Rossi Ready to Start Accepting Orders For 1MW Plants

For people wanting to get to the head of the queue for ordering E-Cat Plants when they are ready, Andrea Rossi signaled today on the Journal of Nuclear Physics that he is ready to start entering in to customer agreements to do so.

Tom
May 14, 2018 at 8:54 AM
Dr Andrea Rossi:
Are you ready to accept orders for the industrial plants? If yes, how is possible to start a deal?
Thank you if you can answer,
Tom

Andrea Rossi
May 14, 2018 at 1:30 PM
Tom:
Yes, we are open now to begin to examine requests for 1 thermal MW plants, but only from industries that use directly the heat for their production process in their factories. For this utilization we have the necessary certifications and our industrialization is scheduled to start at the end of the year. Therefore the answer is YES, but the Customers must be aware of the fact that the delivery terms could be modified. The contracts will take in consideration this fact.
Warm Regards,
A.R.

A few things of note here: The output is 1 thermal MW, so it seems like that will be the minimum size. Rossi says that they will ‘examine requests’, so he might be selective about who gets the plants. It looks like to be considered you have to be a legitimate industrial customer who will use the heat in the production process — this is what the plants are certified for. The industrialization is ‘scheduled’ to start at the end of 2018, but that is not guaranteed at this point. There’s no mention of price, guaranteed COP or temperature range. There’s nothing yet on the ecat.com website yet, which is still showing data about the first generation plant, which is the low temperature model which was operated during the 1 year Doral test, but which hasn’t been on the market.

  • Max Nozin

    How can you order something extremely confidential like Rossi’s product?

    • Buck

      CC
      May 14, 2018 at 2:05 PM

      Dr Rossi:

      I am interested to order a 1 MW Ecat for the factory I am the CEO of.
      Can you give us a contact information?

      Cheers
      ______________________________________

      Andrea Rossi
      May 14, 2018 at 2:34 PM

      CC:

      Please send an email to [email protected]

      Please send us basic information of your concern, which use you will make of the heat. Please also send us the phone number and the name of the person we must contact.

      We will contact you at our first convenience.

      Warm Regards,

      A.R.

      • causal observer

        Too hard (irony)

        • Buck

          😉

      • Dr. Mike

        It’s nice to see that Rossi’s marketing group will contact this firm at “their first convenience”.

        • Buck

          It is a civil engaged response made for all to see; an appropriate response for a man working towards creating an entirely new market.

        • causal observer

          Think he might get a few junk orders?

      • Max Nozin

        Rossi will give his cat for adoption only into good hands.

  • causal observer

    Who might buy?

    try googling “1mw industrial heater”
    (2nd item on the list that I got was ecat…chortle)

    Further down the list:
    http://www.caloritech.com/engineered-products/circulation-heaters

  • cashmemorz

    Rossi recently announced on this site that a deal for an ecat was made.

    The E-Cat and Food Industry — Rossi Says Partnering with ‘US Global Company’Posted on April 10, 2018

    “It is a US global company”
    This was announced a weeks ago. So being open for customers at this point is giving the news a little late or he just forgot to let that info to be known.
    Is this more confirmation to allow others on board?
    How many announcements are needed to get this point across?
    If there are deals made and units are delivered, will the users announce that?
    I doubt anyone will want to be the first to admit it, even if it works properly. No one will want their competition to be aware of any competitive edge they have, especially a strong edge where the price of the energy used goes down significantly.
    Rossi might give out meta data that x number of customers are using the ecat. How to confirm that?
    Maybe by hiring a go between such as a notary public, chartered accountnt or a financial instrument similar to an eskrow account. Would Rossi or his customers agree to that? Do we have a right to know those numbers?
    There are probably ways to sniff out which companies need large energy use and which ones have a lower power bill after the unis go on sale or lease.

    • Albert D. Kallal

      Actually, some caution here. The way I read the answers, is the person asking the question “injected” the assumption that this is for the food industry. I don’t have the actual text, but it seemed that the question was is the e-cat a great match for the food industry, and then the answer from Rossi was the company is a US global company. I don’t want to point out that there is some “wires” crossed between the question and the answer in that thread. I would suggest some caution here, as that tread was screwball in the leading questions. Rossi was answering that it is a US global company, and the previous question was the e-cat a good idea for the food industry. The “connecting” between the two was made by readers – not directly by Rossi.
      R
      Albert

      • cashmemorz

        Thanks. Overoptimistic in sleuthing is not a good thing. It leads to me getting the wrong data. Bad detective, me. So who could it be…?

  • Bob Greenyer

    Not got a lot of use for 1MW, however, I’d love to be able to purchase the 2 X 10kW units I put my name down for in 2011.

    • Rene

      Likewise on the list in 2011. 10KW or 20KW heat is what I needed in 2011. I would have been happy with 8KW too.

  • GiveADogABone

    Early days, but I can see where this is going: tie the QX heater to a CHP unit with a closed cycle gas circuit e.g. :-
    https://www.bosch-thermotechnology.com/gb/en/commercial-industrial/ocs/chp-modules-669481-p

    Generation of three-phase current
    400/50 V/Hz
    400/50 V/Hz
    Electrical output
    12 kWel
    19 kWel
    Thermal output
    27,5 kWth
    36 kWth
    Maximum permissible operating pressure
    6 bar
    6 bar
    Operating weight
    925 kg
    1.010 kg

    The QX can easily reach the temperatures of a gas-fired combustion process, so replace the hot combustion gas with a closed gas circuit that passes over the Stirling engine hot end, through the waste heat recovery and back to the QX inlet. With a thermal efficiency of electricity generation of 19/(19+36)=34%, the works power of the system would be self-generated, provided the CoP of the QX heaters is reasonable. The saturated steam temperature at 6 bar is 159C, so useful in all sorts of ways.

    Fossil fuel CO2 emissions zero. Continuous power and heat. Heavy transport could be powered by this; think ships, lorries and railway locomotives, subject to the necessary permissions.
    Bye, bye (thank goodness!) to any more windmills, solar cells and things that rely on the tides.

  • Karl Venter

    Hi All

    Would the ECAT .. not be an ideal fit for a CSP plant to keep the salts hot and working through the night
    I am not in this field and thought they would jump at the chance to produce more energy / electricity

    Any comments?

    • causal observer

      Maybe, if the e-cat doesn’t knock Concentrated Solar Power out of the market too quickly. Depends on the capital + operating cost of the e-cat vs operating cost of the CSP. The biggest CSP Is 377MW, and CSPs are already competing with solar panels.
      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concentrated_solar_power
      Complicated equation!

      • Omega Z

        The worlds car companies manufacture around 100 million vehicles a year. Within 10 years they could likely double that. And there are those who would buy them. Except, economically, it is not within their means.

        While initially, demand for LENR products will likely outstrip supply, it will also hit the economic wall. I see nearly all current energy use being replaced by natural attrition. Replacing the old when it’s life cycle comes to pass. It has nothing to do with Wants. It ultimately comes down to economic means.

        It’s claimed that current world energy demand will increase by 50% in the next 30 years or so. That alone is an economic squeeze. Things may get a little tight. The cost to finance will rise.

        • causal observer

          An interesting twist on the car equation is that autonomous cars may lead to sufficient car sharing that the actual demand plummets.

          A 50% rise in energy consumption is likely due to developing regions wanting more ergs. At this point they are as likely to go with distributed systems as with central plants and transmission lines. So the capital costs could be distributed in smaller increments closer to the user communities. Maybe easier decision-making.

          I’m assuming Rossi will license others to allow them to use the technology, which will increase capacity. It’s going to be difficult to claim IP pre-eminence with 500M people living in energy poverty and all of its ills.

          • Omega Z

            Rossi increasing capacity wont be the issue. Economic means will be the main factor. Thus a long transition period.

            ->”A 50% rise in energy consumption is likely due to developing regions wanting more ergs.”

            I agree as U.S. energy consumption has mostly stagnated. However, cheaper energy will likely have an impact resulting in more energy use in the U.S..

            Not to be dismissive but developing and 3rd world countries have a different life style and perspective then we do.

            India spent over a Billion$ to build basically upscale porta potties for the rural areas. They actually flushed. When checking back, many were using these buildings for storage. For them, storage was a greater priority. You can crap anywhere in the bushes or sadly, where they obtain their water..

            The 500M people living in energy poverty will also have a different perspective and life style then us. It is probable they will not have a wired home or even a home that’s conducive for such. They also wont have all the electrical devices nor the economic means to obtain them that we do.

            The point here is this will be a long drawn out transition for them regardless if electrical energy is brought to them by private business or government programs. Either way, Rossi’s IP will not be an issue in the matter. The up front cost of hardware will be the issue.

  • LarryJ

    He might be flooded with requests from clowns, snakes, triflers, haters and a myriad of ne’erdowells.

  • sam

    JPR
    May 12, 2018 at 7:41 PM
    Dear Andrea:
    You said the SK could be your masterpiece. Is this related also to the SSM?
    All the best,
    Jean Paul Renoir

    Andrea Rossi
    May 15, 2018 at 10:48 AM
    JPR:
    By the end of May an extremely important test will be completed and we will know if we reached a remarkable product or a failure.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

    • Buck

      Sam,

      I think it is quite possible that the exchange was the following. Rossi’s response has greater relevance to the open question of when will he, Rossi, conclude that the SK is a viable product extension to the Ecat family of products.

      ======================================================

      Jean Paul Renoir
      May 15, 2018 at 7:08 AM

      When do you think enough data will have been collected to allow to consider the Ecat SK a real alternative?

      All the best

      JPR

      _______________________________________________

      Andrea Rossi
      May 15, 2018 at 10:48 AM

      JPR:

      By
      the end of May an extremely important test will be completed and we will know if we reached a remarkable product or a failure.

      Warm Regards,

      A.R.

      • Omega Z

        The time stamp would indicate you are right.

        One has to be careful when there are several posts counter posts made. They do not always display in proper order.

      • sam

        Kandra Harrel
        May 16, 2018 at 8:52 AM
        Dear Dr Rossi,
        Is the Ecat SK founded on the bases of the Ecat QX we watched in the video of youtube “Ecat QX demonstration of November 24 2017 in Stockholm”?

        Translate
        Andrea Rossi
        May 16, 2018 at 3:34 PM
        Kandra Harrel:
        Yes
        Warm Regards,
        A.R.

        Joseph J

  • The world uses 70% of its energy to produce industrial low grade heat and the vast majority of that heat is at the temperature of hot water/steam. Every watt of heating and its cost is part of any industrial heat cost so any reduction of any watt of heat whether it is heating water the first 10 degrees or the last 10 degrees to its desired temperature is part of the cost equation. Cold fusion has always offered as its first most likely product the ability to pre-heat water very inexpensively. If 90% of the heat is cheap, one only needs to use ones expensive heat source for the last 10%. The economics are obvious. There has always been sheer folly in the fan boys expectations and exhortations for the end all be all of cold fusion deliverying their boyish dreams, the lessor reality of cold fusion has resulted in nothing but SciFi diatribe. Thanks to Rossi for forging the trail forward, there are plenty of us right behind with similarly effective, perhaps more effective, cold fusion technologies being designed and readied for delivery. atom-ecology.russgeorge.net

  • Curbina

    To quote Asimov: “The Universe is a perfect circle”. Which is an obscure way to say “Haven’t we been here already?”

    • malkom700

      Let’s ask our one-year-old granddaughter for sure, it will be smarter with us. If there is no grandchild there is no point in the matter.

  • Dr. Mike

    A confident entrepreneur with a potentially fantastic product just might take a different marketing approach than that which is indicated by Rossi’s above response. Even if most of the initial units have been designated to go to Rossi’s financial backer, that backer would surely want to get as many units as possible into various applications in many industries so that production capacity can be increased using funds from sales.

    • causal observer

      “Confident” needs to be filtered through the lens of prosecution, jail, slander, abuse, and lawsuits. Rossi has IP, capability and control; he gets to play the cards the way he sees best.

      I find the term ”financial backer” troubling, as it implies an equity stake. While that’s posible, perhaps he has a development, manufacturing and distribution partner who will get a fat percentage of gross sales, and who has set aside capital risk in view of the enormous upside.

    • Omega Z

      To start, SLOW and STEADY

      Important tasks have to be accomplished.
      1) Train personnel.
      2) See how it works in the wild.
      3) If there’s issues, fix them and then you can start increasing production and sales.

      Otherwise-
      You pump a lot of these units out real quick only to find there’s a serious issue to be fixed, you just created a major problem. You’ve got customers expecting to save on cost suddenly losing money in down time. The more units out there the more likely a competitor gets access to them. For each day you spend fixing the issue is a 2 day gain for the competitor.

      These 1st customers are or were your future sales promotion(word of mouth). While these initial customers were easy to come by, all potential future customers will be quite skittish. They will be concerned as to whether the problem is solved. They want a dependable product.

      • frank

        You forgot the most important one:

        0) Have a well designed, tested, reliable, safe and certified product, that can go into series production.

        • Omega Z

          I thought 2 & 3 more or less covered most of these issues.

          This technology will involve a learning curve. Design and engineering will be an evolution. Even a simple home water heater would require some engineering changes. You can not make a product of this nature and optimize it with out real world use.

          There are currently new turbine generators being designed and pilot plants built today of which they don’t know the outcome. The only way to determine what changes will be needed is in real world operation. The only thing they see for certain is additional changes will be required in following iterations from what is learned along the way.

          Certification. Rossi already has certification for industrial use. There will also be additional certification from additional entities along the way. Rossi is aware of this as are potential customers. It’s a normal/common procedure in the industrial world. An inspector comes in, takes a few measurements(certain clearances are required for different equipment) and a few readings & check documents. Sometimes they may require or sometimes just suggest changes and their done. No big deal.

      • Karl Venter

        Could not agree more
        People are generally scared to try new things
        You can promise them payback on paper they will be skeptical

        — sure some loyal in the beginning will come forward but its not them you need to convince if you have a factory pumping out units at an incredible rate you need to advertise

        Rossi is jumping around too much
        Am concerned he is not focusing on a product but rather product development — Somebody needs to sell something before anything starts to happens?
        Good luck Rossi I hope you win big – my advice would be to get advice from those who have been down this road before – if you think you can do everything yourself with a product like this you are mistaken

    • Vinney

      This is only a tentative start, the units are going to be ‘officially’ released, but rare, exclusive and expensive. This model of marketing has worked and is very effective in this age of social media.
      An example would be the performance characteristics and new technology in a limited edition Ferrari or Bugatti.
      The press will be all over it, it will be a ‘poster’ energy technology.
      No-one knows more than Rossi that he has limited time to see the introduction and adoption of this technology, but he necessarily wants all the credit and accolades.
      Things will change very quickly after the launch, remember he has a dream that the E-cat should be available and affordable to everyone.

  • cashmemorz

    Similar to how the first transistor controlled devices were put in the market. A small enough radio to carry around was a novel and apparently freedom giving device. Imagine having to stay in one place to listen to a radio controlled by several large tubes, big speakers and the whole thing usually in a small furniture type box. One could carry that around, if one had to. The best that was available were devices that were low on power on the audio end, requiring earphones on top of the basic radio, a big battery and some more wires. Too much to play with for most. Then in 1952 the first shirt pocket sized
    transistor and boom, freedom. Same with the Rossi device. To power a house these days requires major sized PV or other source. Convertors, batteries, retrofitting, up front investment of major money and very few people with houses even want to get into all that. It is worse now with a personal power source, then what was happening with the radio. before the 1950’s. Now the history of power is about to go from a device about the size of a big room to a
    device that is the size of a large appliance. Good start but not for everyone. The size and, costs, dependability, and for some of the fear factor of
    radiation will have to be worked on first by way of demonstrated proof, that the radiation is minimal or at least can be mitigated by an enclosure.

    If all of those concerns and further reductions size are expected be done. Probably in 5yrs minimum, more like 10. If the hot fusion experts are able to get over all of the hurdles that need to be made to get their very large devices working then we are in competition mode. But I am seriously doubting the hot fusionists are able to do it. Because, why did Bernard Bigot, director-general of ITER, testifying before Congress, have to lie about the way power in and power out was calculated for their hot fusion device?
    There were several big lies in history about power and perpetual motion. I wish Rossi to be the real thing. But at my age I won’t get to take part. It is starting to look like a long development or something else

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