-X (if real) then I guess you wouldn’t even bother with regenerative braking either, energy savings are not worth it.
            Of course the Tesla can be said to needlessly expensive in that is is such a high tech car. On the other hand for the mass market you need to mass volume for costs to come down, so you’d be stuck in a catch 22. So it made sense for them to aim for the high end at first, then move towards a car for the mass market.

          • Steve Savage

            It might be possible that Musk’s battery factory ends up producing the E-cat !

          • ecatworld

            Interesting news about Tesla Motors today. The Model 3 Electric Car will launch in March at a price of $35,000 — in the US that’s before Federal and State tax credits. With those in place you could pay as little as $18,000 for the car. I reckon this will get many more EVs on the roads.

            http://thenextweb.com/gadgets/2016/02/10/tesla-to-debut-35000-model-3-in-march/

          • jousterusa

            I just hope our “imagination” has not led us into yjr frpths of a confidence game of massive proportions. We can only go so long awaiting test results.

        • giovanniontheweb

          batteries do not produce energy, e-cat does

      • Gerard McEk

        Musk can sell it as life-time fuel! 😉

    • bkrharold

      ecat-x would be perfect for automobiles. The electricity component would charge a small economical battery range 50-80 miles, the heat would provide direct power to the wheels with a steam engine. Nothing would be wasted.

  • Gerard McEk

    So AR is preparing for mass production. I hope he contacted Elon Musk to put some of these Ecats in a Tesla and drive with it around the world. That would be a huge promotion for both the Ecat and Tesla.

    • Ophelia Rump

      Musk might not be so keen on the idea. It would gut the economy of batteries. Battery cost is somewhere around ten cents per mile for an EV. The electricity only costs about four cents.
      The batteries are the fuel for EVs more so than the electricity.

      • SD

        I think Musk sees further ahead than his current profits on batteries.

        • Ophelia Rump

          I bet he does not see this one coming.

          Musk is betting 5 Billion on the profitability of the battery. That is the cost of the factory to make the batteries.

          When the vehicle only requires 1 battery instead of 74, if you scaled that 5 billlion down also, the factory might only be worth a 67 Million investment. That is a lot of altruism. I would not presume upon anyone’s altruism to that degree.

          • Panasonic is on the hook for much of that 5 billion, not just Tesla. And since Elon said that 100s of gigafactory battery plants will be needed to meet EV/stationary demand even if your 1/74 ratio is correct that Nevada plant could still be fully utilized.

          • mcloki

            The battery business will be huge. Each e-cat could utilize a battery storage device to even out usage.

          • Ophelia Rump

            No one is going to pay for a superfluous battery. They will only be used where there is a need and in proportion to the need. Redundant Cats will be less expensive than the batteries and lighter.

          • DrD

            Possibly true if the economics and reliabilty mean it makes sense to leave the Cat running 24/7 AND the E-Cat output can be controlled with a fast response time which ought to be possible even if it means “dumping” power. Methinks It needs high electric power to start up. A small battery makes sense.

          • roseland67

            Nobody, anywhere knows that to be true,
            Battery costs are known, relatively fixed,
            (and continually going down), safe and proven, the Ecat? Not so much!
            Hopefully soon, but we have all been saying that since January, 2011.
            Battery storage will be around for the rest of many of our lifetimes .

          • Ophelia Rump

            Tesla is taking a loss on the vehicles, the battery business is the profit center.
            Without selling 74 cells per car, Tesla is doomed. Musk is worth 13 Billion. The E-Cat could hurt him badly.

            http://seekingalpha.com/article/3885356-tesla-earnings-loss-per-car-net-margin-hit-frightening-levels

            Tesla Earnings: Loss Per Car, Net Margin Hit Frightening Levels
            Loss per car sold at near-record high: $18,331.

          • The loss per car metric is simply misleading. every bit of revenue is going back into the business to massively expand production. Tesla is fine, and not being “profitable” at this time is expected and completely warranted.

          • wondering

            @opheliarump:disqus
            Perhaps you are right but at least intuitively I wouldn’t think so. I thought batteries were the most expensive part of an EV, everything else being simpler in EVs than in ICE vehicles. With an energy source like the ECat-X (if real) then I guess you wouldn’t even bother with regenerative braking either, energy savings are not worth it.
            Of course the Tesla can be said to needlessly expensive in that is is such a high tech car. On the other hand for the mass market you need to mass volume for costs to come down, so you’d be stuck in a catch 22. So it made sense for them to aim for the high end at first, then move towards a car for the mass market.

          • Steve Savage

            It might be possible that Musk’s battery factory ends up producing the E-cat !

          • Frank Acland

            Interesting news about Tesla Motors today. The Model 3 Electric Car will launch in March at a price of $35,000 — in the US that’s before Federal and State tax credits. With those in place you could pay as little as $18,000 for the car. I reckon this will get many more EVs on the roads.

            http://thenextweb.com/gadgets/2016/02/10/tesla-to-debut-35000-model-3-in-march/

          • roseland67

            Frank,
            interesting proposition bet here,
            what gets commercialized first, the Model III or the ECAT?

            I will take Tesla in Q1 of 2018

          • roseland67

            He is betting on it because he KNOWS it works NOW and can
            be safely manufactured, supplied, installed, operated and maintained
            for a known cost.
            As of today, he, (like all of us), do not KNOW that about ECAT,
            maybe someday, but not today.

        • giovanniontheweb

          batteries do not produce energy, e-cat does

      • Musk doesn’t care about the stationary battery business all that much. If there was a commercially viable, on board electricity generator able to charge his teslas as they drove around he would be all over it.

        • Gerard McEk

          I indeed think so too. His battery store system must compensate for the battery under demand of his cars, all with the aim to bring the battery price of his cars (and the car price-) down.

      • Gerard McEk

        Musk can sell it as life-time fuel! 😉

      • roseland67

        Ophelia, maybe, maybe not.
        IF, the ECAT could power an onboard generator that would charge the batteries,
        then the battery plant could be made much smaller, lighter and cost effective,
        His electric drive train design stays intact.
        This would be a monumental move forward in the BEV market but to do this,
        Rossi has to show the world his product works, is safe, reliable, repairable, cost effective etc, and as of the last 5 years, nada.
        Improved battery chemistry will be the way forward for Tesla, not ECAT power.

    • bkrharold

      ecat-x would be perfect for automobiles. The electricity component would charge a small economical battery range 50-80 miles, the heat would provide direct power to the wheels with a steam engine. Nothing would be wasted.

      • DrD

        if as AR says, the E-Cat-x can do 100% electric (I assume that’s “almost 100%”), why would you suffer a steam system as well.
        One of my concerns is how responsive is the output to changes in demand.
        The answer may be a hybrid, small battery plus small E-Cat-x. You’d need a battery anyway.

        • bkrharold

          I was suggesting the waste heat could be put to good use, creating a hybrid.

      • roseland67

        Christopher,

        Tesla has 2 products that have been proven to work, for which demand can’t be met,
        a market cap of billions, employees already working in “robotized” factories and
        another such mfg. facility in process, these are visible to anyone, they work now.

        Rossi has a grand total of NOTHING, yet, NOTHING, maybe soon, maybe not.

        Musk doesn’t need Rossi, he needs battery chemistry improvements.

  • artefact

    On JONP:

    “Jed February 10, 2016 at 8:37 AM
    Dr Andrea Rossi,
    Congratulations for your US Patent.
    49% chance that the E-Cat will be industrialized by 2016: is it too high a figure?
    Cheers,
    Jed

    Andrea Rossi February 10, 2016 at 9:32 AM
    Jed:
    No, it is not too high a figure.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.”

  • artefact

    On JONP:

    “Jed February 10, 2016 at 8:37 AM
    Dr Andrea Rossi,
    Congratulations for your US Patent.
    49% chance that the E-Cat will be industrialized by 2016: is it too high a figure?
    Cheers,
    Jed

    Andrea Rossi February 10, 2016 at 9:32 AM
    Jed:
    No, it is not too high a figure.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.”

    • bachcole

      artefact, now ask him the same question only at say 66%. (:->)

  • Gerard McEk

    I indeed think so too. His battery store system must compensate for the battery under demand of his cars, all with the aim to bring the battery price of his cars (and the car price-) down.

  • mcloki

    The battery business will be huge. Each e-cat could utilize a battery storage device to even out usage.

    • Ophelia Rump

      No one is going to pay for a superfluous battery. They will only be used where there is a need and in proportion to the need. Redundant Cats will be less expensive than the batteries and lighter.

      • bkrharold

        I was suggesting the waste heat could be put to good use, creating a hybrid.

  • Roland

    Given the ambiguous nature of Rossi’s communications it is possible to read this latest missive as a reference to an exponential increase in the output of the E-cat X, hence more hopefulness for its production potential.

    Like many others I’d welcome more hard info in the not to distant future; which is also implied.

  • Roland

    Given the ambiguous nature of Rossi’s communications it is possible to read this latest missive as a reference to an exponential increase in the output of the E-cat X, hence more hopefulness for its production potential.

    Like many others I’d welcome more hard info in the not to distant future; which is also implied.

  • jousterusa

    I just hope our “imagination” has not led us into the depths of a confidence game of massive proportions. We can only go so long awaiting test results.