MFMP Publish their LENR Recipe

This post has just been published on the MFMP Facebook Page

The Cookbook is in the signal…
Prepare thoroughly (Ni + LiAlH4 + Li)

1. Bake Ni
2. Reduce Ni
3. Hydrogenate Ni
4. Mix: Ni + LiAlH4 + Li
5. Bake and vac reactor, add Nickel, vac warm, add H2, Vac
6. Heat to above Mossbauer determined Ni Debye (say 135C), pressure regulated to approx 1bar abs.
7. Hold, pressure regulated to approx 1bar abs.
8. Heat slowly to as close to Ni Curie as comfortable (Say 340C), pressure regulated to approx 1bar abs.
9. Hold, pressure regulated to approx 1bar abs.
10. Slowly lower temp to above highest known Ni Debye (Say 220C), pressure regulated to approx 1bar abs.
11. Hold, pressure regulated to approx 1bar abs.
12. Go as fast as possible through Ni Curie
13. Hold, pressure regulated to approx 0.5bar abs.
14. Cycle through 500C internal, pressure regulated to approx 0.5bar abs.
15. Hold, pressure regulated to approx 0.5bar abs.
16. Raise internal temperature to over 1200, pressure regulated to approx 0.5bar abs.
17. Drop to around 1000 and hold, pressure regulated to approx 0.5bar abs.
18. Raise internal temperature to near boiling point of Lithium
1h Thermal > x/β- emissions > Pb > IR/THz > 5h (SSM)
where ‘>’ means ‘leads to’

The End of the Carbon Age is Nigh

Thankyou to all those that helped us

  • Kevmo

    I sure hope someone among us has the means to replicate this.

    • US_Citizen71

      The plans for everything they used is on the quantumheat.org website. The only difficult to obtain items are the chemicals, but anyone with the least bit of scientific credentials should be able to access them. I am hoping for a crush of replications in the Universities of the world.

      • SG

        I predict it will be met with apathy by the universities of the world–at least for awhile until they can no longer turn a blind eye.

  • Fyodor

    Um, has anyone actually generated excess heat from this recipe?

    • US_Citizen71

      They did! I watched it live!

      • SG

        Was this an invite-only? I’ve followed nearly every live test and don’t remember this one.

      • bachcole

        Much better. Can you give us a rough estimate of what you saw?

        • US_Citizen71

          The same peaks you can see on the graphs already released on HUGnet. The active side which had been trailing the null overtook it. A check of the of the coil halves and the thermocouples post run showed them to be equal. As well as a non-fueled post run showed the active trailing the null again. The radiation spectrometer showed a peak pre-active side temperature increase. I have read the donor letter everything from it except two images has been posted above. Relax Roger there is more to come, what the donors received is only the extended trailer.

          • NT

            Well said US_Citizen71

      • NT

        I watched too and it was exciting, for me anyway. I have tried to watch all of their experiments waiting for this moment…

    • Kevmo

      Excess heat isn’t nearly as important as x/β- emissions
      That is proof it is nuclear in origin.

  • LukeDC

    How hard is it to reinitiate SSM I wonder. Is it just a matter of regulating thermal input? If so this will be a game changer.

  • Bob Greenyer

    Absolutely NOT Neutron radiation

    • pelgrim108

      Is point 1 to 18 the complete recipe?

      • Bob Greenyer

        We will be transcribing all notes and we hope the crowd will look for anything we may have missed.

        It may be much more than is needed, we not this on our site that some of the steps may prove to be redundant.

        • pelgrim108

          5. Bake and vac reactor, add Nickel, vac warm, add H2, Vac
          Should it say “mix” instead of “Nickel”?

          • Teemu Soilamo

            I read the donor letter and still do not understand where the COP of 6 comes from. Have there been tests that were not streamed live where a COP higher than 1.2 was achieved? How can MFMP be so sure that this is IT??

          • Ged

            You missed the actually important part of the letter then ;). Also, the data isn’t there because it’s just a copypaste. Will just have to wait for the full announcement!

          • Teemu Soilamo

            So, there was another test? Or just a new way to analyze the *GlowStick* 5.2?

          • pelgrim108

            You are asking for the plot, when only the trailer has been released. 🙂

          • bachcole

            Even crappy movies have great trailers. I just want to jump to the chase. I am prepared to invest a great deal of emotional energy in this, email contacts, get excited, and I don’t want to be severely disappointed.

          • US_Citizen71
          • Christina

            Oh!

          • JiW

            I believe this is the important part of that letter:

            “Alan shared the remainder of the data files from the NaI scintillator…Ecco, first took a look at the data and found some anomalies…To our extreme surprise, the onset of excess heat followed the massive anomaly in emissions and the minor anomalies were during and only during excess heat.”

            So, radiation (=NaI scintillator data anomalies) and excess heat at the same time?

          • Ged

            Nuclear devices make more than heat, right?

          • Teemu Soilamo

            That’s all find and good. But when you claim a COP of 6, you damn well better have something to show for it. And what about the 5 hours of SSM? We were led to believe that there was a loop of 6 hours: 1 hours of heating and 5 hours of SSM. Rinse and repeat.

          • SG

            While I agree with you Ged that the data attachments to the donors provide a fuller picture. But unless they are holding back something more significant (which they very well might be), I think all should prepare yourselves for some disillusionment. It is easier if you prepare yourself. Then, if they do release some info that makes all of us to stop and to wonder the possibilities, then so be it. But be prepared either way.

          • Ged

            Always sound advice!

          • William D. Fleming

            Momentous, exciting stuff! I am so grateful to be alive to live through these discoveries. Thanks to all involved!

          • deleo77

            Maybe one of the best lines they said tonight:

            What we will share is that the way in which
            we discovered it and the journey of analysis that makes it virtually
            impossible to say that Rossi does not have what he claims. It also shows
            that, whilst he may have been optimistic in how fast this would play
            out, he has been telling the truth, quite openly for years.

          • Kevmo

            Yes, Rossi was “optimistic”. And we’ve seen the same spirit here tonight because Bob said “the rest is just engineering”. But yet, it’s been 5 years and Rossi hasn’t really progressed past his initial “optimistic” claim, has he? He lined up $60M worth of funding, bought some condos in Florida, but 5 years later he hasn’t sold any units. There’s far more than “just engineering” ahead for this field. It is incredibly complex.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Yes – I will correct – I have had very little sleep recently

          • bachcole

            Welcome to my world. But I still have enough cojones to drive my son to school and answer simple questions without playing the count of Monte Christo game.

  • Sanjeev

    The above is the procedure followed in last *GlowStick* 5.2. You can see all the data and analysis here:
    http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/home/mfmp-blog/515-glowstick-5-2
    As we know the signal was very little (about 10°C above null). But probably Alan has better data for input power and other stuff, which made them conclude that this recipe may work. So lets wait for the data and perhaps calorimetric confirmations from multiple parties in multiple runs. Can take weeks/months. There is no instant gratification, this is hard Science.

    • Ged

      There is another signal. Replication is key, as always in science. But think of it like the discovery of Gravity waves, the way the data there worked. And I still need to do those stats I promised, once I stop being so distracted by the Orbo, hah.

      • Sanjeev

        Agree Ged, there is another signal, but I’ll let MFMP say it 😉
        It has not gone through the usual internet peer review, probably all were distracted by that ocube and other kiddie stuff. I hope people will start tearing it apart soon.

        • Ged

          Yes! Many eyes to correct it with and see if it survives and withstands critique.

  • Owen Geiger

    Keep in mind that this ‘basic’ recipe may only produce a COP of 6 or so. But that is enough to confirm LENR is real and repeatable for the masses. Rossi is years ahead of this basic recipe in my opinion and will likely benefit from this news. Congrats to MFMP.

    • Bob Greenyer

      A million minds – but Rossi has his patent.

      • f sedei

        You just defined Rossi’s genius that sets him apart from peers.

        • US_Citizen71

          Oh yes! The JoNP is a goldmine of suggestion and outside the box thinking. It is hard to shift paradigms when you only stay between the lines. It never hurts to brainstorm.

  • Brokeeper

    Congratulations MFMP team on the published LENR cookbook recipe. This can only accelerate LENR recognition with commercialization of the E-Cats. What are your next steps?

    • Bob Greenyer

      62Ni

  • Monty

    here is the letter from MFMP to the donors (courtesy of Shane D. https://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/index.php/Thread/2799-MFMP-Publish-their-LENR-Recipe/?postID=14243#post14243)

    During ICCF-17 in South Korea, shortly following the sad death of Dr. Martin Fleischmann, it became abundantly clear to a group of fresh attendees that the old approach to science, combined with the ostracisation of the great minds that had worked in the face of ridicule, was not delivering on the promise of of what we immediately called, “The New Fire”.

    It also was clear that there was something to investigate and we were morally bound to do it.

    We said that people would not believe, until they could experience it as if they were doing themselves and so the idea of Live Open Science was born. That was not enough, it had to be an effort that was free from commercial or government interests and that result and so it had to be conducted by the people, for the people. Our journey was made possible by the courage of Francesco Celani and we thank him profusely.

    Your donations played a critical role in realising this vision, but you know that, what we know you will want to hear is what we have to share tomorrow.

    We have been running and analysing an experiment live over the past Month. First for us in this experiment were:

    – Parkhomov Baking of Ni(correctly done)

    – Pre Hydrogenation of Ni

    – Proper baking out of cell under vacuum

    – Parkhomov pressure

    – Piantelli de-oxygenation

    – Piantelli ‘loading’ + proper dwell times

    – Piantelli capture analogue

    – Use of free Lithium

    – Use of calibrated NaI

    – Cycles attempting to create nano Ni distillates (inspired by “Bang!” discovery of dissolved Ni)

    – Long Run

    You can see that there are steps in there that came about only because of activities that were made possible by donations. The critical visits to Piantelli and Parkhomov.

    Around the beginning of the month we saw what appeared to be up to a COP of 1.2, not earth shattering, but sustained and robust and in line with both observations by others and the Lugano report when adjusted for correct emissivity. Over the next weeks we tried various bookend calibrations which supported this finding.

    We have said that only two paths would satisfy us:

    Statistically significant Isotopic or elemental shifts from Fuel to Ash

    Statistically significant emissions commensurate, correlating, or anti correlating to excess heat

    We are happy to tell you that we believe we have satisfied our condition 2, yet of course we’d like to replicate ourselves. Actually, though, it goes much further than that. What we will share is that the way in which we discovered it and the journey of analysis that makes it virtually impossible to say that Rossi does not have what he claims. It also shows that, whilst he may have been optimistic in how fast this would play out, he has been telling the truth, quite openly for years. Not only that, nature itself has been telling the same story and it told us too.

    By the 16/02/2016 we had given up trying to destroy the *GlowStick* 5.2, part of a long lineage of []=Project Dog Bone=[] experiments. After the reactor was turned off, Alan shared the remainder of the data files from the NaI scintillator kindly donated by a project follower called Stephen (Thankyou Stephen, really).

    Project follower and open science legend, Ecco, first took a look at the data and found some anomalies – one SO striking that we thought there had been an equipment failure. We did not know the time that the anomalies occurred and had to wait until Alan woke to explain the time stamps so we could correlate it with the thermal and power data published live to HUGNet (Thankyou Ryan and Paul Hunt).

    To our extreme surprise, the onset of excess heat followed the massive anomaly in emissions and the minor anomalies were during and only during excess heat.

    This led us on a path of discovery, the sequence of which explains:

    The massive count signal discovered by Francesco Celani during Rossi’s first public demo

    How Rossi knew his reactor had started

    How the E-Cat generates excess heat

    How it self sustains

    How it can scale easily

    That it is safe

    It also showed us how replicators can know they have succeeded in triggering the New Fire and how to enhance the excess heat.

    Subsequent to this, we found out Rossi had travelled the same design journey and had publicly shared it in the past.

    The irony is – this was all being conducted live in the open, including discussions and graphing, whilst people were distracted with news of the end of the 1MW 1 year test. Same day…

    In the past week we have been checking, cross checking to verify and this morning we cleared our last serious doubt, again live, with shared data. Because this is already in the open we want people to know so that they can start replicating based on what works, moreover, the insight will allow people to immediately start improving on our results.

    Thank you for making this possible

    We did it

    We lit the New Fire Together!

    • Ged

      I’m sure they have this and more to say tomorrow, no need to steal thunder! Besides, a copypaste doesn’t include the data figures that were in the e-mail.

      • Matt Sevrens

        So what were they ultimately able to get the COP to? And what exactly happened on the 16th? Is the max they reached still only 1.2?

        • Ged

          It’s not the COP that matters here 😉 (well, not directly or exclusively). People can argue about heat all day long, but there are some forces of nature that hold far more weight.

          • wannabe_lenr_chef

            Betting the details tomorrow have something to do with gravity. I.e. “Far more weight”. And an earlier comment along the lines of wheels being a thing of the past?

          • Ged

            Haha, no, that would be awesome though. It’s really more obvious than that, but it’s easy to get stuck on thinking all that a nuclear reactor makes is heat. The posted donor letter does spell it out, but it’s a little less obvious without the data figures that were in the letter–which is why it shouldn’t have been posted and people should have waited till the full release, but excitement makes folks jump.

          • wannabe_lenr_chef

            🙂

          • Bob Greenyer

            We have posted an expansion of the formulae, a diagram and a calculator.

          • US_Citizen71

            Hot lead?

  • Owen Geiger

    The difference between COP 6 and COP 80+ could be obtained in months with massive, widespread open source research like MFMP is doing. Rossi still appears to have the first to market advantage and will likely reap billions $. Good for him. But for me I’m tired of waiting years and years. Open source can blow this field wide open almost overnight thanks to the Internet.

    • Bob Greenyer

      Rossi has the patent.

      What we have to share will enable the next successful replicator to get a higher COP.

      • US_Citizen71

        You guys have done great! Are there plans for a replication attempt soon? Hopefully with calorimetry. : )

        • Bob Greenyer

          Mathieu is preparing and EU replication attempt and I expect I may do one with me356

          Mathieu needs to replicate the key finding of the emissions. Everything you need to know to design a better reactor stems from this being real.

          • US_Citizen71

            Exciting and interesting times ahead for MFMP then. I can’t wait.

          • This is an impressive achievement if they really have achieved a COP of 6 and 5 hours in SSM. They need to publish full mechanical blueprints, all electrical stimulation instructions, and fuel mixture procedures and formula down to the last minute detail. They should make it so MIT, UCLA, Caltech, etc. can duplicate the experiment in a couple of days. Don’t hold back anything. The point is to educate the entire world.

          • Ged

            The funny thing is, all this data is already out there on their site and data logs. I thing they are just collating it all into a nice, convenient report, but anyone can go scrounging it out. That’s the irony of everyone wanting them to release it all, it’s already there, but it’ll be much nicer in a fully wrapped, and vetted package. Then they can start doing their primary phase 2 mission, which is making kits for people to use to replicate, such as those at MIT, UCLA, etc.

          • Teemu Soilamo

            The only problem is, there seems to be a disconnect between “COP of 6 and 5 hours in SSM” and the data. What we seem to have so far are short spikes of nuclear activity. Unless, of course, that was an instrumentation or logic error of some sort. Promising? Perhaps. But hardly earth-shattering at this point.

            The manner in which MFMP are handling this seems unbecoming of them, not conservative at all!

          • Ged

            I think you just want your LENR power X-wing already ;). Same! But, for experimentalists, theorists, and the rest, the “COP of 6 and 5 hours in SSM” are the least important bits. It’s what makes the reaction tick that matters, because knowing that and only that will let one leap the technology into X-wing powering reactors. That can open a whole new paradigm in physics. But we have to see and make sure it passes a larger round of scrutiny.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Please read my reply to you below.

            This is more important than COP. It is what enables COP – we now understand why Parkhomov saw more excess – it was apparatus design.

          • SG

            MIT, UCLA, and Caltech won’t even attempt a replication. At least not any time soon. With the possible exception of Peter Hagelstein. MFMP’s announcement will be met with apathy by the mainstream scientific community. Sad, but watch, and see.

          • Alan DeAngelis

            You seem to be very fond of those institutions.

      • bachcole

        Higher than what? Why are you playing this ph’cking game, Bob. I have exactly zero tolerance for manipulation.

        • Bob Greenyer

          In order to fully appreciate the information you will receive, you will first need to deeply read and take on board the following post.

          goo.gl/zlv4gj

          • bachcole

            So, I read it. I have been hearing slight comments about very short gamma ray bursts. So, did you get a gamma ray burst. Perhaps it burned some of your brains cells if you think that I am going to be satisfied with implication rather than straight talk. Don’t toy with my emotions, Bob. (:->)

  • EEStorFanFibb

    Congratulations to Bob and the rest of the MFMP team. Thank you for your persistence and hard work!

    • Bob Greenyer

      A pleasure

  • Bob Greenyer

    You can judge for yourself – the data is on HUGNet

  • Bob Tivnan

    This is also a great day for open science. I’m hoping we see a flurry of live open experiments that not only replicate, but also reveal new insights about igniting and sustaining the fire. Let the theorists play catch-up.

    • bachcole

      What open science? A recipe is not open science. It is a hypothesis. Where is the proof; where is the COP; where is the graph showing a COP greater than 1?

      In the end, I suspect that Greenyer et. al. will have the goods, but I absolutely, positively refuse to believe it with these sub rosa, secretive coded messages.

      • Ged

        Yes, if you remember GS5.2 thread, the COP was greater than 1. The main work was doing the bookend calibrations and equipment checks to verify that for sure. Heat is easy to argue about, so that’s not the real message here nor the surprise.

        • bachcole

          I don’t remember GS5.2 because I don’t read highly technical material because I know that I won’t understand what I am reading. My evidence is all soft/social evidence; that I why I am here. Or perhaps right brain evidence. When I saw the cylinder glowing, I was convinced; and that is right brain evidence.

  • bachcole

    “Nothing to see here, folks. Just move on.”

    I got here because I followed the evidence. I stayed here because of my faith in the evidence and faith in what I saw. Right now, I ain’t seeing squat. Sorry to be LENRically incorrect.

  • Matt Sevrens

    This gradual rollout is incredibly frustrating

    • US_Citizen71

      Have patience it is worth the wait.

    • Bob Greenyer

      I know, its been 4 billion years, come on already!

  • bachcole

    God I hate these ph’cking games. If Greenyer et. al. have something, why can’t they just say it.

    • Bob Greenyer

      The analysis is ongoing and team members are writing reports. It is very necessary for people to absorb each step to comprehend the whole.

      I am extremely exhausted and stopped my paid work to deliver this as fast as conceivably possible. I wanted to ensure that as many people as possible did not miss the information so it can be lived through.

      • Matt Sevrens

        Just focus on the work at hand then, instead of following up on these threads.

      • bachcole

        Better. But the dam of my enthusiasm and excitement and joy will not burst until you have something definite to say.

      • Teemu Soilamo

        You know that your gushing hyperbole was asking for it, right?

        I believe you have what you claim, but you must understand that you’re treading on extremely thin ice with such epochal statements. Following up with cryptic hints and no clear indication that solid, incontrovertible data is forthcoming is extremely nerve-racking to us.

        5h SSM? COP 6?

        • Ged

          Sometimes we just gotta be patient, but the truth is you already know the data for the most part, and the posted letter says the rest. I think they are just holding back till quantitations are completely done. People are just so eager, just gotta calm.

          • Teemu Soilamo

            Where is the 5h SSM in that data?

          • Ged

            THAT, I haven’t seen, and I don’t even know that’s at all what’s being alluded to. Better things are being alluded to, well, from an experimentalist’s point of view. We already saw them hit overunity, live, during the GS5.2 run, and the donor e-mail tell us what else was also found at the same time that we just didn’t notice. The emissions, which are vastly more important than any COP. Everything’s been about checking and bookend calibrations and evaluating the robustness of the data. Serendipity had it that they were cycling the core during GS5.2’s main run, which I have had sitting on the back burner doing stats on; but that cycling allowed emissions to be seen specifically and with a high N only when excess was occurring, never any other time. A lot of easy data averaging and analysis, really nails down the whole thing as a smoking gun. That’s what’s exciting. Seeing what only nuclear reactions can do. Who cares about SSM and COP, as those can be artifacts, but nuclear is undeniable as long as repeatable (though it was repeated over those many cyclings, but independent devices also need to replicate), and all equipment checks/calibrations/controls pan out–and that’s what they have been working hard on it seems and are concluding.

          • Teemu Soilamo

            “There were spikes of nuclear activity” hardly seems like the end of the fossil fuel era. Why this whole dog and pony show? Just release the data and conclude that, maybe, someday we will be able to control the reaction and get, you know, ACTUAL USEFUL HEAT out of it! Right now, that seems like a million miles away.

          • Ged

            The data is already out there. It’s just not conveniently packaged yet, but is being so. Patience. But you can always grab it yourself from their site and hugnet.

            Spikes of nuclear activity is the most important turning point of all if it bears scrutiny, because then the phenomenon can begin to be understood as well as properly monitored instead of Edisonian guessing games with designs and mixtures, etc.

          • Teemu Soilamo

            While I appreciate your position, the dumb me thinks it seems like a better smoking gun would be lots of heat from practically no input. I understand that the nuclear phenomenon is very promising, but what if it was a measurement error of some sort? There would be considerably less room for such an error with heat calorimetry from SSM.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Teemu, look at our site or FB, the formulae has been extended.

            What we discovered and verified is the source of the excess heat and that it is thermally driven – with engineering and materials choice you get COP – We have given a link and a calculator of you to ‘have a go’.

            The COP of this experiment would have been in line with the REAL COP of Lugano – had it been a Dog Bone and not a *GlowStick* – the important thing is getting it turned on and knowing how to see that and then seeing what drives the excess heat.

          • Teemu Soilamo

            Bob, I am not well versed enough to draw any conclusions from that. As a layman, I was hoping that there would be actual experimental results, not theoretical judo substituting materials for others and thus calculating the theoretical COP (does it really work like that??)

            Anyway, I am going to bed now. Good luck to you gentlemen, I hope tomorrow will bring lots of clarity and understanding™.

            PS. Was I not entertained? Yes, I was entertained!

          • Matt Sevrens

            It appears that what they found was not a large COP but rather a HUGE burst in Gamma that was correlated temporally with excess heat. This information then connected a lot of dots and produced a new theory in terms of how to produce the LENR effect reliably. That being said, it doesn’t appear they have actually TESTED this recipe again yet.

            Correct me if I’m wrong

          • Obvious

            Until they or someone else manages to duplicate this, I am on the fence about this.
            Freethinker had a similar result, so that should be looked at again. It might be corroboration to some extent.

            I haven’t fully digested the information yet, so too soon for me weigh in, personally.
            I hope the MFMP is right, and this works.
            Once they get the reporting cleaned up, it will be easier to sort things out.

          • US_Citizen71

            Lots of tests have shown the same. goo.gl/zlv4gj really is key.

          • Obvious

            I have a fair bit of experience with gamma detectors, but not sticking them close to a heat source or noisy electrical signals. Something worth fiddling with in the meantime.
            I’ll be doing some emissivity checks on ceramic tonight, but I might be able to poke a gamma detector near a fluorescent light fixture and my tube coil driver and hot tube (no fuel) to see if I can fool it. The real sensitive detectors are at work, but I have an ancient analog GR-110 unit coming soon. They are remarkably sensitive (but no spectra output).

          • Mats002

            I agree the 5 hour of SSM is missing from the data, so that part of this theory is a prediction. The rest is actually TESTED at least once. And not only by MFMP.

            The prediction about SSM must be vindicated, as for any prediction of a theory.

            The process of being convinced of a phenomena is very personal, you’re way is different than my, it is the sum of once experience plus some brain hard wiring.

            For me, seeing SSM and a number of replications on top of this will make it absolutely real but it is a ‘wake up’ process and this is the first step. It is important.

          • Teemu Soilamo

            Good morning, Bob! Hope you slept well. 😉

            I will repost a concern voiced by Pekka Janhunen:

            “In Lugano, Rossi didn’t have any lead shielding, yet no gammas were seen. It’s curious that with Lugano setup, MFMP gets old E-cat rather than Lugano behaviour.”

            What do you think is going on?

          • Bob Greenyer

            I had 3 hours, I want to finish editing my “bad hand waving” video I recorded 2 days ago and get it out.

            Regarding Pekka’s Question we have been obviously thinking on that for the past week and it will be the subject of a separate blog post.

            You need to remember that the Rossi said (I paraphrase)

            “The heater coil communicates with the core”
            “The coils is just doped with Inconel”

            What if the heater coil was inconel treated Tungsten, It would only need to be 1mm to attenuate 100% of 0-100KeV range Gammas we seem to have observed and we estimate the coil could have been as big as 4mm in Diameter.

            Rossi said the core of the reactor was more complex and Cook said in his “Rossi Effect” presentation that there was Tungsten KNOWN to be in the FUEL in Lugano. When he was asked to clarify that, he said it was in the structure of the reactor – so a 1mm Tungsten sleeve would do it.

            About the initial HUGE gamma burst, I think this is a collective body effect that is a semi-permanent aspect that would not re-appear if the reactor was NOT TEMPERATURE CYCLED – hence the need to just have LUGANO reactor full on.

            As Axil has noted – the fuel from the ‘envelope’ seemed to be pre-processed and I whole heartedly agree. It would have been previously in a reactor and have gone through this phase and “Bang!” showed us that the wetted Al / Li on the surface would protect the Nickel from oxidation.

            An alternative hypothesis is that Rossi managed the Turn on of the reactor – and then handed over for the long run and the Tungsten in the body of the reactor prevented the lower energy running emissions.

          • “The heater coil communicates with the core”, i.e, some change in the heater coil has an effect on the core (reaction).

            I can only think of two possibilities: (a) modulating the heat output directly affects the reaction (after a delay, presumably), or (b) a waveform in the heater current affects the reaction through varying EM induction (or RF if the frequency is high enough).

            I’m wondering if MFMP have any plans to try the ‘basic formula’ plus modulated current, either variable/chopped DC or AC?

          • georgehants

            Afternoon Peter, things at long last might be coming together, a good show from Mr. Rossi and us crazies will be justified.
            Don’t forget phonons for your communication, he.

          • Hi George. Yes, us loonies do seem to be on the right track. Replications soon I hope, and we have yet to see what ‘http://lookingforheat.com’ will bring us on March 1st…

            Regarding phonons, if oscillating/variable EM is a stimulant for LENR, then phonons arising in the nickel electron cloud are probably the mechanism that enables absorption of the energy, i.e., coupling of signal to effect. If so, resonance would be the likely key. I’m hoping someone will put this possibility to the test at some point.

          • Teemu Soilamo

            I see, thanks!

          • Bob Greenyer

            Once people understand the significance of the finding and the fact that Rossi has been saying it all along… it makes it easy to come up with engineering solutions.

          • e-dog

            Thanks for posting here on e-catworld!
            Absolutely Awesome. Congratulations again!! Please pass it on to the team.
            Any theories on what was going on with MF&SP’s experiments? High lead content scientific glass ware??

            WOW, seriously who is going to play you in the movie??? lets get to the important stuff?

          • Teemu Soilamo
          • Bob Greenyer

            We have some of Martin Fleischmann and Stanley Pons original LiOD they used.

            BTW, I acted from the age of 4 to 30 haha

          • Oystein Lande

            The Lugano report also says :
            ” In addition, the resistor coils are fed with some specific electromagnetic pulses”
            Any speculation on what these pulses are? Have you tried something similar ?

          • Bob Greenyer

            No

          • Mats002

            I look forward to the music concert inside the Glowstick, I am thinking of giving you my voice on mp3 shouting ‘cooooold fusion!’

          • Brian Ahern is not on the bandwagon (from MFMP site):

            “I am severely underwhelmed bythe context behind the claims from yesterday.

            The gammas are a factor of six above background, but 9 orders of magnitude below heating.

            Secondly, we were tantalized by the term signal. What signal?

            Thirdly, we were promised 5 hours of self sustained mode. Where is the data? What was the COP?

            I fear that MFMP is relying on Rossi’s data. Layering in a 30 minute Rossi video was frighteningly bad.

            If this release limited itself to gammas it would be interesting, but a long way from understanding the mechanism producing heat. As it is, nothing has advanced in LENR.”

            ———

            There does seem to be some confusion in some quarters about the gamma claim. Note that MFMP are not claiming that the initial gamma spike nor even the <100 keV photons that they detected sporadically thereafter are the cause of the excess heat they measured. Just that they saw them and if not a malfunction of some kind clearly indicate nuclear events.

            And the 5 hour SSM was in that cryptic one line equation but they didn't achieve 5 hours of SSM in the glowstick experiment. They've yet to tell us in detail about the SSM hint but I expect it's just that they feel that they understand how SSM is achieved now.

            Right now what we've got is a clean X/gamma radiation signal that correlates with excess heat onset. That may not be a slam dunk but it's close. Replications permitting.

          • Matt Sevrens

            Actually they are claiming the gammas are the source of heat. The claim is that the gammas are thermalized by lead in the e-cat. That was the point of posting the Rossi video.

          • In the E-Cat yes. In GS5 not necessarily. They didn’t have lead.

          • Matt Sevrens

            Me: Where is the lead in the glowstick?
            Mats002: The lead is around the radiation meter, as I can see it.
            Bob Greenyer: Yes – and that may have thermalised some emissions and back radiated it – though there is very little opposite the active – since that is where the scintillator well is.

          • I stand corrected. The point still stands that they didn’t use a lead shield to thermalize the photons in GS5.

          • Matt Sevrens

            Yeah. It seems like they’ve found another piece of the puzzle but we still don’t have a consistently replicable cookbook. In a few weeks we’ll know though.

          • It is interesting, on a meta level, to watch the behavior of MFMP as a pioneer in live open science.

            As soon as they found a recipe and data that *they* found convincing they released it to the public. This seems to be in the spirit of LOS. However they are catching some heat for not internally replicating before going public and raising expectations through the roof (does seem to be a risk) and also their playful release of info (exciting but maybe not the highest level of professionalism especially in a field plagued by all sorts of “interesting” personalities).

            I don’t know what’s right or wrong. They are blazing a trail and making up the rules as they go. But it is fun to observe.

            I feel we owe them a great debt so let’s let them do it the way they want. I certainly can’t fault their enthusiasm in light of the potential magnitude of what they just possibly accomplished.

          • LCD

            Ok but the fact that gammas or xrays were created by heating Nickel is not significant?

          • GreenWin

            Remember – Mills has been making soft xray and excess heat in early Raney nickel experiments since mid-1990s. These experiments have been replicated. But Mills maintains it’s a reaction due to hydrino – an atomic hydrogen atom transitioning to a lower ground state.

            Regardless, IF the MFMP recipe can produce gamma bursts on cue – physics says it’s a “nuclear” reaction. It may be something else. But it’s a helluva lot more than the hot fusionists have accomplished the last 65 years.

          • Bob Greenyer

            90% of the energy in trace 7 is in the range 30KeV to 96KeV.
            we cannot see below 30KeV

            Some energy will have been absorbed in the steel fuel container and in the heater coil etc at the lowest energies.

          • SG

            Bob, do you agree with Brian Ahern that gamma energy detected is “9 orders of magnitude below heating.” I’m not even sure what he means by that statement. But if we did a thought experiment with a lead shield combined with the GS5 apparatus, what kind of heating levels would be expected?

          • artefact

            He says that there are not enough particles detected to be the reason for the heat.

            A reason why that would be enough is when the emitted particles gets so much downshifted that most of the particles become heat and only some are energetic enuogh to leave the reactor IMHO.

          • Bob Greenyer

            I believe that yes. I also can’t explain the radiation data other than it is coming as a result of an interaction in the reactor just be for and during excess heat – Brian did not address the correlation aspect. It is a good indicator that it is working AFAIK and it is necessary to have reactor geometry to shield for it.

            The energy mix – depends on your pet theory, here is a few.

            Thermalisation of ’emissions’ which may only in part be what we observed – or what we observed was in someway an after effect of nuclear spallation resulting in Muons (Olafsson/Holmlid) leading to the signal
            Nickel transmutation, stepwise (Piantelli/Focardi) – this may result in the observed emissions but not the bulk of energy
            Nickel transmutation, via neutron stripping (Gullstrom)
            Lithium conversion, either to 6Li (via neutron stripping) or to 2X 4He aneutronic fusion (Piantelli)

          • Pekka Janhunen

            In fact I somewhat doubt this 90% figure, maybe forgot to multiply by energy to get differential energy flux from differential number flux?

          • Bob Greenyer

            Your best bet is to ask Bob Higgins on the Signal thread how he calculated it.

            If it is not right it should be corrected ASAP

          • Pekka Janhunen

            Brian Ahern is right at least about gammas are energetically insignificant.

            In Bob Higgins’ gamma analysis PDF file, the spectrum number 7 (Figure 6) is roughly given by

            f(E)=(200/keV)*(200keV/E)^2 [counts/keV].

            Multiplying by energy E, we get energy per 1keV bin:

            W(E)=(200/keV)*(200keV)^2/E [energy/keV].

            Integrating with respect to E from lower cutoff E to some high cutoff Emax we get the total energy deposited on the detector as

            Etot(E)=(200/keV)*(200keV)^2*ln(Emax/E)
            =1.28e-9*ln(Emax/E) [J].

            Gamma power falling on detector is Etot divided by measurement time 14160s:

            Power(E)=Etot(E)/(14160s) = 9e-14*ln(Emax/E) [W].

            Notice that the result depends only weakly (logarithmically) on the lower cutoff E. Physically, it means that the lowest energy quanta, although numerous, do not carry a very big part of the energy if the spectrum falls like 1/E^2. For example if E=30keV and Emax=1.5MeV, the logarithmic factor is 3.9, and if E=1keV it is 7.3, less than twofold increase. Of course, in drawing this conclusion we assumed that the spectrum continues to follow 1/E^2 shape also below the observation threshold 30 keV.

            Taking into account the solid angle covered by the detector gives some 2-3 orders of magnitude more power. If we assume 3 orders of magnitude there to be generous and use 100eV as lower limit (so that the logarithm factor is 9.6), we obtain gamma output power of only one nanowatt.

            Gamma power dissipated in any Pb shielding of an E-cat is energetically completely insignificant. If one insists that all energy internally is liberated originally as photons (for which we have no proof), in that case almost all of them must be of so low energy that they dissipate already in the fuel powder. This was my point to Rossi in April 2012 (http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=510&cpage=51#comment-219945 ) and the point is still the same. In brief, something which is only five times above background radiation cannot be energetically comparable to any measurable heat output of a reactor.

          • Is the argument that the burst is insignificant and doesn’t show nuclear events?

            Or is the argument that the burst is not responsible for any significant excess heat?

            Cause I don’t think anyone is arguing the second one.

            The focus is on the significance of the first one (and the evidence that it correlates with the onset of excess heat — note not assuming cause and effect, just linked phenomena).

          • Pekka Janhunen

            The latter: the “burst” (which rather looks a 2-hour episode to me because that was the time resolution) is not responsible for any measurable excess heat.

            I agree with your last paragraph.

            Energetically significant levels of X-ray/gamma emissions would also have direct health effects, including lethal ones. But no LENR researcher has ever been diagnosed with radiation sickness, let alone died of it.

            1 MeV gammas (for example) are so penetrating that they are not really damped by the reactor at all, not even if it would have 1 mm of lead or tungsten shielding. This means that the detector really sees all MeV gammas that the reaction ever generates, apart from geometric factor. Those photons are very few: less than one count per second on the detector and perhaps hundred or so events per second in all directions. But to produce, for example, 100 W of excess power needs thirty trillion Li-H fusion reactions per second.

            Cold fusion means essentially or embarrassingly radiation-free nuclear reactions. That it sometimes produces a nanowatt of radiation is energetically only a curiosity, although it can also be used to demonstrate to sceptics that the underlying phenomenon (or at least a small part of it) is nuclear. Entirely or almost radiation-free reactions, that is the nature of LENR, that is what MFMP is finding, and that is the reason why it has been so hard to physicists to believe in such experimental results.

          • Axil Axil

            Here is my theory…

            The surface plasmon polariton (SPP) is first born out of concentrated infrared photons, but it gets to a stage where it can extract nuclear binding energy out of the nucleus. That energy is stored and downshifted through FANO resonance in a soliton until the SPP decays whereupon its EMF energy content now in the XUV and X-ray range is released to the far field.

            I have been saying for years now that a cold reactor will cause gamma radiation. IMHO, this is due to the failure to form a Bose condensate among many Surface Plasmon Polaritons (SPP)s. Lack of sufficient polariton pumping allows the SPP to initiate the LENR reaction, but not enough thermal pumping to create a bose condensate among the SPPs to spread the radiation around to thermalize or downshift gamma level radiation through super-absorption among many SPPs.

            Low temperature means many SPP are working alone thereby creating x-rays because no downshifting is possible.

            High temperatures means many SPPs working together in a BEC to share energy throughout the SPP ensemble through super-absorption.

            SPP pumping is similar to laser pumping

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_pumping

            Until the SPP pumping gets to an inversion condition, a SPP bose condensate cannot be formed.

            Weak pumping means no laser beam is produced.

            Usually, the x-xay stage lasts only a few seconds during power ramp at up startup or on power ramp down during shutdown when the reactor is cold or is getting cold.

            The transition from LENR to LENR+ happens when the SPPs form on the metalized hydrogen(HRM) which amplifies their catalytic power. HRM is metastable. The more energy accumulated in the HRM, the longer lived the HRM are.

          • Bob Greenyer

            We’ll see when we/others get some lead in there.

            The cell did get hotter, only after the ‘turn on’ and only across the period in which the low end radiation was detectable. I am sure that MIT have better equipment and can give a better answer in time, but for now, the data is the data.

          • Kevmo

            Yes, the phenomenon can begin to be understood if the right people are gathering the right Geiger counter data. That’s why Rossi was so upset at Celani when he measured gamma rays at the beginning of the experiment. If Rossi had allowed the experiment to go on, Celani could have gotten the vast majority of the information necessary to unlock Rossi’s secret. Rossi knew it, Celani knew it, maybe only 1 or 2 others that day knew it.

        • bachcole

          Teemu, I understand EXACTLY what you are saying. Bob Greenyer is not telling us that the mail man just delivered our mail. He is telling us that a drone powered by an e-cat just came to our mailbox, unlocked the mail box, and delivered our mail.

      • TomR

        Thanks Bob, do what you think is right, tomorrow is soon enough. Thank you Bob.

        • bachcole

          Although I almost always agree with you, TomR, for me, Bob could have just skipped all of the pre-announcements today and did the real announcement tomorrow.

      • Philip James

        Thank you Bob. Writing “methods” section is tedious but important. One comma in the wrong place, or a missing step, could lead someone to make a lot of mistakes, waste time, and sully the results by claiming “it doesn’t work.. waaaaah!”. In my lab we often have people come and observe the experimental steps to make sure the “voodoo” is seen.

        Take your time. The impatient can wait. It’s not like they are going ALL go out and build it tomorrow.

      • Bernie Koppenhofer

        Bob, Congratulations, get some sleep!

      • Kevmo

        That’s a mistake. When I have found an astonishing result as an engineer, it has been best for me to sit on it for a couple of days, verify it, work on my backlog of other things on my plate, and then release it. Rationality sets in during those couple of days of settling down. Also, it gives you time to write a thorough report.

    • Ged

      People could just wait till tomorrow ;).

  • Bob Greenyer

    Key expansion of the formulae has been released.

    • Mats002

      It’s your big moment – and for a peanut too! Congratulations MFMP – Bob, Alan, Mathieu, Echo and all who helped!

      What is next step now? I guess one thing is repeating, repeating, repeating – and what else?

      • Mats002

        And to Skip and Ryan and Bob H and who did I forget now? You are LENR heroes!

      • Bob Greenyer

        Double detection
        62Ni
        Thermalisation layer

  • deleo77

    Below is some additional info that they shared tonight. After reading this all I could think was “wow, Rossi really did it.” For years following this I can honestly say that sometimes I believed Rossi had the goods, sometimes I didn’t. But now I am concluding that he does. MFMP were able to replicate his results, and they are able to share it in a way so that others can do the same. This is the end of the journey, skeptics be damned:

    To our extreme surprise, the onset of excess heat followed the massive anomaly in emissions and the minor anomalies were during and only during excess heat.
    This led us on a path of discovery, the sequence of which explains:
    The massive count signal discovered by Francesco Celani during Rossi’s first public demo
    How Rossi knew his reactor had started
    How the E-Cat generates excess heat
    How it self sustains
    How it can scale easily
    That it is safe
    It also showed us how replicators can know they have succeeded in triggering the New Fire and how to enhance the excess heat.
    Subsequent to this, we found out Rossi had travelled the same design journey and had publicly shared it in the past.
    The irony is – this was all being conducted live in the open, including discussions and graphing, whilst people were distracted with news of the end of the 1MW 1 year test. Same day…
    In the past week we have been checking, cross checking to verify and this morning we cleared our last serious doubt, again live, with shared data. Because this is already in the open we want people to know so that they can start replicating based on what works, moreover, the insight will allow people to immediately start improving on our results.
    Thank you for making this possible
    We did it
    We lit the New Fire Together!

  • builditnow

    S U P E R C O N G R A T U L A T I O N S to Alan, Mark, Skip, Bob, and the rest of the MFMP team.
    I visited Alan’s lab, observed Alan’s work and experiments on the glowsticks and helped out some. Alan and Mark do extremely precise and good work. I’m a demanding engineer and know when I see a great experimenter.

    Thanks to all those who supported Alan with the purchase of the PA1000 power analyzer last year.

    Bachole: The examination of the results, the post experiment calibration checks and the careful examination all of the possible ways that measurements could be in error, all takes time and care. Bob is carefully measuring his statements so as to not say more than can be said right now. The most important thing Bob is putting out is the recipe so that others can try a duplication of the results. One experiment can be false no matter how carefully it is checked.

    The next important step is several more replications using this recipe and lets hope most of these experiments work and that ways to increase the reliability and output are discovered.

    Now is a good time to support your local / favorite experimenter.

    • Mats002

      I am willing to support Freethinker if you see this ^^ (tlc and money), if you are in my geography Sweden. Frank Acland has my data for contacts.

  • US_Citizen71

    Leaping beyond the end, what can produce a photovoltaic effect with 100 keV or so?

    • Bob Greenyer

      I think it might be possible with a semiconductor with the right band gap or via a black body intermediary

      • US_Citizen71

        Whatever works is likely the source of the electricity in the E-Cat X, extrapolating from your proposed model of heating.

        • Hi all

          With oil prices crashing yet again, Goldman Sachs describe Lithium as the “new gasoline”

          http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e7fd87ec-8eb2-11e5-8be4-3506bf20cc2b.html#axzz415bYHpnR

          Kind Regards walker

          • Pekka Janhunen

            On one hand, they are more right than they ever guessed. On the other hand, the size of future battery market might be proportional to E-cat X’s startup time which is short, hence, lithium demand might also decrease. (Or if sodium batteries come, then lithium is not needed for batteries.)

          • tlp

            Yes, future electric cars need only small batteries, and/or ultracapacitors. E-cat cars consumes some lithium, but Sun Cell cars not, only water. Lets see if there is market for both.

          • EEStorFanFibb

            Bloomberg: “Another Oil Crash Is Coming, and There May Be No Recovery

            Superior electric cars are on their way, and they could begin to wreck oil markets within a decade.”

            http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-02-24/another-oil-crash-is-coming-and-there-may-be-no-recovery

  • Matt Sevrens

    Why doesn’t trace 9 show any of the signal but still shows excess heat?

    • US_Citizen71

      I have a feeling that answer wins a nobel prize.

    • Bob Greenyer

      The data is the data.

      Bob Higgins has done a much more correct photometric analysis of the data than Ecco’s ‘minimum viable product’ approach – he is still authoring that, but we will publish it later today.

      Take a look – the data is and always has been in the live folder linked to off the live doc on the GS 5.2 blog.

      http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/home/mfmp-blog/515-glowstick-5-2

      • Bernie Koppenhofer

        Bob, you were dead tired four hours ago, we need you clear minded, get sleep and congratulations again!

        • Bob Greenyer

          Imagine how tired I am now.

          I fell off my bike and bust my hand steering the experiment a few weeks back – so I want some light before i get on. Man – I need sleep

          • Mats002

            Sleep tight Bon, reload your orbo 😉

  • Bob Greenyer

    Bob Higgins is suggesting that the initial turn on pulse alone could exceed to total possible chemical energy in the *GlowStick*.

  • David Taylor-Fuller

    So you guys have a clear gamma signal. But have you guys gotten an ash analysis yet? If not when can we look forward to seeing one from GS 5.2

  • Aryth

    As far as I understand, the summary of what was said is that:
    1. There was a statistically significant COP > 1, i.e., some sort of exothermal reaction took place
    2. There was a gamma rays burst, i.e. some nuclear reactions were involved
    3. There is a new hypothesis of understanding of procedure that would allow (at least) replication of the above
    4. The results, together with the new hypothesis corroborate and fit all (relevant) information about previous experiments by Rossy (and Pakhromov)

    These are very, very good points indeed, and the first positive results in MFMP history (I think). But, seems like only the first significant positive step, not beginning of a new era.
    I.e., this HUGE announcement and suspense is a bit of a let down for a believer.

    So, definitely congratulations on your work!
    …and don’t get cocky, now I am really looking forward to your next experiment (or few).

    • wondering

      I suppose point 2. proves that LENR is real, which is quite huge. Which makes it extremely likely that Rossi’s 1MW plant is the real deal. And that means the end og the carbon age could indeed be nigh. A few years are not much in this context.

      But one must see others replicate it.

      • Aryth

        I would not be surprised if this is exactly what they said about the original MF experiment.

      • Bob Greenyer

        It’s real. When you understand the data, this will be clear.

        With this information – many people will report excess and likely much higher.

        • The race to the LENR moon has started.

          It’s like wernher von braum just released his rocket plans 😀

        • Aryth

          Bob,
          I almost flinch when I see that you are still up and typing…

          • Bob Greenyer

            OK – The sun is up. Time to go.

          • Frank Acland

            Thanks for sticking with us, Bob, and answering so many questions!

          • Stephen

            Wow Bob you have been working solidly through to Dawn! Have a good rest you deserve it. That sun rise you saw may well be the dawn of a new era! Fantastic work and thank you for all the answers to our questions. It’s been great to watch.

  • jimbo92107

    Hundreds of college engineering students just got the steps for their first project.

    • Mats002

      New frontier ahead – be careful out there!

    • Let’s hope that much physic doctorands are using this as their main topic 🙂

  • Bob Greenyer

    I have just published a video I only watched on Monday Night all the way through. So – we just worked out how to make a High COP reactor based off our findings – and here in this March 12 2012 video, Rossi is telling everyone how the heat is generated… the problem is, no one KNEW he had something and what the ’emissions’ genuinely were. Well now you do.

    • Nice thing Bob! Let’s hope you guys will also be called in the history books if this turns out to be the basic path to LENR!!

      Do you know whether me356 or Denis Vasilenko will verify your work?

      • Bob Greenyer

        Mathieu and Ryan are preparing replications, I may work with me356 in coming weeks – but with the information we are sharing – I would be VERY surprised if we can move fast enough to repeat before another replication is achieved – and given that we have confirmed HOW you can get higher COP and shared it – others will do that.

        My one reservation is that much higher COP may need more 62Ni and we will be putting that to the test.

        • Don’t worry, the second place is good enough 🙂
          You and all the replicators which collected data over data in all their experiments won this game together!

    • SG

      Bob, thank you for posting the video. While I had watched Rossi in that video twice before, I had never caught the key statement that “the heater of the system is the lead because it is the lead that turns the … low energy gamma radiations into heat.” He even says it with a subtle smile and knows exactly what he is giving away. But we all seemed to miss the significance of it. Maybe because at the time, none of us even knew whether low energy gamma radiations were produced–we had no evidence. In light of the recent MFMP tests, we have confirmations of low energy gammas. Now, just need to add a lead shield and thermalize the gammas. Wow. Okay, took me a bit to see it, but now I better understand your excitement.

      • Pekka Janhunen

        I wrote to Rossi about this in April 2012 (http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=510&cpage=51#comment-219945 ). Rossi’s answer was short “It has [implications].” But I still don’t understand how knowing it helps one create the reaction in the first place.

        In Lugano, Rossi didn’t have any lead shielding, yet no gammas were seen. It’s curious that with Lugano setup, MFMP gets old E-cat rather than Lugano behaviour.

        • Esko Lyytinen

          I also paid my attention to the fact, that in Lugano test there was no lead shield. IF the energy content in the X-rays is considerable enough for the shield to markedly affect the COP results, then I would expect that the people were in real danger in the Lugano test. And even if there were considerable energy in X-rays, a shield well outside the stick in a stick type reactor may not be really important to the COP value, but may be important for shielding the people.

          • Enrique Ferreyra

            Thinking the same, maybe gammas are now interacting with other element to enhance the whole reaction, and its true that this is only a part of a larger system.

          • US_Citizen71

            We do not know what the Lugano reactor was constructed of exactly. There may have been a lead layer or another material under the alumina. Lead would have been liquid at the working temperature but it would still convert gamma to heat.

          • SG

            Tungsten.

        • Stephen Taylor

          Yes, the question of no gammas observed in the Lugano (and Ferrara?) test needs considering. They looked for radiation signatures. What are the details of their observations? How and why do they differ from the observations of the MFMP team. A very important question, Pekka.

        • Teemu Soilamo

          Very good point. Bob needs to address this ASAP.

    • GreenWin

      Wonderful work Bob! Thank you and all at Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project for enlightening the world and the means to fully rehabilitate the exceptional work of Fleischmann & Pons. Perhaps by the APS meeting in Salt Lake City, April 16, you will have a preliminary replication kit our most revered scientists can turn a blind eye to. 🙂 Congrats!

  • Matt Sevrens

    “The heater of the system is the lead, because the lead turns the radiation, the low energy gamma radiation into heat” – Andrea Rossi 2012

    Jesus. Right there for everyone to hear. For four years.

    • Obvious

      “The shielding is necessary to allow the radiations to be thermalyzed: it’s from the thermalization of the gamma rays that comes the energy. The system is radiation free outside the reactor, and doesn’t produce radioactive wastes.”
      – JoNP March 30, 2010

      • SG

        Sitting right before our very eyes for six inexplicable years.

        • Obvious

          Q: Why the gamma rays (behind the shield) are not measured in the public experiments?
          A: Surely you are not a Physic: gamma rays are the fingerprints of their source.
          – JoNP June 24, 2011

    • Rene

      Wait a moment. After 2012, Rossi said there were several reactions going on and that the gamma producing one was an unwanted side reaction that he eventually eliminated (digging through JONP for a reference).

      • Possibly there are several possible mechanisms that can produce ‘anomalous heat’, and thermalisation of gamma is just one of them. MFMP’s formula seems to be a starting point, and quite some way from where Rossi is now.

  • I think they need carbon powder and possibly steel or iron dust to make it really work. A COP of 1.2 is not going to impress the universities. A COP of 6 is very impressive, and at least 3 is a minimum.

    • Bob Greenyer

      I am going to sleep. Honest.

      I was forced by chest beaters to lay a COP on the table, but I think the team may want to revise the early figure downwards. All the same, it is of little consequence, the message is the same, you know what needs to be in the reactor, basically how it needs to be treated and the KEY facet to create higher COP has been verified.

      The rest is just engineering.

      • Kevmo

        Well, Howard Hughes and the Spruce Goose would say that the engineering won’t be so easy.

    • Now a lot of people know the necessary steps.
      Now they can put in more variables etc. to tune it.

      • Bob Greenyer

        Yes, frankly – I think it is much simpler than this recipe.

        • Let’s call it the “basE-Cat recipe” 😉

      • Congrats MFMP! Really well done.

        • Maybe you really should choose two days for your symposium now 🙂
          After this it seems really likely that many research groups could present positive experiments…with interesting variations in details.

      • In particular, Rossi’s ‘frequencies’.

  • Matt Sevrens

    So now we know production of gamma radiation is necessary, and lead is necessary to thermalize it. Do those 18 steps guarantee the production of gamma radiation?

    • clovis ray

      no we don’t know that, in the e-cat there is no radiation, there use to be a small burst way back when he first started but it has been eliminated now,
      if radiation is detected i want nothing to do with it, and this is the best way to kill this discovery, get someone poisoned and that will be bad.

      • Warthog

        What we know is that there is more than one energy release mechanism present. At least one chain results in gamma release, and at least one does not. Apparently the gamma mechanism is a “phase” that the system goes through to get to the preferred “non-gamma” state. I suspect that there are control points that will allow the selection of either chain.

  • Michel Vandenberghe

    Congrats to the MFMP team 🙂

  • Andreas Moraitis

    Some questions, partly rhetoric:

    1 – Did MFMP repeat the experiment, obtaining comparable results?
    2 – How can they be sure that the temporary gamma readings were not caused by an external source?
    3 – Does the small temperature difference between the “active” and the “null” side reliably indicate excess heat?

  • R101

    Great stuff Bob and MFMP!
    Now all us regular humans need is a youtube video showing how to use this recipe 🙂

    • Owen Geiger

      Or buy the MFMP kit when available… At that point dozens or hundreds of groups will be replicating and LENR will explode on the scene like it’s hard to imagine. No wonder Bob is ecstatic with excitement.

      • “explode on the scene” – lets hope not.

      • R101

        Yep, that would be great!

  • Dods

    Grats MFMP and Bob.

    Now labs need to pull team names from a hat. The Wacky Race is on. There’s gold in them hills I tell ya, theres gold. Might as well gamify the gamma.

  • artefact

    I’m looking forward to the opening of LookingForHeat.com now.

  • georgehants

    As I wrote a little while ago, MFMP are the first in the World to publish a (hopefully) repeatable and verifiable recipe for the production of Cold Fusion.
    They outrank Mr. Rossi (IH) in that we have only ever had clues and Rossi says regarding his work.
    Because MFMP are willing to share their work and if Bob will confirm that they will work toward free Cold Fusion for those who need it most, if he would reply with a link to donate, we will make a worthwhile contribution for their work.
    Wonderful day

    • GreenWin

      George, I think we’ll discover that Dr. Rossi has hinted the information freely and openly all along. He stopped short of drawing the road map. As is so often the case, the key was hiding in plain sight. Time for your bubbly? 🙂

      • georgehants

        GreenWin, all True, but capitalism, profit, power has intervened to stop millions of scientists around the World working on Cold Fusion for five+ years.
        I wish to take nothing away from Mr. Rossi but the Truth is the Truth.
        Hopefully he (IH) will confirm properly on this occasion, we will see.

        • Warthog

          No. The thing that “intervened to stop millions of scientists around the world working on Cold Fusion” (and for a lot longer than five+ years) were the “physics establishment”, who engaged in actual fraud and every other kind of delaying tactics and dirty tricks from the first P&F revelation, and which continues today. “Capitalism” in this situation is neutral. And it will be “capitalism” that will put it into service far sooner and in a wider variety of ways than “socialism”.

          • georgehants

            Warthog, yours is an opinion, mine is indisputable Fact unless you give a good reason for Mr. Rossi (IH) hiding the secrets of Cold Fusion other than profit for five plus years.
            MFMP have now released freely that secret (hopefully)
            I deal in Evidence and Facts not opinion.

          • Warthog

            Simply wrong, old buddy. Even if Rossi had totally laid it out “open source” it would still have been ignored/denied/denigrated by the physics establishment and gone nowhere.

            It is the desire for “profit” that is the only thing enabling Rossi to gather enough resources (that mean old thing…..CAPITAL) to gather the needed information toovercome the skeptopaths (and he has not done so yet).

            The level of altruism you want humanity to display will never, ever happen. It is (unfortunately) contrary to human nature. And all historical attempts to FORCE it to happen have been disastrous (160MM dead, huge environmental damage, and on and on). The “cure” (socialism) has proven unequivocally to be worse than the “disease” (capitalism).

          • Teemu Soilamo

            By your logic, then, the MFMP method will also go nowhere.

          • Warthog

            In the wider science establishment, I think that will be the case. The skeptopaths are testing their arguments for “saleability” as we type and read these posts.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Bit of both – I had team calls to confirm we are going to do an exact replication of ourselves next. Calls and responses – and went to bed.

            I will release a Raw version as I think it is necessary to explain a few things and add the extra info.

            I will then look to do a more refined one as energy allows.

            At the moment there are Universities and private replicators seeking clarity and journalists so it makes sense to get out more and more clarifying media.

            People will certainly have opinions on how this information is being released (not that it wasn’t already in the public domain as the experiment and discussion/analysis was live), but it is as fast as we can – after we were ‘happy’ that it was meaningful.

            I have had 4 hours restless sleep but must go and do family duties this morning (searching for a play school for our son), so it’ll have to wait a little longer.

          • Appleby

            Thanks I also would like to email you a video of some heat exchanger tubing I got a gate pass for from my employer with strange magnetic properties.

            If I put the north side of a round (speaker) magnet on the end of the tubing it wants to find “center”.

            If I put the south side of the same magnet on the same end of the tubing it forces itself to one side or the other.

            I don’t know if this will complicate things or if you’re even interested but I have more than enough to send to you.

            To make matters even harder for you I have no idea what the tubing is made up of.

            Only thing I can tell you for sure is it does not show any corrosion after 10 years of laying on the ground in the weather.

          • Bob Matulis

            I am happy to hear you are pursuing an exact replication. I am excited about the announcement regarding gamma rays occurring with excess heat. But ever since the original P&F breakthrough the biggest stumbling block is replication.

            This upcoming replication is a defining moment in my opinion. If it fails and ultimately takes numerous attempts to get the positive results we are “back to square 1”. However, it succeeds on this next try it suggests that the effect can be reliably replicated. I believe it will just be a matter of time before countless replications settle the fact that LENR is real.

            Great work and congratulations on what has already been accomplished. Your time, blood, sweat and tears is very much appreciated.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Thanks Bob and believe me – there will be a lot of sweat on the next one – but if it doesn’t deliver – we have to try again, we didn’t get this far by thinking it was easy.

  • Gerard McEk

    Congratulations MFMP!
    Finally you have been able to find Andrea’s recipe! I am sure we can soon read the book: “The hunt for Andrea Rossi’s recipe”. I am convinced that it will be an exciting book.
    With this discovery you not only gave great respect to Andrea and said that everything he said is true, but you also cleared the name of your great inspirer Martin Fleischmann. Of cource you and I have always known that he was an honest man and that his and Stanley Pons’ discovery of ‘Cold Fusion’, wasn’t flaw, pathetic science, pseudo science or whatever they called it nearly 27 years ago, but now you have proven it, great!
    Not only that, you gave the world the recipe and now there is no way for science to refuse replication and sort out the theory.
    Let us hope that the people will use the new and enormous energy source with care and great respect.
    Regards, Gerard

    • georgehants

      Gerard 10 likes for that comment, only if people change will, I think, your last sentence come to pass.

      • The Book must include these memorable Quotes.

        I paraphrase from memory of the evening (actually some ungodly hour in the morning for me)
        “Its getting quite hot now”
        “It might explode and we end up molten lithium or even vapour”
        ” I can hide behind this monitor”
        “Maybe we should put up the blast shield?”
        “Yeh lets up the blast shield.”
        Noise of moving furniture.
        “Ok We have put up the blast shield.”
        5 Minutes later BANG!
        And the sound of bits of the reactor shrapnel being scattered round the lab.
        “Ooh it exploded!”
        Lots of expletives, “It vapourised”
        “Any one know what does Lithium Aluminium Hydride smells like?”
        “Err Death!”
        “Maybe you should open some windows and the door”
        “Maybe go outside”

        Ah those were the days 🙂
        http://coldfusionnow.org/mfmp-dog-bone-week-ends-with-cell-popping-bang/

        Kind Regards walker

        • georgehants

          All About Carbon Monoxide Poisoning
          Winter is the time of year when the number of cases of Carbon Monoxide Poisoning goes up and up. Every day we read about another family that has been overcome by carbon monoxide, the most deadly toxin on the planet. Every year, as many as 40,000 people seek medical attention in the United States as a result of carbon monoxide poisoning. Carbon Monoxide (CO) poisoning is believed to be responsible for more than half of the poisoning deaths world wide. The CDC (Centers for Disease Control, US Government) reports that more than 2,500 Americans die each year from carbon monoxide damage
          . – See more at:
          http://carbonmonoxide-poisoning.com/#sthash.M4W0TVNv.dpuf

          • Hi all

            In reply to georgehants

            One of the things we can hope for 🙂

            Kind Regards walker

        • Hi all

          Based on a true story for the film:
          Scene outside the lab door, as the team takes a cigarette break to calm their nerves.
          Member of the morning shift turns up.

          “What you all doing outside?”
          “Making sure we are alive!”
          “You all look alive to me.”
          Pause
          Bob puts up his thumb and says “Awesome!”

          Kind Regards walker

  • Jonas

    Now where can I buy the kit? 😀

    • Jonas

      Actually, I wouldn’t at all mind designing and 3D printing (via e.g. Shapaways) something of this nature. I don’t understand half of the theory, but if someone wanted a strong and robust thing I might be of some assistance. 🙂 Now 3D printing in e.g. aluminum or other metals is rather expensive, but I assume things could be made pretty small (which is also easier to do in 3D than by hand), and – as mentioned – very durable, and also very exact..

  • georgehants

    Some may like to read the E-mail we received from Bob at MFMP.
    ———
    Dear Donor,
    During ICCF-17 in South Korea, shortly following the sad death of Dr. Martin
    Fleischmann, it became abundantly clear to a group of fresh attendees that the
    old approach to science, combined with the ostracisation of the great minds
    that had worked in the face of ridicule, was not delivering on the promise of
    of what we immediately called, “The New Fire”.
    It also was clear that there was something to investigate and we were morally
    bound to do it.
    We said that people would not believe, until they could experience it as if they
    were doing themselves and so the idea of Live Open Science was born. That was
    not enough, it had to be an effort that was free from commercial or government
    interests and that result and so it had to be conducted by the people, for the
    people. Our journey was made possible by the courage of Francesco Celani and we
    thank him profusely.
    Your
    donations played a critical role in realising this vision, but you know that,
    what we know you will want to hear is what we have to share tomorrow.
    Wehave been running and analysing an experiment live over the past Month.
    Firstfor us in this experiment were:
    Parkhomov Baking of Ni(correctly done)
    Pre Hydrogenation of Ni
    Proper baking out of cell under vacuum
    Parkhomov pressure
    Piantelli de-oxygenation
    Piantelli ‘loading’ + proper dwell times
    Piantelli capture analogue
    Use of free Lithium
    Use of calibrated NaI
    Cycles attempting to create nano Ni distillates (inspired by “Bang!” discovery
    of dissolved Ni)
    Long Run
    You can see that there are steps in there that came about only because of
    activities that were made possible by donations. The critical visits to
    Piantelli and Parkhomov.
    Aroundthe beginning of the month we saw what appeared to be up to a COP of 1.2, not
    earth shattering, but sustained and robust and in line with both observations
    by others and the Lugano report when adjusted for correct emissivity. Over the
    next weeks we tried various bookend calibrations which supported this finding.
    We have said that only two paths would satisfy us:
    Statistically significant
    Isotopic or elemental shifts from Fuel to Ash
    Statistically significant
    emissions commensurate, correlating, or anti correlating to excess heat
    We are happy to tell you that we believe we have satisfied our condition 2, yet of
    course we’d like to replicate ourselves. Actually, though, it goes much
    further than that. What we will share is that the way in which we discovered it
    and the journey of analysis that makes it virtually impossible to say that
    Rossi does not have what he claims. It also shows that, whilst he may have been optimistic in how fast this would play out, he has been telling the truth,
    quite openly for years. Not only that, nature itself has been telling the same
    story and it told us too.
    By the 16/02/2016 we had given up trying to destroy the *GlowStick* 5.2, part of
    a long lineage of []=Project Dog Bone=[] experiments. After the reactor was
    turned off, Alan shared the remainder of the data files from the NaI
    scintillator kindly donated by a project follower called Stephen (Thankyou
    Stephen, really).
    Project
    follower and open science legend, Ecco, first took a look at the data and found
    some anomalies – one SO striking that we thought there had been an equipment
    failure. We did not know the time that the anomalies occurred and had to wait
    until Alan woke to explain the time stamps so we could correlate it with the
    thermal and power data published live to HUGNet (Thankyou Ryan and Paul
    Hunt).
    To our extreme surprise, the onset of excess heat followed the massive anomaly in emissions and the minor anomalies were during and only during excess heat.
    This ed us on a path of discovery, the sequence of which explains: The massive count signal discovered by Francesco Celani during Rossi’s first public demo
    How Rossi knew his reactor had started
    How the E-Cat generates
    excess heat
    How it self sustains
    How it can scale easily
    That it is safe
    It also showed us how replicators can know they have succeeded in triggering the New Fire and how to enhance the excess heat.
    Subsequent to this, we found out Rossi had travelled the same design journey and had publicly shared it in the past.
    The irony is – this was all being conducted live in the open, including discussions
    and graphing, whilst people were distracted with news of the end of the 1MW 1
    year test. Same day…
    In the past week we have been checking, cross checking to verify and this morning
    we cleared our last serious doubt, again live, with shared data. Because this
    is already in the open we want people to know so that they can start
    replicating based on what works, moreover, the insight will allow people to
    immediately start improving on our results.
    Thank you for making this possible
    We did it
    We lit the New Fire Together!

    • GreenWin

      “British Oil Industry Warns it May Collapse” CNN February 23, 2016: 8:07 AM ET
      http://money.cnn.com/2016/02/23/news/economy/uk-oil-industry-losing-money/

      Thanks for the post George and to MFMP.

      • georgehants

        Morning GreenWin, good, what difference does it make, hopefully lots of jobs lost so that people can enjoy their lives and spend time helping others.
        Production of all the necessities etc. will not be effected by all those people being out of work.

        • Nigel Appleton

          Lots of people enjoy their jobs.
          Lots of people would find it difficult to survive and support their families without jobs, let alone enjoy life and help others.

          What planet do you live on?

          • bachcole

            But, as much as I agree with you per current conditions, what happens when LENR and millions of robots come online and put millions out of work. Do we just turn our backs on them?

          • US_Citizen71
          • GreenWin

            The SPCB (Soc Prevention Cruelty to Bots) will be filing a complaint against Boston Robotics. How long does their power supply last?

          • US_Citizen71

            They are not telling at this point. The Wired article couldn’t get a comment from them. But much like electric cars an electric robot would benefit much from an ECat X. Here comes the Cylons! ; )

          • georgehants

            Nigel thank you you have completely missed the point of my post and given an opinion without asking reverent questions.
            Not very clever.

      • Pekka Janhunen

        “We have a huge task ahead but the prize is worth fighting for,” she said

        • georgehants

          Pekka what “prize” did she mean, a better World or profits for the rich?

          • GreenWin

            The prize is continued obdurate thinking by our most revered men and women of “science.” They have dug their own grave.

          • georgehants

            GreenWin, please stop using these obtuse words, I have to get out my dictionary all the time when I read your posts, ha.

          • GreenWin

            A proper and… punctilious observation George. Apologies. 🙂

          • Warthog

            My favorite bumper sticker of all time…….”Eschew Obfuscation”

          • georgehants

            Ha, Warthog, I had to look that up as well, very good.

          • Pekka Janhunen

            “Professors, policymakers, and business leaders routinely chant the
            mantras that public companies “belong” to their shareholders; that the
            proper goal of corporate governance is to maximize shareholder wealth;
            and that shareholder wealth is best measured by share price…”
            (The Shareholder Value Myth, Lynn A. Stout, Cornell Law School, https://corpgov.law.harvard.edu/2012/06/26/the-shareholder-value-myth/ )

          • georgehants

            What a load of crap they speak, it is people who do the work only that should receive reward, all others rewarded by the work they have done for society.
            No need for parasites living off of the effort of others.

          • GreenWin

            Now, pragmatic pension funds (paying teacher, firemen, police, government worker etc. pensions) will have to find new investment vehicles. Cherokee Partners and Woodford lead the way.

          • bachcole

            As much as I am usually irritated by you, george, I love this question. Oh God, I love this question.

    • Dods

      That’s a solid post that should go down in the history books.

      Cheers for posting George and Cheers again to the MFMP.

    • artefact

      Wonderful day today.

      • georgehants

        Many thanks for that artefact, O yes it could be the start of something BIG.

      • Mats002

        +1 (not logged in)

    • Ted-X

      The nano-Ni distillates might be from nickel carbonyls ant the temperature cycle.

      • Bob Greenyer

        I will explain in a ‘bad hand waving’ video I will post later today.

        Actually, it should read Precipitates

  • Congratulations, MFMP! You’re a part of history now. Amazing work!

    I watched much of that experiment live (yay for LOS!) and at the time felt the temperature behavior was interesting but unconvincing. (How could these dang thermocouples keep failing in a way that seemed to show excess heat!). If I had known there was a giant gamma signal I might have started to feel the vindication then that I feel now.

    Because now, and maybe I speak for others that have been following this closely for years, I feel like science has walked up and given me a giant bear hug.

    Stumbling on this story in 2011, I wound up so intrigued I pounced on it like a detective. Could there be any more important development at this point in history than the emergence of ultra clean, inexpensive, safe and nearly limitless energy? But it was from the start an 80/20 affair. For every positive piece of evidence, circumstantial or otherwise, there was a doubt or a flaw. For every scientist or engineer claiming an interesting result there were ten laughing in his face. People screaming SCAM right from the start. Screaming. But there was just too much smoke for there not to be a new fire.

    Once I became convinced, I tried to convince others. It has been kind of a lonely road with only our fellow travelers here at ECW and a few other places seeming to have the open — but properly skeptical and evidence based — minds necessary to appreciate this hugely important science, engineering and business story in full.

    So hat tip to ECW and especially Frank Acland who made this eye of the hurricane what it is.

    What a wild ride.

    • GreenWin

      ” I feel like science has walked up and given me a giant bear hug.” Yes REAL science as practiced by 0.01% of “scientists” perhaps has hugged you LENR G. The rest has thumbed its nose and whined Fraud!

      • I share your frustration with the scientific establishment (c’mon people your job description is to look into *everything*), but my focus is not there. They’ll be harshly judged when finally the full story is told.

        My focus now is on the collective future this enables for all of us. And it is awesome.

        • Mats002

          Hi LENR G, I am curious what are you thinking to do of this? 🙂

          • Time permitting I may attempt some detailed analyses of the potential impact of LENR technology on specific aspects of our economy, environment, geopolitics, etc. But only if real life relents a bit.

            Now that we’re transitioning from the prove it phase to the so what phase.

  • Alan DeAngelis

    Congratulations MFMP!
    F&P were/are chemists. You would get a huge reception at
    an American Chemical Society meeting. It may be too late for

    San Diego (March 13-17) but the next one is in Philadelphia Aug. 21-25).

    http://www.acs.org/content/acs/en/meetings.html

    • Alan DeAngelis
      • TPaign

        I just read through their email sent last night.Awesome work MFMP! Thank you for being diligent in following the scientific method. Many folks don’t understand how incredibly important that is, especially in regards to a “taboo” such as LENR. You guys made my day.

  • Bob Greenyer

    You probably have all the lithium you will ever need in the batteries in your house

    • Enrique Ferreyra

      Do you plan to write a formal paper ?

      • Bob Greenyer

        Yes and Bob Higgins is leading that effort – this will take a good while – but we wanted to get the ‘message’ out – the minutia will distill in time.

        If you want to see the first part of his work, go here:

        http://goo.gl/kYGJDP

  • Warthog

    People are NOT going to change, which is why it is necessary for there to be a form of governance that is actually designed to work WITH humanity’s flaws (republic/democracy) instead of beating against an unbreakable wall trying to force them to change (socialism/communism).

  • artefact

    Selling Kits and components for LENR experiments.

  • Enrique Ferreyra

    I understand that there are still things to clarify, but if MFMP guys are sure to be nailed I believe and trust them.
    Congratulations !!

  • Oystein Lande

    Congratulations!
    And let’s also celebrate all the cold fusion heroes of present and past:


    The world needs dreamers and the world needs doers. But above all, the world needs dreamers who do.

    Professors Martin Fleischmann and Pons said it started with an idea, a dream.

    And we noted then and now the sceptics that likes to talk.

    Unfortunately, talkers are usually more articulate than doers, since talk is their specialty.

    But talkers have never been good doers. It’s the doers that change this world.

    And These are just a few of the good ones:

    currentscience.ac.in/Volumes/108/04/0491-suppl.pdf

  • JDM

    MFMP could perhaps make a “science fair” kit to sell to recoup their out-of-pocket expenses and at the same time get an entire new generation involved in developing applications for the tech.

    • Owen Geiger

      Yes, a $200 10Kw science fair kit would be wonderful. Snap a few pieces together, plug it in and enjoy one year of free heat. Pop in a $20 recharge cartridge for next year. Repeat.

      • Excellent. They can be used by colleges throughout the world to retest CF.

    • gdaigle

      Yes, a kit would be a good idea since it could provide properly prepared materials in ways not mentioned in the recipe. Also, no induction by electrical or magnetic fields are referenced, making it easier for this to be done in an oven/kiln.

  • Ivan Idso

    What would a one line press release read?

    • Owen Geiger

      MFMP publishes cold fusion recipe for nearly free limitless energy.

      • William D. Fleming

        With due credit to Andrea Rossi.

  • Bob Greenyer

    Yes I was telling random people that we have the means to get off this rock and colonise the heavens – I just love the looks I get. hehe

    • Dods

      When all this has concluded that the next bone I hope this site chases and not just die slowly. I put my vote in for the EMDrive now.

      • Dods

        Best register emdrive-world.com now Frank 😉

        • Mike403

          I’ve been following the LENR ‘story’ for five years. I have come through the ‘It’s impossible – against the Laws of Physics’ stage. I spent a fair bit of time contemplating the thought that this is all some sort of mistake / delusion or scam. I really struggled with the apparent total lack of interest from ‘mainstream scientists’ and the media. I recently became encouraged and pretty much convinced by the most recent MFMP glowstick test results (where you could see that there were parts of the ‘active’ trace clearly showing higher readings than the ‘null’ trace). Now that we have the latest analyses of this data (and especially the gamma spike) I believe we are finally at the ‘tipping point’ for LENR.
          Or to quote Victor Hugo: ‘Nothing can stop an idea whose time has come’.

        • Bob Greenyer

          Well, arguably the fuel elements are part of Rossi’s awarded patent.

          But, this should allow others insight to try things that could circumvent the key claims.

      • Bob Greenyer

        Stoyan Sarg said he would help me open up his Anti Gravity drive technology if the MFMP demonstrated the New Fire.

        I have in part been working so hard on this in order to take him up on his commitment.

        • Maybe he should be informed.
          But when I remember correctly he somewhere said he won’t have to do anything with “cold fusion” anymore.

          • e-dog

            How do I bump this to the top?????

        • Dods

          That’s cool. I tried to read some of Stoyan’s Theories on the BSM but its well above my pay grade. But good to know that this community has this story to chase next, all going well of course.

          • georgehants

            A search of —-MFMP confirms cold fusion lenr —– returns ECW and MFMP Facebook, nothing else.

  • William D. Fleming

    Just because we don’t have degrees in physics doesn’t mean we are stupid. We can feel joy because we appreciate the significance of the new developments. I, for one, trust the integrity of the people involved. They plan to publish a full report today, so it’s not too early to rejoice.

    And I trust and believe Andrea Rossi. A new age is upon us!

  • Bob Greenyer

    Inside the coil.

    THERE ARE NO NEUTRONS BEING EMITTED!

  • Private Citizen

    Has there been ash analysis of the reactants responsible for this “smoking gun” gamma emission?

    Forgive, there is such a swarm of commentary, if the ash is mentioned, i missed it.

    • Mats002

      No ash analysis yet to my knowledge.

  • Bob Greenyer

    I worked this out from the signal – before I was aware of this video.

    But listen and dwell on the phraseology – he specifically says

    “the heater of the System is the lead” look at the order of that phrase… To me it came to me in my sleep before I had seen this video and I will post a video I recorded before seeing this, later today.

    • Teemu Soilamo

      Then again, it might be some weird Italian phrasing. But I get your point.

      • Bob Greenyer

        It is more a slip of the tongue which will seem obvious when you see my independent insight.

    • e-dog

      Wow… well done Bob!

    • e-dog

      Just a question, do you have main stream media contacts?
      I get it, I will tell all my friends but we need some people with the creds and the contacts to really get your info out there!
      We still have the problem of ignorance and vested interests that will stand in the way of ….

      Im going to go for some (old) fire/cave man analogies … its like you guys have have seen rossi light a fire over there up in the hills in his shaman tent…
      through lots of stick rubbing you figured out how to do it too.. but no one is watching and its pouring rain, all the fire wood is damp, got no kindling, the old wise fellas are telling you to stop wasting your time .. .and winter is coming.

      this is world changing stuff and we have the internet.

  • georgehants

    Who will be the first to follow the MFMP recipe and credit them for their work?
    Perhaps some of our clever scientists who have been debunking it for 30 bloody years.

    • Bob Greenyer

      We know of several replicators or are preparing their apparatus – but this run took a week at least in material processing – and we believe that is key

      • georgehants

        Bob, it is MFMP that can now be credited with starting the revolution without taking away credit from Mr. Rossi et al, but he for his own reasons has been a disaster of secrecy delaying the Research of Cold Fusion.
        You may have missed my comment way down the page, if you can confirm the points we made we would like to donate further.
        Let me know if you cannot find it.

        • Bob Greenyer

          I am not sure that he has been that secret to be fair – it was just a case of no one with the means paying attention or believing in him enough.

          I will explain in my video today F9

          • georgehants

            Well I expect all the secret work to build bigger bombs etc is going well.
            Remember Mr. Rossi for some reason “donated” his technology to the defense dept.
            Did you find my comment?
            We need conformation that all your work will be passed on for the benefit of humanity and not profit.

  • e-dog

    Good point. Can you get your website tuned up to take donations?

  • David Taylor-Fuller

    Bob, dont know if anyone has asked this yet. But what does the gamma signal signify. Is the energy being generated all or mostly gamma? I am assuming it has to be a significant source of the energy, other wise there wouldnt be a need to convert it to thermal energy via lead/tungsten

    • Appleby

      I have been looking for bob’s video he said he would release and can’t find it. Could someone please post a link?

  • Christina

    Congratulations, MFMP.
    Fantastic.

  • peacelovewoodstock

    Please forgive this dumb question but what does it mean when Rossi or now Bob Greenyer includes ‘F9’ as part of a message?

    • ScienceFan

      Final results of tests could be positive or negative. F-… 9 words.

      • peacelovewoodstock

        Ha! Thanks to all. I knew the meaning listed in urban dictionary couldn’t be it 🙂

    • Sverre Haslund

      F9 – refers to Rossi’s standard disclaimer which is “if the results of the one year test are positive but could also be negative”.

    • etburg

      This is a shorthand for “results could be positive or negative” which is statement one is typically required to make for business and legal reasons. He had to repeat it so often in his blog that someone joked that he should put a macro on his keyboard programmed to a key like the F9 key to type it out for him. After that it became a running joke. Whenever he says “F9” he is doing it in lieu of actually typing out the statement.

      • Bob Matulis

        Perhaps F9 will some day be defined in the Urban Dictionary! 🙂

        • Matt Sevrens

          Until this is replicated it’s all just a hypothesis

          • John Schut

            This is already a replication…

          • More ‘reverse engineering’ with a large element of informed guesswork. Independent replication using the cookbook formula is the stated purpose of releasing the information, and will be the true vindication of MFMP’s work.

          • Bob Greenyer

            A man may lie, nature can not, Piantelli taught me that.

            It is not the size of the signal that matters, it is the structure of the signal and we saw the same signals (switch on and operation) that Rossi and others have observed.

            People can have opinions – but this is not a matter of opinion, this is a gift from Nature and in time, probably very quickly, this will be impossible to deny.

          • psi2u2

            Bob, congratulations to you and the entire MFMP team. Your replication was one of the things I’ve been waiting for. Well done! I look forward to reading more as you make further progress.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Thank you for your unstinting support.

          • we want LENR Fusione Fredda

            No worries, you’ve got tons more here.

          • Bruce Williams

            And here too !

          • Matt Sevrens

            Just do it ONE more time :-/ Thats it. That’s science man. Then you can say your hypothesis is confirmed.

          • Bob Greenyer

            In our pre release letter, published on this site – we state we would like to.

            But the data shows what Rossi claims.

            You know if a number of people that have looked in the same drawer, tell you there is a piece of yellow card in there, then you don’t know if you should believe them. If you look your self and see the yellow card, you have to conclude they were telling you the truth, of course, you can close the draw and open it again if you don’t believe your eyes.

    • Bob Matulis

      “F9” is short hand for a Rossi disclaimer. He uses regularly when discussing the ECAT and to paraphrase it means, “Assuming the test successfully concludes.”

  • LuFong

    Gamma emissions in Rossi’s reactors generating heat is no surprise to me as this was common knowledge way back when. Rossi always had a lead shield in the early E-Cats. At the time it was for thermalization but Rossi also said it was for a fail safe for any radiation.

    I looked back over the Lugano Report ( http://www.elforsk.se/Global/Omv%C3%A4rld_system/filer/LuganoReportSubmit.pdf ) , the gold standard in understanding the E-Cat, and there is a clear statement that there is no gamma’s or any other radiation detected, either in the fuel before and immediately after the test, nor during the test. There doesn’t seem to be any mention of Pb either in the fuel or E-Cat device. This to me is very strange and perhaps someone can expound on this.

    • Kevmo

      I think it’s evidence that Rossi had managed to get past the point where his reactor was “leaking” gamma rays. He’s on his 5th revision while everyone else including MFMP is on version 1.0

      • LuFong

        See my edit on my comment above.

        • Kevmo

          I can’t tell where you edited it.

          • LuFong

            Refresh the page and see the part that says ‘Edit’.

    • Mats002

      Plausible answers is down in this thread, the heating wire or the alumina reactor can be coated with Pb or another dense material.

    • Adam Lepczak

      Lugano tested the “hot cat” version of the reactor. I am thinking it is a 2nd generation of the process. 3rd generation of the process is the Ecat-X. The 1MW plant uses modified flavor of the original design. I would guess that that Rossi has an extensive experience operating the original Ecat but HotCat and Ecat-X are way more efficient but more difficult to control. It is possible that the “HotCat” design was a diversion.

    • Ged

      Bob pointed out the Incol coating on the coils of the hot cat are four times thicker than necessary to block 100% of the gamma rays at these low energy levels. So, of course Lugano didn’t see any without compensating for the coil covered areas.

      Also, Cook/Rossi is just say the major source of the energy is that reaction. But as LENRG pointed out, the resulting neutron shuttling afterwards would make gammas on this scale and energy distribution. The theory is not fully nailed down, but all evidence so far points to Rossi/Cook likely being right about the fusion half of the reaction and why it next to never makes gammas. We’ll have to see with further experiments now that we know how and what to look for.

      • LuFong

        Thanks for the reply but I still don’t really follow (and may never given my background). The coils aren’t the locus of the reaction and would only block some of the gamma’s since they coil around and don’t touch each other leaving plenty of gaps. I don’t really understand the science including the Cook/Rossi paper–I am only looking for superficial contradictions.

        Anyway, Bob Greenyer and MFMP seems confident in the data and the rest is just engineering but I say until it’s demonstrated, it’s still just conjecture. I agree if they have definitive signals of gamma then there is a nuclear reaction occuring but that’s only a small step toward Rossi’s E-Cat, IMHO.

    • Kevmo

      I think someone upthread expanded on this. A thin sleeve of Tungsten takes care of low intensity gammas, or some other metal that is incorporated into the reactor wall itself.

  • Pekka Janhunen

    According to established physics, gammas can only be produced by nuclear reactions or by particle accelerators, for they cannot be produced by chemical reactions. On the other hand, if nuclear reactions occur, nuclear energy can also be liberated.

    Unless the gammas were some kind of measurement error, the experiment shows quite convincingly that some nuclear reactions occurred. The fact that some excess heat (=amount of extra heat energy which is too large to be explained by chemical reactions) was also reported at the same time adds to the case, because both gammas and excess heat can in principle be explained by nuclear reactions. Here, “nuclear reaction” must be understood in a broad sense: any process which transforms nuclei to other ones, including but not necessarily limited to the currently known types of nuclear reactions.

  • Lux Terrea

    I know! I know. Really lame question but all I’ve heard about gamma rays are that they are the most powerful and they easily kill people. Wouldn’t a device that makes them be a really bad thing and wouldn’t that put these lenr devices into a highly regulated category like nuclear power plants?

    • SG

      Even sticky tape emits terahertz radiation. I’m pretty sure sticky tape isn’t highly regulated.

      http://science.slashdot.org/story/09/08/05/1840207/sticky-tape-found-to-emit-terahertz-radiation

      The amount of low energy gamma can be easily blocked by a thin layer of lead or tungsten. There is no radioactive fuel and no radioactive waste.

      • Kevmo

        Excellent response.

      • Facts and common sense seem to become less relevant when agendas are being served. Just the mention of gamma radiation would be enough to serve as the basis for scare stories if some party wanted to monopolise CF by dragging it into the nuclear stockade.

        • Lux Terrea

          Good response and good observation. PR people take note.

    • e-dog

      We really should consult Dr Banner about these gamma rays..

  • e-dog

    I wonder what rossi’s reaction to this MFMP announcement could be?? F9??

    • I guess he tought “damn! now I have competition!!” 😉

    • georgehants

      If Mr. Rossi (IH) ever try to use a patent to stop cheap |Cold Fusion devices from being produced to help humanity we will have our answer.

  • Fyodor

    I hoped that 2015 would be the year of successful replications, Post-Parkhomov. Let’s hope that we were only off by a year and that this works and is reliably replicable.

  • e-dog

    This nearly made me cry, Ok.. I did cry but just a few tears, damn i wish they would stop…. I am still just utterly gob-smacked! Again WOW!

    Copied it of Mats website.. I think it needs to be known, this is history.
    what do you think Frank?

    Here’s the complete letter to the donors from MFMP:

    Dear Donor,

    During ICCF-17 in South Korea, shortly following the sad death of Dr. Martin Fleischmann, it became abundantly clear to a group of fresh attendees that the old approach to science, combined with the ostracisation of the great minds that had worked in the face of ridicule, was not delivering on the promise of of what we immediately called, “The New Fire”.

    It also was clear that there was something to investigate and we were morally bound to do it.

    We said that people would not believe, until they could experience it as if they were doing themselves and so the idea of Live Open Science was born. That was not enough, it had to be an effort that was free from commercial or government interests and that result and so it had to be conducted by the people, for the people. Our journey was made possible by the courage of Francesco Celani and we thank him profusely.

    Your donations played a critical role in realising this vision, but you know that, what we know you will want to hear is what we have to share tomorrow.

    We have been running and analysing an experiment live over the past Month. First for us in this experiment were:

    – Parkhomov Baking of Ni(correctly done)

    – Pre Hydrogenation of Ni

    – Proper baking out of cell under vacuum

    – Parkhomov pressure

    – Piantelli de-oxygenation

    – Piantelli ‘loading’ + proper dwell times

    – Piantelli capture analogue

    – Use of free Lithium

    – Use of calibrated NaI

    – Cycles attempting to create nano Ni distillates (inspired by “Bang!” discovery of dissolved Ni)

    – Long Run

    You can see that there are steps in there that came about only because of activities that were made possible by donations. The critical visits to Piantelli and Parkhomov.

    Around the beginning of the month we saw what appeared to be up to a COP of 1.2, not earth shattering, but sustained and robust and in line with both observations by others and the Lugano report when adjusted for correct emissivity. Over the next weeks we tried various bookend calibrations which supported this finding.

    We have said that only two paths would satisfy us:

    Statistically significant Isotopic or elemental shifts from Fuel to Ash

    Statistically significant emissions commensurate, correlating, or anti correlating to excess heat

    We are happy to tell you that we believe we have satisfied our condition 2, yet of course we’d like to replicate ourselves. Actually, though, it goes much further than that. What we will share is that the way in which we discovered it and the journey of analysis that makes it virtually impossible to say that Rossi does not have what he claims. It also shows that, whilst he may have been optimistic in how fast this would play out, he has been telling the truth, quite openly for years. Not only that, nature itself has been telling the same story and it told us too.

    By the 16/02/2016 we had given up trying to destroy the *GlowStick* 5.2, part of a long lineage of []=Project Dog Bone=[] experiments. After the reactor was turned off, Alan shared the remainder of the data files from the NaI scintillator kindly donated by a project follower called Stephen (Thankyou Stephen, really).

    Project follower and open science legend, Ecco, first took a look at the data and found some anomalies – one SO striking that we thought there had been an equipment failure. We did not know the time that the anomalies occurred and had to wait until Alan woke to explain the time stamps so we could correlate it with the thermal and power data published live to HUGNet (Thankyou Ryan and Paul Hunt).

    To our extreme surprise, the onset of excess heat followed the massive anomaly in emissions and the minor anomalies were during and only during excess heat.

    This led us on a path of discovery, the sequence of which explains:

    The massive count signal discovered by Francesco Celani during Rossi’s first public demo

    How Rossi knew his reactor had started

    How the E-Cat generates excess heat

    How it self sustains

    How it can scale easily

    That it is safe

    It also showed us how replicators can know they have succeeded in triggering the New Fire and how to enhance the excess heat.

    Subsequent to this, we found out Rossi had travelled the same design journey and had publicly shared it in the past.

    The irony is – this was all being conducted live in the open, including discussions and graphing, whilst people were distracted with news of the end of the 1MW 1 year test. Same day…

    In the past week we have been checking, cross checking to verify and this morning we cleared our last serious doubt, again live, with shared data. Because this is already in the open we want people to know so that they can start replicating based on what works, moreover, the insight will allow people to immediately start improving on our results.

    Thank you for making this possible

    We did it

    We lit the New Fire Together!

    • Frank Acland

      Thanks, e-dog. Good idea — I’ve made a separate post for the letter.

      • Bob Greenyer

        What you seeing Remi is an artefact of the process of Live Open Science – everyone is in the lab that chooses to be experiencing the discovery process. The distilled information will come through the noise in time when people have a chance to take stock and connect the dots such that the message can be effectively conveyed.

        I am about to start rolling out the bulk of the information package that puts everything in context. It may have errors and factual inaccuracies – but it is the spirit of it that should allow others with the relevant knowhow to fill the gaps. We should not be afraid of being wrong but when nature tells you something, we should listen.

  • e-dog

    I wonder which main stream media will pick this up first?? Not that ECW isnt main stream… it is for me!

    • None. It’s absolutely worthless for them I guess.
      We have to wait for the flood of replications, then I’m sure wired.co.uk etc will report.

      But this is, yet, too abstract for outsiders.

      • Bob Matulis

        Replications is the key. I would think many university Chemistry profs could have great fun reproducing this.

  • Warthog

    More correctly…”humanity” will not change. Certainly change is possible on an individual basis when done for ” internal” (moral, ethical, religious) reasons. But “human nature” is as God (or Darwin) made it, and trying to impose change via external means ” ain’t gonna happen”, and certainly not on the scale needed to make communism/socialism a success.

  • deleo77

    It’s too technical and early at this point. It’s hard to write a mainstream article about detecting radiation above the background level and get people excited about it – especially when the detection is just above the noise level. If others are able to reproduce this repeatedly and someone with a name in science is willing to say “LENR aka Cold Fusion is real and has now been discovered” then I imagine CNN etc will run with it.

    I do think that others will replicate the Rossi Effect with these steps over the next several months. Ni62 enhancing the effect could really help here as well and will just make the effect even more clear. I know skeptics are nowhere ready to give up the fight yet, but it looks like the train has left the station and Rossi will be vindicated. As someone who has always been 50/50 on Rossi I now finally see something to push me over the hump.

    • Private Citizen

      “I know skeptics are nowhere ready to give up the fight yet”

      Hard to tell, skeptical voices have been banned and banished from the available forums, so all we get to hear is the Hallelujah chorus in the echo chamber.

  • Da Phys

    PZL would have shown a distinct peak in the spectrum.

  • Sant2060

    Great work, congrats. One thing though…correlation doesnt mean causation. I think you would do just fine without hyping gamas and lead as the finalu answer and source of heat…at least until you or someone proves it.

    This is now a very dangerous situation…you cracked a very big pisce of puzzle, but it could all go unnoticed and ridiculed because of one of the oldest logical errors.

    • Bob Greenyer

      We will only be satisfied when we have replicated ourselves – which unfortunately means not adding Lead or Tungsten in the initial run – so no expectation of higher COP.

      We would like to have other detectors to simultaneously look at reactor and another for environmental control.

      Perhaps a third party or other member of the group replicating would also suffice.

      Beyond that – it will be testing the various theories to achieve higher COP

      • Hi Bob, you may be interested in the starting technical discussion at LENR Forum:

        https://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/index.php/Thread/2800-MFMP-18-steps-to-LENR-excess-heat-BasE-Cat-recipe/?postID=14347#post14347

        Also Freethinker reported gammas in his replication approach a while back.

        • Bob Greenyer

          Too many channels already.

      • Pekka Janhunen

        The COP should have nothing to do with the presence or non-presence of radiation shielding.

        That said, maybe you have reproduced the Mouse (which according to Rossi has COP of 1.1) while the Cat is still undiscovered. Maybe the Cat is liquid metal alloy wetting some base metal (perhaps tungsten) on the walls, the liquid containing both Li and Ni plus for example Cu to lower the melting point.

        Although energetically unimportant, the produced ionising radiation (X-rays) might nevertheless be enough to trigger the Cat.

        Of course, everything that I said about Mouse and Cat here is speculative. I agree that you should just replicate yourselves now: do exactly the same as before, but eliminate the possibility that the radiation was a measurement error by using more than one independent instrument to measure it.

        • Bob Greenyer

          I think it is a moderator of thermal loss and the process is thermally driven.

        • Mattias

          But as I understand it … the shielding is actually absorbing the radiation and getting warmer – thus contributing to the total COP (at the moment this excess is “lost”). This means that lead or tungsten actually has everything to do with the COP.

          Maybe I have misunderstood the whole thing?

          • Pekka Janhunen

            Yes someone may have said that, but it cannot be so – see for example my calculation below in this thread. Gamma rays only five times above background cannot measurably warm up anything, because the power is only nanowatt scale.

          • Matt Sevrens

            The thing is it was specifically Rossi who claimed that the heat source was gamma being thermalized by lead.

          • Pekka Janhunen

            Yes. Maybe his device emitted more low-energy photons at that time, or maybe he was just wrong.

          • Axil Axil

            The gamma problems went away after Rossi installed a secondary heater in his reactor to preheat the reactor above the gamma production temperature threshold.

          • Pekka Janhunen

            By secondary heater are you referring to mouse?

          • Axil Axil

            Rossi had trouble with radiation coming from his reactor until he installed a auxiliary heater.

            We can go back now and understand why Rossi had a secondary heater installed in the early versions of his reactor

            http://www.nyteknik.se/incoming/article3144790.ece/BINARY/original/Img+2+ECAT_explained.jpg

            Three E-cats without insulation and one insulated. Text in blue indicates hydrogen inlet, main heater, auxiliary heater and water inlet. Foto: Giuseppe Levi

            Rossi said that it would be dangerous to operate his reactor without a secondary heater. That heater got the reaction temperature into the proper SPP infrared photon pumping zone to remove gamma radiation from the LENR reaction.

          • Sanjeev

            Implications of Signal, Seeing into the Cat with X-Rays
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtTeHU4vBmc&feature=youtu.be

          • Mats002

            I saw the whole video, nothing new for us who followed the experiment and the aftermath but one thing that stuck out was the conclusion that the ‘negative’ outcome of F9

          • Matt Sevrens

            It’s also possible that the gamma MFMP detected was just what escaped the system and the rest was already thermalized. In which case they haven’t discovered how to scale the COP at all.

          • Pekka Janhunen

            Possible, but it would require that the internal gamma spectrum increases by some 10-11 orders of magnitude below the 30keV observation limit.

      • Axil Axil

        To get the heat level up, we must progress from LENR which is low level activity to LENR+ which is high Level activity. LENR is the production of Surface Plasmon Polaritons (SPP). They generated heat up to COP1.2. To get the Heat higher, Hydrogen Rydberg Matter (RHM) must be generated, which is an amplifier of SPP activity.

        To produce HRM, we need to add cavitation and RF stimulation.

        You might try using the contents of a 5 year old Nickel battery.

        See

        https://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/index.php/Thread/2760-Successful-replication-of-Alexander-Parkhomov/?pageNo=1

        It seems that time and many recharge cycles produce nickel that can generate HRM.

        Forget about tungsten and warm up to very old and worn out nickel batteries.

  • Bob Greenyer

    I have discussed with my better half that it may be a good idea – but simply do not have the means – plus, I can do more thinking here.

  • Mike Henderson

    Has a gamma ray burst (GRB) been excluded as a possible cause of the excursion?

    • US_Citizen71

      It is possible, but the odds of a gamma ray burst the appears in signature like bremsstrahlung radiation near the beginning of the production of apparent excess heat is less likely in my opinion than me being chosen by the Republican party to run for president during a contested convention this summer.

  • Jarea

    I have seen a nice comment from Goatguy2 about demanding more specific information on each step of the recipe.
    In my opinion, is a good input that can help Replicators.
    See below
    http://nextbigfuture.com/2016/02/mfmp-project-publishes-recipe-for.html#soa_405ed025

  • VisionandWisdom

    Fantastic news and work MFMP team!
    Any chance of a detailed diagram of the potential reactor setup please?
    I saved all the original glowstick ones and early parkhomov diagrams.
    Roll on 2016 and the successful replications!