MFMP Testing Plans Outlined for Parkhomov Replication Efforts [Updated With Photos]

UPDATE #1 (Mar 29, 2015)

Bob Greenyer just posted this link to the MFMP Facebook page where they provide a status update on two experiments in the pipeline: one by Alan Goldwater in California, and another by Ryan Hunt in Minnesota.

Here’s a picture of the ‘glowstick’ reactor that has been undergoing calibration testing in the Minnesota lab.

MFMP3/29/05

More pictures of the glowstick reactor can be found here.

Many people have been wondering when the Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project might begin testing reactors in their attempt to replicate the reactions of Alexander Parkhomov.

Bob Greenyer gave some information about their plans in a comment here on E-Cat World earlier today:

Ryan Hunt is hoping to have time on Friday – this will first be with the mini-*GlowStick* we made for the pressure test and a furnace controller we bought off Ebay. I will send him Parkhomov Nickel which may arrive next week.

Dr. Brian Ahern received his TCs yesterday and is “ready to rumble” as he said. I am sending him a Parkhomov Ni today.

Alan Goldwater has got HugNetLab working yesterday in California and is preparing to do a pressure test using a few drops of water. He only has LiAlD4 so we are trying to get some LiAlH4 to him, I will be sending him a sample of Dr. Parkhomov’s powder tomorrow.

Bob Higgins successfully manage to silver solder his zero displacement volume pressure monitoring pipe to the reactor swage-lock cap today, which was a major hurdle overcome. I will send him some Parkhomov Ni.

So it looks like preparations are definitely underway for some interesting experimentation. There is a lot involved in preparing fore these kinds of tests, especially since so many of the needed components and ingredients are either not available off-the-shelf, or readily available locally. Thanks to Bob Greenyer for the update, and to the MFMP members who are working hard to get this all moving!

  • Daniel Maris

    Good luck all at MFMP and elsewhere – may truth prevail!

    • As corny as it sounds Daniel “truth and service to humanity”. A fear of mine is a political oil pipeline influenced by the $$$ of the Koch brothers will soon be built across the middle of America as cold fusion is kept in the shadows by 1) powers that be. 2) CF researchers that hold their secrets so they can make $$$.
      Yay Parkhomov and MFMP and all the emerging, transparent experimenters.

      • Omega Z

        Barry
        The fuss about the Keystone pipeline is for the most part political BS and public consumption… AND Who will ultimately own most of those pipelines.

        Note that Pipelines already exist for the full intended route all the way to the Gulf. The Keystone route is basically adding a 3rd lane to an existing 2 lane highway. But for the short stretch that crosses the international border from the U.S. to Canada, it wouldn’t even need Federal approval.

        Meanwhile, About 500K tanker rail cars are hauling it at greater risk & cost anyway. Note the tanker car spills on a nearly monthly bases.

        And in the meantime, much of the pipeline is being built anyway by investors other then the Canadian Keystone group. Who owns the pipelines?
        Following is a map. Note the portions done. Only phase 4 is left uncompleted & even part of that is under construction by others between Baker & Steele City. Approval of Keystone will be mostly a formality & a couple hundred miles to complete.

        http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/43/Keystone-pipeline-route.png

        America’s 2.5 Million Miles of Pipelines
        http://www.propublica.org/images/ngen/gypsy_big_image/pipeline_line_map-630×420.gif

        • Thanks Omega for the education. Phase 4 still goes across half the country.
          I just feel more oil isn’t the future. It’s frustrating that the technology is presently, supposedly up and running, but highly unacknowledged. It’s also frustrating that the Koch (oil) brothers buy political influence (1 billion to the GOP). On top of that a science advisor to the president sends donated $$$ back to a generous company.
          Just want the CF tipping point to spill across the world.

          • Omega Z

            Don’t believe everything your told. That number is greatly exaggerated. Note that the democratic party always out spends the republican party. You may be surprised at who supports who among the rich & special interests. There is plenty of corruption on both sides.

            Aside from that, One might ask why they vote by party on bills rather then policy. One can only conclude that both are voting against their constituents best interests most of the time. I’ve considered that getting rid of party affiliation may be in order thus eliminating party allegiances when voting on bills. Then again. Probably not. All these politicians go into this with their own agendas & merely tell the voters what they want to hear to get elected. In reality, neither party is looking out for the voter.

  • bfast

    Go MFMP!

  • bfast

    Go MFMP!

  • Private Citizen

    This admittedly sounds paranoid, but don’t necessarily trust the 3rd parties who transmit the fuel to testers. If there is a Big Brother effort to sabotage progress on behalf of $trillions in vested oligarchic interests, swapping out samples for duds would be a perfect ploy.

    With the others, I say go MFMP! Go Open Science!

  • Leo Kaas

    Good Luck to everyone on the MFMP team!

  • Leo Kaas

    Good Luck to everyone on the MFMP team!

  • Bob Greenyer

    The slowest thing might be the postal – they were telling me 7-14 days at the post office! Grrr.

    • Fyodor

      Bob,

      Thanks for all your hard work-this is very exciting. I was wondering if there was any news on the “project Fedora” front. Are there plans to replicate any of the systems that Piantelli has made?

      • Bob Greenyer

        I am now speaking with Piantelli regularly, I am doing what is possible to make things move in a direction we would all like.

        • Mr. Moho

          Wonderful!

  • Bob Greenyer

    The slowest thing might be the postal – they were telling me 7-14 days at the post office! Grrr.

    • Fyodor

      Bob,

      Thanks for all your hard work-this is very exciting. I was wondering if there was any news on the “project Fedora” front. Are there plans to replicate any of the systems that Piantelli has made?

      • Bob Greenyer

        I am now speaking with Piantelli regularly, I am doing what is possible to make things move in a direction we would all like.

  • Hank Mills

    Can anyone post the specs of Parkhomov’s powder? I’m interested in comparing it to the old powder. Hopefully, we can figure out what range of specs work best to produce massive heat with LiAlH4.

  • Bob Greenyer

    More detail on Bob Higgins experiment

    http://on.fb.me/1FVV44s

    • Ged

      Very cool, Bob! These parallel testings with different setups is a great idea; a multitude of data types to collect rapidly and adjust subsequent experiments with. You’ve got me all in an excited twitter again!

    • Andreas Moraitis

      Very nice! I am not sure, however, if the „active cooling“ mechanism will make a significant difference. Most of the heat transfer will anyhow happen by IR from the reactor to the surrounding copper tube. Besides, the air volume and the surface areas are small, and heat transfer from air to copper will be much less effective than the transfer from the copper to the water.

  • Herb Gillis

    It would compliment the MFMP work if we got also some data on isotope ratio changes in Parkhomov’s used fuel samples.

  • Achi

    To anyone who can answer. I was asked earlier today if there was something like a “How to” for attempting a Parkhomov/Lugano replication. They said the experiment seemed simple enough in essence but they wanted to know if there was a web page or list or something of all the known required factors for getting a successful replication. Can anyone help?

  • LuFong

    MFMP on their Facebook page and on their website are describing everything they are doing. It’s not cookbook yet but the information is there. Parkhomov has been very forthcoming with his experiments. But it’s not something anyone can do in their kitchen (or their living room as the case me be) though.

  • Gerard McEk

    I am very pleased to know that different groups are joining forces to come to ‘Parkhomov replications’ The designs look nice and well constructed and I keep my fingers crossed for positive results. Good luck!

  • Gerard McEk

    I am very pleased to know that different groups are joining forces to come to ‘Parkhomov replications’ The designs look nice and well constructed and I keep my fingers crossed for positive results. Good luck!

  • georgehants

    If at all possible it is important for MFMP to show a replication before any of the big company’s (Airbus etc.) make any announcement regarding Cold Fusion.
    Nobody will ask them for proof of the technology and all concentration will move away from the small guys who have done so much for the cause.
    The technology must be shown to be able to be built in a garage so that the needy of this World can bypass the capitalist system of monopolies of profit, that puts such things (drugs etc.) out of their reach.

    • Mats002

      Good point, I agree with your analysis. If/when that happens we might have regulations in the west but maybe some LENR punkers will prevail tinkering anyhow?

    • Bob Greenyer

      There are a lot of 25th hour workers ready in the wings and shadows to capitalise on the very hard work that has got it this far.

      A business man once told me, “A stupid man builds businesses, a wise man buys them”

      I fear that it could be worse in this case, it could be stolen.

      When I was with Piantelli, he said twice in his life he has proved his devices to work and then some named “respected” individual or company was given millions to do more research – they got the money and then did nothing of value with it and Piantelli was left high and dry.

      This technology should be for everyone.

      • georgehants

        O Bob, so agree, “This technology should be for everyone.”
        Ruby Carat at Cold Fusion Now, put on her page the other day that old saying —–
        “The good of the many outweighs the good of the few!”

  • georgehants

    If at all possible it is important for MFMP to show a replication before any of the big company’s (Airbus etc.) make any announcement regarding Cold Fusion.
    Nobody will ask them for proof of the technology and all concentration will move away from the small guys who have done so much for the cause.
    The technology must be shown to be able to be built in a garage so that the needy of this World can bypass the capitalist system of monopolies of profit, that puts such things (drugs, food, clean water etc.) out of their reach.

    • Mats002

      Good point, I agree with your analysis. If/when that happens we might have regulations in the west but maybe some LENR punkers will prevail tinkering anyhow?

    • Bob Greenyer

      There are a lot of 25th hour workers ready in the wings and shadows to capitalise on the very hard work that has got it this far.

      A business man once told me, “A stupid man builds businesses, a wise man buys them”

      I fear that it could be worse in this case, it could be stolen.

      When I was with Piantelli, he said twice in his life he has proved his devices to work and then some named “respected” individual or company was given millions to do more research – they got the money and then did nothing of value with it and Piantelli was left high and dry.

      This technology should be for everyone.

      • georgehants

        O Bob, so agree, “This technology should be for everyone.”
        Ruby Carat at Cold Fusion Now, put on her page the other day that old saying —–
        “The good of the many outweighs the good of the few!”

        • Alberonn

          OMG, print it on a tile, hang it on the wall… :<0
          but in essence you're so right and it will in the end…

  • Alberonn

    Congratulations to us all to see MFMP in such a great shape. Rossi should be backed-up, but, please, in a competitive way. Rossi is a passionate, hardworking guy and, yes, he deserves to be rewarded for his efforts as an entrepreneur and a visionairy against all odds. But this thing is too ‘grand’ to leave to a ‘super Bill Gates’, so much money and power concentrated at one spot is useless and very dangerous. It will be ‘taken over’ by the powers that are harrassing mankind for some centuries now, one way or the other and again and nothing will change in the end : they “will manage to put a METER on LENR”…

    I.H. is a wildcard and therefore IMO a serious risk : we know nothing about
    them, they keep in the dark, omnious, we can’t seriously trust them with a
    thing this grand and important for the world, not as a monopolist – no SINGLE
    entity in the world could be trusted with this, actually- OK. my opinion/fear again…

    Rossi’ll get rich OK, welldeserved, but I hope with much more confidence now, since Parkhomov, soon MFMP and in their trail a wolfpack of garage-science replicants all over the world, that that will happen parallel to a healthy proliferation of LENR, beyond the reach of these powers… Russia, India, China.. as far away from the Morgan-Stanley’s and Rotschilds of this world as possible and the internet will enable it… hoping, dreaming…

    • GreenWin

      “I.H. is a wildcard and therefore IMO a serious risk : we know nothing about them, they keep in the dark, **omnious,** we can’t seriously trust them with a thing this grand and important for the world,”

      Whaddaya think Clem?
      That Alberonn shore do stick to a script.
      What script is that Clem?
      Well, it’s a FUD script most pathos is trained on.
      Oh, okay.

  • Alberonn

    Congratulations to us all to see MFMP in such a great shape. Rossi should be backed-up, but, please, in a competitive way. Rossi is a passionate, hardworking guy and, yes, he deserves to be rewarded for his efforts as an entrepreneur and a visionairy against all odds. But this thing is too ‘grand’ to leave to a ‘super Bill Gates’, so much money and power concentrated at one spot is useless and very dangerous. It will be ‘taken over’ by the powers that are harrassing mankind for some centuries now, one way or the other and again and nothing will change in the end : they “will manage to put a METER on LENR”…

    I.H. is a wildcard and therefore IMO a serious risk : we know nothing about
    them, they keep in the dark, omnious, we can’t seriously trust them with a
    thing this grand and important for the world, not as a monopolist – no SINGLE
    entity in the world could be trusted with this, actually- OK. my opinion/fear again…

    Rossi’ll get rich OK, welldeserved, but I hope with much more confidence now, since Parkhomov, soon MFMP and in their trail a wolfpack of garage-science replicants all over the world, that that will happen parallel to a healthy proliferation of LENR, beyond the reach of these powers… Russia, India, China.. as far away from the Morgan-Stanley’s and Rotschilds of this world as possible and the internet will enable it… hoping, dreaming…

    • GreenWin

      “I.H. is a wildcard and therefore IMO a serious risk : we know nothing about them, they keep in the dark, **omnious,** we can’t seriously trust them with a thing this grand and important for the world,”

      Whaddaya think Clem?
      That Alberonn shore do stick to a script.
      What script is that Clem?
      Well, it’s a FUD script most pathos is trained on.
      Oh, okay.

      • Alberonn

        Interesting response, but I need more info… you quoted me almost correctly, but left out the important last part, but I wonder : as english/american is not my native language : what is Clem ? tried Google translate, did not work… I learned my english as an adolescent in Oxford, UK : the word escaped my vocabulary, but always willing to learn :<)
        And there is another linguistic subtlety you bestowe on me : with 'pathos' do you refer to the passionnate pathos with which I try to make my points, or do you, for reasons of simplicity, throw me on the dung-heap of pathological skeptics ?
        Greenwin, do me and yourself a favour : go for the content, I thought we were supposed to show some mutual respect on this site, not ?

  • Bob Greenyer

    Out to post office to send Parkhomov nickel powder to Ryan and Alan.

    • Matt Sevrens

      30 years from now when all this research has been vindicated I’m going to remember your name. My mind is sometimes boggled by how momentous all of this is, but how small the community really is that supports the research. Thanks for all the hard work towards changing the world!

  • Bob Greenyer

    Out to post office to send Parkhomov nickel powder to Ryan and Alan.

    • Matt Sevrens

      30 years from now when all this research has been vindicated I’m going to remember your name. My mind is sometimes boggled by how momentous all of this is, but how small the community really is that supports the research. Thanks for all the hard work towards changing the world!

  • Ted-X

    What about an “L” shaped reactor, where the vertical side could be longer and easier connected at the end to a pressure gauge? (Parkhamov did it horizontally).
    To MFMP I also suggested a toroidal-shape reactor, where the currents could be induced the way they are induced in the welding apparatus (or as in the industrial “inductor metal melters”). In the toroidal reactor the advantage will be from the high amperage currents. In the tube-type reactors the inductive part of heating is limited to the eddy currents, exclusively. There is a potential that the toroidal reactors could go to the power in the range of megawatts.

  • Ted-X

    What about an “L” shaped reactor, where the vertical side could be longer and easier connected at the end to a pressure gauge? (Parkhamov did it horizontally).
    To MFMP I also suggested a toroidal-shape reactor, where the currents could be induced the way they are induced in the welding apparatus (or as in the industrial “inductor metal melters”). In the toroidal reactor the advantage will be from the high amperage currents. In the tube-type reactors the inductive part of heating is limited to the eddy currents, exclusively. There is a potential that the toroidal reactors could go to the power in the range of megawatts.

  • Matt Sevrens

    The goal is to use the wiki here for that cookbook. Here is the table of contents:

    http://kb.e-catworld.com/index.php?title=Special:AllPages

    There is already the seed of a replication page:

    http://kb.e-catworld.com/index.php?title=Parkhomov_Replication_Procedure_Guide_(Framework)

    And the original experiment:

    http://kb.e-catworld.com/index.php?title=Alexander_Parkhomov%27s_E-Cat_replication_experiments

  • Eyedoc

    The short answer is — No, not yet…..just bits and pieces — but it is the goal, once more is known

  • Bob Greenyer

    From Ryan

    [27/03/2015 23:50:09] Ryan Hunt: I just got the controller started on a 12 hour test

    [27/03/2015 23:50:19] Ryan Hunt: Just with an empty tube and scrap of coil

    [27/03/2015 23:51:27] Ryan Hunt: It does data log. I still need to get the PCE830 to data log

  • Bob Greenyer

    From Ryan

    [27/03/2015 23:50:09] Ryan Hunt: I just got the controller started on a 12 hour test

    [27/03/2015 23:50:19] Ryan Hunt: Just with an empty tube and scrap of coil

    [27/03/2015 23:51:27] Ryan Hunt: It does data log. I still need to get the PCE830 to data log

  • Bob Greenyer
    • Axil Axil

      I seem to remember that Parkhamov used a triac in his earliest experimentation to vary the input power to the reactor. Does he still use this method to control input power? Triac power control does not fit in with automatic control of input power through temperature monitoring because Triac adjustment is a manual procedure. Is the current method of input power control defined in the documentation that Parkhamov has recently provided?

      I believe that a triac can produce a shark power surge and a pulsed current feed that might make a difference in the replication efforts.

      • Bob Greenyer

        He attempted to use a thyristor stack on his very first experiment but he said it was impossible with his equipment to accurately determine the input power. So he switched to his current power and control system, where the only transient is when the relay switches the transformer on reaching upper and lower temperature thresholds.

        It is pure sine wave.

        • Eyedoc

          I love AP’s simplicity of design.
          I know it lacks some of the ‘proofs’ that we want, but it works

          • Bob Greenyer

            Just went out and got all the gear we need to make a replica of the frame he had in his latest test for our “off off broadway” ICCF 19 experiment

            http://bit.ly/1xqvPWt

        • with a power meter, accurately measure the power of triac controlled system is natural. that it what they are made for in industry… (they use it in much worst environment than triac)

          at worst you have to put filters to block RF above the wattmeter bandwidth.

    • Will these experiments start today? Or are they just prepared?

  • Bob Greenyer
    • Axil Axil

      I seem to remember that Parkhamov used a triac in his earliest experimentation to vary the input power to the reactor. Does he still use this method to control input power? Triac power control does not fit in with automatic control of input power through temperature monitoring because Triac adjustment is a manual procedure. Is the current method of input power control defined in the documentation that Parkhamov has recently provided?

      If AP is still using a triac, what kind is he using?

      I believe that a triac can produce a sharp power surge and a pulsed current feed that might make a difference in the replication efforts. Such a shark current pick will produce a large initial magnetic pulse down the axis of the alumina tube.

      The testers in the Lagano test scoped the the input power feed in the Lagano test and found to be a pulsed waveform with lots of resonances.

      • Bob Greenyer

        He attempted to use a thyristor stack on his very first experiment but he said it was impossible with his equipment to accurately determine the input power. So he switched to his current power and control system, where the only transient is when the relay switches the transformer on reaching upper and lower temperature thresholds.

        It is pure sine wave.

        • Eyedoc

          I love AP’s simplicity of design.
          I know it lacks some of the ‘proofs’ that we want, but it works

          • Bob Greenyer

            Just went out and got all the gear we need to make a replica of the frame he had in his latest test for our “off off broadway” ICCF 19 experiment

            http://bit.ly/1xqvPWt

        • with a power meter, accurately measure the power of triac controlled system is natural. that it what they are made for in industry… (they use it in much worst environment than triac)

          at worst you have to put filters to block RF above the wattmeter bandwidth.

    • Will these experiments start today? Or are they only prepared for next week?

  • All these people are doing a great service. I thought CF would break through years ago, but secrecy and $$$ has slowed the process. CF needs to be approached, like an attack from many angles. MFMP and Ecat World being two of them. Right now Parkhomov reminds me of Knight Percival. Because of his pure and humble intentions, he was the one who found the Grail and healed the Fisher King.

  • All these people are doing a great service. I thought CF would break through years ago, but secrecy and $$$ has slowed the process. CF needs to be approached, like an attack from many angles. MFMP and Ecat World being two of them. Right now Parkhomov reminds me of Knight Percival. Because of his pure and humble intentions, he was the one who found the Grail and healed the Fisher King.

  • Hank Mills

    Dear Cold Fusion Community,

    I have been informed by a very trusted source that the temperature data covering the time period at the moment the resistor failed and afterwards was never collected by Parkhomov. It does not exist. In my opinion, this is due to a flaw in his experiment: his system seems to have used the output of the thermocouple only to regulate the input power so that a temperature of 1200C was maintained. The thermocouple was not being used at all times to record temperature. Knowing that in previous tests resistors were prone to failing, I find it dissapointing that he did not have a method in place to record temperature. The most important proof of cold fusion is heat after death; most importantly self sustaining HAD. Since his system is capable of self sustaining HAD, I urge him and all those who replicate the Rossi Effect to include a method of constant temperature measurement. For all we know, when his resistor failed the device could have self sustained for a period of time. This could have been amazing evidence of the Rossi Effect. Now, we will never know.

    • Hank, let us wait which results MFMP is getting with their next glowstick experiments. I guess they have better measurement equipment and if they accomplish to get excess heat with their glowstick, they will build a few more of these devices and make measurements like never before. I bet 😉

    • Bob Greenyer

      This is unfortunate, but you have to be aware of his very limited means.

      Because of his limited means, we have had several important revelations like pure sine wave AC power.

  • Obvious

    This looks pretty good. The protocols make sense.

    My only concern is the gap in the middle might create a thermal gradient that could cause a failure point. Small notches in the outer tube would accommodate the thermocouple neatly, requiring maybe only a small drop of ceramic glue to cover, if even needed.
    Maybe this is minor the final version ?

  • Obvious

    This looks pretty good. The protocols make sense.

    My only concern is the gap in the middle might create a thermal gradient that could cause a failure point. Small notches in the outer tube would accommodate the thermocouple neatly, requiring maybe only a small drop of ceramic glue to cover, if even needed.
    Maybe this isn’t the final version ?

  • Alan DeAngelis

    I know that an exact replication of Parkhomov’s experiment must be done first but I must say that the successful addition of that Swagelok fitting would make it possible in the future to put the reactor under vacuum to remove the air and then a little hydrogen gas could be added (making it more like a catalytic hydrogenation). Why waste the LiAlH4 to a chemical reaction with the air?

    • Mr. Moho

      Because it’s easier and it was reported to work that way too.

      • Yes but it would also be nice to know if the Lithium or Alumnia has any effect on the reaction.

        • Alan DeAngelis

          Hi barty,
          I was thinking of having the lithium aluminum hydride in there as well and just topping it off with a little hydrogen gas but you have a good point. In a future experiment, see what happens when the LiAlH4 is replaced with hydrogen gas. That’s the beauty of this simple reactor. All sorts of variations can now be tried.

          • Yes, I assume that MFMP will do many try&error tests after they have replicated Parkhomov and Lugano reliably.

          • yes, but first replicate…
            even if history says that scientists cannot replicate really… they always change the protocol. bad habit, but that is science, real science.

      • Alan DeAngelis

        Yes, didn’t I say that? I’m thinking about additional experiments in the future.

        • Mr. Moho

          I missed “in the future”. Then yes, all sorts of improvements could be made once excess heat is demonstrated, although simpler is better for widespread distribution.

          • Alan DeAngelis

            Yes Mr. Moho, but I do see your point. Parkhomov is an amazing guy. He’s made it work with no funding at all in his apartment! His reactor is so beautify simple. He many not be able to afford a vacuum pump, the hydrogen gas and the extra fittings that would go along with it.
            But he does have an advantage to many of us. No postal service would deliver lithium aluminum hydride to a residential address in the USA.

          • Owen Geiger

            So if Parkhomov can do this for cheap in his living room then it shouldn’t be long before SRI, Ed Storms, Kimmel institute and lots of other LENR labs replicate this. They have the equipment and specialized expertise. It’s just a matter of time.

    • Nicholas Cafarelli

      Nitrogen is used in industrial processes to make nickel foam. The foam may be critical to operation. Alexander Parkhomov has air in his reactors. Air is roughly 80% nitrogen.

      Support my replication: http://www.gofundme.com/l6dfxg

      http://ni.comli.com

      • Axil Axil

        Nitrogen is a LENR poison as per Piantelli.

  • Alan DeAngelis

    I know that an exact replication of Parkhomov’s experiment must be done first but I must say that the successful addition of that Swagelok fitting would make it possible in the future to put the reactor under vacuum to remove the air and then a little hydrogen gas could be added (making it more like a catalytic hydrogenation). Why waste the LiAlH4 to a chemical reaction with the air?

    • Nicholas Cafarelli

      Nitrogen is used in industrial processes to make nickel foam. The foam may be critical to operation. Alexander Parkhomov has air in his reactors. Air is roughly 80% nitrogen.

      Support my replication: http://www.gofundme.com/l6dfxg

      http://ni.comli.com

      • Axil Axil

        Nitrogen is a LENR poison as per Piantelli.

  • Bob Greenyer

    This is unfortunate, but you have to be aware of his very limited means.

    Because of his limited means, we have had several important revelations like pure sine wave AC power.

  • Nicholas Cafarelli

    That rubber mat is going to get overly warm.

    • Bob Greenyer

      nah, the distance is deceptive and the fall off in temperature is huge, plus convection.

  • Nicholas Cafarelli

    That rubber mat is going to get overly warm.

    • Bob Greenyer

      nah, the distance is deceptive and the fall off in temperature is huge, plus convection.

  • Andy Kumar

    Are we still continuing to believe Parkhomov?

    Three year olds continue to believe *repeated lies* told by trusted adults. There is newer more amazing study. I couldn’t find the link.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/10/101014154755.htm

    • Bob Greenyer

      Belief is for religion, this is science, nature will tell us the truth.

      • HS61AF91

        Right – except it’s been my experience, if you do not believe in (want) something happening, it won’t. So please continue doing both: believing, and letting nature demonstrate the truth.

      • georgehants

        Nature I think will tell us very little if we close our Minds to it shouting in our ears.

    • Blazespin

      Andy, here’s a link for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reproducibility

    • US_Citizen71

      …and those that are accustomed to lying think everyone is a liar.

    • Mats002

      Sometimes I re-iterate precisely that thought: LENR is only the *repeated lies* told by trusted adults, and if so, we all here are both decieved and decievers.
      My answer is always the same: We must seek the truth and that is what we are doing here. I agree 100% with Bob: Nature will tell us the truth.
      And I understand George Hants and others when they require from tax paid science: You are the one ought to find it out for us. You did not dare.
      No one can throw eggs in our faces because they who can throw are the ones paid for doing the job.

    • the cost of ignoring a possible breakthrough is billions times the cost of finding it does not exist finally.
      the problem is that most academics don’t care of humanity interest but of their publication and Nobel chances, and care never to make any error,even if this mean not taking an ounce of risk.

      this is why science is better done by business and retired scientists, than by young researchers today.

      not that recent experiments, from rossi to parkhomov are much much less solid than what have been done in serious labs, from BARC to SRI, and which let no doubt.

      LENR is real, it is true as the earth get around the sun once a year.
      there is nothing extraordinary in what is saying Rossi or Parkhomov, which does not mean we have to trust them the way we trust the physicists of hot fusion who can claim any loose calorimetry and will be believed anyway.

      I am not sure at all Parkhomov protocol is correct and can be replicated , but it have to be tested.

    • Fyodor

      No one is “believing” him. That’s the whole point of the replication.

    • Ophelia Rump

      So you have some evidence that Parkhomov is a fraud? I have trust issues, I need to see some evidence from you. It is not enough to be skeptical, we must be rigorous, vigilant and skeptical.

      • Andy Kumar

        OR,
        The regulars were being skeptical of Parkhomov, not me. That is why I asked the question. Was it ever resolved if Parkhomov had cut and pasted the data?

  • Bob Greenyer

    Belief is for religion, this is science, nature will tell us the truth.

    • Mytakeis

      Right – except it’s been my experience, if you do not believe in (want) something happening, it won’t. So please continue doing both: believing, and letting nature demonstrate the truth.

    • georgehants

      Nature I think will tell us very little if we close our Minds to it shouting in our ears.

  • guest2

    Bob,
    What are the differences between AP reactors and MFMP reactors? Could you list for comparison?

    • Bob Greenyer

      There are so many variations of APs reactors, it is difficult to know what is being compared.

      The main difference in APs previous experiments was the use of 50% pure alumina – rest being silicates. This was a cause for concern until the latest experiment where the fuel is almost all in contact with a stainless steel tube and still works. We do not know what type of tube he used in the latest experiment.

      The key difference is that our LiAlH4 is from a different source.

      Parkhomov NEVER has anything but pure sine wave actively on, but at different voltages enabled by the switching transformer. There is only a momentary gap when switching to a division of the peak voltage. This means that he always has an alternating magnetic field of some kind. Some of our implementations may have dead zones in applied power.

      Having said that, it would appear that Rossi used a chopped AC waveform – but still regular magnetic field.

      Other than that, these are the main factors that are common

      – A pressure containment vessel ( Al2O3 – MFMP, Mullite – AP, Copper / Al2O3 – Rossi )
      – An effective sealing method ( ceramic, Swagelok, epoxy )
      – A tight helically wound, high temperature resistive heater (NiCr, FeCrAl, Kanthal)
      – Nickel powder ( will be same when samples arrive )

  • guest2

    Bob,
    What are the differences between AP reactors and MFMP reactors? Could you list for comparison?

    • Bob Greenyer

      There are so many variations of APs reactors, it is difficult to know what is being compared.

      The main difference in APs previous experiments was the use of 50% pure alumina – rest being silicates. This was a cause for concern until the latest experiment where the fuel is almost all in contact with a stainless steel tube and still works. We do not know what type of tube he used in the latest experiment.

      The key difference is that our LiAlH4 is from a different source.

      Parkhomov NEVER has anything but pure sine wave actively on, but at different voltages enabled by the switching transformer. There is only a momentary gap when switching to a division of the peak voltage. This means that he always has an alternating magnetic field of some kind. Some of our implementations may have dead zones in applied power.

      Having said that, it would appear that Rossi used a chopped AC waveform – but still regular magnetic field. There were 3 phases, and so there may always have been some magnetic field.

      Other than that, these are the main factors that are common

      – A pressure containment vessel ( Al2O3 – MFMP, Mullite – AP, Copper / Al2O3 – Rossi )
      – An effective sealing method ( ceramic, Swagelok, epoxy, solder / brazing )
      – A tight helically wound, high temperature resistive heater (NiCr, FeCrAl, Kanthal, inconel)
      – Nickel powder ( will be same when samples arrive )

  • US_Citizen71

    …and those that are accustomed to lying think everyone is a liar.

  • Mats002

    Sometimes I re-iterate precisely that thought: LENR is only the *repeated lies* told by trusted adults, and if so, we all here are both decieved and decievers.
    My answer is always the same: We must seek the truth and that is what we are doing here. I agree 100% with Bob: Nature will tell us the truth.
    And I understand George Hants and others when they require from tax paid science: You are the one ought to find it out for us. You did not dare.
    No one can throw eggs in our faces because they who can throw are the ones paid for doing the job.

  • the cost of ignoring a possible breakthrough is billions times the cost of finding it does not exist finally.
    the problem is that most academics don’t care of humanity interest but of their publication and Nobel chances, and care never to make any error,even if this mean not taking an ounce of risk.

    this is why science is better done by business and retired scientists, than by young researchers today.

    not that recent experiments, from rossi to parkhomov are much much less solid than what have been done in serious labs, from BARC to SRI, and which let no doubt.

    LENR is real, it is true as the earth get around the sun once a year.
    there is nothing extraordinary in what is saying Rossi or Parkhomov, which does not mean we have to trust them the way we trust the physicists of hot fusion who can claim any loose calorimetry and will be believed anyway.

    I am not sure at all Parkhomov protocol is correct and can be replicated , but it have to be tested.

  • Sanjeev
  • Sanjeev
    • toussaint françois

      This is 6 hours ago……and still no news

      • Fyodor

        It says that he’s seeing a 40 degrees per hour increase-so it could be a while before it is hot enough.

        • Brent Buckner

          Further updated around 6:30am EDT on March 31 – “I regard the NaAlH2 run as a null result. We load LiAlH4 tonight.”

    • Guest

      Another update:

      http://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/index.php/Thread/1181-Brian-Ahern-Parkhomov-replication/?postID=3540#post3540

      So the results were negative. Now he will try the parkhomov powder who was sent to him by Bob Greenyer.

  • Fyodor

    No one is “believing” him. That’s the whole point of the replication.

  • Fyodor

    It says that he’s seeing a 40 degrees per hour increase-so it could be a while before it is hot enough.

    • Brent Buckner

      Further updated around 6:30am EDT on March 31 – “I regard the NaAlH2 run as a null result. We load LiAlH4 tonight.”

  • Ophelia Rump

    So you have some evidence that Parkhomov is a fraud? I have trust issues, I need to see some evidence from you. It is not enough to be skeptical, we must be rigorous, vigilant and skeptical.

  • Bob Greenyer
    • uDevil

      Can you provide more details on how signals are conditioned and acquired (filtering, amplification, sample rate)? For example, the pressure sensor displayed at the second link has response time 1000 SPS to avoid possible aliasing.

      • AlanG

        The pressure sensor is an analog ratiometric instrument, 0.5-4.5 v.d.c output for 0-5000 psi gauge pressure. The observed noise level (from the reference voltage and the A/D input stage) is around +- 2 psi or 0.1% of full scale.

        The DAQ system is a HUGnetLab board as used in previous MFMP experiments with good results. It uses an ADUC7060 chip with ARM core, running as an Apache pdp client. Data is captured at 1 sample/sec, and high accuracy is not expected with this system.

        Having said that, I don’t see how aliasing is an issue with an analog input that shows no periodic sampling artifacts. It will be a concern with the power calculation, which is obtained from the switched voltage output of the PID controller, sampled at 1/sec. I’ll be publishing that data for the calibration run later today, and look forward to a lively discussion.

        AlanG

  • Bob Greenyer
    • uDevil

      Can you provide more details on how signals are conditioned and acquired (filtering, amplification, sample rate)? For example, the pressure sensor displayed at the second link has response time 1000 SPS to avoid possible aliasing.

      • AlanG

        The pressure sensor is an analog ratiometric instrument, 0.5-4.5 v.d.c output for 0-5000 psi gauge pressure. The observed noise level (from the reference voltage and the A/D input stage) is around +- 2 psi or 0.1% of full scale.

        The DAQ system is a HUGnetLab board as used in previous MFMP experiments with good results. It uses an ADUC7060 chip with ARM core, running as an Apache pdp client. Data is captured at 1 sample/sec, and high accuracy is not expected with this system.

        Having said that, I don’t see how aliasing is an issue with an analog input that shows no periodic sampling artifacts. It will be a concern with the power calculation, which is obtained from the switched voltage output of the PID controller, sampled at 1/sec. I’ll be publishing that data for the calibration run later today, and look forward to a lively discussion.

        AlanG

        • uDevil

          If you know ahead of time that your signals will not have significant components at frequencies higher than .5 Hz, filtering is not required to sample at 1 SPS. That’s probably a good assumption for the temperature channels. For pressure it might be better to filter the signal if you’re limited to low sample rates. The choices and reasons should be documented. Thanks for the response. I appreciate your work.

    • Fyodor

      Hi Bob,

      There have been some folks at NASA (Joseph Zawodny, Dennis Bushnell) who have publicly discussed LENR. Has anyone reached out to them to see if they would be interested in participating in the replication process? It would probably be a great credibility booster.

      • Bob Greenyer

        Interesting angle. There were NASA people at ICCF18, I am sure there will be a presence at ICCF19

  • Ged

    Have to keep our eyes on Brian Ahern’s prong of this attack. Seems a possible small, but above calibration, signal by 455 C. If the experiment works, it is expected to start significantly seeing divergence from calibration in the 700 C range. Note that he is using NaAlH4, which has somewhat different decomposition kinetics.

    • Axil Axil

      Expect sodium to demonstrate a lower operational temperature than lithium. Expect and operating temperature of about the melting point of sodium at 800C.

    • Another update from Brian Ahern:

      http://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/index.php/Thread/1181-Brian-Ahern-Parkhomov-replication/?postID=3540#post3540

      So the results were negative. Now he will try the parkhomov powder who was sent to him by Bob Greenyer.

      • Sanjeev

        Lesson : Try the recipe that was reported to work. Later try your own. Lots of time and effort saved.

        • Andreas Moraitis

          Yes, but to know what not works may help to adjust the theoretical assumptions.

          • Sanjeev

            I don’t think the “theoretical assumptions” are going to benefit the humanity a lot.
            IMHO, its more important to get a reliably working prototype at this time. Sooner the better.

          • Andreas Moraitis

            Theory is needed to optimize a technology – at least, if the underlying mechanisms are rather complex. Besides, it may be important with regard to possible safety issues. Furthermore, people might be interested to understand how the devices work that they are using in their daily life. Certainly, not everybody cares about the last point, but for me and many others it is essential.

          • Sanjeev

            So I guess you are trying to optimize the one dozen working lenr reactors sitting on your desk right now ?
            What is more important – to build a working reactor or to optimize/improve it without even starting to build ?
            Can you run before you learn to walk ?

            I do not intend to trample on the “theory-types” airy fairy guys, who post nothing but junk here, but to be honest, theories have produced more hot air than all the working lenr devices in the history. Theory should be based on experiments, not on delusion. If you are attempting to optimize a tech that isn’t even available then you are in a big delusion.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Also agreed

          • Bob Greenyer

            Agreed

      • Ged

        Oh yeah, forgot he was using some random powder in that run–that is a variable for us to consider in addition to the hydrogen source.

  • Ged

    Have to keep our eyes on Brian Ahern’s prong of this attack. Seems a possible small, but above calibration, signal by 455 C. If the experiment works, it is expected to start significantly seeing divergence from calibration in the 700 C range. Note that he is using NaAlH4, which has somewhat different decomposition kinetics.

    • Axil Axil

      Expect sodium to demonstrate a lower operational temperature than lithium. Expect and operating temperature at about the melting point of sodium… 800C.

    • Another update from Brian Ahern:

      http://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/index.php/Thread/1181-Brian-Ahern-Parkhomov-replication/?postID=3540#post3540

      So the results were negative. Now he will try the parkhomov powder who was sent to him by Bob Greenyer.

      • Sanjeev

        Lesson : Try the recipe that was reported to work. Later try your own. Lots of time and effort saved.

        • Andreas Moraitis

          Yes, but to know what not works may help to adjust the theoretical assumptions.

          • Sanjeev

            I don’t think the “theoretical assumptions” are going to benefit the humanity a lot.
            IMHO, its more important to get a reliably working prototype at this time. Sooner the better.

          • Andreas Moraitis

            Theory is needed to optimize a technology – at least, if the underlying mechanisms are rather complex. Besides, it may be important with regard to possible safety issues. Furthermore, people might be interested to understand how the devices work that they are using in their daily life. Certainly, not everybody cares about the last point, but for me and many others it is essential.

          • Sanjeev

            So I guess you are trying to optimize the one dozen working lenr reactors sitting on your desk right now ?
            What is more important – to build a working reactor or to optimize/improve it without even starting to build ?
            Can you run before you learn to walk ?

            I do not intend to trample on the “theory-types” airy fairy guys, who post nothing but junk here, but to be honest, theories have produced more hot air than all the working lenr devices in the history. Theory should be based on experiments, not on delusion. If you are attempting to optimize a tech that isn’t even available then you are in a big delusion.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Also agreed

          • Bob Greenyer

            Agreed

      • Ged

        Oh yeah, forgot he was using some random powder in that run–that is a variable for us to consider in addition to the hydrogen source.

  • Sanjeev

    The thread of Brian Ahern has about 9000 views. Who are watching ?

    • We are seeing views from several social networks.

    • Interesting: Now we hit the 10000 mark…

  • Sanjeev

    The thread of Brian Ahern has about 9000 views. Who are watching ?

    • We are seeing views from several social networks.

    • Interesting: Now we hit the 10000 mark…

  • Bob Greenyer
  • Bob Greenyer
  • Bob Greenyer
    • Ged

      Starting to light a fire under our excess feet with all this anticipation!

      • Bob Greenyer

        Looking to see something in the Bigger Wats

  • Bob Greenyer
    • Ged

      Starting to light a fire under our excess feet with all this anticipation!

      • Bob Greenyer

        Looking to see something in the Bigger Wats