The Possible Political Impact Should LENR Emerge (Doug Marker)

The following essay was written at the Sifferkol blogsite and refined over a couple of days.

It considers the effect a disruptive energy technology could have on the stability of oil producing nations should the price of oil decline further than it has in the past year. The essay considers the possibility that LENR is already recognised as a disruptive technology and that should Andrea Rossi have the working solution he describes, that there could be an effort to block or at least delay his progress.

http://www.sifferkoll.se/sifferkoll/excellent-geopolitical-lenr-analysis-by-doug-marker/#comment-25313

Doug Marker

  • Andy Maier

    It’s about time to stand up against these oil producing nations. As long as they are in posession of a product the whole world is pending on they will keep controlling everything and anything worldwide. This fact can only be stopped when somebody comes up with a solution or an idea to make this product(s) obsolete.

  • Carl Wilson

    Currently the last comment on the article at the sifferkoll site was:

    “Malkom700 said:
    If we can produce cheap and clean energy will not be hesitate to
    be introduced. The Third World War is a much smaller threat than
    global warming.”
    To believe that global warming is a threat one would have to look at the evidence for it or trust those that do. All the denialists have to do is declare that the evidence is a bunch of lies and that ends the argument.

    • Pekka Janhunen

      War is always a very, very bad option.
      The anthropogenic greenhouse effect increases the global temperature, almost no doubt about that. But negative implications of the warming are often exaggerated, sometimes grossly. If it leads into extremism of any sort, it is worrying and bad.
      The strongest warming takes place in highest latitudes such as Finland. We see it in nature: for example the lake ice melts 2-3 weeks earlier nowadays than it did 30-40 years ago. But it’s not a catastrophe, on the contrary it has also many positive implications. Vegetation zones are just moving poleward some hundreds of kilometres.

      The rainfall pattern in tropics is not much affected by greenhouse gases, but instead it is affected by the hemispheric asymmetry of anthropogenic soot emissions. If and when those emissions are reduced in China and India, the rainy zone shifts a bit northward in Africa, bringing more rains to countries like Nigeria. Also this is not a catastrophe, but rather it’s return towards more natural state which existed before the industrial age.

      • Carl Wilson

        “Vegetation zones are just moving poleward some hundreds of kilometres” out of the areas that our agriculture is adapted to, too quickly to build up the soils in many areas, releasing large amounts of carbon dioxide in others.

      • Carl Wilson

        “The rainfall pattern in tropics is not much affected by greenhouse
        gases, but instead it is affected by the hemispheric asymmetry of
        anthropogenic soot emissions.” You believe the studies that show this, I tend to believe the other studies.

  • Carl Wilson

    Currently the last comment on the article at the sifferkoll site was:

    “Malkom700 said:
    If we can produce cheap and clean energy will not be hesitate to
    be introduced. The Third World War is a much smaller threat than
    global warming.”
    To believe that global warming is a threat one would have to look at the evidence for it or trust those that do. All the denialists have to do is declare that the evidence is a bunch of lies and that ends the argument.

    • Pekka Janhunen

      War is always a very, very bad option.
      The anthropogenic greenhouse effect increases the global temperature, almost no doubt about that. But negative implications of the warming are often exaggerated, sometimes grossly. If it leads into extremism of any sort, it is worrying and bad.
      The strongest warming takes place in highest latitudes such as Finland. We see it in nature: for example the lake ice melts 2-3 weeks earlier nowadays than it did 30-40 years ago. But it’s not a catastrophe, on the contrary it has also many positive implications. Vegetation zones are just moving poleward some hundreds of kilometres.

      The rainfall pattern in tropics is not much affected by greenhouse gases, but instead it is affected by the hemispheric asymmetry of anthropogenic soot emissions. If and when those emissions are reduced in China and India, the rainy zone shifts a bit northward in Africa, bringing more rains to countries like Nigeria. Also this is not a catastrophe, but rather it’s return towards more natural state which existed before the industrial age.

      • Carl Wilson

        “Vegetation zones are just moving poleward some hundreds of kilometres” out of the areas that our agriculture is adapted to, too quickly to build up the soils in many areas, releasing large amounts of carbon dioxide in others.

      • Carl Wilson

        “The rainfall pattern in tropics is not much affected by greenhouse
        gases, but instead it is affected by the hemispheric asymmetry of
        anthropogenic soot emissions.” You believe the studies that show this, I tend to believe the other studies.

  • Vicky

    What the hell is this… How people can recognize this techology as “disruptive energy technology”. I think they are thinking only about the money the Oil industry is producing but for whom.. Suppose there is no LENR. Then can anyone tell us Who is going to purchase Oil after 10-15 years. Even I am not able to think that any Oil industry can be able to produce and refine the oil due to global warming. Heat on earth is increasing and peoples are dying. This increasing level of heat will not allow you refine the Oil. Its the beast time to think and support the people who are finding the ways to generate the Green Energy. I don’t know people will be agree with me or not but there is urgent need to declare that the use of Fossil Fuel is “disruptive energy technology” and get away from it as soon as possible.

    • E.M.Smith

      “Disruptive technology” is an economic term of art, it means a new tech that overturns the markets of the old. It is not about impact on the planet.

      With that said, I have spent years digging into the Global Warming issue. This is not the place for a debate on it (they tend to drag on endlessly); but the end point of my search has been to realize that Global Warming is a computer fantasy. I have ported the NASA GIStemp codes to my own computer and run it. Read the code. Analysed the process. The “waming” come from data adjustments and excessive averaging and manipulation. The snow across Europe, Denver, Argentina, etc is ample proof we are not warmer. The weather now is indistinguishable from what I remember from the 1950s.

      • Carl Wilson

        “The ‘warming’ come from data adjustments and excessive averaging and manipulation.” This is what UC-Berkeley professor Richard Muller (a physicist) thought. So the Koch foundation put $150,000 for him to demonstrate it. Oops. Google: Koch-Funded Berkeley Temperature Study.

    • DrD

      Hi Vicky, imagine if or when LENR fuels our cars. Don’t you think all those petrol station owners, tanker drivers, oil refinery employees will feel it’s disrupted their lives? Those examples are the tip of the ice burgh. That doesn’t mean I don’t long for LENR to eliminate oil based systems but lets not be mistaken, there’s a lot of people, (our pension funds included) that will suffer much disruption and will probably fight and delay it.

    • bachcole

      Absurd hysteria. People have been dying for millions of years.

      • Observer

        Then why is it that everyone seems to think they are immortal until proven otherwise?

        The ultimate test for a skeptic is to not believe the proof he is mortal.

        • bachcole

          Only teenagers think that they are immortal.

          I know as an observational fact that I am immortal and that I am NOT this body, as much as I try to keep it healthy.

          • Observer

            Each day we re-define ourselves as that which remains.

      • psi2u2

        True, but the history of oil, a relatively scarce but very valuable commodity, is full of violence and pollution. So putting that behind us with a source like LENR can only be a good thing.

    • we want LENR Fusione Fredda

      Hello Vicky. The meaning of ‘disruptive technology’ as it is used here is positive: it means a technology that breaks completely away from what was there before.

      http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/disruptive-technology.asp
      It does not refer to destruction or destructiveness, other than in the ‘Shiva deity’, or in the ‘phoenix’ sense.
      Many of us here are not native English writers, and seek with much hope a peaceful, clean and fair ‘rebirth’ of energy sources.

  • DrD

    Hi Vicky, imagine if or when LENR fuels our cars. Don’t you think all those petrol station owners, tanker drivers, oil refinery employees will feel it’s disrupted their lives? Those examples are the tip of the ice burgh. That doesn’t mean I don’t long for LENR to eliminate oil based systems but lets not be mistaken, there’s a lot of people, (our pension funds included) that will suffer much disruption and will probably fight and delay it.

  • Carl Wilson

    “The ‘warming’ come from data adjustments and excessive averaging and manipulation.” This is what UC-Berkeley professor Richard Muller (a physicist) thought. So the Koch foundation put $150,000 for him to demonstrate it. Oops. Google: Koch-Funded Berkeley Temperature Study.

  • we want LENR Fusione Fredda

    Hello Vicky. The meaning of ‘disruptive technology’ as it is used here is positive: it means a technology that breaks completely away from what was there before.

    http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/disruptive-technology.asp
    It does not refer to destruction or destructiveness, other than in the ‘Shiva deity’, or the ‘phoenix’ sense.
    Many of us here are not native English writers, and seek with much hope a peaceful, clean and fair ‘rebirth’ of energy sources.

  • Observer

    Then why is it that everyone seems to think they are immortal until proven otherwise?

    The ultimate test for a skeptic is to not believe the proof he is mortal.

    • Montague Withnail

      There is no doubt, if LENR was announced as factory ready and immediately cost effective tomorrow, that it would be such a huge disruption that it would initially throw the world into dangerous turmoil.

      Just following through this scenario, it would represent an economic
      dislocation orders of magnitude worse than the sub-prime crisis, which was so
      dangerous because suddenly no one knew what financial assets were worth.

      The same would be true here. A sudden and coordinated loss of value (probably to zero and beyond) of oil majors, miners and utilities is probably not
      something that the Western banking or insurance industries could survive. This time it would be much harder for governments to bail it all out. Forget about the Middle East, we would just close the borders on them and let them get on with it while trying to deal with our own problems.

      So, does this mean that governments are actively and deliberately subverting LENR? I highly highly doubt it for several reasons:

      1. They would have done a better job. How hard really would it be to shut Rossi
      up? Get to him plus a couple of dozen others and it’s basically done with. If
      that’s what they wanted to do, they would have just done it.

      2. They would have done a worse job. Western governments are really bad
      at this sort of thing, they are way too leaky. We would know about it via
      Wikileaks or something by now.

      3. It’s a bad choice. Genuinely if they perceived a threat/opportunity of this
      magnitude they would come up with a better strategy for dealing with it, which
      would involve special regulation and epic amounts of “printed” money
      to keep the financial system afloat during the transition. Trying to keep information like this locked up is just a recipe for losing control

      4. It’s too big a sacrifice. There are two sub-categories here, industry and
      military. If governments really believed in LENR they wouldn’t be able to help
      themselves, they would be desperate to help their industry get a competitive
      advantage and they would be desperate to make sure they didn’t fall behind
      militarily. They wouldn’t sit on their hands and let competing nations get ahead.

      I’m afraid the explanation is much simpler. They just don’t believe it. Personally I am convinced that LENR is a real phenomenon, but I don’t really believe Rossi (I would love to, but for such eccentric claims I would need to see a credible independent validation). I suspect it will take years, maybe decades before we understand LENR sufficiently to make cost effective and useful energy out of it. That will give the world time enough to adjust relatively safely, but we do need to make a start – the long run problems of AGW and depletion are still out there and time-critical.

      • DrD

        I agree with your first paragraph except it also needs certification. No good having production and orders if they’re illegal to use.
        As for the rest, Governments aren’t so well organised and as you say nor can they keep secrets. That doesn’t mean there aren’t powerful interests who stand to lose fortunes who may well be active behind the scenes. So far they either haven’t needed to take drastic actions or they’ve been successful, so far.

        • cashmemorz

          Those displaced workers bring to mind a reason for taxing LENR and other disruptive tech. Tax it to provide for those displaced workers. This could be various methods such as retraining or a form of employment insurance or other monthly cheque, call it what you want, to cover the transition until the worker in question finds their own way to make aa living.

      • doug marker

        Montague,
        A good set of points and well argued.

        Re your main premise ” if LENR was announced as factory ready and immediately cost effective tomorrow”, I don’t believe anyone believes this to be the case, nor is it really likely. Even if Rossi has what he says it is still years away from ‘prime time’.

        The issue with your follow on points is they almost all argue to your main premise which, is quite improbable. Although there are some valid general issues that are included in those points.

        But, none the less a good set of thoughts.

        Cheers

        Doug Marker

    • Jacques

      Okay, I take back my greed remarks. But if the effects are real, their adoption is inevitable and will happen on their own time frame, and artificially holding onto the reins does nothing but induce skepticism. We’re still at the “Is this real?” stage and Rossi seems reluctant to move that dialogue forward, Cheers —

      • doug marker

        Jacques,
        Personally, I believe Rossi wants to move ahead faster than those who are watching and have energy agendas want him to.

        Rossi no matter what people may think, has triggered an enormous amount of interest worldwide, among people who would otherwise not know of LENR or its potential. There are now far too many smart and honest people who have done enough due diligence to conclude personally that LENR is and has been real for a long time – the more multidisciplinary types of researchers and inventors that take up the interest, the faster it will be exploited and understood.

        The trend in Science in the past few decades has been for graduates of physics and science to become specialized. This in part is driven by the explosion of new scientific work coming from the invention of the maser & laser. Particularly in the field called ‘Photonics’.

        The below information is a very good example of how science is directing new talent into teams with specialist skills. This is now what LENR needs and may soon get once the anti LENR propagandists can be put rightly in their place (spoilers).

        The advances in LENR require multidisciplinary expertise from Physics and Chemistry and Engineering plus smart people with great intuition and curiosity. They are emerging in growing numbers but we need a lot more.

        The Laser as an example:
        Just the laser alone has reshaped the scientific world tremendously as its use intrudes into so many areas of science. In particular the current discoveries in the areas of OAM (Angular & Orbital Momentum) of light are stunning. (see these links

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbital_angular_momentum_of_light )

        https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/03/160315104208.htm

        The research in this ‘Photonics’ field of research and development is ‘racing’ ahead and promises yet more ‘quantum leap’s in technology from use in quantum computers, use in storing petabytes of data on a device not much larger than a DVD, massive increases in bandwidth and efficiency of fibre optics and even how light is harnessed and analyzed from space for achieving greater Astrophysical research of distant stars. In addition there are already demonstration videos of scientists using low watt laser ‘tweezers’ to manipulate small micron size particles (i.e. 4 microns big) on glass slides. There are other demos that use angular momentum of a laser beam to drive microscopic parts such as tiny wheels and pumps. These are working in labs today. The potential from these lines of research is wide open.

        Link to using OAM to create multiple (4) entangled photons – this capability has great significance to Quantum Computing.

        http://www.laserfocusworld.com/articles/2016/02/oam-entangles-four-photons-not-just-two.html

        This next link is about using OAM for vast improvements in fibre optic carrying capacity (it is already old news from 2013, old by current Photonics progress) …

        http://www.extremetech.com/computing/159986-twisted-laser-vortexes-carry-1-6-terabits-per-second-over-fiber-optic-network

  • we want LENR Fusione Fredda

    #LENR: dilly-ding, dilly-dong!

  • we want LENR Fusione Fredda

    #LENR: dilly-ding, dilly-dong!

  • Observer

    Each day we re-define ourselves as that which remains.

  • psi2u2

    True, but the history of oil, a relatively scarce but very valuable commodity, is full of violence and pollution. So putting that behind us with a source like LENR can only be a good thing.

  • Montague Withnail

    There is no doubt, if LENR was announced as factory ready and immediately cost effective tomorrow, that it would be such a huge disruption that it would initially throw the world into dangerous turmoil.

    Just following through this scenario, it would represent an economic
    dislocation orders of magnitude worse than the sub-prime crisis, which was so
    dangerous because suddenly no one knew what financial assets were worth.

    The same would be true here. A sudden and coordinated loss of value (probably to zero and beyond) of oil majors, miners and utilities is probably not
    something that the Western banking or insurance industries could survive. This time it would be much harder for governments to bail it all out. Forget about the Middle East, we would just close the borders on them and let them get on with it while trying to deal with our own problems.

    So, does this mean that governments are actively and deliberately subverting LENR? I highly highly doubt it for several reasons:

    1. They would have done a better job. How hard really would it be to shut Rossi
    up? Get to him plus a couple of dozen others and it’s basically done with. If
    that’s what they wanted to do, they would have just done it.

    2. They would have done a worse job. Western governments are really bad
    at this sort of thing, they are way too leaky. We would know about it via
    Wikileaks or something by now.

    3. It’s a bad choice. Genuinely if they perceived a threat/opportunity of this
    magnitude they would come up with a better strategy for dealing with it, which
    would involve special regulation and epic amounts of “printed” money
    to keep the financial system afloat during the transition. Trying to keep information like this locked up is just a recipe for losing control

    4. It’s too big a sacrifice. There are two sub-categories here, industry and
    military. If governments really believed in LENR they wouldn’t be able to help
    themselves, they would be desperate to help their industry get a competitive
    advantage and they would be desperate to make sure they didn’t fall behind
    militarily. They wouldn’t sit on their hands and let competing nations get ahead.

    I’m afraid the explanation is much simpler. They just don’t believe it. Personally I am convinced that LENR is a real phenomenon, but I don’t really believe Rossi (I would love to, but for such eccentric claims I would need to see a credible independent validation). I suspect it will take years, maybe decades before we understand LENR sufficiently to make cost effective and useful energy out of it. That will give the world time enough to adjust relatively safely, but we do need to make a start – the long run problems of AGW and depletion are still out there and time-critical.

    • DrD

      I agree with your first paragraph except it also needs certification. No good having production and orders if they’re illegal to use.
      As for the rest, Governments aren’t so well organised and as you say nor can they keep secrets. That doesn’t mean there aren’t powerful interests who stand to lose fortunes who may well be active behind the scenes. So far they either haven’t needed to take drastic actions or they’ve been successful, so far.

    • doug marker

      Montague,
      A good set of points and well argued.

      Re your main premise ” if LENR was announced as factory ready and immediately cost effective tomorrow”, I don’t believe anyone believes this to be the case, nor is it really likely. Even if Rossi has what he says it is still years away from ‘prime time’.

      The issue with your follow on points is they almost all argue to your main premise which, is quite improbable. Although there are some valid general issues that are included in those points.

      But, none the less a good set of thoughts.

      Cheers

      Doug Marker

  • Jacques

    The best way to combat Big Energy and Big Science (whatever that is) is, as it has been for some time, to publish a detailed enough description that people can replicate what Rossi has and begin an effort to understand what is happening and why. Then it becomes unstoppable. That he hasn’t, or won’t, indicates that either he is 1) greedy, 2) has let the need for full credit go to his head, or 3) (least desired outcome) is a charlatan. No. 2 is silly if he already had most of the goods. No. 1 is indefensible — there’s no moral lifestyle you can live on for $500 million that you can’t live on for $50 million or (at his age, face it) $5 million. About No. 3, the less thought the better, but it has be considered given the now years of dribbling out factoids,.

    • colodude

      Jacques, it’s better for your health, and ours in the long run, if you avoid pretending you can accurately estimate an appropriate level of spending by someone you don’t know or even whom you might know, especially since you didn’t earn their money nor understand their dreams. That is so French of you!
      Now, if you set for yourself an upper bound of acceptable spending, have at it; whatever you choose to do with your surplus, if any, is meant to bring you happiness, and those you benefit by that surplus spending will be grateful. And, indirectly, I will rejoice with your success, because it’s always helpful to celebrate rather than to regulate a person who delivers a large benefit for large numbers of people.

      Now, about the real point of your note: the open source project named in memory/honor of Fleishmann and Pons will do just as you suggest–an excellent idea, and if someone else happens to aid the research group by pointing out some short cuts to take and dead ends to avoid, that would be stupendous.

      Finally, Jacques: you–not just you, of course, but all of us hoping for a quick, nonpolluting energy grand solution to finally appear–may want to carefully think through the 2nd-order economic transitions such a thing as LENR–or one of its equivalent competitors–will force. In addition to knocking down most of the rich, greedy energy barons and emirs (Yayyyy!), there will also be the newly displaced workers from the fields of engineering, drilling, piping, transportation, etc, that currently number in the millions on six continents. These are skilled, SMART individuals, who will find it difficult to redirect their passion and energy. The human costs brought by this welcome interloper will need to be borne by the new technology itself.
      Perhaps LENR will prove to be more than a boiler replacement, as job-friendly a purpose as it is. Will a more robust transmutation industry arise from what we learn when a correct LENR theory finally takes shape? What a great new toy we have to play with!

      • Jacques

        Okay, I take back my greed remarks. But if the effects are real, their adoption is inevitable and will happen on their own time frame, and artificially holding onto the reins does nothing but induce skepticism. We’re still at the “Is this real?” stage and Rossi seems reluctant to move that dialogue forward, Cheers —

        • doug marker

          Jacques,
          Personally, I believe Rossi wants to move ahead faster than those who are watching and have energy agendas want him to.

          Rossi no matter what people may think, has triggered an enormous amount of interest worldwide, among people who would otherwise not know of LENR or its potential. There are now far too many smart and honest people who have done enough due diligence to conclude personally that LENR is and has been real for a long time – the more multidisciplinary types of researchers and inventors that take up the interest, the faster it will be exploited and understood.

          The trend in Science in the past few decades has been for graduates of physics and science to become specialized. This in part is driven by the explosion of new scientific work coming from the invention of the maser & laser. Particularly in the field called ‘Photonics’.

          The below information is a very good example of how science is directing new talent into teams with specialist skills. This is now what LENR needs and may soon get once the anti LENR propagandists can be put rightly in their place (spoilers).

          The advances in LENR require multidisciplinary expertise from Physics and Chemistry and Engineering plus smart people with great intuition and curiosity. They are emerging in growing numbers but we need a lot more.

          The Laser as an example:
          Just the laser alone has reshaped the scientific world tremendously as its use intrudes into so many areas of science. In particular the current discoveries in the areas of OAM (Angular & Orbital Momentum) of light are stunning. (see these links

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbital_angular_momentum_of_light )

          https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/03/160315104208.htm

          The research in this ‘Photonics’ field of research and development is ‘racing’ ahead and promises yet more ‘quantum leap’s in technology from use in quantum computers, use in storing petabytes of data on a device not much larger than a DVD, massive increases in bandwidth and efficiency of fibre optics and even how light is harnessed and analyzed from space for achieving greater Astrophysical research of distant stars. In addition there are already demonstration videos of scientists using low watt laser ‘tweezers’ to manipulate small micron size particles (i.e. 4 microns big) on glass slides. There are other demos that use angular momentum of a laser beam to drive microscopic parts such as tiny wheels and pumps. These are working in labs today. The potential from these lines of research is wide open.

          Link to using OAM to create multiple (4) entangled photons – this capability has great significance to Quantum Computing.

          http://www.laserfocusworld.com/articles/2016/02/oam-entangles-four-photons-not-just-two.html

          This next link is about using OAM for vast improvements in fibre optic carrying capacity (it is already old news from 2013, old by current Photonics progress) …

          http://www.extremetech.com/computing/159986-twisted-laser-vortexes-carry-1-6-terabits-per-second-over-fiber-optic-network

          • Jacques

            Hi Doug —
            You miss my point. First Charles Townes never hid how his first laser was put together (despite being based on physics that had a high probability of being right) and lots of people made them and soon developed gas lasers and solid state ones — and even though they took 25 years to become commonplace (CD players, supermarket checkouts, fiber optics, etc), there was never any secret how they worked.

            LENR is still mysterious to most physicists, and the only way to demystify it is through transparency and replicability, which is how science has operated for 400 years. Unfortunately Rossi seems to be impeding both and I don’t understand why. I listed three obvious reasons above — and none is very attractive. Subtracting greed, because people objected to it, that leaves the Big Head theory (isn’t a Nobel Prize enough?), or the Big Con, which none of us want. If there’s another, I’d be glad to hear it.

            None of this addresses your original point of societal disruption, but that’s going to happen regardless of what buggy whip manufacturers do. 🙂

          • doug marker

            Jacques,

            I do agree with you that it would be ‘wonderful’ had Rossi told us all how to build a copy. I would get a team together at a nearby University to have our go at it. Still hope to do it but not quite yet. Am even willing to fund it myself.

            Despite this, I don’t hold it against anyone who has done something remarkable, to handle it how they want to even if I don’t really like how they are going about it. I do defend their right to do it their way though even if there may be a price they pay for doing it that way. So in a broad sense I agree with you but defend Andrea Rossi’s right to be himself.

            Cheers

            Doug Marker

          • Jacques

            I can’t argue that point — and won’t. cheers —

      • cashmemorz

        Those displaced workers bring to mind a reason for taxing LENR and other disruptive tech. Tax it to provide for those displaced workers. This could be various methods such as retraining or a form of employment insurance or other monthly cheque, call it what you want, to cover the transition until the worker in question finds their own way to make aa living.

    • doug marker

      Jaques,

      It is very unfair to imply or accuse Andrea Rossi of being ‘greedy’ – that is a rather one-sided and biased view. If he has produced what amounts to a miraculous advance in technology, why is he greedy if it turns out he wants to monetize his work. He would have more reasons to build up a development fund than you have to see him donate it to anyone and give up any monetary reward for his efforts. The problem with giving it away is that someone else quite ruthless would find a way to own it. Just look at Tesla, Marconi, Farnsworth (invented TV) etc: etc: etc: etc: There are a lot of creative people who got ‘done over’ by aggressive industrialists who tend to be the really greedy and unscrupulous ones.

      The opposite of accusing him of being greedy is to say he owes it to you and the world you see, to give it away. That is a very very narrow view and is a great notion when someone else has what you want. 😉

      Cheers

      Doug Marker

      • Zapece

        Frankly if the ecat works, money isn’t going to be important for very long as our whole society is essentially based on exchange of energy in the form of work. If energy becomes highly abundant then money becomes close to worthless. I’ll be able to heat my driveway in the winter in -20C weather not to mention grow food round the clock all year long. The only thing left that will have any real value will be things we can’t get more of such as land so buy up while you still can.

  • doug marker

    Jacques,

    I do agree with you that it would be ‘wonderful’ had Rossi told us all how to build a copy. I would get a team together at a nearby University to have our go at it. Still hope to do it but not quite yet. Am even willing to fund it myself.

    Despite this, I don’t hold it against anyone who has done something remarkable, to handle it how they want to even if I don’t really like how they are going about it. I do defend their right to do it their way though even if there may be a price they pay for doing it that way. So in a broad sense I agree with you but defend Andrea Rossi’s right to be himself.

    Cheers

    Doug Marker

  • jousterusa

    In terms of political impact, the greatest will be in oil-producing states in this country, where no one who does not accept the dominance of Big Oil on the state’s environmental and other policies is an also-ran. That will be very beneficial for all of us, ridding the House and Senate of long-term incumbent dinosaurs who should have been retired decades ago. Let’s just hope it happens peacefully.

  • jousterusa

    In terms of political impact, the greatest will be in oil-producing states in this country, where no one who does not accept the dominance of Big Oil on the state’s environmental and other policies is an also-ran. That will be very beneficial for all of us, ridding the House and Senate of long-term incumbent dinosaurs who should have been retired decades ago. Let’s just hope it happens peacefully.