Energy Production & Transmutation: Two Different LENR Tracks

The recent test results from the MFMP showing apparent transmutations after charcoal has treated for two minutes in the George Egely NOVA reactor are quite fascinating, although I think it is still premature to regard them as conclusive. My understanding is that the MFMP will be doing the test on a more pure carbon sample to see if similar results are produced.

I originally became interested in LENR because I though it could be an important source of inexpensive and low-coast energy, and so far, energy production seems to be the goal of many LENR researchers. However, it is possible that another equally important future LENR application will be either elemental, or isotopic transmutations (or may be both).

The goal of many of the old alchemists was to be able to make something extremely valuable (e.g. gold) from a common element (e.g. lead), but many centuries ago they did not have the understanding of chemistry, nor the necessary technological apparatus to make it happen. This changed in the 20th Century with nuclear engineering. Here’s an excerpt from a Scientific American article on the subject of transmutation.

With the dawn of the atomic age in the 20th century, however, the transmutation of elements finally became possible. Nowadays nuclear physicists routinely transform one element to another. In commercial nuclear reactors, uranium atoms break apart to yield smaller nuclei of elements such as xenon and strontium as well as heat that can be harnessed to generate electricity. In experimental fusion reactors heavy isotopes of hydrogen merge together to form helium. (An element is defined by the number of protons in its nucleus whereas an isotope of a given element is determined by the quantity of neutrons.)

But what of the fabled transmutation of lead to gold? It is indeed possible—all you need is a particle accelerator, a vast supply of energy and an extremely low expectation of how much gold you will end up with. More than 30 years ago nuclear scientists at the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory (LBNL) in California succeeded in producing very small amounts of gold from bismuth, a metallic element adjacent to lead on the periodic table.

If LENR reactors are able to produce similar results at much lower cost, and safely, in reasonable quantities then we might find that transmutation is comparable in importance to energy production, especially if currently rare and valuable elements and/or isotopes can be created. It may be that we will see two very different tracks for LENR emerging.

  • sam
  • Bob Greenyer

    In Dr. Egely’s lapsed patent application, one embodiment is targeting remediation of nuclear waste. In the work of Adamenko, he found that just one strike could reduce 60Co by over 50%.

    If we can use LENR techniques to reduce radiation of Fission and [traditional] Fusion waste, then we will help with the energy problem.

    On the subject of making a specific element. Dr. Egely has his lab removed after demonstrating, to a small degree, production of Palladium having been asked to do so.

    In the coming weeks I will share my ideas on how specific elements can be targeted, my understanding is based on several factors. A key insight was presented without context at ASTI.

    Proof of production of Tritium in LENR by Tom Claytor
    Production of precious metals in Suhas Ralkar’s foil processor
    High production of Lead in Suhas Ralkar’s fuel processor
    High production of Lead in Mark LeClairs work
    1300x production of Lead during a specific world changing event

    There is a reason why Lead is prevalent, can anyone guess it? It is not very hard…

  • Jouni Tuomela

    Please look at this,
    from beforeitsnews
    http://aip.scitation.org/doi/full/10.1063/1.4989845
    “Evidence of nuclear fusion neutrons in an extremely small plasma focus device operating at 0.1 Joules”

    • Bob Greenyer

      This is an important finding.

      It is charge clusters as far as I can see.

    • Andreas Moraitis

      Obviously, the described technology resembles Rossi’s QX. (one would just have to replace D+D by Li+p).

  • Axil Axil

    http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2016/ph241/yoon1/

    The Curious Story of the Muon-Catalyzed Fusion Reaction

    The Curious fact is that LENR produces mostly muons from the energy that it generates from nuclear reactions and very little heat.

    These muons push out covalent electrons that bind chemical compounds together and fuse that molecule into a heavier element.

    What happens in LENR is a Muon-Catalyzed Fusion Reaction

    • Bob Greenyer

      I agree up to a point, Muons are the longest lived observables.

      • Zephir

        Why the nature would use such a counterintuitive way? The formation of muons (2nd generation of matter) requires higher energy density, that the overcoming of Coulomb barrier itself. The function of catalyst is exactly the opposite: it reacts under lower energy, thus serving as an intermediate of reaction.

        • Bob Greenyer

          I don’t think it needs to at the simplest level.

  • Axil Axil

    Bose condinsation is extremely important in LENR. It is where all the miracles of LENR come from. The polariton is a boson. It is made from an electron and photons of heat combined together through quantum mechanics. Polaritons are electrons that has lost their charge and most of their mass. Electrons are fermions and they cannot form condensates.

    Why would a polariton condinsate as a black hole look like a tachyon?

    http://phys.org/news/2015-09-law-implies-thermodynamic-black-holes.html

    Because the area of future and past holographic screens increases in different directions, the direction of time is different for the two types of screens. In past screens, time moves forward. Expanding universes, such as ours, involve past holographic screens, and so we naturally perceive thermodynamic time as running forward. In contrast, time runs backward in future holographic screens. In a sense, this interpretation has the odd result that thermodynamic time runs backward inside black holes and collapsing universes. The polariton condinsate is a analogue black hole where energy enters but leaves in unexpected ways.

    In a polariton condinsate as a analog black hole would look like a tachyon which is a particle that is traveling backward in time.

    In the 1967 paper that coined the term, Feinberg proposed that tachyonic particles could be quanta of a quantum field with negative squared mass. However, it was soon realized that excitations of such imaginary mass fields do not in fact propagate faster than light, and instead represent an instability known as tachyon condensation. Nevertheless, negative squared mass fields are commonly referred to as “tachyons”, and in fact have come to play an important role in modern physics.

    The Polariton condinsate as an analog black hole would be a tachyon containing negative mass and moving backward in time.

    According to string theory, The polariton condinsate as a tachyon releases energy in three ways: heat as hawking radiation, light whose frequency is proportional to the density of the polaritons that form the condinsate and muons…lots and lots of mesons.

    • Zephir

      /* Bose condinsation is extremely important in LENR. */

      It’s sorta suspicious, when someone who pretends being an expert in given area and who forces his ideas everywhere still cannot spell his own main theoretical concept properly. Would you believe a therapeutist, who even cannot pronounce the world “cancer” correctly? Such a behavior would point to the unusual degree of superficiality in thinking.

      • Axil Axil

        I stand before your superior intellect and knowledge.humbled by my many faults and hope someday to improve to some small level of adequacy. Until that day comes, you might ignore anything that comes from me. I will not be offended at your disdain and lack of attention. In fact, I will be relieved to not hear from you.

        But you should also be aware that a bully is marked by the abuse he inflicted on those of lesser station and abilities.

        Bullying is usually seen as acts or verbal comments that could ‘mentally’ hurt or isolate a person in a social setting. Bullying usually involves repeated incidents or a pattern of behavior that is intended to intimidate, offend, degrade or humiliate a particular person or group of people. It has also been described as the assertion of power through aggression.

        How Can Bullying Affect an Individual?

        People who are the targets of bullying may experience a range of effects. These reactions include:

        Shock
        Anger
        Feelings of frustration and/or helplessness
        Increased sense of vulnerability
        Loss of confidence
        Physical symptoms such as:
        Inability to sleep
        Loss of appetite
        Psychosomatic symptoms such as:
        Stomach pains
        Headaches
        Panic or anxiety,
        Inability to concentrate
        Low morale and productivity

        Is it your intent to subject me to such effects?

        • Zephir

          Lower productivity… OK, let me think about it…

        • Chapman

          What he is saying is that we love you, and really respect the breadth of your interests, but you tend to boomerang back to concepts you have already beaten to death, and yet they are still no more relevant than when you first proposed them.

          I have a nephew, and I dearly LOVE the kid, but there was a summer a few years ago when we all wanted to throttle the little bugger! He got hold of a baseball almanac as part of his interest in baseball cards, and NO discussion could take place within his earshot without him having the desperate need to jump in and inform us of a string of nonsensical batting averages, RBI’s, and consecutive win statistics. We could be discussing the landscaping benefits of edible ground coverage versus purely ornamental foliage around the garden and this would trigger a lecture about the rules for stealing base and what constitutes a foul ball.

          Are you getting what I am saying?

          And do not take offense and get all mean about it (you tend to respond to ANY contradiction with extreme snarkiness and disproportionate venom), but I have read all your BEC monologues over the years and I have a suspicion that you do not really understand what they are! It is not so much that you repeatedly misapply the CONCEPT, but you do not seem to fully understand the underlying theory of the structure that IS the concept. I would humbly suggest you study up on BEC’s, beyond just a wiki article or two, before you attempt to explain how they cause LENR.

          Thank GOD my nephew never heard of BEC’s!!! I suspect my family tree would have been pruned down by one branch…

          • Axil Axil

            You are very kind and considerate in applying criticism that is not harmful to my sensitive nature.

            You have devoted much time and attention in this considerate response, so I feel obliged to respond in kind.

            Yes, IMHO, Bose condensation is a key concept in understanding all the processes involved in the LENR reaction. This mechanism is not well know even in professional science and yet it explains much about the way LENR works.

            There is much misunderstanding in LENR that Bose condensation awareness will correct. First. LENR has nothing to do with fusion, next, all the miracles that LENR demonstrates come from polariton condensation.

            Even beyond heat production, what the science of LENR introduces with condinsation, entanglement, and coherence as a cornerstone is a new paradigm in science including a new type of quantum mechanics, a new cosmology and understanding of the Sun, a new understanding about the way the fundamental forces work in the universe, and what gravity, dark energy and dark matter really are.

          • Chapman

            On most of that I agree with you 100%.

            LENR certainly has little to nothing to do with conventional concepts of fusion. And I agree with you that there is probably a greater scope of amazing things related to the reaction that we have not yet glimpsed.

            And for what it is worth, I think you are AWESOME! I love reading your other posts, and never fail to learn something from them. Your interests are much broader than mine, so you always drag me into a topic I had not examined previously. I honestly do not intend to insult you when I respond to the BEC thing. I am just beyond the point of BEC Burnout… So when you post about it (and I know you will…) just expect ME to come back with an “Oh Lord! Here he goes AGAIN!!!”, but treat it as you would coming from a friend, or family. Do not take offense, or think you are being attacked or bullied. It is a simple difference of opinion, and a reasonable response when you are (come on… admit it!) intentionally picking at a scab. But you ARE a genuine intellectual, and there is no doubt you think things through, so I offer you my fullest respect, even when we disagree on the validity of the application of a few concepts, and I have absolutely no malice at all towards you.

            On the other hand, I really liked the link to the mcf article. I find THAT topic very interesting indeed. I am not sure how much it occurs in any of Rossi’s tech, but I can see the logic of the mechanics.

  • This could be the beginning of replicators, like in Star Trek. SPOILER ALERT for Star Trek: Enterprise:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyMYKWIAR5s

    Another thing that I am reminded of is that Twilight Zone episode called: “The Rip Van Winkle Caper.”

  • HS61AF91

    Hmmm… when energy production, electricity etc. is ‘freely’ available, and so therefore is transmutation, then the allure of gold, etc. goes away, except for the cosmetic attractiveness of its shine. What an amazingly different world that would be to live in. Like the Babylonian monetary system would cease to have relevance.

    • Bob Greenyer

      Like JP Morgan said to Tesla as he withdrew support “This would destroy the monetary system”

      Oh, what a shame.

  • georgehants

    Science Alert
    Chinese Physicists Just Achieved Quantum Teleportation Underwater For The First Time
    https://www.sciencealert.com/physicists-have-achieved-quantum-communication-underwater-for-the-first-time

    • Bob Greenyer

      Quantum communication was always there… it is an innate ability… life does it all the time…

      • georgehants

        Bob, like everything that is in this reality or one beyond or attached, connected etc. it is always there but until science grows-up and investigates every possible anomaly or possibility it will all lay hidden.
        I hope you agree that all MFMP’s work, should it prove to be Researching non-reality by any chance, all your work will have been as important as any success and should be rewarded by a grateful society

        • Bob Greenyer

          The flood is coming, and I don’t mean EM induced storms pushed around by the diamagnetic properties of water and nitrogen.

          • georgehants

            Bob, we cannot wait for that day when you feel you can let it all out.
            Best

          • Bob Greenyer

            Let’s hope we’re not pushed back to the dark ages in an attempt to silence the gifts that the universe has in store for us.

            As I learnt earlier this year, people can take a real cognitive hit when presented with too much disruptive material in one go, step by step.

          • georgehants

            Have to give them a chance, after centuries of scientific brain-washing it may take a while to bring back Evidence, Logic, open-minds etc. in place of fearful denial and running to hide under a table when faced with reality.

  • georgehants

    Alchemists are often described as the first
    chemists. They developed an extraordinary language (rather than the
    chemical symbols we use today) to describe all manner of things, from
    chemical reactions to philosophical tenets. Click on ‘What is alchemy?’
    to learn about the three aims of the alchemists. Click on each of the
    alchemical symbols for more information and to see alternative symbols.
    http://www.rsc.org/periodic-table/alchemy

    • Bob Greenyer

      Thankyou George, I had never seen this.

      For many months now I have said that Potassium is the easiest and best way to get electrons (group one with low ionisation energy). There are better elements – but these are really difficult to handle and expensive.

      Electrons are critical to all LENR.

      It is funny that Lead is the first element of Alchemy – since I think this is the easiest to produce if you push LENR really hard, see my comment below.

  • Bob Greenyer

    Very close… try again…

  • georgehants

    Via Vortex with thanks
    [Vo]:f13C or faux13C
    JonesBeene
    Sun, 27 Aug 2017 15:36:00 -0700
    Here is a premise which may be worth consideration, even if the evidence for it
    is not yet certain and the details are fluid. After all, this is vortex – not
    Fusion Technology… plus… the proposition is falsifiable, should it gather any
    traction.
    http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg115105.html

  • Zephir

    The case of LENR transmutations is even more intriguing, than the LENR itself. The common problem of many – if not most – observed nuclear transmutations isn’t the observation of heat, but exactly the opposite problem: for transmutations running in the visible scope the amount of heat released was suspiciously way smaller, than this one which the theory of nuclear binding forces predicts. This theory enables to predict the heat released during nuclear transmutation with high precision.

    The only classical explanation is, the products of LENR transmutations are unstable highly excited isomers, which didn’t submit all their internal energy to their neighborhood yet. You may imagine the atom nuclei like the pile of apples, which doesn’t change its shape, under you shake it with sufficiently strong power. It would indicate, that the stability scope of these isomers is way wider, than the classical experiments made during high energies would indicate. There are another theoretical problem with actual mechanism of these transmutations, which would involve NMR resonance effects and Auger electrons from bottom orbitals of atoms.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Physics_AWT/comments/5ow3v7/vall%C3%A9e_synergetic_generator_a_simple_circuit/

  • bob dash

    Solar panels aren’t better than LENR, if it functions as claimed. You can’t run SSTO launch craft, and VTOL supersonic craft, isolated stations/colonies/deep space spacecraft all not dirty fission/chemical based without it. Safe compact nuclear energy sources are the future.

    • Axil Axil

      The evaluation of LENR and its tradeoffs will change when muon creation is seen to be a result of this reaction.

  • bob dash

    Nothing weather and location dependant with a lower energy density will be better.